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[nightmare sasuke]

1Ti 2:4  Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

I have heard some people say this verse means "desire" and not "will" in an active sense. Can any of you shed some more light on the verses meaning?

[nightmare sasuke]

Hi Nightmare,

The Greek word used in this verse is thelo, (Strong's 2309) which means to will.  Strong's also gives as definitions "to wish" or "desire".  I really don't like arguing semantics, so I will just say this:  some translations try to water it down to a weak wish (one that Christendom thinks will never be fulfilled), but however it's translated, God gets what he wants.

"For I am God, and there is no other; I am God, and there is none like Me, declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times things that are not yet done, saying, 'My counsel shall stand, and I will do all My pleasure,' calling a bird of prey from the east, the man who executes My counsel, from a far country.  Indeed I have spoken it; I will also bring it to pass.  I have purposed it; I will also do it."
(Isaiah 46:9-11)

Do you know of any other verses like Isaiah 46:9-11?

[rvhill]

I agree with Isabell, God will do what he wishes and all his desire. For we who are limited there is a difference between wishes and desires, and reality. For God there is no difference between what he wishes and desires, and reality.  So it does not matter how some tries to weaken the verse. 1Ti 2:4 Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.  So in the end it does not matter one bit if the verse is will, wish, or desires for God they are all the same.

[hillsbororiver]

I am in total agreement with Isabell & RV, God's will and/or desire will be done;

 Mat 26:42  He went away again the second time, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if this cup may not pass away from me, except I drink it, thy will2307 be done.

G2307
θέλημα
thelēma
thel'-ay-mah
From the prolonged form of G2309; a determination (properly the thing), that is, (actively) choice (specifically purpose, decree; abstractly volition) or (passively) inclination: - desire, pleasure, will.

Here is more evidence that when the word  "will" or "desire" is used in regard to God there is no question as to whether it is going to come to pass or not.

Luk 11:2  And he said unto them, When ye pray, say, Our Father which art in heaven, Hallowed be thy name. Thy kingdom come. Thy will be done1096, as in heaven, so in earth.

G1096
γίνομαι
ginomai
ghin'-om-ahee
A prolonged and middle form of a primary verb; to cause to be (“gen� -erate), that is, (reflexively) to become (come into being), used with great latitude (literally, figuratively, intensively, etc.): - arise be assembled, be (come, -fall, -have self), be brought (to pass), (be) come (to pass), continue, be divided, be done, draw, be ended, fall, be finished, follow, be found, be fulfilled, + God forbid, grow, happen, have, be kept, be made, be married, be ordained to be, partake, pass, be performed, be published, require, seem, be showed, X soon as it was, sound, be taken, be turned, use, wax, will, would, be wrought.


more Greek definitions;


thel'-o, eth-el'-o
Either the first or the second form may be used. In certain tenses θελέω theleō  thel-eh'-o (and ἐθέλέω  etheleō eth-el-eh'-o) are used, which are otherwise obsolete; apparently strengthened from the alternate form of G138; to determine (as an active voice option from subjective impulse; whereas G1014 properly denotes rather a passive voice acquiescence in objective considerations), that is, choose or prefer (literally or figuratively); by implication to wish, that is, be inclined to (sometimes adverbially gladly); impersonally for the future tense, to be about to; by Hebraism to delight in: - desire, be disposed (forward), intend, list, love, mean, please, have rather, (be) will (have, -ling, -ling [ly]).


 
Το λεξικό βρήκε 1 λέξη.
The dictionary found 1 word.


 
θέλω =  to will desire
thelo


desire;

or-eg'-om-ahee
Middle voice of apparently a prolonged form of an obsolete primary (compare G3735); to stretch oneself, that is, reach out after (long for): - covet after, desire.