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carol v:
There are two groups, the called and the chosen, and one Resurrection.
The teaching on this topic is extensively covered in the teaching at http://bible-truths.com/rapture.htm Exposing the "Secret Rapture" Theory
Peace to you
Arcturus
Arcturus, I believe there is a first and second resurrection
Rev 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Rev 20:6 Blessed and holy is he that hath part in the first resurrection: on such the second death hath no power, but they shall be priests of God and of Christ, and shall reign with him a thousand years.
There is a spring harvest and a fall harvest. No secret rapture of course. However, I'm not qualified to debate on the subject and probably should read Ray's secret rapture paper again. I do believe though that the harvests of the OT are types of the resurrections. There is Christ the Firstfruit, then the harvest of the firstfruits (the elect) and the fall harvest or "ingathering."
Exo 23:16 And the feast of harvest, the firstfruits of thy labors, which thou hast sown in the field: and the feast of ingathering, which is in the end of the year, when thou hast gathered in thy labors out of the field.
Just my limited understanding.
Deborah-Leigh:
Hi Carol
Jesus said I am the Resurrection. Jn 11:25 There are not two authentic Jesus's. There is a false Jesus manufactured in Babylon who they worship. This is another Jesus Paul spoke about and there is the living True Jesus who is the living true Resurrection with no parallel or shadow.
I agree with your scriptures. There is a first resurrection and a second death.
peace to you
Arcturus :)
Kat:
Here is an excerpt from the Mobile Conference 2007 'HOW WE GOT THE BIBLE'
http://forums.bible-truths.com/ index.php/topic,5815.15.html ------------
Now for the last few years I’ve been looking at all these things, about the return of Christ, the millennium and the kingdom and all these things. I haven’t written to much about that yet. You know why? Because I don’t understand it! But now I’m getting there and here is a Scripture in Revelation.
Rev 20:2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that old serpent, who is the Devil and Satan, and bound him a thousand years.
v. 3 And he cast him into the bottomless pit (abyss), and shut him up and set a seal on him, that he should deceive the nations no more until the thousand years should be fulfilled. And after that he must be loosed a little season.
That verse gives me a problem, it would take a long time to explain why. Believe me most people that teach and write books on these prophecies, don’t have a clue. Not only do they not have the answers, they don’t even know what the problems are.
But these verses here;
Rev 20:4 …And they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.
v. 5 But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished. This is the first resurrection.
Both of these verses can not be true, there is a problem here. I racked my brain, in my spare time, but I kept it in the back of my mind for a long time. There is a problem, that won’t work and I can’t make it work. It doesn’t fit, there is no way to make this thing fit. Then some months ago, now I know why it, “But the rest of the dead did not live again until the thousand years were finished” won’t fit. It’s not Scripture! Tischendorf has it right there.
-Rev. 20:5 But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished
It’s not in the Sinaiticus. So I said, okay now we’re moving again. We’re a little closer to the Truth.
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mercy, peace and love
Kat
carol v:
Hi Carol
Jesus said I am the Resurrection. Jn 11:25 There are not two authentic Jesus's. There is a false Jesus manufactured in Babylon who they worship. This is another Jesus Paul spoke about and there is the living True Jesus who is the living true Resurrection with no parallel or shadow.
I agree with your scriptures. There is a first resurrection and a second death.
peace to you
Arcturus
Your response confuses me Arcturus. I did not ever say in my post that there were two Jesus's and your comments following are very...well, I don't want to start bickering with you. But if you truly wish for me to have peace, please don't put words in my mouth or so purposefully twist what I said.
My response was about the 'when' and the 'how' of the resurrection, not the 'Who.' I never, ever, never, ever said there was another "Who". We were not talking about the spiritual resurrection of the living by the way. If you'll read the topic of this thread you will find out that we are talking about what happens to dead people. That's the name of this thread..."dead".
I did not say that the "Who" has parallels and shadows. What I said was that the 'how' and 'when' are typed and shadowed in the Old Testament through the harvests. Believing that there are different times for resurrection for believers and unbelievers does NOT mean that I believe there is any other way except through the one true Jesus Christ. It certainly doesn't mean that I need a talking to about the Babylonian's who worship another jesus. Small j.
We are, of course, only resurrected through the one and only Jesus Christ. Dead or alive, believers, unbelievers or babylonians, Jesus Christ is the resurrection and life for us all.
However, I do believe that there is a study that could be made that Christ is typed in the Old Testament through Joseph and Boaz among others. This does NOT mean that I don't believe there is a true, living, currently-resurrecting-us, Jesus Christ. It means that one way we are taught about Christ and our relationship to Him is through the types and shadows of the OT. Why you think this is a Babylonian thing, well I have no clue.
Paul certainly believed that the Old Testament was full of 'tupos' (types) and I don't think he was worshipping the Babylonian jesus. Do you? And since the entire Word is a revelation of the true Jesus Christ then it seems pretty clear that He can be typed, paralled and shadowed throughout the Scripture without being a type, shadow or parallel Himself.
It's these exact conversations that have led me to let my membership in this forum lapse twice already in the last 3 years. Please do not put words in my mouth. "Two authentic Jesus's...?" Where did you ever get that from what I said? Must be time to go back to reading the emails and downloading the audios...
Carol
Deborah-Leigh:
Sorry you feel like that Carol. My purpose was not to upset, challenge or confuse anyone. :(
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
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