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[hillsbororiver]

Eze 11:19  And I will give them one heart and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh and will give them a heart of flesh:

Eze 36:26  A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh and I will give you a heart of flesh.

Eze 36:27  And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and ye shall keep my judgments and do them.

What do these verses mean to you? As with virtually all the Scriptures there is depth and texture and multiple truths contained within a few words.

Notice the "cause you" to walk in God's statutes, no hint of any free will here or anything we can claim to do on our very own. If it is good it comes from Him.

When we first felt that "pull" from the Lord or the "dragging" process did it seem that there was some revolutionary change you were experiencing? I mean did you feel like things were somehow turned upside down, the comfort level we/you had grown accustomed to dissipate?

After coming to the real Good News of the Gospel have you felt more empathy toward others? I know at one time most people I ran across held no real value to me, unless they were a relative, or an old friend or someone who had something I wanted, people were pretty much non entities to me. I know this sounds cold, but it is true.

Even though I always liked animals as I grew into my teens and adulthood I did not hold them in the highest regard either unless of course they were my own pets.

A few years before I "stumbled" onto Bible Truths I started noticing a change in my perception of people, I started to see reasons to empathize with just about everyone I had contact with, for some reason their dashed hopes or realizations and even the successes they enjoyed became important or at least made an impact, I thought I was going soft in the head.

This started even extending to animals, I seemed to become cognizant or sensitive to what the conditions or environment of the cats, dogs, birds, even wild life experience, now I knew I was going soft in the head.

Reading these verses it struck me that the changes in my "stony heart" began a couple years before the Lord blessed me with access to the Spiritual Truths He revealed to Ray, now I can see that at least in my case He  began the transformation of my "heart of stone" in preparation for His gift of spiritual eyes as well.

The narrow path we are on is primarily a One on one walk with the Lord, each of our experiences are unique and designed for the very purpose He is creating us for, no two earthly things are exactly the same I am sure the same applies to the spiritual.

His Peace to you,

Joe
 

 

[YellowStone]

Hi Joe, You have yet again caused me to stop and really think.

The Scriptures you posted say a lot and I thought I would comment on them first.

Eze 18:31  Cast away from you all your transgressions, whereby ye have transgressed; and make you a new heart and a new spirit: for why will ye die, O house of Israel?

Eze 18:32  For I have no pleasure in the death of him that dieth, saith the Lord GOD: wherefore turn [yourselves], and live ye.  

I see the preceding two verses as a heart being promised unconditionally yet not inevitably. This seems to tie in very well with the following words of Paul.

Phl 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.

Phl 2:13 For it is God which worketh in you both to will and to do of [his] good pleasure. 

We must never fall in the trap of assuming once given, never taken away. I think Craig metioned this very well in another thread. God can and will put obstacles in our path; some which we might no be able to conquer, according to his will.

I know what you mean about seeing things differenty upon receiving a new heart. I went through several years of severe dark depression, I realized that no one knew me, I wasn't even sure they could see me. Yet as I groped around in my darkness, I began to discover (as it was revealed) a part of me that I hadn't known before and I began to see things differently. The one thing that was the most impactful for me was learning that I knew no one either. Like, that youg guy driving a brand new car, was he rich or did he use his inheritance because his dad just died.

Every event, encounter took on a muititude of possible dimensions. It was like nothing made sense, but then everything made sense. People are more than the moment in which we see or hear them; who knows what pain or tragedy lead them to this point, if indeed any. Quite frankly I learned that I knew nothing and who am I to judge another.

To me, this was prehaps Gods greatest revelation to me, that being that the "I" in who I am was not nearly as important as I previously thought. I like how you mentioned animals and being sensitive to their conditions, I know what you mean. The whole world took on a new form.

Great post Joe, I hope this makes sense

Love in Christ,
Darren

[bambam]

Joe,

Interesting post!  When I started to read bibletruths, my eyes were opened to seeing other people more and more.  I don't think I cared as much before hand.  I never really thought about the ramifications of hell on the people of this world (except myself-I was terrified to go there!).   But, after my own struggle to find the Truth and finding bibletruths, I realize that all people, all of creation is right where God wants it and I marvel. 

I see a woman walking down the street looking sad, or a mom trying to deal with her wild kids in the store, or a man sunk down in his car with the music blaring, bopping his head around, and I don't feel sorry for, or pity, or get annoyed by them.  My heart leaps for joy at the thought that all is of God!   Not for myself, but for those people who I used to pity, and feel sorry for because they didn't probably know Jesus and I was too scared to tell them about Him. 

