> General Discussions
Back to Babylon?
fe32k:
I am sure Matt just wanted our opinions and that's what he got. Our opinions are in no way authoritative, but Matt you are definitely not on your own. Seek the scriptures and ask God for guidance. Don't be troubled because now we know that God is in control of EVERYTHING. That can be a scary notion for it can be a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God, but it is also comforting for we know the end result. Diane and I may not see eye to eye, but I am sure that she will keep you in her prayers as will I.
Diane, I only went to church for two years in which I became a youth minister and was "prophesied" to become a great pastor by a well known Hispanic preacher. After 5 mins of just discussing (not preaching) another perspective of this so called rapture, I was shunned as a heretic and was said to be deceived and carrying a devil. Looking back, I know how harmful this environment can be. I would not recommend anyone to regularly attend church just as I wouldn't recommend anyone to walk into a snake pit. I consider them both dangerous. The church can be an emotionally draining place, I personally was not able to stand my last visit and left before the sermon was over. It just hurts to be there. This is the perspective I bring to this discussion on going back to church.
God be with you,
Roy
seminole:
Man Matt, your story sounds real familiar. There has always been trouble aroung here as far back as I know of and it has gotten worse. I did the drug thing and drinking. My goal in life was to move to Colorado, grow my own, brew the lightning and party all the time. Didn't work out that way though. You are right. What the kids get just in the world is more dangerous than anything I know of in churches. You got to do what you think right. Somebody mentioned people in church raising their hands and singing but how is any body to know that it is not genuine from the heart. Not everybody puts on a show just to be putting on a show. Not much different that I can see than people living in a well to do subdivision just to portray their success. You know keeping up with the Joneses. Maybe they don't like the subdivision but they go just to keep up appearances. It happens everywhere in most aspects of life not just church. Matt, you got a good heart and have come so far. You will do the right thing for your family.
Nole
skydreamers:
Hi Roy, thanks for sharing that! I do see more clearly where you are coming from.
I hope I am not coming across as argumentative with you, since I'm sure you and I agree wholeheartedly on many other things!! :) I think you are giving wise counsel, especially given your experience.
Also I probably should clarify about what I meant by Matt having to figure it out alone. What I meant, and what I should have said is Matt, you are likely not going to get an unanimous answer on this one (from the forum), and so yes indeed, it will likely be a decision made between you and God and where you sense he is leading you.
--- Quote ---I am sure Matt just wanted our opinions and that's what he got. Our opinions are in no way authoritative, but Matt you are definitely not on your own. Seek the scriptures and ask God for guidance. Don't be troubled because now we know that God is in control of EVERYTHING.
--- End quote ---
I am definitely in full agreement with Roy on that one... !!;) :D
Peace to all,
Diana
DuluthGA:
Hi Matt, I agree with Jackson primarily. It's all spiritual.
There are many many more Scriptures on "coming out of the world" than there are of "coming out of Babylon." Do we really think we can come out of the physical world? Such as, stop watching this, participating in that, rubbing shoulders with them?
Here are a just a few of many (more) such verses, with only the important words unfurled:
John 12: 25 ... he who is hating his life in this world... [CLNT]
Rom 12: 2 ... do not follow the customs of the present age, ... [Weymouth N.T.]
James 4: 4 ... a friend of the world is constituted an enemy of God. [CLNT]
John 7: 7 [Jesus speaking] "The world ... it's acts are wicked." [CLNT]
Gal 1: 4 ... that he might deliver us out of the present evil age ... [Young's Literal Translation]
John 15: 19 " ... I have chosen you out of the world ..."
John 17: 14 " ... they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world."
Gal 4: 3 ... we, when were children, were in bondage under the elements of the world.
James 1: 27 ... be keeping oneself unspotted from the world.
1John 2: 15 Do not love the world, nor the things of the world.
John 17: 6 [Jesus speaking] " ... whom You have given Me out of the world ... [NKJV]
Phil 3: 18-19 ... enemies of the cross of Christ ... who mind earthly things.
2Pet 2: 20 ... they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord...
John 14: 17 the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive...
So dear brother, I list these to show you, can someone come all the way out of dreaded Babylon then come all the way out of the world as is commanded? We all answer this in our own way with our connection with God's spirit on a daily basis. But I assure you as a friend, there is no one in a physical corner all by his or herself, sitting there nearly perfect. I truly believe we all fulfill God's will at each moment.
Thanks to great thoughts from Diana! :>
With joy, Janice
mari_et_pere:
--- Quote ---Did Jesus sit with the Pharisees? I believe they are more comparable to the church today than the "sinners" Jesus sat with.
--- End quote ---
Wow hang on. I'm not trying to argue here, not at all. I'm actually famous among those who know me for avoiding confrontation. But to take church members, all of them, all how many? Millions? And say they are more like Pharisees than sinners Jesus sat with is...well judgemental at best. Do you not have friends who attend church? Do you think of them as Pharisees? Do ya talk down to them with scathing sarcasm as Jesus did to the Pharisees for their hypocritical speech and actions? Or are they good hearted Joe's and Jane's who happen to be in the decieved majority of Christendom according to God's will, and will remain that way until God calls them to more truth, IF He does, again according to His will?
Matt
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