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Craig

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« on: July 24, 2007, 10:02:31 AM »

I answered this in a thread, but decided to post it here so nobody would miss it.


Quote
I love this forum but I am getting a little weary of some posters' constant "attempts" to be "sarcastic" like Jesus.

Diana,

You make a good point.  Sarcasm is a two edge sword.  When Jesus used it, it was to upbraid the religious scholars and teachers of his time.  These were the ones who were leading the people to destruction.  Also Jesus was perfect and did not have to worry about the "plank" in his eye.

Ray uses sarcasm when answering the religious "scholars" of our time.  They may not be preachers and teachers, but they are spouting doctrine that is completely false.  When a person writes Ray with questions that are searching and trying to understand, Ray does not generally answer with sarcasm.  Much is due to discernment that Ray is given. 

When a person comes to the forum, and you suspect that it is a person who does not share our beliefs.  It is helpful to us as moderators for the membership to "try the spirits" with pointed questions.  As we have said, with enough rope this person will eventually "hang" themselves.  But, BUT I wish the membership would leave it to the moderators to show these persons the door, and not take it upon themselves to drive them away with personal attacks and sarcasm.  If we want to throw "stones" are we any better than the "religious types" of Jesus' time? 

The moderators will start deleting posts that attack another poster.  Ask questions, turn up the heat with pointed questions if you feel led, but leave it to the moderators to decide if a person belongs or not.

The moderators have probably been asleep at the switch lately, for that I apologize. 

Craig
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seminole

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« Reply #1 on: July 24, 2007, 11:59:34 AM »

Craig, don't beat yourself up! Your response was great! You got a life too and you know anytime people get together whether at a church, on-line or even in their homes there is going to be disagreements. Brother, You are doing good.
Nole
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John9362

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« Reply #2 on: July 24, 2007, 12:51:28 PM »

The moderators have probably been asleep at the switch lately, for that I apologize. 

"ASLEEP" you say....I can hear the SNORING all the way to Down Under "Australia" :D :D :D :D
JUST KIDDING...You Craig and all the other Mod's do a GREAT JOB....for that I thank you and our God !! ;)

John9362



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UncleBeau

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« Reply #3 on: July 24, 2007, 01:16:22 PM »

I still don't know how they manage to do so much with what seems to be so little time  ;D I have a hard enough time to get anything done outside of work!
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skydreamers

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« Reply #4 on: July 24, 2007, 02:12:30 PM »

Hi Craig,

Thank you for your post.   As moderators you guys have a tough job, and I think you are all awesome at it.  God has put you in those positions for good reason! ;) 

I know there are people who show up here posing as "scholars" and trying to show us all the errors in our beliefs.  This just happened recently and you guys handled it well.  (And there are some of us who occasionally have spurts of fancying ourselves as scholars.  ;D

I also know that people here, especially long time posters, have good hearts, and even when they are being critical their intentions are good.  As moderators you would know this, but the newbies and guests may not.  But at the end of the day, you just can't make everyone happy! 

So my hats off to the moderators and my prayers are with you for your continued discernment.



Peace,
Diana

 
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bambam

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« Reply #5 on: July 24, 2007, 02:27:45 PM »

I appreciate the moderators efforts!  I am fairly new here and I have had a few questions, and there are always one or two mods that help me out.  How they find time to do it I don't know, but I am very grateful for that precious time!! 

Blessings,
Beth
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iris

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« Reply #6 on: July 24, 2007, 05:35:11 PM »

Thanks moderators for all you do!!!




Iris
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SteveW

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« Reply #7 on: July 26, 2007, 04:29:18 PM »

Thought I would sketch a cartoon...