Now I am not as scared to tell people about who He is because there is no Hell.  I was always ashamed to tell people about Hell, because of the awful place that it would be, and I had to tell them that they would go there if they did not get saved.  I did very little of that in my life that's for sure. 

I think I strayed from the subject a bit.    Sorry. 

Your post just spoke to me, and to think that God is working on EVERYONE at different levels to bring them eventually to the same place is amazing!  Truly amazing!  Why would people not want this to be the Truth! 

Thanks for this post!
Beth 

[D Student]

 WOW!!!
             We ALL know that Ray writes some amazing stuff and draws many people to the Site, but
     Hillsbororiver and YellowStone do also show alot of DEEP points on the GOOD NEWS...

     Some would call them,,, the Next Step Brothers. Or maybe just me...  Thanks.

                                                                                                          D Student

 P.s.  And ofcourse GOD is ALL-in-ALL...
       

[Beloved]

Yes these are great scriptures

(Eze 11:19 KJV+) 
And I will give5414 them one259 heart,3820 and I will put5414 a new2319 spirit7307 within7130 you; and I will take5493 the stony68 heart3820 out of their flesh,4480, 1320 and will give5414 them a heart3820 of flesh:1320

I noticed that the the second word flesh is a different word

H1320 בּשׂר
bâśâr
baw-sawr'
From H1319; flesh (from its freshness); by extension body, person; also (by euphemism) the pudenda of a man: - body, [fat, lean] flesh [-ed], kin, [man-] kind, + nakedness, self, skin.

He takes the hard (non compassionate self serving, cold )heart out of their flesh and gives them  a heart of softness/ nakedness

That is why you walk in HIs statues because you see yourself as you really are.
Naked and helpless .  You see that Everything is of God and that every thing is for His Glory.

Beloved

[Brett]

Good post, Joe. I understand the meaning of God's cause and man have no free will. But these verses you brought is difficult understand or puzzle me, see my bolds:

Eze 11:19  And I will give them one heart and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh and will give them a heart of flesh:

Eze 36:26  A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh and I will give you a heart of flesh.

Is that about future of resurrection? Because it said "new spirit", similar as resurrection with spiritual body. But these verses looks like resurrection with flesh to me. I know that in N.T. said that no flesh and blood will into enter Kingdom of God. Flesh has to be destroyed first then new spiritual body. But Ezek. 11:19;36:26? It can't be resurrection with flesh, it must be something else than is about resurrection, does it? Like parable or something?

Brett

[Robin]

Eze 11:19  And I will give them one heart and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh and will give them a heart of flesh:

Eze 36:26  A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh and I will give you a heart of flesh.

Eze 36:27  And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and ye shall keep my judgments and do them.

What do these verses mean to you?

I can't explain what the verses mean to me, but they are very important to me and have been the hope that helped me endure. God gave me those verses as a promise when all I could see at the time was the smoking Mt Sinai and the law I could not keep. 50 days after the first passover was the giving of the law. 50 days after Christ's death was the giving of the Spirit. We are sealed and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts if we are the elect. I believe Ray says this is a deposit of that which is to come. I think he said it on one of his audios. I experienced slavery like that in Egypt, the great falling away when looking at the law and a glimpse of the promised land through the verses. The verses represent hope in the wilderness to me.



Zechariah 7
9Thus speaketh the LORD of hosts, saying, Execute true judgment, and shew mercy and compassions every man to his brother:

 10And oppress not the widow, nor the fatherless, the stranger, nor the poor; and let none of you imagine evil against his brother in your heart.

 11But they refused to hearken, and pulled away the shoulder, and stopped their ears, that they should not hear.

 12Yea, they made their hearts as an adamant stone, lest they should hear the law, and the words which the LORD of hosts hath sent in his spirit by the former prophets: therefore came a great wrath from the LORD of hosts.

 13Therefore it is come to pass, that as he cried, and they would not hear; so they cried, and I would not hear, saith the LORD of hosts:

 14But I scattered them with a whirlwind among all the nations whom they knew not. Thus the land was desolate after them, that no man passed through nor returned: for they laid the pleasant land desolate.

2 Corinthians 3:2-4
 2Ye are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read of all men:

 3Forasmuch as ye are manifestly declared to be the epistle of Christ ministered by us, written not with ink, but with the Spirit of the living God; not in tables of stone, but in fleshy tables of the heart.

