> General Discussions
Gods laws of health and nutrition - where in Scipture?
carol v:
--- Quote from: lilitalienboi16 on September 03, 2008, 04:58:54 PM ---
--- Quote from: Linny on September 03, 2008, 03:39:54 PM ---I'm sorry Alex but we have been talking about a lot of things on this thread and I even went back on this whole page and never saw once "don't listen to this doctor and don't listen to that doctor."
We are just talking about natural ways to find healing using all the things God has given us.
If you choose to use doctors, then go for it. It is your right to do so. Just as it is my right to read for myself and try other things.
By the way, I have gotten a lot of my information, especially regarding child issues, from a Pediatric doctor with 30 years experience who teaches when you need a doctor, and when you don't. It was his very educated opinion that we have used doctors way too much and to our detriment.
Bless you,
Lin
--- End quote ---
Carol V wrote; "PLEASE -- don't listen to that doctor"
Edit: Sorry carol V, i'm not trying to pick on your or anything.. simply showing LIN that i had reason for what i said.
--- End quote ---
ALEX QUIT PICKING ON ME ;D
I was talking about one specific doctor Alex who told Brenda how low carbing would KILL her.
Beloved:
I have been trying to avoid this topic somewhat. Thanks Brenda for the point for humanizing docotors. I get so tired of these types of discussions some times.
I was just talking to someone in alternative medicine about the field of medicine.
Guess what folks there is no simple solution.
Everything people have said has some element of truth but what is lacking is complete understanding.
The physical working of the world are very complex, many people make a statement and then tend to have that statement blanket the whole.
Rather that point out any made here, I want to discuss one I heard on the news this week.
Does eating/drinking grapefruit cause breast cancer?
The answer is yes and no. But when you read this particular persons response there are many unspoken assumptions in the persons answer. What he did not discuss is:
Almost everything you take into your body has to be metabolized. Your digestive tract even though hidden, is an external organ like your skin. It has an opening the mouth and an exit the anus. Jesus spoke of this you remember. It is an interface. The gut is where things taken are internalized.
Grapefruit has a unique quality in that it can induce (change the way your liver works) enzymes (chemicals that cause chemical reactions) . Most of the time grapefruit slows one particular P450 enzyme (they do not have names but numbers CYP** UGT*** too complex to teach here) in the liver. This particular P450 is used to metabolize various substances...hormone digoxin and many others things . It depends on how much and how often you drink it for one.
Now lets say you are taking BCP or Hormone replacement or are producing a little too much estrogen...then eating grapefruit regularly will cause these compound to accumulate. One drink of alcohol can raise hormone replacement 500% Grapefruit does this to a little less extent than alcohol. The levels of hormone raises with each dose,
Now if you have liver cells that has mutated this P450 gene that too will make you susceptible to estrogen you could get cancer of the breast or uterus. There are many other genes in the body that do other things with estrogen that can cause this cancer effect also.
Even if you do not eat grapefruit you could have a mutation and produce too little P450 and get the same effect and never ever drink grapefruit. Then there is epigenic which actually has to do with the 'gene cards you were dealt with at birth' and this is how the environment impacts you as an individual.
It is impossible for any man to monitor all the things in any persons body. We have some computers to help but even these are not enough. We can now examine people genes for their metabolic capabilities (poor responder or excess burners) That is why people respond differently to the same drug. These gene tests are not cheap and may not be covered by insurance.
The problem today is time and money, no doctor has the time to thouroughly search your condition even though that doctor has studied and knows how the body and these drugs works.
On the other side the individual patient does not have this same training and cannot do it for themselves, alternative medicine does not provide as deep as training regarding drugs or environmental interaction and orthodox medicine cannot even keep up with even its own research data and new findings even in this day of computers.
Someone mentioned that poor diet is bad, science has shown over and over that animals and people live longer if they are fed restricted diets less food daily. In one way today's diets are over abundant things like calories etc in other ways it lacks certain nutritions depending on the person's choice of food.
Certain foods and certain medications and conditions can also deplete some nutritive substances, example metformin can deplete Vitamin B12. If you lack B12 then certain chemical reaction do not work as well. it is like a big web everyhting is connected to something else.
Today medical model and reimbursement by insurance make it impossible to spend the time to check every aspect out. Most medical offices spend huge amounts on personnel just to process the paperwork.
I subscribe to a computer program where I can enter foods and herbs and drugs and see the cross reactions, even your pharmacist can't do this, they just analyze the interaction of drugs you are taking. Guess what Walgreen does not know the drugs you are getting from Walmart or the over the counter stuff or supplements you take, let alone the foods you eat. Are you gaining a perspective on a little of the complexity yet?
