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Author Topic: In The Shadows  (Read 4466 times)

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hillsbororiver

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In The Shadows
« on: December 07, 2007, 09:18:35 AM »

The latest Bible Study that Ray gave was once again very enlightening.  ;)

It gave me a different perspective on those who are still bound by the church system(s), actually I have more empathy now than I had previously because these folks are stumbling in the darkness of the physical shadows of His Word.

Who could blame or mock the physically blind for bumping into a wall or tripping on a curb? Who could become frustrated or angry when attempting to describe scenery and colors to this physically blind person as they just could not perceive or understand what exactly it was being described to him?

This admonition of "come out of her my people" is also saying come out of the shadows my people, come into the Light of His Spirit. Of course it is God who removes the scales in His time, in every man's season, I must say that this has opened my own eyes a bit in how I now perceive the people still tied to the ritualistic traditions of Babylon.

You can hear it all here;

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,2641.msg19809.html#msg19809

His Peace and Wisdom to you,

Joe
 
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Gregor

  • Guest
Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #1 on: December 07, 2007, 02:26:45 PM »

2 Chronicles 25:24
And he took all the gold and silver, all the articles that were found in the house of God with Obed-Edom, the treasures of the king’s house, and hostages, and returned to Samaria.

2 Chronicles 36:18
And all the articles from the house of God, great and small, the treasures of the house of the LORD, and the treasures of the king and of his leaders, all these he took to Babylon.

Ezra 6:1 Then King Darius issued a decree, and a search was made in the archives, where the treasures were stored in Babylon.

2 Kings 24:14 Also he carried into captivity all Jerusalem: all the captains and all the mighty men of valor, ten thousand captives, and all the craftsmen and smiths. None remained except the poorest people of the land.

It is interesting to note that the people of God and their treasures were taken captive by Babylon more than once, yet even then it was only for a set period of time before they were freed. Likewise, there are still people of God and treasures in "Babylon" today, but it will be in God's time that they are set free. I find it most interesting that only the poorest people of the land remained free. Funny how God has chosen the poor:

James 2:5
Listen, my beloved brethren: Has God not chosen the poor of this world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom which He promised to those who love Him?

2 Corinthians 8:9
For you know the grace of our Lord Jesus Christ, that though He was rich, yet for your sakes He became poor, that you through His poverty might become rich.
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Chris R

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Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2007, 07:25:36 AM »

Hi Joe,

There are many folks that can be sat right down, and shown proof positive the truths presented in the articles and teaching on this website, and walk away shaking their heads.

Folks so indoctrinated, they are for the most part incapable of hearing the truth.

 Psa 49:15  But God will redeem my soul from the power of the grave [sheol]: for he shall receive me. Selah.

When shown that "sheol" translated 32 times "Hell" in the KJV, shows that souls can and will be redeemed from "hell",  you would think that at least 99% of the people reading this verse would consider the remote possibility that there is something amiss about the translation.

Unfortunately, its more like 1%.. or less, its almost unbelievable, honestly, just unbelievable. These truths stare them right in the eye, but STILL they are unable to see.

Talk about a delusion, that these should believe a lie...WOW! And if these can not see even the basic truth regarding "hell" in the bible, how in the world can these folks go one step further?

Until God removes this hate in their heart for all mankind, until they repent of this cruel and horrific doctrine of hells fire, until they bitterly repent of this doctrine of demons that would make God a monster, and Christ of no effect...they will never see the truth in this life time.

Chris R





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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2007, 01:15:09 PM »

Hey Chris R

It is tempting to feel sorry for those poor little Christians who have been lead astray and are deceived by the big bad Babylon Harlot cooing sentiments of nice sounding heresy and cozy feeling blasphemies and appear good angel of light despotic insults that rail against God and Christ. How quickly would even the most blind join in and cry "Crucify Him!" if it is us who appear to be the enemy of their man made doctrines in orchestrated lead worship and praise of their pagan god? What a joy that we all come out of the darkness if not now at the LOF. It is such a miracle that first too we are physical and then spiritual as Christ gives us eyes to see, repentance to change and His Faith to succeed.

