and everything that does not come from faith is sin

[Robin]

Romans 14:23
But the man who has doubts is condemned if he eats, because his eating is not from faith; and everything that does not come from faith is sin.

My brother and I have been talking about this verse this month. We were relating it to the belief that  choosing God has to be sin because it is not from faith.

My son started drinking again last night after a year of being sober. When he drinks he becomes violent and I have to break contact with him and put him in God's hands. I can do all the right things, but not without fear and emotional pain. He always puts himself in life and death situations and I never know if he'll live through it.

I thought of the verse above and even though I put my son in God's hands it is not from faith yet. It is just doing the right thing. So it is sin because of the fear and worry I go through.

I thought of some other verses.


Luke 9
58Jesus replied, "Foxes have holes and birds of the air have nests, but the Son of Man has no place to lay his head."

59He said to another man, "Follow me."
      But the man replied, "Lord, first let me go and bury my father."

60Jesus said to him, "Let the dead bury their own dead, but you go and proclaim the kingdom of God."

61 Still another said, "I will follow you, Lord; but first let me go back and say good-by to my family."

62Jesus replied, "No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit for service in the kingdom of God."



2 Samuel 18
31 Then the Cushite arrived and said, "My lord the king, hear the good news! The LORD has delivered you today from all who rose up against you."

32 The king asked the Cushite, "Is the young man Absalom safe?"
      The Cushite replied, "May the enemies of my lord the king and all who rise up to harm you be like that young man."

33 The king was shaken. He went up to the room over the gateway and wept. As he went, he said: "O my son Absalom! My son, my son Absalom! If only I had died instead of you—O Absalom, my son, my son!"

2 Samuel 19
1 Joab was told, "The king is weeping and mourning for Absalom." 2 And for the whole army the victory that day was turned into mourning, because on that day the troops heard it said, "The king is grieving for his son." 3 The men stole into the city that day as men steal in who are ashamed when they flee from battle. 4 The king covered his face and cried aloud, "O my son Absalom! O Absalom, my son, my son!"

5 Then Joab went into the house to the king and said, "Today you have humiliated all your men, who have just saved your life and the lives of your sons and daughters and the lives of your wives and concubines. 6 You love those who hate you and hate those who love you.

I think of David and his son Absalom when I'm going through all these trials with my own son. David had to put the Kingdom before his own grief over the loss of his son.

Jesus seems to say the same thing in the verses above. Those are hard words. I can hear myself saying "Lord, save my son first and then I will be able to follow you in faith." That's not how it works though.

62Jesus replied, "No one who puts his hand to the plow and looks back is fit for service in the kingdom of God."


Mark 9:24
Immediately the boy's father exclaimed, "I do believe; help me overcome my unbelief!"

[Karen]

I empathise with you regarding the issues of your son. I also have experienced many problems with my children in the past and still do in a variety of ways, drug use, alcohol use amongst other stuff! I used to call it the ' the sin of anxiety' as in Math 6 we are exorted to not be anxious. Perhaps more pertinently in Math7 it goes on to say that 'you then, who are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children.....' I see your response to your son's behaviour as a good gift. You love him and are trying help him by doing what you know to be right.  I suspect you believe this to be right because you believe God has revealed this wisdom to you. Surely Faith is an ongoing growth, therefore you are in faith by trusting in Father God for you and your son that you will cope and that through these issues you will increase in your knowledge of God.
Isn't this 'the contrasts' God has given us so that we may learn more of His goodness.

This is my first post, I'm afraid that I am not very good at 'paying attention to the word' as Ray exhorts so I'm trusting Ray and my good husband (Dave in UK)  to do that better than me at this moment in time and I thank God for the intuition He has given me that acts as a good receptor tool for me in the first place.

[psalmsinger]

I haven't looked at that verse in detail before, but surely it is inclusive of "faith in God".  All other faith would not be in God and therefore sin.  Karen, your reflections are excellent.  Think of all the emotions and feelings you have for your son as he has to experience this death of the flesh and know that our God cares about our children even more than we can possibly know.  God is not anxious or worried for He knows the final outcome is positive and has planned how to perfect each vessel in love.   Faith is believing that God will fulfill His promises even when it just seems hopeless to us as we see and deal with such imperfections here and now.  Jesus revealed to us the emotions that God or His children on many occasions especially Love, the most important one.  He spoke once of taking them under His wing like a mother hen does her chicks, but they would not.  Sometimes our children are like that too..........we just have to love them anyway as we seek what is right by faith in God.  May God correct our children and bring about a complete change of their heart through His love. His will be done.

37   O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
(KJV)

Rest in the Lord,

Barbara

[Robin]

Welcome Karen.

You said

"Isn't this 'the contrasts' God has given us so that we may learn more of His goodness."

And the scripture Barbara posted

37   O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

John 3
16 For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. 17 For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved.


What a beautiful picture of the Father's heart toward all his children. These contrasts really are showing me God's goodness. I've always struggled with being able to see God's love. This is the second time the trials with my son have shown me the love of God when I couldn't learn it in any other way.

1 John 4:18
There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.


Thank you.

[joyful1]

Hi Gena, Karen and Barbara--and all!

Gena--let me say how sorry I am for your pain and the sense of failure that probably has overcome your son at this point--growing pains! I hope that this brings a deeper longing in his heart for God's strength....

Isaiah 41:10
So do not fear, for I am with you; do not be dismayed, for I am your God. I will strengthen you and help you; I will uphold you with my righteous right hand.


You've reminded me of a very important truth!
Our faith increases! (Kingdom things grow!)

I am seeing that the faith AND its INCREASE, however, is of God!

1 Corinthians 3:6
I planted the seed, Apollos watered it, but God made it grow.

Like any of the other "kingdom" things in our lives....we want MORE and we want it NOW! LOL!

Luke 17:5
The apostles said to the Lord, "Increase our faith!"

Praying for our faith to increase and our peace to be multiplied, this day!

Sincerely,
Joyce

[Deborah-Leigh]

Hello M G

You observe quote : ....the trials with my son have shown me the love of God when I couldn't learn it in any other way.

To be grown to a place high enough to be enabled by the Spirit of God to SEE LOVE in TRIALS is extraordinary of God and a miracle of Divine favor that exposes how God works!

Barbara your insightful observation is inspiring to all who are in trials. Quote : God is not anxious or worried for He knows the final outcome is positive

Hi Karen. Welcome to the Forum!  and joyful1 it is so true what you say that God wills strengthen us and help us.

Peace to you
Arcturus