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Author Topic: Being Called  (Read 14723 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Zade

  • Guest
Being Called
« on: June 22, 2007, 08:23:22 PM »

Hello, I'm new here.

I have a question about being "called."

Matthew 22:14: "Many are called, but few are chosen"

From this we know that not all who are "called" will be in the Kingdom of God. Only the chosen few have eonian life because "narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it."

Romans 8:30: "Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified."

From Matthew it seems being called is not grounds for glorification because many are called, but in Romans 8 here it says (indirectly) that whoever he calls he glorifies.

Thanks
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seminole

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #1 on: June 22, 2007, 08:41:02 PM »

"Many called few chosen" , a "camel going through the eye of a needle" all are basically saying that many have the knowledge of Jesus Christ and He "calls out" to many but not many answer and accept His call for salvation.
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Zade

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #2 on: June 22, 2007, 09:14:19 PM »

Falcon, I'm sorry, but I don't see where I'm making assumptions.

Matthew 22:3: He dispatched his servants to summon the invited guests to the feast, but they refused to come.

Am I correct that these guests were called (NIV says invited) to the feast?

Gathered all they found, bad and good alike, 5 and the hall was filled with guests.

Am I correct that these guests were also called/invited to the feast?

So "many are called" to the feast, but not all who are called to the feast eat at the feast. Some called refuse the feast, and one called came to the feast and was unworthy of being there. So not all of the called eat at the feast, but from Romans 8 it seems that all of the called eat at the feast.

If I'm going wrong somewhere please tell me where. I've read nearly all of Ray's writings.

Thank you
« Last Edit: June 22, 2007, 09:16:33 PM by Zade »
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skydreamers

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #3 on: June 22, 2007, 09:54:19 PM »

Hi Zade,

Welcome to the forum!

I think you have a valid question, in that it does seem like Romans is referring to the "many called".

Perhaps the key is in the original words used.  In Romans, the word used in "them he also called" is defined by Thayer as follows:

[u]kaleō[/u]

1) to call
1a) to call aloud, utter in a loud voice
1b) to invite
2) to call, i.e. to name, by name
2a) to give a name to
2a1) to receive the name of, receive as a name
2a2) to give some name to one, call his name
2b) to be called, i.e. to bear a name or title (among men)
2c) to salute one by name




 By using E-sword, I found out that there are different words used in Mathew 22:14


For many are called, but few are chosen."
Matthew 22:14


Here the word for called is:

klētos

1) called, invited (to a banquet)
1a) invited (by God in the proclamation of the Gospel) to obtain eternal salvation in the kingdom through Christ
1b) called to (the discharge of) some office
1b1) divinely selected and appointed


And for chosen:

eklektos

1) picked out, chosen
1a) chosen by God
1a1) to obtain salvation through Christ
1a1a) Christians are called “chosen or elect” of God
1a2) the Messiah in called “elect”, as appointed by God to the most exalted office conceivable
1a3) choice, select, i.e. the best of its kind or class, excellence preeminent: applied to certain individual Christians



So although Thayer seems to think the called and the chosen are the same, he nonetheless notes some key differences which are helpful to us.  The chosen are indeed "the best of their kind". 

Now, keep in mind, the Chosen (Elect) are "called out" of the Called.

So to me, Romans is still speaking of the Elect who were "called" (called by name...since God knows the name of his Chosen, it makes sense that he would spiritually call them by name within their spirits....)

This is not the same meaning as "the many called" in Matthew, who are "invited to the banquet" but not specially and specifically called by name, as the Elect are.

Hope that made sense....

Gotta run.

Peace and God bless us and give us wisdom,
Diana
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Beloved

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #4 on: June 23, 2007, 12:41:10 AM »

Diane I agree  with Roger the chosen are not the best of their kind 


(1Co 1:26 KJVR)  For ye see your calling, brethren, how that not many wise men after the flesh, not many mighty, not many noble, are called:

(1Co 1:27 KJVR)  But God hath chosen the foolish things of the world to confound the wise; and God hath chosen the weak things of the world to confound the things which are mighty;

(1Co 1:28 KJVR)  And base things of the world, and things which are despised, hath God chosen, yea, and things which are not, to bring to naught things that are:

(1Co 1:29 KJVR)  That no flesh should glory in his presence.