Hebrews 8:10 and Jeremiah 31:32-34
32Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the LORD:

 33But this shall be the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel; After those days, saith the LORD, I will put my law in their inward parts, and write it in their hearts; and will be their God, and they shall be my people.

 34And they shall teach no more every man his neighbour, and every man his brother, saying, Know the LORD: for they shall all know me, from the least of them unto the greatest of them, saith the LORD: for I will forgive their iniquity, and I will remember their sin no more.

Hebrews 10
 15Whereof the Holy Ghost also is a witness to us: for after that he had said before,

 16This is the covenant that I will make with them after those days, saith the Lord, I will put my laws into their hearts, and in their minds will I write them;

 17And their sins and iniquities will I remember no more.

2 Corinthians 1:
 21Now he which stablisheth us with you in Christ, and hath anointed us, is God;

 22Who hath also sealed us, and given the earnest of the Spirit in our hearts.


Hebrews 12
 18For ye are not come unto the mount that might be touched, and that burned with fire, nor unto blackness, and darkness, and tempest,

 19And the sound of a trumpet, and the voice of words; which voice they that heard intreated that the word should not be spoken to them any more:

 20(For they could not endure that which was commanded, And if so much as a beast touch the mountain, it shall be stoned, or thrust through with a dart:

 21And so terrible was the sight, that Moses said, I exceedingly fear and quake:)

 22But ye are come unto mount Sion, and unto the city of the living God, the heavenly Jerusalem, and to an innumerable company of angels,

 23To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,

 24And to Jesus the mediator of the new covenant, and to the blood of sprinkling, that speaketh better things than that of Abel.

 25See that ye refuse not him that speaketh. For if they escaped not who refused him that spake on earth, much more shall not we escape, if we turn away from him that speaketh from heaven:

 26Whose voice then shook the earth: but now he hath promised, saying, Yet once more I shake not the earth only, but also heaven.

 27And this word, Yet once more, signifieth the removing of those things that are shaken, as of things that are made, that those things which cannot be shaken may remain.

 28Wherefore we receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved, let us have grace, whereby we may serve God acceptably with reverence and godly fear:

 29For our God is a consuming fire.

[hillsbororiver]

Thank you Everyone for your responses,

I don't have the time to respond to all of you presently but I would like to tackle Brett's question, Beloved made a great point about the "second flesh" spoken of in these verses.

Good post, Joe. I understand the meaning of God's cause and man have no free will. But these verses you brought is difficult understand or puzzle me, see my bolds:

Eze 11:19  And I will give them one heart and I will put a new spirit within you; and I will take the stony heart out of their flesh and will give them a heart of flesh:

Eze 36:26  A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh and I will give you a heart of flesh.

Is that about future of resurrection? Because it said "new spirit", similar as resurrection with spiritual body. But these verses looks like resurrection with flesh to me. I know that in N.T. said that no flesh and blood will into enter Kingdom of God. Flesh has to be destroyed first then new spiritual body. But Ezek. 11:19;36:26? It can't be resurrection with flesh, it must be something else than is about resurrection, does it? Like parable or something?

Brett

What we are given now is the earnest728 of His Spirit, remember Ray writing about how in this flesh we are not born again we are conceived again in His Spirit. You are right Brett, flesh and blood does not inherit the Kingdom (but we receive a down payment), that inheritence is paid in full at resurrection.

 G728
ἀῤῥαβών
arrhabōn
ar-hrab-ohn'
Of Hebrew origin [H6162]; a pledge, that is, part of the purchase money or property given in advance as security for the rest: - earnest.


2Co 1:22  Who hath also sealed us and given the earnest728 of the Spirit in our hearts.

2Co 5:5  Now he that hath wrought us for the selfsame thing is God, who also hath given unto us the earnest728 of the Spirit.

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe

[Chris R]

Hi Joe,

 I like so many others have a much lighter heart concerning all of makind, And look at everyone differently than i did just a few yeas ago.

It is the second half of this verse i find facinating, and revealing.

Eze 36:27  And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes and ye shall keep my judgments and do them.

Not only are we caused to walk in Gods statutes, Not only are we caused to keep his judgements..BUT..We are caused to DO THEM...

When is it that we keep his judgements?..But even more than that..When is it that we must DO these judgements?

Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters? [1Cor 6:2]

A thought to ponder.

Chris R.