Ray said in one of his more recent audios, something like they will not see past the idols of their hearts and are as blind as bats. I remember being just like that. I could well have been Muslim! :D What a privilege to see and comprehend to the level that I do now, the Truths Ray has shared in the Christ that is made visible through his teachings.

We know that the spiritual wars against the carnal and the carnal man is at deep seated hatred against God. I believe when this fact is revealed by the consuming fire of God, there is such pain in conviction that this could be what will happen in the LOF White Throne. Those that enjoy escaping this reality  prefer to not know God. They enjoy knowing the praises of men. They love the cuddle soft sentimentality void of truth. Such love without Truth is whoredom.

They will repent. They will be saved. They will come to the knowledge of the Truth but right now I believe they would just as soon murder anyone that gets in the way of their beliefs. Babylons leaders do not make kings out of their followers but only cowardly hypocrites and if at all proselites in their own images.

Only Christ is The King of Kings!

Peace be to you

Arcturus :)
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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2007, 02:20:00 PM »

Hello acomplishedartis

Part of our suffering I believe, is to realise that what we know and see can not make the blind see and know. The joy and comfort is that they will see and come to learn the Truth as will all.

It is not our job to convince anyone. Winning souls for Jesus is not a job description but having an answer when someone might ask you the reason for your hope, is part of being prepared, well educated in the Word of God which the Scriptures say we should study.

Peace be to you

Arcturus :)
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Kat

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Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2007, 02:24:54 PM »


Hi Joe,

The Church is indeed stumbling in the darkness of the physical shadows of His Word.  But at least they do know something about the physical words of the Scripture.
There is a great number of people who have not even reach the shadow of the Word yet.  I'm speaking of the unchurched.  Are they better off in not knowing anything about what the Scriptures say, and that would include heresy?
 
I was trying to talk to my son-in-law about a Scriptural subject that he brought up and it was really frustrating in that he knew very little of what the Scriptures actually say.  Why husband is the same.  

So we really have two categories of people that are blind, those that have reached the shadow and are deceived and those who have not even reached the shadow yet.

I know when my eyes began to be opened, I could relate Spiritural things I was seeing to the physical words of the Scripture I already knew.  
Now those who do not even have a rudimentary knowledge of what the Scripture say seems to present a real difficulty in explaining these things to them.  But they usually don't have an interest in the time it takes to study and come to a good knowledge of what is in the Bible.  So is ignorance better than being deceived? At least churched people usually know something about what the Bible says, sure it's just physical and full of heresy, but it's something.  But they are both blind as a bat, concerning spiritual understanding.

Anyway I was just thinking about this whole segment of people that we don't seem to think about so much.  There is a lot that they have to learn just to get to the shadow.  

mercy, peace and love
Kat

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Deborah-Leigh

  • Guest
Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2007, 03:58:10 PM »

Interesting point of view Kat.

Perhaps this is why the Scriptures say Come out of HER and not THEM. We have to know something even if incorrectly rather than nothing perhaps?

Peace be to you

Arcturus :)
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Gregor

  • Guest
Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2007, 04:34:55 PM »

Judges 14: 1 Now Samson went down to Timnah, and saw a woman in Timnah of the daughters of the Philistines. 2 So he went up and told his father and mother, saying, “I have seen a woman in Timnah of the daughters of the Philistines; now therefore, get her for me as a wife.”
3 Then his father and mother said to him, “Is there no woman among the daughters of your brethren, or among all my people, that you must go and get a wife from the uncircumcised Philistines?”
And Samson said to his father, “Get her for me, for she pleases me well.”
4 But his father and mother did not know that it was of the LORD—that He was seeking an occasion to move against the Philistines. For at that time the Philistines had dominion over Israel.

God is sovereign. His ways are not ours. We don't always know the purpose and reasoning behind what God does, but we do know that every detail, down to the number of hairs on our heads, is in God's plan. Just as I wouldn't get mad at Satan for being the perfect adversary (just as God intended), neither would I get worked up over "Babylon." The blind are here for a reason:

John 9:3 Jesus answered, “Neither this man nor his parents sinned, but that the works of God should be revealed in him.

