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[Akira329]

Triton that was funny

[hillsbororiver]

Do you guys think the worms will be happy?

Happy and very fat!

Great observation Triton.

Peace,

Joe

[Patrick]

Just like regenerative buckets of KFC

Make it Popeye's New Orleans spicy, and I'll be fatter and happier.

[David]

Hi Triton.
When examined the heresy of eternal hell is so full of contradictions, foolish misconceptions, and physical impossibilities, that we could spend a great deal of time pointing them out.
For instance, the majority of Christians believe that hell is a literal physical location, and there are billions of people there NOW burning for their sins. They believe that sinners enter hell fully conscious with a physical body. Question, how does a physical body endure being burned continually for even a day, let alone for eternity without turning to ash? I used to know a couple of guys that worked in a crematorium. According to them a body is turned to ash in no more than an hour when it goes into the furnace.
The answer I invariably get from Christians is that these sinners with their physical bodies cannot die once they are in hell, so therefore they burn forever. Well that poses more questions than it answers anyway, and still doesn't answer how a physical body alive or dead withstands continual burning and remains intact. But we also have another problem, so now these sinners have eternal life, which according to scripture can only be given through Jesus Christ. Answer is typically "well yes, Jesus gives them eternal life so that they can be punished eternally for their sins and for rejecting the Gospel." So now they turn Jesus Christ into a depraved monster, and they have a hell full of repentant believers. Think about it, if they rejected Christ and the Gospel, well they sure as grass is green won't now will they, not if they've been judged in the very presence of Christ. And if they are fully aware of their fate for their sins etc which is a fair assumption given that they are fully conscious in a living physical body, and this fire hole full of tortured physical bodies exists, well I think even Saddam Hussein is going to start to do some serious repenting, but according to Christians, too late, tough luck, they are going to hell.

[Dave in Tenn]

I don't mean to argue, but to run with a point that David made.  A majority of Christians might well believe that Hell is full of physical bodies.  Many don't, however, arguing that hell is full of tormented souls.  Both of these views contradict each other and both would be willing to call the other heretical.  Add to this equation Individualistic beliefs, concepts, and visions of Hell--each capable of deeming all others heresy--and you get such a twisted mishmash of contradictions within contradictions that God Himself is the only One smart enough to untangle.

In terms of the 'Hellites' attacking US, how complex a defense we must make if that's our goal!  To stand our guard against assaults from dozens or even hundreds of 'official' Hell doctrines joined by Militias of Millions of Unofficial, individualistic combatants and we're sure to get bogged down.

Which of the following propositions is closer to the truth as WE understand it?

1.  There used to be a Hell, but now there isn't because the scriptures prove it.

2.  The Scriptures teach that there is no Hell.

3.  The Scriptures do not teach Hell.

I'm going with #3.  They, instead, teach the Gospel and many other wonderful truths.

There are reasons why the Hellites need to hear this truth, without doubt.  The rest of the world needs to hear it too. I don't want to make the focus of THE Gospel #2 above.

If I'm not getting it, let me know.

Added next day:  This is what has been so powerful about reading Ray's articles.  YES, he takes on all comers with boldness.  But he also 'replaces' error with truth by teaching truth in the course of dealing with those that contradict. 

[David]

I don't mean to argue, but to run with a point that David made.  A majority of Christians might well believe that Hell is full of physical bodies.  Many don't, however, arguing that hell is full of tormented souls.  Both of these views contradict each other and both would be willing to call the other heretical.  Add to this equation Individualistic beliefs, concepts, and visions of Hell--each capable of deeming all others heresy--and you get such a twisted mishmash of contradictions within contradictions that God Himself is the only One smart enough to untangle.

In terms of the 'Hellites' attacking US, how complex a defense we must make if that's our goal!  To stand our guard against assaults from dozens or even hundreds of 'official' Hell doctrines joined by Militias of Millions of Unofficial, individualistic combatants and we're sure to get bogged down.

Which of the following propositions is closer to the truth as WE understand it?

1.  There used to be a Hell, but now there isn't because the scriptures prove it.

2.  The Scriptures teach that there is no Hell.

3.  The Scriptures do not teach Hell.

I'm going with #3.  They, instead, teach the Gospel and many other wonderful truths.

There are reasons why the Hellites need to hear this truth, without doubt.  The rest of the world needs to hear it too. I don't want to make the focus of THE Gospel #2 above.

If I'm not getting it, let me know.

Added next day:  This is what has been so powerful about reading Ray's articles.  YES, he takes on all comers with boldness.  But he also 'replaces' error with truth by teaching truth in the course of dealing with those that contradict. 

Hi Dave, thank you for your input brother.
Yes you are correct, many Christians believe that Hell is a realm full of tortured souls, however most believe that Hell is a physical place/geographic location (and they believe the same about Heaven). So whether they believe people in Hell are in physical conscious boddies, or just there in terms of their soul, the questions and contradictions are still glaringly obvious as you point out. They still have to have eternal life. If they are physical how do they endure the fire without burning up? If they are souls how do they feel physical burning? The whole doctrine doesn't have a leg to stand on in terms of scripture, morally, in terms of common sense, in terms of scientific physical possibilities.
I think you are right to go with number 3, however I would also say that number 2 is also correct. The doctrine of eternal hell and all its sub doctrines that hold it up, as Ray has shown us in his papers, is full of pagan beliefs and myths. The Bible clearly teaches us never to follow these beliefs.

[chuckt]

hi all, i got this from a martin zender book i read along time ago, i put it in my own format but just though i should give credit...sorry if its against the rules:

geographical location........................ kjv,niv, nasb




hierousalem..................................jerus alem

kapharnaoum................................caperna um

nazeret........................................naz areth

bethania.......................................bet hany

ephesion...................................... ephesus

bethleem......................................beth lehem

kappodokia....................................capp adocia

damaskos.....................................damas cus

geenna..........................................HELL (((( say what )))



kinda cute.....


chuckt

[dave]

I read the email that was sent and I am always impressed by how
 "living witness's" of "hell" know so much about a "place"(and who lives there) and that the scriptures give so little information about;      and well if National Geographics says.... well..whats left to say.
I firmly believe that the souls who believe the myrhs, fables, and stories told by religious people to keep them in a                     
controlled "box"...will not be changed unless the witness of a believer is Holy Spirit led.
In other words, if I am not filled and led at the time..all the words, scriptural proof, and debate will not "make em see."

[Kent]

Exactly. You said it well, brother! BTDT.

"Hell" hath no fury like trying to how them some things they are missing.
But that does not stop me from planting some seeds for those that read or overhear the conversation.

[Roy Monis]

hi all, i got this from a martin zender book i read along time ago, i put it in my own format but just though i should give credit...sorry if its against the rules:

geographical location........................ kjv,niv, nasb




hierousalem..................................jerus alem

kapharnaoum................................caperna um

nazeret........................................naz areth

bethania.......................................bet hany

ephesion...................................... ephesus

bethleem......................................beth lehem

kappodokia....................................capp adocia

damaskos.....................................damas cus

geenna..........................................HELL (((( say what )))



kinda cute.....


chuckt

Hi! Chuckt

Great stuff, I'll take a note of that. Thanks!

God bless you brother/sister in our joint walk in Christ.   

Love in Christ Jesus.

Roy UK