SteveW
« Last Edit: July 26, 2007, 04:34:44 PM by SteveW »
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Harryfeat

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« Reply #8 on: July 26, 2007, 05:00:24 PM »

Hey Steve,


What a remarkable gift you have!!  You completely captured the essence of the concern.
I am sure that I have read a few of Larry Longwool's posts here and there.  Uses different names of course but still recognizable.  Thanks for the grins

Moderators take a bow for all the work you do to keep this board running.  A word of thanks and encouragement is little enough for all you do.  Thank you!!! Thank you!!! Thank you!!!

feat
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hillsbororiver

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« Reply #9 on: July 26, 2007, 05:34:19 PM »

Thanks for the kind words folks, it is very nice to hear. The truth be told we (moderators) are doing a labor of love and the best thanks we get, the biggest rewards we receive are when the membership edifies each other and seeks understanding in an attempt to build up the Body of Christ.

I agree with feat, that is a great gift of art being displayed by you Steve as well as a timely message!

By the way it is great to see you feat, it helped to make my day yesterday when I realized you were here!

Thanks again everyone,

Joe
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SteveW

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Re: Posts
« Reply #10 on: July 27, 2007, 11:00:06 AM »

Thanks, Feat and Joe. Its a gift I don't get to use much.  Last night my wife suggested I try to illustrate the themes of bible-truths. Wow, I'm not sure where I would begin, but - perhaps - she planted a seed.  If God wants it to happen, it will.

It's been a while since I've seen your posts, Feat, but I seem to remember many in the past - you have an unforgettable handle.

Joe, I don't think the moderators have been as leap at all.  It seems to me more of a case of a very few - and some in just a very few instances - not abiding the forum rules and not paying attention to to the mods.  The beast occasionally arises in us all.  One just can't make the forum totally insular, and that's OK.  I think you guys do a good job at keeping this community in balance.  Thanks.

SteveW
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Dean Peterman

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« Reply #11 on: July 28, 2007, 03:43:39 PM »

Doesn't Jesus speak only in parables?
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josh

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« Reply #12 on: July 28, 2007, 04:00:50 PM »

Dean,

Here is an explanation of the way Jesus used parables from Ray's "Twelve Truth's" Paper. Hopefully this will wet your appetite to read the rest, it's my favorite!

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TRUTH NUMBER 2

(A) "All these things spoke Jesus unto the multitude in PARABLES; and without a parable spoke He not unto them" (Matt. 13:34).

(B) "But without a PARABLE spoke He not unto them…" (Mark 4:34).

(C) "This PARABLE spoke Jesus unto them: but they understood not what things they were which He spoke unto them" (John 10:6).

Jesus taught in parables only, and no one understood His parables, hence Jesus taught in a way that He knew no one would understand His message. This truth of Scripture is so revolutionary to the minds of most Christians that many will think it blasphemy, and yet the Scriptures abound with statements that fully support it.

I heard Matt Croach (elder son of TBN President, Paul Croach) state on international television that Jesus spoke in parables to make the meaning of His teachings simple and clear and understandable to the simple farmers and uneducated people of Judea. My Wycliffe Bible Dictionary has a similar explanation: "Purpose of parables. The obvious purpose of Jesus’ use of parables was to make spiritual truth clear and compelling." What a crock.

Is anyone interested in what Jesus Himself had to say about His use of Parables? Good. Here it is:

"And the disciples came, and said unto Him, Why do you speak unto them in parables? He answered and said unto them, Because it is given unto you to know the mysteries of the kingdom of heaven, but unto them it is not given" (Matt. 13:10-11).

Now then, does anyone see any similarity between "to make spiritual truth clear and compelling," and "…but unto them it is not given?" No? Neither do I. What I see is a diametric opposite. What I see is a flat out contradiction between Christian teachers and the Word of God.

"Jesus spoke in parables to make His quaint little stories clear and understandable to the uneducated farmers of Judea," my foot: "and when the chief priests and Pharisees had heard His parables, they perceived that He spoke of them" (Matt. 21:45). The Chief Priests and Pharisees were generally highly educated people. But even they didn’t know what Jesus’ parables really meant, but they on one occasion at least, "perceived" that Jesus was speaking about them.