[hillsbororiver]

Hi Chris,

Interesting point you raise, could this be what Malachi is speaking about here?

Mal 3:16  Then they that feared the LORD spoke often one to another: and the LORD hearkened, and heard and a book of remembrance was written before him for them that feared the LORD and that thought upon his name.
 
Mal 3:17  And they shall be mine, saith the LORD of hosts, in that day when I make up my jewels; and I will spare them, as a man spareth his own son that serveth him.
 
Mal 3:18  Then shall ye return, and discern between the righteous and the wicked, between him that serveth God and him that serveth him not.

This process of discernment starting at our conception (by His Spirit), growing as we journey with Him as we interact with the brethren, finally culminating to full maturity at the resurrection to immortality , do you see this too?

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe

[Kat]

Hi Joe,

I like what is being brought out here.
It has caused me to consider what my outlook is now opposed to what it use to be. 
I guess the way I use to think, had to do with believing we had a free will and were determining our own path.  I would get frustrated thinking things were happening, that did not have to happen.  As in people were making choices to do wrong things and cause problems and suffering, that did not have to happen.
Since I have been brought into the knowledge of the truth and had my eyes opened to the myth of free will, now I know that God causes all things.

Phi 2:13  For it is God who works in you both to will and to do of His good pleasure.

All the truths I have been learning has so very much effected the way I look at things.  But as soon as I read that man does not have a free will, I think that was what made a big difference in the way I feel about others and has given me a whole different way to look at their actions.

So we need a new heart that when He starts teaching us His truths, that we can believe these things, and as you were saying;

This process of discernment starting at our conception (by His Spirit), growing as we journey with Him as we interact with the brethren, finally culminating to full maturity at the resurrection to immortality

I think that is the way I see it too.  The more we learn of the truth and the more we interact with others and put these truths into practice, these experiences mature us towards being ready to stand before Him.

mercy, peace, and love
Kat

[Deborah-Leigh]

Chris R

You ask....When is it that we must DO these judgements?

We must do these judgements when we are in the world interacting with the worldly. We must do these judgements when asked, questioned, challenged. We must interact I believe as Ray does with his detractors, hypocrites and abusers that come to test, refute and outright hate the Word of God. We have also to discern who is searching and answer in the gentle tones of edification where necessary. These two go hand in hand.

A few days ago a minister came to my shop. He opened a conversation because he saw the Concordance and several Bibles on my desk. He asked which Church I go to. I answered that on neither this mountain or on that mountain but in Spirit and in Truth is my Church. He challenged me and said to my face, so you do not assemble with the brethren. I challenged him right back and replied " So you know me do you?"  He tried the same conclusion a few sentences later after back peddling and again I said " So you know me do you?" I left him with the fact that Jesus said when you pray go into your closet and do not do as the hypocrite does. I said to him the Churches have their reward and they all pray outside the closet. I felt in my soul that this really touched  him and he will not be able to shake the fact that the Truth was said and he heard it. He left the shop and I felt sad for him. When he said he did not know me, of course he doesn't know me but I also felt it was Christ that he does not know for the Church preaches and teaches another Jesus.

It is one thing to be among like minded brethren, but in the world, that is where we have to be hot or cold, and do the walk not just talk the talk. We have to risk opposition, persecution and ridicule. Humanity is the beast is what we are taught by Ray in Who is the Beast.... some are coming out and are needing to hear the Truth. Few there are who will risk telling it.

Ray Smith tells it on the global internet. What is it to us to be ready in all seasons to tell one or two here or there that come and ask us or challenge or question us. How little is that in the bigger picture?

The harvest is great.....

Peace to you

Arcturus

[Beloved]

Correction
I made a mistake in my post..... there are not two flesh words, both are 1320



Beloved

[YellowStone]

Arcturus, I just want to tell you that your post spoke to me so deeply. I am so impressed with how you handled the minister and your reponse of: " So you know me do you?"  is priceless and I mean this with all sincerity.

I will surely remember these words and the spirit in which they are to be given. Thank you so much for sharing this. 

Love in Christ the Lamb,

Darren

[Deborah-Leigh]

Darren

It certainly was a gutsy inspired retort that was also risky being said straight in the face of a complete stranger not as a off the cuff remark but as a direct question demanding a direct answer not in any aggressive manner but in a hey...I will answer you if you answer me. This question was really inspired I believe, and by so saying in such an up front in your face way this also brought forward the fact that the minister was judging and condemning and that he had no authority to do so! What a dire and uncomfortable position to be exposed in not once but twice.  Without trying to teach him a thing, this gave him a real slap across the proverbial face to wake him up in his soul.

