re thief on the cross

[chav]

Hi
I have  been checking out the translation of  Luke 23:43

And He said to him, "Truly I say to you, today you shall be with Me in Paradise." NASB

You will notice that that the comma is placed after 'him' which seems to suggest that both Jesus and the thief were going to be in paradise after they died.Most translations follow this rule it seems.

Both the Concordant and Rotheram's render it differently and correctly by placing the comma after 'today'

And Jesus said to him, "Verily, to you am I saying today, with Me shall you be in paradise." CLNT

And he said unto him - Verily ,I say unto the this day: with me ,shalt thou be in  Paradise. Rotheram.

Amazing how one simple piece of editing can produce two such opposed versions of the truth.

With that in mind can anyone put me in the direction of Ray's writings regarding the scripture in Peter ,that is  where he talks about Christ preaching to the spirits in prison.I used to be taught that this took place between Christ's death and resurrection and some would argue that was what Christ was referring to when he spoke to the thief on the cross.
many thanks.

Dave Gater

[chav]

oops !
Just realised I have posted in wrong place
my apologies
Dave

[Deborah-Leigh]

Hello Dave

This should help.

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,4646.0.html

Peace be to you

Arcturus

[chav]

Thanks Arcturus
I knew it was there somewhere, hopefully Ray's paper concerning this subject isn't too far in the future.

Dave Gater

[jER]

I find the two thieves who were crucified with Christ (one on the right, the other on the left) resembling that of the parable; Sheep and the goats (Matthew 25:31-46). For one remained in his sin, while the other repented and believed the truth:

"And these shall be coming away into chastening eonian, yet the just into life eonian." (Matthew 25:46)

"Who has an ear, let him hear what the spirit is saying to the ecclesias. To the one who is conquering, to him will I be granting to be eating of the log of life which is in the center of the paradise of God" (Revelation 2:7)

"with Me shall you be in paradise" - the Kings garden!

JER

[Deborah-Leigh]

Your post caused me to think of this jER. From http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,5312.0.html Quote:

So the more we study this Word of God, the more we see it's all one thing.  There is one giant parable and it is this.

Gen 1:26  "And God said, Let Us be making man in Our image..."

There it is!

>
>
>
It doesn't matter what subject we study it always goes back to that one thing.  What is it that God is doing?  He's changing us from what we are, into what we are going to be.  That whole thing is what we call life, creation, existence, the plan of God.  It's all that ONE thing, all of it.  You've got to relate everything that there is in the universe to this one thing that God is doing. 
He's changing humanity into His own image!

Peace to you

Arcturus

[jER]

Indeed, Arcturus...

"It's like you go to the Grand Canyon, it's all one canyon, you know.  You can take pictures at sunrise or at noonday or take pictures at sunset.  You can go down into it with the mules or you can go from the edge or you can go from the north side or the west side or from a airplane or helicopter.  Now they even have a glass bottom floor, where you can walk out and look straight down. 
But it's all the same Grand Canyon, is it not.  So you can view it from many different angles.  Once you become familiar with the Grand Canyon, you can look at pictures from a helicopter or from this end or that end, from the bottom looking up or from the top looking down and you will know that it's the Grand Canyon.  Even if all the pictures are angled differently and there's different lighting, you'll still know it's the grand canyon."

From http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,5312.0.html

...and, I only live an hour from the Grand Canyon!   

His Peace to you,
JER

[Deborah-Leigh]

That is so special jER. You can really identify with that spiritual teaching perhaps unlike anyone who has not had the joy of seeing the Grand Canyon!

In South Africa we have a place that is called God's window. It is I imagine a parallel to the Grand Canyon but on a way smaller scale. Anyway, when you reach the point to where you can see downwards, it is as if you are in an aeroplane and not on Terra firma!

The Grand Canyon is something I think I'd enjoy seeing though and through the spiritual perspectives you have quoted from Ray, it challenges, invites and encourages to so integrate the Truth as to see it from all directions as God's own plan and His own purposes coming to pass!

Peace be to you

Arcturus