Exodus 4:11
So the LORD said to him, “Who has made man’s mouth? Or who makes the mute, the deaf, the seeing, or the blind? Have not I, the LORD?

Leviticus 19:14
You shall not curse the deaf, nor put a stumbling block before the blind, but shall fear your God: I am the LORD.
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sonofone

  • Guest
Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #8 on: December 08, 2007, 10:51:05 PM »

Well Ray says that we should not be to hard on the Church because this is the birth place of the elect.In fact he says that he does not believe that many if any come to election except through the Church.Paul warned the Gentiles not to boast against the branches.We also don't know whether we are elect or not,Thus the fear and trembling.
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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #9 on: December 09, 2007, 03:05:56 AM »

I think I know what you are saying sonofone.

For me " Come out" does not say go back and show up, attack, return to to fix, begin to harbor feelings of resentment or self righteous indignation. Come out simply says come out. For me it is that simple.

Ray does mention however quote : I know that many people think I am too hard on Christian heresy. That’s because I love them. Would you not show a little "hard" tough love to your children if they were taking mind-destroying DRUGS? Well it is my opinion that Christian heresies are mind-destroying drugs as well. This ministry is a love/hate ministry -- love for all God’s creatures and hate for all the spiritual mind-destroying heretical drugs out there on the streets and on the air waves around the world.

Trust me when I say: When one learns the Truth about our All Wise, All Powerful, All Loving God, the unscriptural theories regarding an eternal hellhole of eternal torture will vanish like the dew in the morning Sun.
http://bible-truths.com/lake2.html Unquote

I think what Ray writes above describes "coming out" :) which does not eliminate, change or convert what we come out of.  :) I believe this is part of Gods plan to teach us good from evil.

I believe God's consuming fire brings the following to fulfillment and perhaps indicates why those who have the Spirit of Christ are so hated by the world.

Rev 18:6 Repay to her what she herself has paid to others and double her doom in accordance with what she has done. Mix a double portion for her in the cup she mixed for others. 7. To the degree that she glorified herself and reveled in her wantonness, living deliciously and luxuriously, to that measure impose on her torment and anguish and tears and mourning. Since in her heart she boasts, I am not a widow; as a queen on a throne I sit, and I shall never see suffering or experience sorrow. 8 So shall her plagues afflictions, calamities come thick upon her in a single day, pestilence and anguish and sorrow and famine; and she shall be utterly consumed, burned up with fire, for mighty is the Lord God Who judges her.

Peace to you

Arcturus :)
« Last Edit: December 09, 2007, 04:09:39 AM by Arcturus »
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sonofone

  • Guest
Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #10 on: December 09, 2007, 07:58:55 AM »

Ray speaks a lot about literal and spiritual.He also shares that that the bible doesn't mean what it says,but what it means.exp cutting off the offending arm or plucking out the eye.The fact that the bible is a big parable.

In Rays talk about the sabbath,he speaks about the literal physical keeping of rituals,such as lords supper,foot washing,baptism etc..Ray contends that these too are spiritual commands,not literal.

So I'm sure that the coming out of her my people has to be applied spiritually first,in fact I fail to see mass exodus as scriptural or profitable. I understand the desire to get away from the plagues if you will of the church,but what does that really mean.

If I were Paul or Timothy of today or in today's time would I stay away from the church altogether?Would I be content to serve God in the corners and shadows? Weren't they proponents of attracting believers to the church? Wasn't Timothy's job to elect elders to watch and care for the sheep?

I need help in understanding this practical application of coming out of her.
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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #11 on: December 09, 2007, 09:24:55 AM »

I do not think we are to become timid, superstitious, cowardly, intimidated or holier than thou in coming out of her. As you observe sonofone this going from physical to spiritual is the path away from carnality towards obedience to Christ. This reminds me of the teaching on WORSHIP IN SPIRIT & TRUTH http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,5312.0.html quote : But obedience, that is where it is at.  Sometimes we come short, I know.  But there is no doubt in my mind, that's what it’s all about, and I know what it’s all about.