I almost could not believe the exchange but it did leave me both heart wrenched, amazed and inspired all at the same time. What struck me was that blind people are really not so terrifying after all and on a sadder leaning, if Jesus had said to him, who was speaking through me, so you know Me do you? the minister he had to say no twice.... That was hard for me on the one hand but on the other, he had been touched and the truth was spoken and he got it and I believe that. That is my comfort.

It was not for me to do or see more ....but it left me thinking of Ray and how he must feel when the Truth he speaks cuts into the darkness of his detractors with light undeniable. It is a good thing requiring risk of rejection or even pain to see that they turn away, go their way, trying to forget....

As for the minister, I know the Lord was at work in the heart of this person who came to my shop and I feel so grateful to have been able to experience this first time...in your face....way that shakes of the darkness of spiritual sloth, apathy and deception.

It is strange but three other people have been to my shop and opened conversation concerning the teachings of Babylon. I have not said anything but I remain on guard to not agree with any of their beliefs or their understanding and when called for agreement I refute with what I know, breaking down what they think is the truth and I have felt my soul rise up every time to the occasion. It is really wonderful. It happened again today. Only a few blocks of deception could be taken down in todays conversation though. Well...at least that was something!  Perhaps that is why God put me in a shop....

Peace to you

Arcturus

[YellowStone]

Arcturus, that Christ was with you then and with you still is very obvious to me.

Yes you jolted him, shocked him; yet you never degraded him. There is a lesson in your words for us all. Once again thank you for sharing your Christ sharing given experience.

Love In Christ the Lamb,
Darren

[Deborah-Leigh]

Peace to you Darren.

Your words are very precious.

Arcturus

[ez2u]

Here is a scripture i was looking at this week about how Noah judged the world.Heb 11:7                                                                                                    Being divinely warned by God about the things not yet having been seen, moved with fear, by faith Noah prepared an ark for the salvation of his house; through which he condemned the world and became heir of the righteousness according to faith. 

It raised questions in my mind of dispensations.  I believe that there are the chosen now and will be and has been.
When I came to Rays' teaching it was good to read what I had thought was true.  But my understanding did not come from studding the word of God for hours.  I do read the Bible but very little studding.  It came by the Holy Spirit, quickening it to me.  I was very happy to see all the scripture verses and the in depth students of Gods Word.  Nothing has eased the the wilderness that my life has taken in the last 22 years.  I believe I was a stronger christian when I was Just 5 years in to my new life in Christ than now. My heart sang for Joy as i held my babies in my arms. Now I am in a prison of almost solitary confinement as my husband hates to hear the word of God and almost all my  brothers and sister in Christ has moved away or died.  Thanks for listening I need to get that off my chest.  COME LORD JESUS!  I have started to study the word with esword and other helps.  Every thing in my life has changed and my desires and priorities most of all.  Things have seem to melt away that wasn't as important when Jon was in a coma and Josh became mentally ill.  I do not regard myself as chosen just because I have suffered.  Many people have suffer and are not chosen.  To me that is all in the Lords doing.  Just because one knows, studies profusely or suffers greatly, about such things doesn't necessitates chosen.  A little girl in Iraq could be chosen who barely understands all this.  these things are in Christ's hands and i have the daily task of my world to do.  The most important issue at hand for me is obedience.  Peggy

[Kat]

Hi Peggy,

This life can certainly be difficult.  But I do believe God is preparing us through our experiences for something.  And then coming to the truth and finding it to be a very lonely walk, I think it makes us turn to Him all the more.

Your final statement; The most important issue at hand for me is obedience.
I put up a transcript of a Bible study on 'Worship in Spirit and Truth'  That is the very point that Ray made in that study.  His final statement was;  But obedience, that is where it is at.  Sometimes we come short, I know.  But there is no doubt in my mind, that's what it’s all about, and I know what it’s all about.

mercy, peace, and love
Kat

[Rene]

Kat & Peggy,

Hebrews 5:8 came to mind in reference to your comments.  Speaking of Jesus, it states: "Although He was a son, He learned obedience through what He suffered." There is a direct correlation between suffering and obedience. 

Regardless, it all starts with the heart.  Unless the Lord blesses us with a renewed spiritual heart, we cannot do anything righteous anyway .

Rene'