So surely, if Jesus’ parables were "clear and compelling" to the uneducated farmers of Judea, then they would be even more so to His own disciples, not?

"Then Jesus sent the multitude away, and went into the house: and His disciples came unto Him, saying, Declare [expound, define, explain] unto us the parable of the tares of the field" (Matt. 13:36).

Even Jesus’ Own disciples had to have these parables explained to them. And just how did Jesus "declare" these parables to His Own disciples? You wouldn’t believe me if I told you. You wouldn’t believe me if I showed you. Okay, here’s how Jesus explained His parable. He explained His parable to His disciples by telling them ANOTHER PARABLE! I told you that you wouldn’t believe me. More on this later.

This is another one of those marvelous spiritual truths of Scripture, which you will never hear explained in the Church. Just what do they teach all these future clergymen in seminary? The fact is, Jesus did not want the people to understand Him and Jesus did not want them to repent and Jesus did not want to spiritually heal or save them. He clearly said so. But why? Because God has a plan that involves calling MANY, but choosing out only a FEW.

"For whosoever has, to him shall be given, and he shall have more abundance: but whosoever has not, from him shall be taken away even that he has" (Matt. 13:12).

Does anyone understand what Jesus just said here? Probably not too many, for this too, is a parable explaining a parable—and no one understood either. I wish they would let me teach a few classes at seminary.

"Therefore speak I to them in parables, because they seeing, see not; and hearing they hear not, neither do they understand. And in them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah… for this people’s heart is waxed gross, and their ears are dull of hearing, and their eyes they have closed; lest at any time they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should BE CONVERTED, AND I SHOULD HEAL [SAVE] THEM" (Verses 13-15).

Wow! Jesus didn’t want them to understand and He didn’t want to convert them and He didn’t want to save them. How could Isaiah’s prophecy be true if Jesus were to contradict it by teaching them plainly so that they could understand and repent? Now, that’s what Jesus said, and that’s what Isaiah said, but there’s a problem:

"But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Isaiah said, Lord, who has believed our report?" (Rom. 10:16).

Yes, who? Have you believed this report I have just given you? It is almost frightening how few truly believe God’s Scriptural reports. Hence, precious few believe and understand the Scriptures, and fewer yet, obey them.

There is good news, however, concerning the Parables, which virtually no one understands, and it is this:

"And when He was alone, they that were about Him with the twelve asked of Him the parable. And He said unto them, Unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God, but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables." (Mark 4:10-11).

I have never met a Christian in my life that believes this verse. Not one. They all have told me that Jesus spoke many times, in fact most of the time, in plain language to the multitudes and the people, and not in parables only.

Hey, I’m glad that it is they who are contradicting Jesus and not I. Add to this denial the heresy that anyone can at any time, accept Jesus and believe, and then be saved. Jesus says they can’t; the Church says regardless of what Jesus says, they can. Who ya gonna believe?

Continuing:

"That seeing they may see, and not perceive: and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted and their sins should be forgiven them. And He said unto them. Know ye not this parable? And how then will you know all parables?" (Verse 12-13).

Say, did you get that? If you would know but one parable, you would know all parables! This is because all parables are speaking of the same subject, just presented from different perspectives. Wouldn’t you just love to know just one parable so that you could know all parables?

What is so utterly amazing is that not only does the Church not understand all of the parables of Jesus, but, they do not even understand the parables which Jesus explained. I assure you that I am as serious as I could ever be when I say that. In a future paper I will explain what all the parables mean. But for now, just understand, that Jesus’ entire ministry was preached in such a way that no one would understand Him, except to those very few to whom it was later (much later—see Truth Number 3) given to understand. Pray that God will grant you spiritual understanding of His parables, or you too, will "…understand not."


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God's Peace.
Josh
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Dean Peterman

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« Reply #13 on: July 28, 2007, 04:07:15 PM »

Thanks Josh
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josh

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« Reply #14 on: July 28, 2007, 05:44:42 PM »

My pleasure Dean, Hope it helped.
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