The stuff (food OTC , drugs environmental chemical etc etc etc) going into the body, and the persons genes and the disease they have all play a role in health.
No man can fathom this. Satan and the world continue to mess with God's creation.
The Scriptures talk about vegetarian diets in the past but the world is now more corrupt, the soils are depleted of nutrients and there are too many confounding things. The species of plants we grow for food have changed and we eat different . Who in the world had citrus year round? Chemical and things are applied to plants , even organically grown foods may have problems with its nutrient content.
I believe that a high vegetarian diet is a good choice, but beans and rice though a vegan diet do not always cut it either. Its protein source are not effective as meat/chick' eggs for B12 and iron. Our bodies are made to digest meat. Jesus ate meat and fish and he talked about giving eggs to his children. This is physical and it has spiritual meaning also.
I have taken courses and I have read and bought books and have research all the aspects alternative medicine and anti aging medicine, toxicology etc and found even these lacking...
Even alternative medicine are after money just like orthodox medicine and the church....their stuff is dirt cheap to produce, no FDA etc...then why the high prices for most of it?
My advice is to approach all with discernment, ask questions, look things up, we have the internet. If you take antibiotics be sure to take a probiotic...replenish the good germs in your gut ....you need them in your gut, they actually metabolize some of things and produce needed things...
Caution eat a small portion of anything that may have antibiotics in it...like meat and dairy. All you need is a size of a deck of cards, one oz of cheese a little dairy etc...not the 18 oz T-Bone that the world wants t serve you. Vary you diet, always choose local and in season if you can, grow some stuff yourselves. eat all kinds of food, Did you know that sauerkraut was a good source of Vitamin C in the past when people did not have citrus and other things we have today. .
I hope that you can now see that the correct answer to the question I posed about grapefruit and breast cancer is .......it DEPENDS......on a whole lot of things.
Oh that one doctor who said that it would kill you...is making a blanket statement....
You have no idea how frustrated I can get because medicine (alternative and orthodox) is really in many ways like the Babylonian church. They are corrupt and yes they too are blind and deaf. As a physician I have to keep this idol of the heart (medicine) in check too.
No arguments in me......God is in control and I will REST in that.
beloved
Kat:
Hi Beloved,
Thank you for your input on this, that was some really good advices. It's good to hear from someone that has put all those years into studying these things.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
Beloved:
here is a little copy form when I did the drug interactio
Note #3 Grapefruit Juice
CYP3A is present in the gut as well as the liver. Grapefruit juice inhibits gut CYP3A if given as 1 double-strength eight ounce glass and will inhibit liver CYP3A if given as three double-strength glasses. If given as one double strength glass, like any CYP inhibitor, it will particularly affect drugs that are preferentially metabolized in the gut. When grapefruit juice interacts with a drug, the inhibition occurs immediately if the grapefruit juice dose is high enough. Although effects can last up to 3 days after grapefruit juice intake, effects are especially predictable when grapefruit juice is consumed along with the oral dose of drug. CYP3A inhibition not only depends on the type of grapefruit juice (the inhibitor, with white grapefruit juice being a better inhibitor than pink and both, mechanism-based inhibitors) but also how much CYP3A is present. As little as 6-8 ounces of grapefruit juice taken WITH a high first pass substrate of CYP3A can substantially alter pharmacokinetics. GFJ also inhibits P-gps other transporters and esterased, and this adds to the effect.
Please note that the program assumes the co-drug is metabolized via the gut. As a result, the program may predict a drug interaction that may not occur if a drug is a liver substrate. If a drug is known to be metabolized in the gut, it is listed as an intestinal 3A substrate. As research becomes available, data will be added to the program.
This is just to show you how this one food wroks, the Gen Rx program says there is 75 to 150 % increase but it really depends on the amount and duration of taking grapefruit in.
So if your genes are normal then you can see, taking it in moderation and not taking it daily would be better. If your genes are abnormal this program can adjust for that too. but you have to do the test.
beloved
OBrenda:
YW Beloved,
One of the parts of the epigeome program I couldn't find for people to watch, was a study they did over several generations of people. What they found was that those people who had great grandparents that lived through famine, where more healthy than, people who had grandparents who ate plenty of nutritious food.
Doesn't make any sense, but it goes along with what Beloved said about eating less...
Someone mentioned that poor diet is bad, science has shown over and over that animals and people live longer if they are fed restricted diets less food daily.
It's confussing, I guess because it's complicated by so many unseen things. I think for my part I will stick with the low carb diet that Samson & Carol have encouraged me with. It is what makes me feel best, and eat less. I would like to check my PH balance for peace of mind.
Learned lots of things here with people putting a lot of time and heart into it.
Alex....I'm sure all will pray for those grades as God directs your path...
;D ;D ;D
Brenda
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