> General Discussions
Why Mary
Amrhrasach:
--- Quote from: Dennis Vogel on November 17, 2008, 07:41:55 AM ---
--- Quote from: winner08 on November 16, 2008, 03:07:36 PM ---When God said that we should not worship any idols, does this include statues of Mary and even at that, Jesus also??? What about the saints??would praying to these statues be the same as, lets say any other religion who prays to statues such as ,well i don't want to name names. Still would it not be breaking one of God's ten?
--- End quote ---
Any image is wrong, let alone physical statues.
IMO, people worship many idols of the heart all day, everyday, without realizing it.
Example: For guys it could be a brand new car. It sits in the driveway and you go to the window over and over looking at it with admiration. It fills us with pride to know that's 'my' new car. We like how other people look at our new car with envy.
I'm as guilty as anyone. I just did some minor remodeling. I found myself just looking at my handyword with pride (not that we sould not do whatever we do with all our might).
Anything that fill's us up with pride (puffs up) is wrong. We can take credit for nothing.
Luk 18:19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.
Dennis
--- End quote ---
*>*>*>
Wow! I've really never thought of it that way Dennis. I've tried to understand but it's never come through like that.
"IMO, people worship many idols of the heart all day, everyday, without realizing it."
I'm so guilty. Don't want to be, but I am. I pray God fills our minds with the proper things.
A.
aqrinc:
Yes Dennis,
You are so right, that is why we should Rest in Christ and stop trying to fix us up. As Paul said; Not i but
Christ in me.
Galatians 2:20:
I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ lives in me: and the life which I now live in
the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
Galatians 6:14:
But God forbid that I should glory, except in the cross of our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom the world is crucified
to me, and I to the world.
george.
--- Quote from: Dennis Vogel on November 17, 2008, 07:41:55 AM ---
--- Quote from: winner08 on November 16, 2008, 03:07:36 PM ---When God said that we should not worship any idols, does this include statues of Mary and even at that, Jesus also??? What about the saints??would praying to these statues be the same as, lets say any other religion who prays to statues such as ,well i don't want to name names. Still would it not be breaking one of God's ten?
--- End quote ---
Any image is wrong, let alone physical statues.
IMO, people worship many idols of the heart all day, everyday, without realizing it.
Example: For guys it could be a brand new car. It sits in the driveway and you go to the window over and over looking at it with admiration. It fills us with pride to know that's 'my' new car. We like how other people look at our new car with envy.
I'm as guilty as anyone. I just did some minor remodeling. I found myself just looking at my handyword with pride (not that we sould not do whatever we do with all our might).
Anything that fill's us up with pride (puffs up) is wrong. We can take credit for nothing.
Luk 18:19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.
Dennis
--- End quote ---
Marlene:
George and Dennis, This is all so true. I was always trying to fix me. I was always trying to fix others. I felt responsible to help others. Now, I know I can't fix me or anyone. It is God who does this. Any thing can become and Idol. Christmas use to be that for me. I had expectations that never seemed to work out. I would have a let down feeling after the Holidays. But, before coming in here God started showing me that is why I felt depressed. Now, this is the day my family likes to get together. I almost lost my life two years ago. It was in Oct. That , Christmas was about being with people I love. We never know when we might not have each other. We were never able to have children but we always gave to neices and nephews.
Its not the things that we build up that perish or can be stolen, that have value, but first Christ and people. So, there we should not judge, but judge ourselves because we all have idols of the heart. I dont think having a meal when all are together is wrong. I think anything is wrong when it takes away from the Glory of God. I know we cannot be the judge. The judge will show each one of us those idols of the heart and it will be in his time, not ours.
I believe the best gift we can give is LOVE it never fails, even if the LOVE we gave seems to it never fails. We should live in LOVE 375 days a year. The Holidays are for some just another time to get together. Any other thing besides Love can become an idol .
