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MORE ON THE IMMORTAL SOUL
UncleBeau:
--- Quote from: Falconn003 on July 12, 2007, 03:03:45 PM ---UncleBeau
I WROTE::
--- Quote ---No one has to take on any role as a teacher and post unrelated scriptures pulled off E-sword to compound the message already conveyed so vividly in the articles.
--- End quote ---
NOW ! where did i say not too post any scripture at all? I do not see it, can you please POINT it out to me UncleBeau ?
wait a minute Rodger....where did I say "any scripture at all"? Could YOU please point that out to ME? Let's see if you go to extremes and absolutes any where else...
UncleBeau WROTE::
--- Quote ---If all people did was copy and paste Ray's teachings or just tell people to read it and discuss it without posting scripture, this wouldn't be much of a forum, would it?
--- End quote ---
WHERE DID this even come out of, yourself perhaps. No way did i convey the above, less you add more into what you read.... ::)
I think you are the one who is reading into my word more than what was said. I love to hear people "compound" a message if it's correct. Does that not show that they understand it? Is it not a good thing to see that, or is it annoying for you? Before you decide to quote me on that and pick apart my words, understand I'm not assuming that you're annoyed by people copying and pasting from esword....but certainly am thinking it loudly.
UncleBeau WROTE::
--- Quote ---Guess what. Not everyone will be taught (from God) everything that you have.
--- End quote ---
The SCRIPTURES SPIRITUALY are what being taught !!
To who, Rodger? You? Obviously not me or anyone esle that "compounds the message", or why would you say something as mean and cruel as this...
Until you or some one else comes up with or believes to have a more precise inspired interpretations of the Word of God, as Ray inspired by the Holy Spirit too write, Then go open your own web site and maintain it.
Yeah...that is a pretty extreme length to go to in order to prove whatever your point is. I don't think I even need to respond to this statement, Rodger. I know for a fact that Ray does NOT talk to people this way. So if you'd like to learn from him and only him, than you should stick to his principles and not this. I NEVER said I or ANYONE has a "more precise inspired interpretation" than anyone....and I'm sorry, but I won't be openng my own website anytime soon.
And what of the SCRIPTURE " all will know righteousness...." do we disregard it aswell ?
In what manner would I disregard scripture, Rodger? I think you're a little foggy on WHEN "all will know righteousness". I think you should go back and read Ray's teachings.
UncleBeau WROTE::
--- Quote ---Let me ask you this...What does a teacher teach? what they've been taught just as it was taught to them, or what they've been taught according to the way they they understand how to convey it to others?
--- End quote ---
This is a big disagreement on my part, why you may ask. For the reason MANY do not see the SPIRIT as the comforter and deny the Holy SPIRIT's truths.
Why would you disagree? Why do you think that so many people teach the same subject but include and take out certain things? Because they all understand it differently! This is the point that I've been trying to get across to you, Rodger! Rather than picking apart words and quotes, try looking at what they're saying. By the way, what you said here has absolutely NO relevance to what you replied to. Do you understand that there's a difference between denying and never seeing?
It is the Spirit THAT CAN ONLY DISCERN the WORD of God and only the SPIRIT alone can do this,,,,,now UncleBeau and any others who MIGHT deny this, did you come to these truths on your OWN? If so ...please by all means explain away....
And just when did I imply this, Rodger? Didn't I just say (FROM GOD) when you quoted me saying
--- Quote ---Guess what. Not everyone will be taught (from God) everything that you have.
--- End quote ---
? Is not God's Spirit the Holy Spirit, Rodger? I think maybe you should go back and read Ray's articles.
We were all taught about hell, tithing, imortal soul, free will, traditions, ceromonies...ect of the worldy church. How do you think, suppose, assume, speculate, by chance, we all here, separate the worldly beliefs from the Truths of God ?? do you honestly believe a mere man does it for us all ??
We were ALL taught? All of us? When was this? just now? Yesterday? Does not GOD determine who learns what? Who is this "mere man" anyway, Rodger?
UncleBeau WROTE::
--- Quote ---When I learn something at my job and someone eventually asks me a question related to what I've learned, do I tell them to go read it because it's been covered somewhere else? No. What if they've already seen the answer somewhere and forgot. Do I remind them that they should have already learned that and they should go back and look again? No. Should someone scold me for "trying to take on any role as a teacher" If I do in fact answer a question that they might have?
