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FOR WHAT DID PAUL VOLUNTEER?

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hillsbororiver:
FOR WHAT DID PAUL VOLUNTEER?

All who will have a part with Christ when He comes to rule this earth in His kingdom must volunteer for judgment now! Remember how Paul volunteered: "What will You have me to do?" But just what was Paul volunteering to do?

Was he volunteering to be praised and adored by the public?

Was he volunteering to wear thousand-dollar suits, $500 shoes, $20,000 Rolex watches, drive $80,000 automobiles, live in multimillion dollar multiple homes, fly in private executive jets, and collect millions and millions and millions of dollars of poor people’s money to promote the gospel of prosperity and worldliness?

Did our Lord tell Paul that his ministry and calling would be a "walk in the park" with never-ending comforts and pleasures, having medals and honors bestowed upon him by the leaders and dignitaries of pagan nations, living in a five and a half-million dollar mansion large enough to be a luxury hotel, while feasting like a fat king in the opulence of Babylonian extravagance?

Is this the description of a successful minister of the Gospel?

Was Paul’s message to all the Gentile nations that they had to give to him (or they would be ROBBING GOD) ten percent of all their gold, silver, salaries, or money, so he could flaunt his worldly and lavish lifestyle in the faces of these poor Christian converts.

Let’s "get real" as they say.

"For I will shew him [Paul] how GREAT things he must SUFFER for my name’s sake" (Acts 9:18).

In II Cor. 11:22-28 we learn that Paul suffered the following:

weariness
jails
blows
deaths (of loved ones, eventually himself)
thirty-nine lashes
flogged with rods
stoned
shipwrecked
day & night in swamp
journeys dangers of rivers dangers of robbers
dangers of his race
dangers of the nations
dangers in the city
dangers in wilderness
dangers in the sea
dangers from false brethren
toil and labor
vigils
famine and thirst
fasts
cold and nakedness 

Besides those things that are without, that which cometh upon me DAILY, the care of ALL THE CHURCHES’!

Add a little "fire" to the above scenario and we might conclude that Paul was being tortured and punished in a Christian hell.

But Paul was not being "punished," he was being "JUDGED," and there is a world of difference. Paul was being made STRONG. Paul was being molded into a SPIRITUAL GIANT! And being trained, educated, purged, perfected into a spiritual giant is NOT a walk in the park!

Was it just Paul that God singled out to endure such hardships and trials? No, we too must partake of the same:

"Confirming the souls of the disciples, and exhorting them to continue in the faith, and that WE [Christians, followers of Christ] MUST through MUCH TRIBULATION [Greek: thlipsis--affliction, troubles, burdens, persecution, anguish] enter into the kingdom of God" (Acts 14:22).

Does your pastor teach that you must go through such things if you are to be a follower of Jesus Christ and rule with Him in the Kingdom of God? Or does he teach that if you are going through just such things that you probably need to get your life in order and repent because you obviously have many, many sins in your life that are bringing on all these troubles and therefore, you are not being blessed of the Lord? Their prosperity gospel of worldliness and gross materialism is a travesty of the gospel of Jesus Christ! I hear this prosperity gospel of worldliness and materialism every time I turn the TV on. But what do the Scriptures say:

Before I continue this train of thought, let me interject that although we are to go through extreme hardship, persecution, and tribulations, God nonetheless, strengthens us so that we can endure these things. It is not God’s purpose to discourage us. We have this promise from God:

"There hath no temptation taken you but such as is common to man: but God is faithful, Who will not suffer you to be tempted above that you are able; but will with the temptation also make a way to escape [Gk: ‘sequel’] that you may be able to bear it" (I Cor. 10:13).

I'll let you check all the many Scriptures of comfort that God gives us even while we are undergoing all our trials and sufferings. Here’s one more good one, however:

"Blessed [Gk: HAPPY] is the man that endures temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the CROWN OF LIFE, which the Lord has promised to them that love Him" (James 1:12).

It is most important that we consider, however, some of the many Scriptures that relate to our suffering, afflictions, and persecutions. This is necessary if we are to ever acquire a deep spiritual understanding of God’s judgment on the world in the lake of fire and second death. As we go through these many Scriptures, be aware of the fact that we are not going through all these things as punishment. God is not punishing us, He is chastening us, and there is a BIG difference.

"And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ; if so be that we SUFFER with Him, that we may be also glorified together" (Rom. 8:17).

"That no man should be moved by these AFFLICTIONS: for yourselves know that we are APPOINTED thereunto" (I Thes. 3:3).

Paul suffered much to get the gospel to the Thessalonians, "... Suffering ... being outraged ... a vast struggle ... [why?] ... We have been TESTED by God to be entrusted with the gospel ... God, Who is TESTING our hearts" (I Thes. 2:1-4, Concordant Literal New Testament).

