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Author Topic: Are you carnal?  (Read 5112 times)

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Sorin

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Are you carnal?
« on: February 25, 2008, 01:09:14 PM »

What then is it to be carnal or carnally minded? It’s not good, I can tell you that. It’s a monster—IT’S A BEAST:

    "for to be carnally minded is DEATH…"

And just why is that?

    "Because the carnal mind is enmity [DEEP-SEATED HATRED] against God: for it is NOT SUBJECT to the [spiritual] law of God, neither indeed CAN BE [Gk: ‘is ABLE’]. So then they that are in the flesh [carnal-minded] CANNOT please God" (Rom. 8:6-8).

    *

      Have YOU ever seen yourself as the man of sin?
    *

      Do you believe that YOU were once the son of perdition?
    *

      Have YOU ever been carnally-minded in your walk with God?
    *

      Have YOU ever left your first love?
    *

      Have YOU ever put your hand to the plough and looked back?
    *

      Has the spiritual house YOU built upon the sand fallen yet?
    *

      Have you fallen from grace since first believing?

No? You say, "NO—NEVER"! Then the chances are great that "ye are YET carnal."

 

WHEN WILL I SEE THE BEAST WITHIN?

Paul wasn’t telling the unbelieving world that "ye are yet carnal." Nor was Jesus telling the world that they had "left the first love." No, Paul and Jesus are both telling THE CHURCH that they are "yet carnal and have left their first love"! In other words, AFTER coming into a church, AFTER they have accepted Christ, AFTER they have pursued their walk with God, AFTER they have built a spiritual house upon the sand, AFTER they have become indoctrinated with the commandments of men and the traditions of men, can one fall away and be in a position to actually spiritually SEE THE BEAST WITHIN! SEE the man of sin and the son of perdition. See your carnal-minded, God hating, SINS. You and I and all who have be enlightened by God’s word and our own failures in life, can surely see that we are all spiritually, WILD BEASTS.

If you insist that: "Ray! I don’t see myself as a spiritual BEAST, or a man of SIN, or the son of PERDITION [destruction]." Well, all I can to say is to parrot Paul: "YE ARE YET CARNAL."

 
Taken from Ray's Lake of Fire 14
http://bible-truths.com/lake14.html
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phazel

  • Guest
Re: Are you carnal?
« Reply #1 on: February 25, 2008, 01:52:04 PM »



The subject of the Carnal mind is interesting as I often believe I am carnal minded because of how I react and things I set mty mind to that I think I am right about that.

So a couple of questions I might ask is.

If I recognize my faults, even though I still have not overcome them  does that mean I am not really carnal minded?


Would a true carnal mind actually not recognize that at all, or would it be not recognizing the need for Christ to take care of our faults?


I ask that second question because I have not found one person in my life that thinks they are perfect, so they do recognize faults, they just do not express any need for Jesus.

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Kat

  • Guest
Re: Are you carnal?
« Reply #2 on: February 25, 2008, 04:06:12 PM »


Hi Phazel,

Well being in the flesh, is carnal, because the word carnal in the Greek G4559 sarkikos means - pertaining to flesh, that is, (by extension) bodily, temporal, or (by implication) animal, unregenerate.
So before we have God's Spirit working in us all our actions are carnal or for the flesh.
But when the Holy Spirit is indwelling our way of thinking changes.  We no longer set our minds on the carnal/flesh, but the spiritual.  We have a stronger desire to obey the Laws of God, over the pulls of the flesh.  But that's not to say we won't still stumble, because we are still in the flesh and need to be chastened in order to learn.

Here is an email where Ray explains this.

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,4098.0.html ---------

It is GOOD that we should feel embarrassed over our sins. My past sins are an embarrassment to me when I from time to time think about them. If they were NOT an embarrassment to me, I might still be committing these same stupid and lustful acts.  Embarrassment and guilt are good for us. These feelings first make us realize that these things are lustful, and wrong, and stupid.  But we will not have victory over them unless and until God reveals to us their real purpose and need to get rid of them.

Where did the mechanism by which Eve:  "saw that the tree was GOOD FOR FOOD, and that it was PLEASANT TO THE EYES, and a tree to be desired to MAKE ONE WISE..." come from in the first place?  Did SHE create these desires in her heart and mind and soul?  Get real--SHE HAD NOT A CLUE!  God created humanity in the spiritually weakened state in which we find ourselves, but there is a great and grand reason and purpose for it.

There is a "SPIRITUAL GREATNESS" that is achieved by the conquering of illegal pulls [spiritually 'illegal'] of the flesh and the stupid sensual lust for self-gratification.  These things are not good, in and by themselves, as modern psychologists might try to convince us, but they do serve a good purpose when they embarrass us and make us feel guilty. Embarrassment and guilt are the precursors to REPENTANCE.