In His Love,
Marlene
hammerandnails:
Hello, Eileen,
The reason why Jesus was born like us, and not created as Adam, because He had to be like us in EVERY aspect.
Born of a woman through the womb which is the gate.
Gate also means door, a door that opens another dimension.
He had to be born in this dimension through the womb, like us, and us must pass into
another dimension (the kingdom of our father) through Him, which is the door (gate).
So, think about it like this:
The gate to this earthly dimension is the womb.
The gate to the Kindom(heavenly dimension) is Jesus, which in every aspect was like us, in order that we must be qualified to enter.
This is supported by the following scriptures:
John10:1-4
"Verily, verily, I say to you, He that enters not by the door (womb) into the sheepfold, but climbs
up some other way, the same is a thief and a robber."
"But he that enters in by the door (womb) is the Shepperd of the sheep."
"To him the porter(the Father) opens;and the sheep(us) hear his voice: and he(Jesus) calls his
own sheep (the called) by name (before you were in your mother's womb, I knew you), and lead them
out(of this world into the Kindom.)"
"And when he puts forth his own sheep (us, him like us), he goes before them (the first born into the Kindom)
and the sheep (the chosen) follow him (to the end): for they know his voice. (the language of the Kindom,
which is the language of love, which only the chosen can hear, because they were given ears)"
"The said Jesus to them again, Verily, verily, I say to you, I am the door (to the Kindom of the Father)
of (for) the sheep (us)." v.7
"I am the door: (of the Kindom) by Me if any man (must be a man) he shall be saved, and shall
go in and out, (whom all the KEYS[understanding] of the Kindom are given,[the chosen and the faithfull])
and find pasture (spiritual food)." v.9
Also:
"Sanctify (dedicate) to Me all the FIRST BORN, whatsoever OPENS THE WOMB among the children
of Israel, both of man and of beast: IT IS MINE." Exo.13:2
"That you shall set apart TO THE LORD all that open the MATRIX (womb), and every FIRSTLING.....
.........THE MALES SHALL BE THE LORD'S." V.12 ALSO SEE V. 15!
Mary means rebellious, bitter (gk.#3137) from #0413 (Heb) meaning the same thing, from #04805 (Heb.) which means rebellion, bitterness.
"And when they came to Marah (#04785, bitter, from#04751-Mar, bitter, the root word for Mary)
they could not drink of the waters of Marah, for they were bitter: therefore the name of it was called Marah." Exo.15:23
"And Moses cried to the Lord; (see v. 24) and the LORD show him a tree[the cross], which when he
had cast into the waters (see James3), the waters were made sweet:....." v.25
Mary was neither holy nor sweet, but bitter and rebellious (before the Lord was born), as from the seed of the apple
that Eve ate (the tree of knowledge of good[sweet] and evil[bitter]), which came to us through generations!
We are bitter, made sweet by the cross!!! ;D
We carry the seeds of bitterness:
"Looking diligently lest any man fail of the grace of God(after we have been made sweet);
lest ANY ROOT OF BITTERNESS SPRINGING UP TRUBLE YOU, and thereby MANY BE DEFILED;" Heb.12:15
I hope this helps.
Lost in His Love
Ariel
thomasanthony:
Regarding idols and statues in the church, let's not forget idols representing the Holy Spirit in the form of a bird as Paul spoke of in Romans 1:23
"and exchanged the glory of the incorruptible God for an image in the form of corruptible man and of birds and four-footed animals and crawling creatures." NAS
This, of course, is strictly forbidden under the first commandment. My wife goes to a Pentecostal church which a has giant (molded?) image of their logo, which is a dove (phoenix?) with his claws grasping the globe behind the pulpit in a dominating fashion that cannot be ignored. I have asked several members about this, and they believe that the Holy Spirit is God, in fact they pray to the Holy Spirit (which is unscriptural), but somehow do not see this as idolatry. It is even worse when you consider the striking similarities betwen their image and numerous variations used by freemasons.
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