I know if we go and look at the teachings surrounding the myth of Free Will we come to also realise that we can not even obey unless by the Grace of God ("Grace. Divine influence on our hearts." Ref http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,5417.0.html)

Can we do anything Godly on our own? Of course not. Can we come out of Babylon or obey or worship God in a pleasing way to God? No.

So when we speak of any perceived instruction in the Scriptures, are they not shadows of how we will be made into the image of Christ when He has finished His work? I think so. Christ says "come out." We will. He also told Pharaoh to let his people go and like Pharaoh we to will go against what God says until such time as we receive the wisdom, knowledge and understanding by experience, that God knows best, He is Love and will not leave, loose or forsake His Creation. He will save it all. The process of God by which He is perfecting His creation, is interesting and worth studying.

I know I have come out of Babylon not because I do not attend Church services but because I do not attend or serve their teachings! Many are still in Babylon who no longer go to Church but believe they do their bit by watching TBN or paying in some money to redeem their souls. They are yet blind and as pointed out by Gregor, I too believe this is exactly in the Plan of God and will be all to His Glory. Being more knowledgeable is no guarantee of faithfulness. Only Christ has been proved Faithfull and True. We are all in the testing refining process.

It is one thing to receive the command to "Come out of Her" with all the warnings and quite another to obey through the Spirit, Wisdom, Council and Faith of Christ.

Working out our salvation with fear and trembling should show us where we are pinpointed in obedience and hence the fear and trembling. Non have made it to perfection except Christ Jesus. Missing the mark by the width of the great divide of the Grand Canyon or by a hairs breath, is still missing the mark. We fail one command and we fail all so we live by no laws, do's and don'ts, works, literal observations far from the heart of God,  ( shadows ) and depend on all fulfillment of the law that is already won by, in and through Christ. This brings to mind Ray's talk on Repentance http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3709.0.html

Like the parables perhaps this has simply underscored that Ray's teachings are also ONE teaching that is God's way of making us into His image.

Peace to you

Arcturus :)

« Last Edit: December 09, 2007, 09:33:06 AM by Arcturus »
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Chris R

  • Guest
Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #12 on: December 09, 2007, 09:48:25 AM »

Ray speaks a lot about literal and spiritual.He also shares that that the bible doesn't mean what it says,but what it means.exp cutting off the offending arm or plucking out the eye.The fact that the bible is a big parable.

In Rays talk about the sabbath,he speaks about the literal physical keeping of rituals,such as lords supper,foot washing,baptism etc..Ray contends that these too are spiritual commands,not literal.

So I'm sure that the coming out of her my people has to be applied spiritually first,in fact I fail to see mass exodus as scriptural or profitable. I understand the desire to get away from the plagues if you will of the church,but what does that really mean.

If I were Paul or Timothy of today or in today's time would I stay away from the church altogether?Would I be content to serve God in the corners and shadows? Weren't they proponents of attracting believers to the church? Wasn't Timothy's job to elect elders to watch and care for the sheep?

I need help in understanding this practical application of coming out of her.

Hi Sonofone


 1Cr 15:46  Howbeit that [was] not first which is spiritual, but that which is natural; and afterward that which is spiritual.

It is in this order all things must come to pass. We do not posess any ability whatsoever to convince anyone of anything, nor can we save one single soul.
First the physical, then the spiritual, first come out "physically" then you can mature.

Why is it that we are told to "come out" ?

that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

They are crafty, they speak smooth things, and deceits, and before long, you will be partakers of her sins.

Peace

Chris R
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sonofone

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Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #13 on: December 09, 2007, 10:38:36 AM »

I need for someone to help me balance out scripture that clearly teach and shoe the church gathering together,and being in fellowship with each other,versus this literal coming out of the assembly of believers.Heresy was prevalent even in the new testament church,yet no instruction to stop fellowshipping.I too want to come out of her,but what does that mean if we are to apply things spiritually,not physically?
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Deborah-Leigh

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Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #14 on: December 09, 2007, 12:13:51 PM »

Hi sonofone

All excerpts from Ray's LOF series copied in blue font.

