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[ertsky]

i was shocked to find that where the KJV has the english word "patience" many many times (roughly 30) it should read "endurance"

if you have e-Sword bring up the KJV+ which has the strongs numbers and type 5281 into the search box

5281 is the greek hupomone which is endurance like staying under

closely related to 5278 hupomeno which is stay under or endure

heres an example

the KJV reads

Jam 1:4  But let patience have her perfect work, that ye may be perfect and entire, wanting nothing.

Rotherhams has

Jam 1:4 But let, your endurance, have, mature work, that ye may be mature and complete, in nothing, coming short.

WOW!!! (got that one {Jam 1:4} directly from the Lord)

anyways check it out

31 fantastic verses on endurance obscured by the KJV "patience"

blessings

f

[Daniel]

Interesting ertsky I would not have known. I checked the number on strongs it seems to indicate enduring. What do you see in "diffferences" between patience or enduring? Not sure what you caught here.

I checked the dictionary using the word "patience" and it contained the words "to endure"? http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=patience

Daniel

[ertsky]

well to me patience is like

"waiting around in the queue all day tested his patience"

but endurance is like

"he was amazed he could even endure under such incredible pressure"

ie. patience is more passive

endurance is more Christlike

check these verses

KJV says

Rom 5:3  And not only so, but we glory in tribulations also: knowing that tribulation worketh patience;
Rom 5:4  And patience, experience; and experience, hope:
Rom 5:5  And hope maketh not ashamed; because the love of God is shed abroad in our hearts by the Holy Ghost which is given unto us.

Rotherhams has

Rom 5:3 And, not only so, but let us boast also in our tribulations; knowing that, our tribulation, worketh out endurance.
Rom 5:4 And, our endurance, a testing, and, our testing, hope,
Rom 5:5 And, our hope, putteth not to shame. Because, the love of God, hath been poured out in our hearts, through the Holy Spirit that hath been given unto us:

read the 31 verses where KJV has patience for hupomone 5281 and then substitute the more accurate endurance, it's incredible!

f

another example

KJV has

Rev 3:10  Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth.

Youngs has

Rev 3:10  `Because thou didst keep the word of my endurance, I also will keep thee from the hour of the trial that is about to come upon all the world, to try those dwelling upon the earth.

[SteveB]

We must endure until the end my aussie brother...then we will be saved. Waging the good fight of faith, overcoming the CHRUCH WORLD, flesh and the devil.

This is strong meat bro. thanks for posting!

Peace...Steve

[Daniel]

Thank you Ertsky for showing me where you feel they might conflict, I'm not catching that myself. In referencing those who did endure it speaks of considering "the patience" of Job (#5281)

James 5:11 Behold, we count them happy which endure[/u]. Ye have heard of the patience[/b] of Job, and have seen the end of the Lord; that the Lord is very pitiful, and of tender mercy.

The dictionary and the concordance and a "comparison" even in scripture seems to agree with the same thing. I don't see patience as passive. If you have 5 toddlers and "patience" I can't imagine a mom or dad lounging around with a Pina colada in a state of passivity. Though its probrobly done, I highly doubt its the norm :lol:

Daniel

[ertsky]

Daniel the very verse you quoted is a classic example!

the KJV has

Jam 5:11  Behold, we count them happy which endure. Ye have heard of the patience of Job, and have seen the end of the Lord; that the Lord is very pitiful, and of tender mercy.

think about what Job went through!!!!

now tell me, patience or endurance

here's the same verse in Rotherhams

Jam 5:11 Lo! we pronounce them happy who have endured;—Of the endurance of Job, ye have heard, and, the end of the Lord, have ye seen,—that, of much tender affection, is the Lord, and full of compassion,

f

[Daniel]

Alright, I'll let this go Ertsky, I see patience as enduring. Going through hardship while patiently waiting on God thats all.

I don't see patience as relaxing at the beach :lol:  Thats relaxation :lol:

Its kool bro, how you see a thing is how you see it, no problems. I just wanted you to know that just because the word is different doesn't mean I read it as another might perceive what that word means to them thats all.

The scriptures speak in multitudes of ways of the same thing differently. Trial, tribulation, suffering, crucifying the flesh, enduring to the end, patience and longsufffering, taking a wrong, being buffeted for doing well, waiting on the Lord, being spoken evil of and considering Job etc etc etc. One word does not change the overall picture painted in scripture. Even patience when flipped over has endure in it and no doubt I understand whats meant and I use the KJV myself.

Everyone has their preferences though, I realize that. Just in this case (for me personally) I understand the message and see the word the same, no hinderances in that for me thats all.

Blessings bro  

Daniel