We must come to the place in our lives where we not only desire to obey the laws of the land, the powers ordained by God to somewhat limit the evils of society, but to also obey the Laws of GOD.  We want and desire to do what God says, not because we have figured out all the logical logistics of His commandments, but because we desire to OBEY HIM REGARDLESS of how well we understand all the reasons why God tells us to do and not do certain things.

Christians will argue;  "Well I don't see the harm in teaching my little ones about Santa Claus and the Easter Bunny."  Of course they don't. To their carnal minds the commandment of God to "Learn NOT THE WAY OF THE HEATHEN" has little or no effect on their attempt to worship God as they please.

When you see the "SIN in sin" and start to hate sin as God hates sin, then and only then will you make progress in eliminating these things in your life. Of course, you know, when I say such things it means that God is bringing this about in your thinking and God is enabling you to have to the power to actually conquer these pulls of the flesh.  All we who have had a measure of success in victory over sin to the point that sin "no longer has DOMINION over us" (Rom. 6:8-19), desired to be free from sin LONG BEFORE IT EVER ACTUALLY CAME ABOUT! I believe that most of my readers will say "A-men" to that!

Be patient and do not stop crying out to God for deliverance, for in time God will grant you the fruit of righteousness.

God be with you,
Ray

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David

  • Guest
Re: Are you carnal?
« Reply #3 on: February 25, 2008, 04:51:51 PM »

Hi Sorin. Thank you so much for sharing this insight. I remember discussing something along these lines with a Friend in Church before I left. Our pastor would always put every single scripture, especially those from Paul's letters out on people in the local pubs and clubs, people in betting shops, kids on street corners taking drugs and causing trouble, basically anyone except those in the Church. I asked my friend if he realised that just about all of Paul's Epistles were written to the Church and were mostly about the Church. Of course they apply to everyone, as does all of Gods word. But if we who claim to be in Christ don't see that these scriptures are for us then we are lost. I was as carnal as the day I was born when I was in the Church. For a time I actually believed that I was fine, I was saved, it was done, I was complete in Christ. I remember the first time I watched the two videos of Ray doing the talk on "how hard is it to get saved" on Google, and I just thought "Oh Lord, please help me I am in so much trouble." I realised right then I hadn't even started, I had taken one tiny step was all. I had a mountain the size of which is not seen on this earth to climb, and even then its only a slim chance I'll be saved.
Oh yes I was indeed carnal, and in some respects I probably still am. I don't believe our carnal mind is fully burned out of us while we still live in the flesh. 
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Martinez

  • Guest
Re: Are you carnal?
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2008, 07:36:58 PM »

If you can be affect adversely by external circumstances you, you are still carnal.

Mat 5:27  "You have heard that it was said, 'You shall not commit adultery.'
Mat 5:28  But I say to you that everyone who looks at a woman with lustful intent has already committed adultery with her in his heart.

Mat 15:11  it is not what goes into the mouth that defiles a person, but what comes out of the mouth; this defiles a person."

Mat 15:18  But what comes out of the mouth proceeds from the heart, and this defiles a person.
Mat 15:19  For out of the heart come evil thoughts, murder, adultery, sexual immorality, theft, false witness, slander.
Mat 15:20  These are what defile a person. But to eat with unwashed hands does not defile anyone."


The beast, that man of sin reminds of that kid that you go somewhere with after school and He says "Hey Martinez, you wanna go throw eggs at Mr Thompson's house?" and you say "I don't know, my father said that it's wrong to throw things" and He says "Oh come on, do you always do what your parents tell you? it will be fun" and of coarse your so weak willed you just cave in!

The Beast is also like the Incredible Hulk! your quite happily living your life as Bruce Banner, trying to be a good disciple of Jesus, when all of a sudden someone comes an says of does something that hurt you or makes you angry and before you can even try and fight it (or even if do try and fight it) Roarr!!! your transformed into the beast and you rip that person head clean off and afterwards when you change back into Bruce you shake your head and go "will I never be rid of this green skinned curse!!??

To answer your question Sorin, yes I've seen the Beast, the man of sin, and He is still Me!

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Sorin

  • Guest
Re: Are you carnal?
« Reply #5 on: February 26, 2008, 07:41:37 PM »

Martinez, believe me when I say; I am still the beast as well. And man is this beast ferocious.
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Martinez

  • Guest
Re: Are you carnal?
« Reply #6 on: February 26, 2008, 07:59:05 PM »

Martinez, believe me when I say; I am still the beast as well. And man is this beast ferocious.


Yep! ;D

Damned green skinned curse it is! ;D ;)
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