Notice that a gathering, assembly or congregation has a different meaning to what CHURCH means. Once you have seen this difference then notice there is a more refined difference between the Church and MY CHURCH which Jesus said HE would build.

John tells us that Satan has a "synagogue." Synagogue means "a gathering together, an assembly, a congregation." This should not sound strange to our ears, seeing that we have already learned from Paul’s writings:

"For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed as into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the minister of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their work."
http://bible-truths.com/lake10.html

Just what is a "church?" Strong’s Greek Dictionary, #1570. ekklesia, a calling out. (1b) Ekklesia, from ek, "out of," and klesis, "a calling…" So the church is those whom God has CALLED OUT to be His "called out ones,"http://bible-truths.com/lake8.html

Can we not easily see the progression in how God uses these words? God first GATHERS all His people—there was a synagogue in every city. He then CALLS OUT a people (a church) from that huge gathering, and many others from among the Gentiles. He then INVITES many of the called out ones (from the Church) to be His True Followers. But in the end only those whom God SELECTS OUT of the INVITED, of the CALLED OUT, from the gathering of the whole ASSEMBLY will be in the First Resurrection to reign with Christ in the Kingdom of God. And thus we start with a huge number and end up with but a "FEW"! "For MANY are called [‘invited’ from the ‘called out’ church], but FEW are chosen" to reign with Christ as Judges, Priests, Lords, and Kings. (Matt. 22:14).http://bible-truths.com/lake11.html

NOT FORSAKING THE ASSEMBLING OF OURSELVES TOGETHER

In Hebrews 10:25 were are admonished as follows:

"Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as you see the day approaching."

That this is speaking of believers congregating together to worship and study God’s Word, there can be no doubt. However, there is a much deeper meaning to this "assembling" that few have ever seen. I never saw it myself until I read a paper by J. Preston Eby, entitled: "FORSAKE NOT THE ASSEMBLING."

I will quote an excerpt or two from his paper:

"The Greek word for ‘assembling’ is EPISUNAGOGE. The word, literally, is a verb meaning to synagogue. It is a compound of the Greek prefix EPI with the word SUNAGOGE from which we get our transliterated English word Synagogue. EPI means super – imposition – that which is above, higher than, highest, upon. SUNAGOGE means a meeting, assembly, or gathering. Putting these two words together, EPI-SUNAGOGE means THE ABOVE SYNAGOGUE, THE HIGHER MEETING, THE HIGHEST ASSEMBLY, THE HIGHER-THAN-ALL-GATHERINGS!

It bespeaks of something far greater than merely collecting so many breathing bodies together in one place.

It is a meeting in a higher realm, on a higher plane, in the high places of the Spirit, and in the heights of Truth. It is a gathering together in a dimension above. It indicates an assembling IN THE SPIRIT…"

(All Caps belong to Mr. Eby).http://bible-truths.com/lake11.html


During Jesus’ ministry, He spoke of "the" church and "My" church. There already existed "the church" (Matt. 18:17), at the very time that Jesus said He would build "MY CHURCH" (Matt. 16:18).

 http://bible-truths.com/lake8.html

Peace to you

Arcturus :)

« Last Edit: December 09, 2007, 12:29:38 PM by Arcturus »
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Kat

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Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #15 on: December 09, 2007, 03:22:22 PM »


Hi sonofone,

When Jesus Christ lived on earth, the way they learned the Scriptures was to go to the Temple or a synagogue, where the scrolls of the Laws, the Prophets and the writings (the OT Scriptures) were kept.  Jesus Christ and the Apostles and all Jews followed this custom.  Now when Christ began His ministry and started teaching in the Temple and synagogues, well you know they eventually killed Him, because of what He was teaching.  Now the Apostles carried on this same teaching and did it go any better for them?

