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Jonah's Gourd
Beloved:
I wrote the last post at 2:am and can not stop thinking about this.
It seems like such a tall tale but it is so loaded with information
The gourd really represents this world, the things of this world which God brings to man without any preparation on man's part. that bring comfort to man, We receive comfort from the things of this earth. We receive comfort from the plants and the food, the weather, the organic matter that we use to build our things.
Man by nature is more concerned about this earth than he is about his fellow man. We see this today as man gets very uptight when Panda or baby seals are threatened but do you see them organizing any world campaigns and selling tee shirts of protest when the Rowandans or other folks are being slaughtered. Cut down some trees or kill some spotted owls...watch out. This creation is what is important to them. And this is what pains them.
Do you see something similar here, Jonah. is more concerned about this plant than he is about Nineveh, that was on the threshold of being destroyed. You see how unbalanced, how out of proportion, the attitude of man is toward this world.
He is far more concerned about those things which benefit him directly, the things that this world produces, than he is about his fellow man
I found this YLT translation very interesting.
Jon 4:10 And Jehovah saith, `Thou hast had pity on the gourd, for which thou didst not labour, neither didst thou nourish it, which a son of a night was, and a son of a night perished
Being that we are called sons of light...the things of the world are sons of darkness, like grass ....here today gone tommorrow...this is very poetic.
Here at the end of Jonah we are back to almost the same position we were in at the end of chapter one:
the outsiders(the sailors and now the city and its king) had turned to God despite the example they had from a follower of God and they understood and obeyed God better than the prophet did.
And the prophet is once again isolated by his own attitudes and actions, and his only chance out of his isolation is turning back and talking with God. It is time for the insiders to come in too.
The storm, the great fish, the gourd and the worm and scorching sun may all seem at first to be just God giving Jonah a taste of his own medicine, but I think that is only a part of it.
There is something else going on in these last verses. God is calling out to Jonah, asking him to end his isolation and come home.
There is a interplay play of selfishness/selfrighteousness going on in all of us sometimes and we need to constanly pray that God will keep us on the straight and narrow.......for like Jonah and Elijah we are all men who are subject to like passions
beloved
mharrell08:
--- Quote from: Beloved on November 15, 2008, 12:59:41 PM ---I wrote the last post at 2:am and can not stop thinking about this.
It seems like such a tall tale but it is so loaded with information
The gourd really represents this world, the things of this world which God brings to man without any preparation on man's part. that bring comfort to man, We receive comfort from the things of this earth. We receive comfort from the plants and the food, the weather, the organic matter that we use to build our things.
Man by nature is more concerned about this earth than he is about his fellow man. We see this today as man gets very uptight when Panda or baby seals are threatened but do you see them organizing any world campaigns and selling tee shirts of protest when the Rowandans or other folks are being slaughtered. Cut down some trees or kill some spotted owls...watch out. This creation is what is important to them. And this is what pains them.
Do you see something similar here, Jonah. is more concerned about this plant than he is about Nineveh, that was on the threshold of being destroyed. You see how unbalanced, how out of proportion, the attitude of man is toward this world.
He is far more concerned about those things which benefit him directly, the things that this world produces, than he is about his fellow man
I found this YLT translation very interesting.
Jon 4:10 And Jehovah saith, `Thou hast had pity on the gourd, for which thou didst not labour, neither didst thou nourish it, which a son of a night was, and a son of a night perished
Being that we are called sons of light...the things of the world are sons of darkness, like grass ....here today gone tommorrow...this is very poetic.
Here at the end of Jonah we are back to almost the same position we were in at the end of chapter one:
the outsiders(the sailors and now the city and its king) had turned to God despite the example they had from a follower of God and they understood and obeyed God better than the prophet did.
And the prophet is once again isolated by his own attitudes and actions, and his only chance out of his isolation is turning back and talking with God. It is time for the insiders to come in too.
The storm, the great fish, the gourd and the worm and scorching sun may all seem at first to be just God giving Jonah a taste of his own medicine, but I think that is only a part of it.
There is something else going on in these last verses. God is calling out to Jonah, asking him to end his isolation and come home.
There is a interplay play of selfishness/selfrighteousness going on in all of us sometimes and we need to constanly pray that God will keep us on the straight and narrow.......for like Jonah and Elijah we are all men who are subject to like passions
beloved
--- End quote ---
Well said Dr. Carol :)
Marques
hillsbororiver:
Thanks to all who replied, Amrhrasach you are on the right track;
--- Quote from: Amrhrasach on November 14, 2008, 04:41:53 PM ---Joe, would some of this be representative of man's pride, sorrow, and injustice toward God throughout life, a volatile living pattern to man? Yet, God is continually showing his pity, longsuffering (patience), and justice toward man? All with the intent of removing man's self centeredness and instilling a need for God's redemption?
