> General Discussions
The World Is Groaning For It Knows Not What
hillsbororiver:
--- Quote from: Kat on January 15, 2008, 07:17:01 AM ---
The “saviors” are going to rule from mount Zion, not over there in that ugly swill of a city called Jerusalem. But from spiritual mount Zion. He is going to rule “them,” Esau is them, “and the kingdom shall be the Lord’s.” What kingdom? The kingdom of what, in this context? Kingdom of saviors, plural saviors. Who are these saviors? That’s us, we’re saviors. Well this sounds a little odd, I mean we’re saying we’re going to be the saviors of the world. Well we do have a leader though, King of kings, Lord of lords, Savior of saviors and Son of sons. We’re sons right, He’s the Son of the sons. He will always have a name superior to every other one.
--- End quote ---
Hi Kat,
Excellent addition, thank you.
His Peace to you,
Joe
Deborah-Leigh:
Another great thread Joe.
I find interesting that THE WORLD is groaning and waiting for the manifestation of the SONS of God and the SONS of God are not waiting for themselves to be revealed but for Christ to be! :D 8)
Heb 9 : 28 Even so it is that Christ, having been offered to take upon Himself and bear as a burden the sins of many once and once for all, will appear a second time, not to carry any burden of sin nor to deal with sin, but to bring to full salvation those who are eagerly, constantly, andpatiently waiting for and expecting Him. (Amplified version)
What also strikes me is the teaching out of Rays PRAYING BY GOD’S RULES
http://bible-truths.com/praying.htm
Let’s now understand this most profound truth. It isn’t just that, "…we know not what we should pray for as we ought…" No, it is much more profound then just that, it is that "….for we know not what we should pray for, to accord with what MUST BE, we are not aware…" Why does the spirit aid our infirmity? What is our infirmity? Our infirmity is that we don’t know what to pray for that will absolutely always be in accord with what must be God’s will, and God’s will is "what must be." And since none of us has perfect foreknowledge of what God’s will must be, God’s spirit aids those who are obedient to Him, in requesting and praying about, the right things, so our prayers aren’t in vain.
For me, the world does not know what it should pray for. Only the Spirit of Christ can guide anyone to pray for the Will of God as only the Spirit of Christ knows what is in accord with the will of God as only HE has perfect knowledge of God the Father.
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
hillsbororiver:
--- Quote from: Arcturus on January 15, 2008, 02:24:01 PM ---
I find interesting that THE WORLD is groaning and waiting for the manifestation of the SONS of God and the SONS of God are not waiting for themselves to be revealed but for Christ to be! :D 8)
--- End quote ---
Beautiful Arcturus, that pretty much sums it up Sister!
It is really comforting to contemplate that through all the trials and tribulations of life in this world, in this flesh we have our Lord right there with us, we need to remember even in the darkest hours we are not alone.
JESUS CHRIST IS OUR COVERING
We just read where the Apostles were on a boat on the sea of Galilee and were, "…COVERED with waves…" I see another type here. What do the "raging waves of the sea" symbolize?
Jude tells us that, "filthy dreamers," who "defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities," "brute beasts," those who have "gone the way of Cain," and are after "the error of Balaam," and those who "perished in the gainsaying of core," these are "spots in your feasts of charity … RAGING WAVES OF THE SEA…" (Jude 8-13).
Say, did you notice where these "filthy dreamers, brute beasts, raging waves of the sea" are located. That’s right—IN THE CHURCH. These evil people are eating right along with the rest in the Church’s "feasts of charity." These are those who, "say they are apostles [of Christ], and are not," and those who, "say they are Jews [spiritual Jews -- converted Christians], and are not, but are the synagogue of Satan."
The disciples were literally "covered with waves" of the sea, but they were also covered with the "raging waves of the sea" spoken of in Jude, because they were, as yet, unconverted.
Actually, the Sea of Galilee is really a lake, also called, The Lake of Gennesar [et] and Lake Tiberias. Jesus Himself called Galilee a "lake" (Luke 8:22). Notice that the carnality of man symbolized in "covered with waves" (raging waves of the sea) needed salvation—"Lord save us, WE PERISH." What did Jesus become to His disciples at that very instant? Answer: "a covering shelter." Whereas they were covered by the raging waves of the sea, Jesus now became their "covering."