Paul -
Acts 9:29  And he spoke boldly in the name of the Lord Jesus and disputed against the Hellenists, but they attempted to kill him.

Acts 21:31  And as they were seeking to kill him, the news came to the chiliarch of the cohort, that all Jerusalem was in an uproar.

Stephen -
Act 7:58  Then they cast him out of the city and stoned him; and the witnesses laid down their garments at the feet of a young man named Saul.

James -
Act 12:2  He killed James the brother of John with the sword;
Act 12:3  and when he saw that it pleased the Jews, he proceeded to arrest Peter also.

John was the only apostle who escaped a violent death. The belief of the early Christian writers and history verifies that all the rest of apostles did face martyrdom.

There are a few Scriptures that show that the Apostles didn't only go to the synagogues or Temple.

Acts 12:12  And thinking about it, he came to the house of Mary the mother of John, whose last name was Mark; where many had gathered together to pray.

Acts 16:13  And on the Sabbath day we went out of the city to the riverside, where prayer was customarily made; and we sat down and spoke to the women who met there.

I do not believe that Paul's letters to different churches were to the synagogues, but to the different groups of Believers in different cities.  As in the following Paul is addressing one of these groups.  There is no mentions of meeting in a synagogue, but "assemble as a church," which could have been anywhere.

I Cor. 11:17  But in the following instructions I do not commend you, because when you come together it is not for the better but for the worse.
v. 18  For, in the first place, when you assemble as a church, I hear that there are divisions among you; and I partly believe it,
v. 19  for there must be factions among you in order that those who are genuine among you may be recognized.
v. 20  When you meet together, it is not the Lord's supper that you eat.

So now we, just like the Apostles, start out in the church.  While we are deceived we believe we are in His church, but when our eyes are opened we see it for what it really is, the Synagogue of Satan. 
We have to understand the difference between 'going to church' and assembling together with like mind Believers.  Of course we want to seek out the Believers and share in learning the Truth.  I think God has provided that here at Bibletruths.
As Paul was addressing problems in I Cor. 11 that they were having, maybe that is a reason we do not have the assembling in person.  Because God does not want us to be distracted by the physical, that we are still susceptible to.

Through the ages He no doubt provided different ways for those of like mind to fellowship.  But now it seems like this is what He has given us - the fellowship on the internet.
That was more then I intended to say, but I hope it helps  :)

mercy, peace and love
Kat

« Last Edit: December 09, 2007, 03:32:58 PM by Kat »
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sonofone

  • Guest
Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #16 on: December 09, 2007, 06:32:26 PM »

Thanks for the feedback everyone I really appreciate it.
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indianabob

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  • Posts: 1772
Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #17 on: December 11, 2007, 12:40:13 AM »

In the Shadows


Friend Steven,

All that needs to be said has been said and I cannot add anything more.
I would however like to summarize what has become more clear to me personally.

Those that God has called out of Babylon, out of the organized church, are the only true believers.
As nice as those other folks may be, humanly speaking, they are still in Babylon and don't intend
to come out no matter what I may say to them.  So, I leave them alone spiritually and fellowship
with them ONLY as neighbors and members of the local community.  They are not yet God's chosen
and when they are they will seek me out just as I will seek them.

Therefore, it is obvious to me that my present task is to learn all that I can through prayer, Bible study,
sacrificial love toward all people and spiritual fellowship with the very few that God has bound me to
in this phase of my spiritual development.  It is now my task to work with others of like mind, IRON
sharpening IRON and not to correct or offer enlightenment to any who have not yet been chosen. 
I am not an evangelist at this time, I am still and shall remain a student.

In this group I have noticed that there is ONE teacher.  One at a time is a good plan, it avoids confusion.
The rest of us, all of us, are students.  We can share our personal visions and our tests or trials
and share how we have struggled to overcome our own limitations and how God has worked on us,
sometimes without our knowledge until it suddenly became apparent and that is good.  However, we
need to consciously avoid the temptation to become teachers ourselves.   Why?