Surely I'm just too far off the mark. But nonetheless, my first thoughts.
A.
--- End quote ---
--- Quote from: Akira329 on November 14, 2008, 04:52:37 PM ---Just when things seem to be going MY way, I am beaten down again.
A very repetitive pattern in the lives of those whom God loves and whom he loves he chastises.
Antaiwan
--- End quote ---
Hi Antaiwan,
We are beaten down especially when we focus on ourselves rather than God and our Brothers and Sisters, whether they be in agreement with us or are in a church or totally in the world they all are our brethren.
--- Quote from: Beloved on November 15, 2008, 12:59:41 PM ---
The gourd really represents this world, the things of this world which God brings to man without any preparation on man's part. that bring comfort to man, We receive comfort from the things of this earth. We receive comfort from the plants and the food, the weather, the organic matter that we use to build our things.
--- End quote ---
Yes Beloved!
Just like the Garden of Eden and the church, gifts from God but with a worm/serpent/devil to tempt us into defiling them with our carnal, selfish nature. You raise many valid points in your responses.
--- Quote from: Beloved on November 15, 2008, 12:59:41 PM ---
Man by nature is more concerned about this earth than he is about his fellow man. We see this today as man gets very uptight when Panda or baby seals are threatened but do you see them organizing any world campaigns and selling tee shirts of protest when the Rowandans or other folks are being slaughtered. Cut down some trees or kill some spotted owls...watch out. This creation is what is important to them. And this is what pains them.
--- End quote ---
Exactly! More moral outrage over someone's "carbon footprint" than all the innocent lives lost to abortion!
--- Quote from: Beloved on November 15, 2008, 12:59:41 PM ---
And the prophet is once again isolated by his own attitudes and actions, and his only chance out of his isolation is turning back and talking with God. It is time for the insiders to come in too.
There is a interplay play of selfishness/selfrighteousness going on in all of us sometimes and we need to constanly pray that God will keep us on the straight and narrow.......for like Jonah and Elijah we are all men who are subject to like passions
--- End quote ---
As there was with "The Sons Of Thunder (James and John) who Jesus rebuked when they wanted to rain fire down on the Samaritans that did not welcome them into their village.
Luk 9:51 And it came to pass, when the time was come that he should be received up, he steadfastly set his face to go to Jerusalem,
Luk 9:52 And sent messengers before his face: and they went, and entered into a village of the Samaritans, to make ready for him.
Luk 9:53 And they did not receive him, because his face was as though he would go to Jerusalem.
Luk 9:54 And when his disciples James and John saw this, they said, Lord, wilt thou that we command fire to come down from heaven and consume them, even as Elijah did?
Luk 9:55 But he turned and rebuked them and said, Ye know not what manner of spirit ye are of.
Luk 9:56 For the Son of man is not come to destroy men's lives, but to save them. And they went to another village.
Carol, you are so right, there is a lot to consider here.
Peace,
Joe
Beloved:
I think you will appreciate this Joe in Luke 11 and Matthew 12 Jesus himself revives the story of Jonah and applies it to his life and to his generation.
In these two passages Jesus denounces the people who are seeking a sign and saying to only sign that will be given to them is the sign of Jonah, ....is it being in the belly of the fish or ....that the foreigners and outsiders repented at the word while they, the current insiders, were not repenting.
According to Jesus, the foreigners and outsiders who had repented would rise in judgment against those in the current generation who were demanding a sign and rejecting it when they had it.
In Matthew the sign of Jonah does point to the belly of the fish In Matthew Jesus likens his own death and resurrection to the time Jonah spent dead for all practical purposed and the message he delivered afterwards, which was accepted with repentance.
The other thing this brings up for me is the "sign of the fish" that a lot of Christians have on their car bumpers do you know the origins and symbolism of a fish? It is not what you think...yep... pagan....the miter hat, not eating fish on fridays...yep they all has pagan roots. No wonder God warns us about graven images...they are all twisted pagan images.
beloved
Amrhrasach:
Beloved, your responses on this topic are deep, interesting, and of high quality. I, for one, appreciate them.
A.
ps. how interesting the bumper stickers and the symbolism. I see them all the time where I live. It never occured to me.
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