Jesus SAVED His disciples from the "raging waves of the sea that covered them," in the middle of the Sea [lake] of Galilee. But this was a literal physical event. They were not spiritually converted as yet, but this event pointed to just such a conversion of the spirit. Will not Jesus also become a "covering shelter" for others? If so, for whom, and for how many?
JESUS CHRIST IS THE COVERING SHELTER
OF THE WHOLE WORLD
"And He [Jesus] is the propitiation [Greek: hilasmos, signifies "an expiation, a means whereby sin is COVERED and remitted" Strong’, p. 121] for our sins: and not for ours only, but also FOR THE SINS OF THE WHOLE WORLD" (John 2:2).
It may come as a surprise to realize that Jesus started His work of propitiation in a "lake"—the Lake of Galilee, and He will finish His work of propitiation in another lake, "the Lake of Fire."
In Romans 3:25 we read:
"Whom God has set forth to be a PROPITIATION through faith in His blood to declare His righteousness for the remission [passing over of] sins that are past, through the forbearance of God."
In Heb. 9:5 this same word hilcsterion (propitiatory) is used for the COVERING LID OF THE ARK. Jesus Christ IS the ark. When the disciples were "covered by the raging waves of the sea" Jesus Christ became their "covering," and (physically) SAVED THEM!
In Hebrew, "haven" comes from cowph, and it means "to COVER; a cove (as a sheltered bay, Strong’s Hebrew Dictionary p. 32).
Jesus not only "propitiates—COVERS," He IS the Covering, "…IS the Propitiation…" (I John 2:2). Likewise, "Jesus Christ the same yesterday, and today, and for ever," does not just "cover" IN the lake of fire: HE IS THE LAKE OF FIRE! Jesus Christ IS the Judge of the world, and the world is Judged not only BY Jesus Christ, but IN Jesus Christ.
These words and their meanings that God chooses for our understanding are not accidental coincidences. Every word of God is purified to perfectly fit its application:
"The WORDS of the Lord are PURE WORDS: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times" (Psalm 12:6).
Do any really believe that God wants to play just one more insane cruel joke on the majority of humanity which are supposedly destined to an eternity of torture in fire, by telling us that this insane pit of torture is going to take place in a SHELTERED PLACE OF SAFETY? Is God Almighty going to torture the majority of humanity in a place He jeeringly calls: a pond, a lake, a "SHELTERED PLACE OF SAFETY?"
It is true that, "It is a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the Living God" (Heb. 10:31), but that does not negate the fact that there is also "safety, shelter, and covering" in God’s Divine Pond of Spiritual purifying FIRE.
http://bible-truths.com/lake12.html
His Peace and Wisdom to you,
Joe
joyful1:
:D wow! good thread guys! I think I see what you are saying: that at that time Paul was saying that the whole world was groaning and travailing "until now" ....but NOW (which was then)...at least the believers SAW the GREAT LIGHT and UNDERSTOOD that the Saviour had come! And Paul understood that the elect had come into the world as well....something that could NOT have happened UNTIL NOW (which was then!)...by that I mean...the elect had begun to appear at that time. Now a baby is born head first....and the head of THE CHRIST, Jesus, was born...first fruits....and the process is ongoing....in us individually and in the world as the Christ is being born (hands, arms, chest, abdomen, legs, etc. we are all different PARTS of the Body)... into the world for the future reign.
Is this CLOSE?
:D
Joyce
hillsbororiver:
--- Quote from: joyful1 on January 16, 2008, 08:49:46 AM ---
I think I see what you are saying: that at that time Paul was saying that the whole world was groaning and travailing "until now" ....but NOW (which was then)...at least the believers SAW the GREAT LIGHT and UNDERSTOOD that the Saviour had come! And Paul understood that the elect had come into the world as well....something that could NOT have happened UNTIL NOW (which was then!)...by that I mean...the elect had begun to appear at that time.
--- End quote ---
Yes Joyce,
The "until now" can also apply to each and every one of us at the moment (in our/their own lifetime) that come to this realization!
Paul's generation was the first to receive this wonderful New Covenant but every (called/chosen) believer who came after that time has their own personal Eureka! moment in regard to this incredible Truth.
His Peace and Wisdom to you,
Joe
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