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[fe32k]

This came up during the "back to babylon?" thread and I thought it might deserve a separate discussion because there seems to be different opiinions on this.

Just how evil are the doctrines of the christian church, whether it be catholic, protestant, other (i.e. Jehovah witness, WWCOG, etc)? Are they comparable to any other evils commited in the world by HUMANS?

I say there is nothing more evil than to teach eternal torment. It targets the spirit and causes men and women (and children!) to blaspheme God every second of their lives. It denies justice, purpose, love and sanity on the part of our God. Is there any single one event or doctrine or system more evil than this? I can't think of anything. I would love to hear peoples take on this. Am I really being too hard on the church?

Thanks!!
Roy

[Craig]

Am I really being too hard on the church?

On the church as an institution?  Probably not.

On the church members?  Probably so. 

Blessings
Craig

[TimothyVI]

Well said Craig.
The institution is made up of it's members, and they are good people who are decieved
until God removes the scales from their eyes.

Tim

[fe32k]

But Craig I have emphasized my love for the people in church. My issues are with what they teach and who they profess to be. Jesus did not hate the pharisees, he hated the way they taught, what they taught, their fake holiness, etc. Jesus knew that one day they would be His brothers, just not that day. I just do not think we should be tolerant of these things. Paul was not tolerant of the Judaizers at all, and what they were doing was not nearly as comparable as eternal torment.

Roy

[ciy]

Roy

I do not think that you are too hard on the individual.
 
"The preparations of the heart in man, and the answer of the tongue, is from the Lord."  Proverbs 16:1

I see your posts on the threads as encouragement.  We need to always lift each other up and support each other when our thinking is weakening.  Just as Elijah and Jonah needed a swift rebuke to set them straight so do we.  That is why we should fellowship with true believers.

We that have come out of Bablyon have all been Pharisees of the flesh and heart at some time so we all need to be encouraged in the truth.

http://bible-truths.com/fools.htm

CIY

[Shmeggly]

I don't think you are too hard on them either; Jesus took people to task for being hypocritical and leading people astray....that's what the church does.  He did however have compassion on the broken hurting people like the prostitutes and other "sinners" etc....that's where we need to find that fine line between the two.

I know there's times when righteous anger rises up in me over how people are being misled, and I can speak very plainly and seemingly harsh.  I just watched Bill Weise's "23 Minutes In Hell", and I immediately started making notes on where he starts twisting scripture, or making his story fit what he thinks the scripture says.  I was getting angry and used strong language....I did not change it either when I sent it to a few friends who are Christians....there is a time for getting angry and using strong language, and if it isn't in this case, when would it be?  They are driving people AWAY from God, not scaring them to Him! 
I know I have to be careful in how I come across at times because it is easy to get worked up; I know where you are coming from....to me it's righteous anger on how other people are treated (you want to defend them) , not anger because YOU or ME are being mistreated....hope that makes sense...J

[musicman]

This doctrine of ET is so evil that I don't know how God can consider the believers of it better than atheists.  No atheist believes that anyone is going to a place of torture forever.  In fact, several have dismissed God altogether because of that doctrine.  I am convinced that most hell believers (not necessarily church members) don't want to find out that they are wrong.  Therefore, who should receive the more severe judgement?  Will it be the hell believers or those who absolutely deny that Christ is Lord?

[Beloved]

I am very reluctant to even think about either the quantity or quality of God's Judgnement on any another person.

Like David said ..My Sin is against God ond only You.

We should therefore not speculate (which will only indulge ones pride)  and leave the level of judgement to God... who we know ....is All Merciful and JUST.  Jesus will bring All in All to the Father. All will learn righteousness.

Beloved 

[Dean Peterman]

Dear Roy,

I will say that if this doctrine of eternal punishment is not true then it is without a doubt a serious misrepresentaton of God.  However, most people within Christendom only believe this is true because they feel they have no other choice.  They have (as I was for 20 years) been deceived into thinking that the Bible teaches this doctrine.  They feel to be loyal to God and his Word they have to accept it as truth.  This doctrine of hell bothered me for years but I just couldn't find any way to get rid of it.  The Bible did seem to teach it and I didn't want to disrespect God by calling him a liar.  After all, who was I to say anything God was doing unjust.  It was not until I accidently found several websites, including Bible Truths, that I was given accurate information.  Prior to this I had never, ever, in all my extensive reading come across the truth presented on Bible Truths.  I wasn't even looking for this information.  I was actually looking up something else and a link popped up on my computer screen and I went to it and started reading.  My guess is that most of the people in Christendom would give anything to know that hell is not a real place.  It scares them as it scared me.  No one wants their family and friends to go to such a horrible place.  As sad as it may seem the doctrine of hell was the mother of necessity.  The evil men ruling over the Catholic Church used this false teaching to compel people to give money to obtain favor with God for either them or their dead loved ones.  The protestant reformation was not primarily about breaking free from false teaching, it was rebellion against deceptive and heavy handed ways to extort money from people.  Martin Luther did not like the idea that the Roman Catholic church was using fear to get money from people.  However, he never gave up the doctrine of hell.  It has been part of Christendom ever since. 

Never the less there are some in Christendom that seem to relish the thought of people burning in hell for all eternity.  As evidence of this just go to the website listed below and you will see what I mean.

http://www.atruechurch.info/hell.html


Sincerely,

Dean

[fe32k]

I was highly misunderstood when I was making comparisons of EVIL between grossly historical events and the DOCTRINE of eternal torment. Although I believe that some people in christendom are evil hearted, I would not compare them with some one like hitler. A lot of people in Christendom are sincere people, but sincerely decieved. I just hate the Doctrine of Eternal Torment. Ray gets a lot of emails of people who supposedly been to hell. I don't think they have never been into hell until they are sent there for at least a quintillion years. If these people have ever REALLY gotten to see this fabled hell, have they ever considered that it is God showing them a vision as to why He woud NOT create such a place?

Roy

[Sorin]

Nothing is more evil than to torture someone  with fire for all eternity, never ending insane amounts of pain whilst they're screaming and crying and begging for mercy and to do it over and over and over and over; it's the sickest, most evil idea ever! Does that tell you how "evil" the eternal torment (false) doctrine is?  And, ha, a true church dot com; they ought to change their name to a true church of satan dot com .

[gmik]

OMG  I went to that link.  What a crock!!!

He actually said that God was cruel!!!

[musicman]

Dear Roy,

I will say that if this doctrine of eternal punishment is not true then it is without a doubt a serious misrepresentaton of God. 

What do you mean if?  It most definately is not one bit true.