Then he tells them that they too are "appointed" to such like sufferings and afflictions. Paul praises the faith and endurance of the Thessalonians because of: "... all your PERSECUTIONS and the AFFLICTIONS with which you are bearing ... which you are SUFFERING ... you who are being AFFLICTED ..." (I Thes. 1:5-7).

Now then, was this because the Thessalonians lived in a bad part of town, or bad part of the world, or that they lived at a bad time in history? Or does God bring these things upon all who would follow Christ in all ages?

"Yea, and ALL [in every era] that will live godly in Christ Jesus SHALL SUFFER PERSECUTION" (II Tim. 3:12).

But aren’t all these persecutions and afflictions at the hands of evil men rather than God? For sure wicked men commit many wicked deeds against the true followers of Jesus Christ, but Who is ultimately responsible for ALL things, including the tribulations and persecutions on believers? It is, of course, GOD

"Who works ALL things after the counsel of His Own WILL" (Eph. 1:11).

"So that we ourselves glory in you in the churches of God for your patience and faith in ALL YOUR PERSECUTIONS AND TRIBULATIONS that ye endure; Which is a manifest token [display] of [of WHAT?] ... OF the RIGHTEOUS JUDGMENT [Gk: ‘just judging’] OF GOD!"

And for what grand purpose?

"... that ye may be counted WORTHY OF THE KINGDOM OF GOD, for which ye also SUFFER" (2 Thes. 1:4-5).

Just how much are we expected to give up and suffer for Christ in order to be worthy?

"And a man’s foes shall be they of his own household. He that loveth father or mother more than Me is NOT WORTHY of Me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than Me is NOT WORTHY of Me. And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after Me, IS NOT WORTHY OF ME" (Matt. 10:26-28).

What does God consider a "reasonable" sacrifice to become members of the Family and Kingdom of God?

"I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your BODIES A LIVING SACRIFICE, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service" (Rom. 12:1).

Make no mistake about it; if you will follow Jesus Christ, you will experience many of the hardships spoken of in these Scriptures. I am not saying that it is necessary to teach youngsters in Sunday School these deeper truths of God, but if we adults are to ever go on to maturity in Christ, it’s time to get our heads out of the sand!

The good news is that if we have a volunteering heart and accept the judgments of God on our lives now, we will be sure to avoid the harsher judgment on the whole world reserved for "that day."

"For if we would JUDGE [Gk: diakrino=THROUGH JUDGE, separate thoroughly, to withdraw, discern, judge] OURSELVES [members of the called-out House of God], we should not be judged [Gk: krino=judge, set right, decide, to try, condemn, punish]. But when we are judged [the same Greek word krino as used above with reference to judging the wicked world] we are CHASTENED of the Lord, that we should not be condemned [Gk: katakrino, an adverse sentence] with the world" (I Cor. 11:32).

Pay close attention to the three Greek words, diakrino, krino, and katakrino, used in this verse.

There is so much contained in this verse. There is a judgment now on God’s saints. We are judged by being "chastened of the Lord." What does that mean? "Chastened" is from the Greek word paideuo and here is what it means: "to train up a child, i.e. educate, or (by impl.) discipline (by punishment): -- chasten (-ise), instruct, learn, teach" (Strong’s Greek Dictionary p. 54).

Are you following this amazing use of words? You will now learn a marvelous truth of Scripture that is not being taught in any theological seminary that I am aware of anywhere in the whole world.

We are "judged" by God, and the vehicle that God uses to do this judging is "chastening." In other words, we are "judged" by God by being "trained up" like a child, by being "educated," by "discipline" involving "punishment," "instructed," by which we "learn," and all these "teach" us WHAT WE SHOULD BE.

There is no doubt that some of this chastening can be harsh, sorrowful, and painful. Much of it is not very pleasant and God admits as much to us. And it is not possible for one single son of God to avoid this chastisement! Let’s read it:

Read the rest here;

(From the Lake of Fire Part III) http://bible-truths.com/lake3.html

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe

ciy:
Joe

I was going to post this on the Jesus' Church thread, but I see this post as good info and encouragement along the same lines as that thread.

This is from Ray's new post on Judgement in Gehenna Fire.

Here is a marvelous truth regarding Christ's judgment of His Elect: We accept judgment voluntarily. Jesus never forced or coerced anyone to follow Him. Jesus asked some disciples to follow Him, and they did:

"And He [Jesus] said unto them [Peter and Andrew], Follow Me, and I will make you fishers of men. And they straightway left their nets, and follow Him" (Matt. 4:18-20).