(1Co 1:30 KJVR)  But of him are ye in Christ Jesus, who of God is made unto us
wisdom, and righteousness, and sanctification, and redemption:

(1Co 1:31 KJVR)  That, according as it is written, He that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.



The elect are not special from.... the human perspective... they are being used by God for His special purpose.



(Rom 12:1 KJVR)  I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service.

Beloved   :D


Roger ....Trix are bad for Kids  ;D ;D ;D...... just Madison Ave Baloney ;D ;D ;D
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Falconn003

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #5 on: June 23, 2007, 01:04:41 AM »

Beloved

Well put and wonderfull scriptures.

God bless
Rodger

ave baloney,,,,,hahhahaha good one,,,good one !
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gmik

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #6 on: June 23, 2007, 01:16:30 AM »

Rodger, make nice w/ the newbies!  They don't know ya like some of us older ones ;)

(just teasing ya)
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Deborah-Leigh

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #7 on: June 23, 2007, 07:00:32 AM »


This has been a very astutely edifying thread.

Peace be to you

Arcturus :)
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Falconn003

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #8 on: June 23, 2007, 02:57:02 PM »

GMIK

 ;D  ;D that's  me.......;D  ;D

God bless
Rodger
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jER

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #9 on: June 23, 2007, 06:39:36 PM »

Beloved...

The elect are not special from.... the human perspective... they are being used by God for His special purpose.

…Accurately stated, and much kinder than the "Slam Dunk" that previously went through the net (although, no problem here with quoting, Ray).

As far as it sounded, Diane could have been making a reference to those who "overcome?" And, not of self determination, either.

Gena and Arcturus – I totally agree.

Nice to meet you, Rodger.


All in due time and order!

- jER
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jER

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #10 on: June 23, 2007, 06:45:05 PM »

WELCOME ZADE...

A friend in Christ - jER
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skydreamers

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #11 on: June 23, 2007, 09:13:55 PM »

Hi Guys,

I was in a hurry when I wrote my post and so what I was trying to show didn't come across clearly. 

Jer,
You indeed picked up on what I was trying to say :)  Thanks for the help in clarifying.

Quote
As far as it sounded, Diane could have been making a reference to those who "overcome?" And, not of self determination, either.


Rodger and Beloved,

You are so right and of course I agree with you; according to the world, the Elect will seem as nothing and nobodies.

For consider your calling, brothers: not many of you were wise according to worldly standards, not many were powerful, not many were of noble birth. But God chose what is foolish in the world to shame the wise; God chose what is weak in the world to shame the strong; God chose what is low and despised in the world, even things that are not, to bring to nothing things that are, so that no human being might boast in the presence of God.
1 Corinthians 1:26-29

I certainly don't think that the Elect are necessarily any better than anybody else.  But as I understand it, the Elect are being brought through a process of purification right now.  So how I was thinking about it was that they are the first of their kind to reach perfection in Christ, thus the honor bestowed on them to be Kings and Priests with Christ. 

But you are right, it doesn't mean they are "best" in and of themselves, for it is God who makes it possible for them to be the Elect in the first place, as you so rightly pointed out that He is the one doing the choosing.  Plus, I truly understand that it is nothing in us that is "best" but it is Christ living his righteousness in and through us.

I hope that clears up a little what I meant.  Sorry for the confusion.:) ;) 

Peace,
Diana

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Beloved

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #12 on: June 23, 2007, 09:58:40 PM »

My remarks were not meant as a negative against Diana in any way  I thought I was sharpening her point.  Oh Diana I know what you mean I am sometimes in such a hurry to write a responce before I accidently delete my own mesaage that I do not always make the point I want to make. I especially have to watch because I have such a blunt way of expressing myself.
 
I am really trying to understand the nuances of the language we use in expressing our beliefs  and agree with Roger's intent that we also need to be scripturally accurate now that we are more aware of doctrinal twists that can occur.

We have so many people here on the forum who are at different levels of their walk that we need to be careful that we are tender toward others as we gently push for clarification and scripturally sound responces. I personally love scriptural sword fights because Truth is always the Victor.  I do not know how some of you out there come up with such in depth anaylsis some times. Kudos I can barely cut and paste a few verses . 