We are something like undergraduate students in God's University.  We all know that we shall become
Bachelors and Masters and Philosophers eventually (BA, MA, PhD) but for now we do not stand before
any other persons, outside the University, and present ourselves as competent instructors.

Yes, we do write theses and present them to our Teacher once per semester.  And yes we do present
our ideas and theses to one another for practice and to check the spelling and appropriate use of
words according to accepted meaning, but we are not graduates, we are not professors, we are yet
students and have not earned the right and are not qualified to speak for God.

This time of testing is to allow us to grow in knowledge and wisdom and the grace of our Lord.  We are
to grow in grace by exercising grace, by patiently enduring the daily trials that come to all who love
God more than self.  There will be time enough for us to teach in the resurrection to LIFE.

As Martin King has said, "I have gone to the mountain top and I have seen the promised land."
We few have been given the vision of God's true plan for mankind, we need to treasure it in our secret
place, our heart of hearts, until the time for its revealing is given.
It is a wonderful thought and that thought will motivate us to remain faithful until the end.

See King's final thoughts below.  (If he only knew the full story)

Well, I don't know what will happen now. We've got some difficult days ahead. But it doesn't matter with me now. Because I've been to the mountaintop. And I don't mind. Like anybody, I would like to live a long life. Longevity has its place. But I'm not concerned about that now. I just want to do God's will. And He's allowed me to go up to the mountain. And I've looked over. And I've seen the promised land. I may not get there with you. But I want you to know tonight, that we, as a people, will get to the promised land. And I'm happy, tonight. I'm not worried about anything. I'm not fearing any man. Mine eyes have seen the glory of the coming of the Lord.

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sonofone

  • Guest
Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #18 on: December 11, 2007, 01:37:33 AM »

Bob I just wanted to acknowledge your reply,and say that I love you for your heart.I appreciate your feedback,I have come to learn as I have at one time not seen your heart and intentions clearly;that you are considerate in what you write.

I am a person that has to study to be quiet.It's hard for me. There is a lot I want to say and share;but this is a season where I need to be more ready to listen than to speak. So I'll be around,even if you don't hear from me.Thanks
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hillsbororiver

  • Guest
Re: In The Shadows
« Reply #19 on: December 11, 2007, 03:41:47 PM »


but this is a season where I need to be more ready to listen than to speak.


Hi sonophone,

I too am presently in that same season.

As you can see by the number of posts I have made in my time here these seasons tend to be infrequent and there are times when I am quite manic in writing, sometimes to my own chagrin.

To be patient is perhaps the most difficult thing for me personally, although I have observed many others who (often unaware) share the same weakness of spirit. Instead of waiting on the Lord to clear things or shed His light I can fall prey to forcing (by my own will) answers to questions that are even of themselves immature, maybe even irrelevant to what He is presently teaching me or showing me. How does one discern these things? Sometimes we only see what we want to see or should I say when we are impatient we can only see what our "old man" wants us to see. Even Satan can appear as an angel of light, how much more susceptible to deception are we when we are anxious and groping for straws to tickle our ears?

Perhaps it is as simple as quiet reflection, meditation, thinking about where we have been, where our real hope is, shedding this need for acknowledgement and validation from other human beings or to be well thought of in the here and now.

Thanks to all of you who have posted here in this thread, there are many good points to consider.

Bob, that was and is a great reminder to me that we should be giving thanks for the opportunity of being a student, that God has called us to learn more of Him and that being anxious to teach or lead can be a real stumbling block to those who put their faith in personalities and "friendships" or succumb easily to praise or validation whether it is sincere or merely as bait to lead others away from His light and back into carnal darkness and confusion.

Not everyone is called to teach and even those who are spend a fair share of time observing, learning, meditating even praying in the wilderness before they are prepared for their mission, Jesus is quiet for 18 years from the time He showed Himself to the "doctors" of the Temple at 12 years old, Paul is quiet for years in between declaring himself (his conversion) to the synagogue(s) even exiling himself to Arabia before beginning his calling to minister to the Gentiles.

This is an interesting journey to be sure, impatience is not our friend as we travel it.

His Peace to you,

Joe
 
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