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leeney:
I went to an acquaintance's house for lunch yesterday.  I was expecting to spend the afternoon only with her, but her husband was there.  He stayed right with us the entire day, including himself in all of our conversations.  They knew I was a 'religious' person, but I knew they would never agree with my thinking so I stayed very vague if we went that direction in our talk.  At one point he brought up the fact that he had a gay son, and talked as though this was ok with God--- it was the people who had it all wrong.  He had grown up Baptist; once he found out about his son, he left that denomination and went to the Episcopal church, who accept gays.  So I'm wondering, did he think homosexuality was wrong--until his son 'came out'?  And that if this hits him personally, it's ok?  I just don't get it.

  Also, I remained quiet for a long time while he talked, and he mistook that to mean I agreed with him.  I did not want him thinking that so I let it be known that this was wrong.  Then he really jumped on me, politely, but aggressively.  He asked, where in the Bible does it say homosexuality is a sin?  I told him I had never read that it was a sin---ONLY that it was an abomination in God's eyes, and we are told by Paul to stay away from it.  So being an abomination is enough for me to know God does not approve of it. Boy, he really came on me then.  But nothing he said made any sense, plus, I was in his home, eating at his table, and I did not want to get into any arguments with him, or worse.  It was a very unpleasant situation.  I didn't say anything else after that.  I felt there was nothing I could do but disagree, and it would have just made things worse.  Being in his home made me feel like I should be more respectful; he was trying very hard to love and accept his son---it seemed to me it was himself he was trying to convince, not so much me.  
 
  Anyway, now I'm concerned as to whether I should continue this friendship with his wife.  I really don't think it could go anywhere, now that this has all been brought out in the open.

  What do you all think?
leeney

knuckle:
Hi leeney--------

        you wrote--So I'm wondering, did he think homosexuality was wrong--until his son 'came out'?

          The fellow still sees it as being wrong that is why he is trying so hard to justify it.Love is a funny thing in families.Siblings will fight like cats and dogs but let some one outside the family critisize it and watch the tribe go to war as a whole.Parents often see the choices there children make as personal victories or failures.We can teach our kids values but we can not think or act for them.This man you visited is probably feeling alot of guilt right now.He thinks he let his kid down.He will try anything he can to rid himself of these feelings.Not until he comes to terms with the fact that a. his son is gay and b.he loves im inspite of it will he get rid of this guilt.

          As for the friendship with the mother---you did an excellent job explaining your views to the forum have you tried explaining it to her?Invite her to lunch (a nuetral place,no husband)and talk to her.Show her some love without compromising your beliefs,let her get some of her grief off her chest--this thing is probably hitting her hard too and she may need a friend now.

leeney:
Hi Knuckle,  thanks for your resonse.

         Well, she is his second wife; the son does not belong to her (don't know what happened to his mom, no one spoke of her).  So I don't think she's as deeply involved as her husband.  She never spoke during this whole ordeal, but I could see she was obviously uncomfortable.  

  When I got home I made up a pretty thankyou card and got it in the mail right away.  I thought I would give it a week and see if she attempts to communicate with me--she had been posting me almost daily, before this.

  I have a cousin who is gay and I have known people in the past who were.  They had become friends with me before I found out.  Everyone of them chose to stop the friendship afterward.  I tried very hard not to treat them differently, but at the same time, they knew I did not approve of their behavior.  It was their decision to end the friendship.

  But I have kids now, and I do not want them around this.  So I am presently trying to think and pray on what to do.  I will consider your suggestion.

  leeney

Harryfeat:
hello leeney.  

Despite the fact that the word "abomination" is used in the bible, if you actually used that word in your conversation with the father, I can understand the defensive posture.

If the father truly believed it was wrong, then he is still coming to grips with the situation and trying to accept it.

You ask if you should continue to be friends with someone who has a son that you believe is committing what you believe is a sin.  Your ostensible reason for this is that you do not wish to expose your children or, "have them around this".  

You will probably have to lock your children away or move out to a isolated place where there is no access to newspapers, tv, radio or the internet or other children.  Like it or not, homosexuality, drunkenness, prostitution, lying cheating, stealing, adultery, cruelty, etc. is a part of the fabric of our society.  

Your best and only real way deal with any of these issues is by teaching your children and being a good example.  What will you do if one of your children ends up being gay despite all your precautions?  

I suggest your try to deal with it yourself and not run away because there is no where to go. There is certainly no need to purposely expose your children to drunken sots, but you should be prepared to deal with it when they do.

Do you believe that it is God's will that there be gay people in this world? Who would choose to be gay on their own?  If you believe that they are fulfilling God's will just as adulterers are then it only makes sense that we deal with compassion even if we don't understand it.  Imagine how you would feel if one of your children "came out" and then all of your friends just decided that you weren't worth having as a friend because of it.

I am friends with a gay couple.  They are kind and genereous men who set a good example to adults and children alike.  Most people don't even know they are gay because they keep their affections private.  I have no trouble having my child associate with them.  

I don't really understand homosexuality and from those I have talked to they would rather be heterosexual.  They all said that it was not a choice. They didn't wake up one day and say should I be gay or straight? I think I'll choose gay just because I like the challenge.

There is plenty of scripture supporting the doctrine of Christ.  Dealing with homosexuals, even just on a mental level, may be one of  our biggest challenges in following His example.


feat

Chuck Norris:
ok, im kind of new at this, but harry, from what i read, you were skirting around the question of which this thread is based.

Is homosexuality against the bible?

Now i agree that in the use of the word abomination, the husband was probably offended, but he apparently is still trying to accept his sons "coming out" and probably was trying to convince himself.

Now you can be gay and be the nicest person in the world, but i believe that you will not go to heaven when you die, unless you change your ways and repent.

'Do not lie with a man as one lies with a woman. That is detestable' (Leviticus 18:22)

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