Beloved     
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jER

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #13 on: June 24, 2007, 02:58:53 AM »

Rodger

"I sincerely appreciate your directness and humbleness."

Your request is very easy to understand and I concur with that of reading the material/articles written by Ray, prior - if one has not taken the time!

Furthermore, I keep in mind that:

General Discussions
Discuss and Question what you have learned at bible-truths.com here. This forum area DOES NOT necessarily represent the views of L. Ray Smith or Bible-Truths.com. Forum Rules Apply.

A friend in Christ!

- jER
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Deborah-Leigh

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #14 on: June 24, 2007, 06:57:55 AM »



Hello Falconn300

Now you know how I feel about your dazzling return and much needed contribution in the Forum!

With a little sense of humour I can observe the following....IF EVERYONE DID read and integrate Rays teachings and then only come to the Forum to ask questions AFTER having read Rays teachings.....either there'd be no Forum! ...Or the Forum  would not be at times such a hard training ground for discernment and exercise of the spirit in matters of the truth and sound doctrine! :D Hence endurance is sometimes the fruit of the Spirit that is being fashioned into my spirit along side with patience sometimes which I do not have much of!

Peace to you

Arcturus :)
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Deborah-Leigh

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #15 on: June 24, 2007, 08:28:35 AM »



Hallelujah! for who made you fit for HIS image of making the whip well ahead of entering the temple and turning over tables! God bless you!

This blesses me it sure does because I too know those RED Flags!!! and I am no sleeping Bull either and I don't like bull! and don't want to be lulled into any sleep of seduction or lukewarmness either! Lord keep me!

Peace be to you

Arcturus :)

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Robin

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #16 on: June 24, 2007, 03:51:05 PM »

Well I must speak up being one of those new members who was very hurt when I first joined. I did read Ray's papers before joining the forum. I sucked them down as fast as I could. I laughed and cried reading the truth that God also taught me. It was the first time I ever heard anyone else believe the same as I did.

I struggled hard with the truth concerning who Jesus is. I couldn't process it and it was so unsettling that I couldn't sleep for 2 weeks and was sick to my stomach with fear. I just sat and cried trying to process the truth pleading with God for answers. I had been so deceived in the past that I was afraid of being deceived again. I came to the forum in a fog and asked some questions. I was accused of asking trick questions and labeled as a detractor. So on top of being sick from the new truth I was learning I felt very rejected by the members here. I quit and then asked to come back. Where else it there to go? lol. They apologized and led me to the papers and told me to read them again. My foggy brain found the answers to the questions the second time around. I really didn't know that it was there because I could only process so much and it went right over my head.

So from my experience I hate to see anyone jump on a new member with only one post. I would rather see them led to the paper that would answer their question. There have been other times when I was looking for Rodger hoping he would show up and tell it like it is as only he can. There were also members who came to teach lies.

So that's my experience and I'm glad I made it through it to be here. Craig more or less told me to toughen up, lol, and not let me feelings get hurt and let me back in. This can all be quite overwhelming at first.

Thanks for listening. I don't usually express my views on issues like this. I just wanted to share my experience.

MG
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Deborah-Leigh

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #17 on: June 24, 2007, 03:57:36 PM »

MG

Thank you so much for sharing that!

I have to say I enjoy your statement : Those who seek truth will find it. Those who don't, will manufacture it.

I think we do have to test the spirits against the spirit of truth. Perhaps in a way this Forum is a threshing floor!.....some posts may appear as Gods winnowing fork....but hey we are in the feather barn compared to the replies Ray is so astutely exhibiting for our example...!....Now that is real tough love at work in the field! God bless you!

Peace to you

Arcturus :)
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Falconn003

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #18 on: June 25, 2007, 12:12:54 AM »

MG

thank you for sharing those moments with us.

God bless
Rodger
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GODSown1

  • Guest
Re: Being Called
« Reply #19 on: June 25, 2007, 12:46:05 AM »

WelL I just want to Welcome! Zade,
                                              GODBLESS! u Zade & b wit U alwayZ! az I nO He is whence ur here, b strong, Trust n the LORD, keep posting dudE.
                                              muchLOVE!! Pera
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