--- End quote ---
And should you teach them wrong, your ok with being held accountable, should you leave something important out or perhaps ferget a prerequisite your ok with your student getting it wrong.
Was that an answer to any of those questions? I guess if you can assume that I'm ok with someone "getting it wrong", then I can assume you believe you don't need to address my questions.
The Holy Spirit is OUR COMFORTER we NEED nothing more !
If this reply contained "nothing more" than accusations and assumtions, maybe I'd believe that you practice this.
If you do not believe Ray's articles are inspired by the Holy Spirit, and think yourself a better teacher over the long years Ray has put in, well by all means go open your forum and have a go at it. Or better and easier yet, take the challenge of proving one OLD scripture text on the Bible-Truths web site wrong and witnesses it with 2 others OLD scriptures.....
Sounds like you have an agenda here, Rodger. What brought THIS up? Did I EVER say ANYTHING even remotely close to this? You sure are spewing out a lot of "IF"s. Take WHAT challenge? Is this a challenge for you? Did I evr say that Ray was wrong in anything? Not once....and what's with this OLD scripture stuff you're saying...where's the NEW scripture?
UncleBeau WROTE::
--- Quote ---It doesn't really matter what you tell them has been covered. The Scripture HAS in fact been covered. It's called SCRIPTURE!
These people are only human. Ray teaches as God instructs him and I don't think it helps anyone by imagining a soap box to put people on that don't understand something to the extent that either you or Ray do.
--- End quote ---
YAHOO !! I am with you on this ...........you go guy.......ah errr.. friend ;D ((one exemption you can leave me out of any comparison to Ray, I could not even put a 6 piece puzzle together))
If you're with me on this, then you'd have no reason to reply. I don't think you read ANY of what I wrote in the above quote EXCEPT for where I mentoned you.
--- Quote ---Let the moderators determine who is taking the role of a teacher.
your friend,
-Beau
--- End quote ---
A M E N
One last thing can we ALSO let the moderators determine who is taking the role of a hierlings as well ??
Honestly Rodger, you can call yourself whatever you wish.
your pal, your bud
Rodger
--- End quote ---
I hope that you eventually see that I wrote to you in my original post for the purpose of letting you know how inapropriate your attitude is about how and when people learn. they are doing their best in GOD's timing. I've heard nicer posts on myspace. When you start to cut people down, insult, assume, and make rash remarks, you are NOT acting as a loving brother in Christ. Instead of picking apart people's statements, try helping them as your brothers and sisters do, not as Ray responds to his detractors. Will you learn anything from this? I love you brother, I really do, but I see an obvious problem with your attitude concerning what God is doing with his children and When he does it. We are instructed to correct. If you think that I'm portraying myself as some better teacher than Ray, then you really miss the point of instruction and fellowship. What's the point in learning something like "there is no hell" If you can't help others coming in to the truth instead of saying READ, READ, READ. You're correct that the Holy Spirit IS our comforter, but why do you suppose He works THROUGH US?
your friend,
-Beau
Falconn003:
UncleBeau
i have only ONE question left......" WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT ???
Rodger
Ps. go read some more then come back.
seminole:
Hey Falcon, I don't understand some of what you write and why you come across harsh but it is your way and for that I do have respect that you stick with and stand on who and what you believe.
Oblivion582:
I always thought it was weird to have a resurrection...if we were already in heaven, like Christindom teaches. But before I'm to pursaded by Ray's teaching I'd like to know the answer to Matthew 22:32.....
"I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living."
Any thoughts on this? This is the main verse blocking me from accepting that the dead are, in fact, dead.
Dean Peterman:
Dear Oblivion,
When I first came to this website I sent Ray an e-mail asking about this issue of the immortal soul. Here is what he wrote to me:
Dear Dean: See HELL Part C for a detailed discussion on the subject of the human SOUL.
God be with you,
Ray
I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living."
Remember, this is a response to the Sadducees who say there is no resurrection. The Sadducees believed that when people die they stay dead. Jesus is showing them that they are wrong about the resurrection. He was not telling them that they have an immortal soul. I too used to think this verse was teaching the existence of an immortal soul but came to see after much study that I was making an unwarranted assumption.
I believed in the doctrine of an immortal soul for many years but can now see after much study that there are multitudes of reasons for rejecting this belief. The best thing you can do is continue to study. Read Hell Part C if you have not already read it. You will find it very helpful. I don’t think Ray discusses this verse specifically but the article will give you a lot of insight on this doctrine.
Sincerely,
Dean
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