One disciple Jesus called excused himself on the grounds that he had more important things to do:

"And another of His disciples said unto him, Lord, suffer me first to go and bury my father. But Jesus said unto him, Follow me, and let the dead bury their dead" (Matt. 8:21-22).

Another disciple starts to follow Jesus, but then decides he has some personal things to attend to first. Jesus will reject such a person:

"And another also said, Lord I will follow you, but let me first go bid them farewell, which at home at my house. And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back is fit for the kingdom of God" (Luke 9:61-62).

Jesus invites one young ruler to be a very Apostle, and he turns it down because the price is too high:

Jesus said unto him, If you will be perfect, go and sell that you have, and give to the poor, and you shall have treasure in heaven,: and come and follow Me. But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful, for he had great possessions" (Mat. 19:21-22).

Others volunteer to be followers of Jesus, but Jesus rejects them without any apparent explanation:

"And a certain scribe came and said unto Him, Master, I will follow you whithersoever You go. And Jesus said unto him. The foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man has no where to lay His head" (Matt. 8:19-20).

Jesus knew this upper class scribe would not be inclined to endure for very long.

By and by, most of Christ's disciples fell by the wayside. When Jesus told His disciples that they would have to "eat My flesh and drink My blood" (John 6:54) in order to have eonian life, they began to murmur:

"Many there of His disciples when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it? When Jesus knew in Himself that His disciples murmured at it, He said unto them, Does this offend you? What and if you shall see the Son of man ascend up where He was before?

So today theologians and Christians would say that they are not offended that Jesus said we are to "eat His flesh and drink His blood," oh no, but they are terribly offended if one applies Jesus' very same spiritual words to such things as Gehenna fire showing that it too is nor literal fire.

"It is the SPIRIT that quickens [gives life]; the flesh profits nothings: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit and they are life... but there are some of you that believe not... Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto Me except it were given unto him of My Father. From that time many of His disciples went back, and walked no more with Him" (John 6: 60-66).

Will any of you also "go back and walk no more with Him" after reading this Lake of Fire series? Does standing up for the Truths of Jesus Christ bring more persecution, condemnation, and ridicule from your "Christian" brothers and sisters than you are willing to endure?

"If any man come to Me, and hate [love less] not his father, and mother, and wife, and children, and brethren, and sisters, yea, and his own life also, he cannot be My disciple"

"And whosoever does not bear his cross, and come after Me, cannot be My disciple"

"So likewise, whosoever he be of you that forsake not all that he has, he cannot be My disciple" (Luke 14:26, 27, 33).

The truth is a hard saying and like Ray's great talk on "Being Saved is the hardest thing you will ever do" it is not a comfortable pat on the back journey. 
CIY

sonofone:
Joe I wonder what the average church member would think if they read this post? It was so simple, so clearly stated, yet so powerful, that I paused to take it all in before posting. Unfortunately I think we all know the answer to that question. He that will have ears let him hear. Great post Joe.

Deborah-Leigh:
Hello Joe

 I will respond rather to the TITLE of your post.

 For me, Paul did not Volunteer. I think he was so INTENSLY AFRAID when he was blinded and fell off his horse that he said the first thing that came to mind which is what we have now on record in the Scriptures.

I do not believe Paul volunteered and I prefer to believe Christ called, chose and assigned and renamed to Paul the man HE was going to make out of deluded, deceived and sincere Saul. Christ said to Saul Acts 9 : 6 ARISE and GO into the city, and YOU WILL BE TOLD WHAT YOU MUST DO.  I think CHRIST Volunteered Saul. Saul had no free will choice and what finally PAUL volunteered for was his death in Rome. Jesus equipped him and enabled him to achieve this final victory.

As ciy says so beautifully about being saved being :  not a comfortable pat on the back journey.  Good one ciy!

Peace be to you

Arcturus :)

hillsbororiver:

--- Quote from: Arcturus on September 13, 2007, 04:11:22 PM ---
 I will respond rather to the TITLE of your post.

 For me, Paul did not Volunteer. I think he was so INTENSLY AFRAID when he was blinded and fell off his horse that he said the first thing that came to mind which is what we have now on record in the Scriptures.


--- End quote ---

Hi Arcturus,

I think when Ray subtitled this portion of his paper LOF Part III he was not using the classic first definition that comes to mind but rather was using this (#9 definition Random House Unabridged Dictionary) instead.

9. to offer oneself for some service or undertaking.

There is no argument that Saul/Paul was greatly influenced (caused) to utter these words you cannot say this response (What will you have me do?) does not fit this definition.

If you can't see this perhaps you should write Ray for a better explaination.

His Peace to you,

Joe

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