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[Ricco]

I had a meeting yesterday with a man that has been studying the bible for fifty years, a pastor of a christian denomination who is adamant about an eternal hell. even though i presented countless scriptures about all being saved he just explained them away, saying that if there is an eternal life there must also be an eternal place of torture, well he was warning me about being in the wrong and that this was also the reason why ray had cancer, i mean how evil is that? There is absolutely no love in that. So this all has obviously left me down and even my wife says asks why are there so few who know the truth? Well the bible is clear that many are called but few are chosen, so to all the chosen out there God bless, and God speed

[smeacham]

I can't understand, in my own mind, why people WANT to believe in eternal torment, even if it is for "the other guy."  How hideous!

Nonetheless, I hold fast to Matthew 13, where Jesus quoted Isaiah with the reason - "so their eyes cannot hear, and their ears cannot hear, and their hearts cannot understand, and they cannot turn to me and let me heal them."  I believe that, for us to understand/turn/be healed, we need to experience God's Judgment first.

Eventually, all will be judged, and eventually all will turn to Him and be healed.  But their eyes are closed and their ears cannot hear, so they cannot see this truth yet, or any truth, because turning to Jesus IS turning to truth - "I am the way, the truth, and the life.  No one can come to the Father except through me." (John 14:6).

For me, the God's Judgment results in humility (and a lack of humility results in Judgment!).  I suspect that your pastor friend is not chosen for Judgment yet, as he certainly doesn't sound humble.  Nor does he love his brethren, or he wouldn't say such spiteful things.

Steve

[Samson]

I had a meeting yesterday with a man that has been studying the bible for fifty years, a pastor of a christian denomination who is adamant about an eternal hell. even though i presented countless scriptures about all being saved he just explained them away, saying that if there is an eternal life there must also be an eternal place of torture, well he was warning me about being in the wrong and that this was also the reason why ray had cancer, i mean how evil is that? There is absolutely no love in that. So this all has obviously left me down and even my wife says asks why are there so few who know the truth? Well the bible is clear that many are called but few are chosen, so to all the chosen out there God bless, and God speed

Hey Ricco,
               
               That's certainly sad and awfull to hear that this " Pastor " attributes Rays cancer to his teachings.
               I was hoping not to hear that someone would do so, it hits a nerve for sure.

               Just remember, they(Pharisee's) said Jesus had a Demon and attributed the performing of miracles
               to the Devil(Beelzebub).

               Perhaps, if given the opportunity(1 Peter. 3:15), maybe you could show him(This Pastor) that the
               word Eternal is a mistranslation of the Greek Word Aionios. If he's willing, present him with the article,
               Is Everlasting Scriptural by Ray. However if God wants him to remain Blind to this Truth, he will remain so.

                                                  Kind Regards, Samson.
               Etern

[aqrinc]

Hi Ricco,

Yesterday was a day of meetings; my meeting was with my Mother. She has been a JW for
over 50 years, no different from your pastor or any blinded person. We are not here to
convert them, just be prepared for when God uses us to be a witness (Not JW); to whosoever
HE Directs toward us.

John 6:44:
No man can come to me unless the Father who sent me draws him, and I will raise him up in the last day.

george.

I had a meeting yesterday with a man that has been studying the bible for fifty years, a pastor of a christian denomination who is adamant about an eternal hell. even though i presented countless scriptures about all being saved he just explained them away, saying that if there is an eternal life there must also be an eternal place of torture, well he was warning me about being in the wrong and that this was also the reason why ray had cancer, i mean how evil is that? There is absolutely no love in that. So this all has obviously left me down and even my wife says asks why are there so few who know the truth? Well the bible is clear that many are called but few are chosen, so to all the chosen out there God bless, and God speed

[lferretj]

hello,
    All I can say is that I used to be where he was, believing in a Hell of torture.  What I don't understand is a pastor of 50 years, believing in hell and not being utterly emotionally devestated everytime he passes someone on the street, cause the chances are that person on the street isn't saved.  If he really truly believed in a Hell then I say their is no excuse to not be crying out on the street corners to try and save people.  I came really close to doing just that, then I found Ray's site.  It was tearing me up that all the people I saw in the mall, or grocery store didn't know this great news and were going to suffer eternally for it, and then little old me didn't have the guts to tell strangers the "good news."  Of course how good is the good news is it involves people suffering for eternity in Hell.   Sorry but once you know the truth you never go back, you can't, you can only try to share it and hope the Lord removes the scales from people's eyes so they can see.
       lferretj   

[aqrinc]

Hi lferretj,

Amen Sister; the beginning of understanding.

george.

[Ricco]

Thank you my brothers and sisters, God bless you all for your love and concern, it is
such an honour and blessing to know the truth, the real truth that is.
I was also one of those who used to condemn all to hell, turn or burn, but praise God for
allowing me repentance and for entrusting me with this honour of the ministry of reconciliation.
Which is of love, it is shocking for someone to coldly hang onto this doctrine of damnation

[Falconn003]

Thank you my brothers and sisters, God bless you all for your love and concern, it is
such an honour and blessing to know the truth, the real truth that is.
I was also one of those who used to condemn all to hell, turn or burn, but praise God for
allowing me repentance and for entrusting me with this honour of the ministry of reconciliation.
Which is of love, it is shocking for someone to coldly hang onto this doctrine of damnation

It is a sadistic primeval concept through out our history to birth such idiotic atrocities in the name of God...

Rodger

[smeacham]

lferretj,

I know what you mean.  I've had opportunities to do sales work, but in the end, I just couldn't do it.  I thought that if I was able to go meet people and tell them stuff, I'd better be telling them the gospel, not about cutlery, books, or insurance.

Now I no longer feel the guilt, because I'm no longer feel responsible for saving people.  That's God's job.  Strangely, I talk much more about my faith and beliefs now, because what I know now truly is Good News!

Steve

[saladking]

Ricco, my advice is that I wouldn't bother trying to show him the truth anymore.
This man's mind is closed off to anything that differs from what he thinks he knows is the truth.  Even clear biblical evidence has now shown you that he won't believe it.  Don't waste your time.

Saladking.

[Akira329]

Mat 10:11  And into whatsoever city or town ye shall enter, enquire who in it is worthy; and there abide till ye go thence.
Mat 10:12  And when ye come into an house, salute it.
Mat 10:13  And if the house be worthy, let your peace come upon it: but if it be not worthy, let your peace return to you.
Mat 10:14  And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet.
Mat 10:15  Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.

I know a man who spoke like this. All this talk about how sin makes you sick!
I got pretty sick of that myself!
Don't worry Ricco this pastor is still in the hands of an all wise and powerful God.
His day will come.

Antaiwan

[smeacham]

Mat 10:14  And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear your words, when ye depart out of that house or city, shake off the dust of your feet.
Mat 10:15  Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for the land of Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.
...
Antaiwan

The ironic thing is, that pastor will probably see YOU as not receiving HIM, and brush the dust off of HIS feet.  It's happened to me, anyway.

Steve

[Dave in Tenn]

2Co 6:14 Do not become diversely yoked with unbelievers. For what partnership have righteousness and lawlessness? Or what communion has light with darkness?
Isa 5:20  Woe to those saying to evil `good,' And to good `evil,' Putting darkness for light, and light for darkness, Putting bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter.
Isa 45:7 Former of light and Creator of darkness, Maker of good and Creator of evil. I, Yahweh Elohim, made all of these things."
John 1:5  And the Light is appearing in the darkness, and the darkness grasped it not.

Steve, I reckon darkness has no fellowship with light either.

Just so we don't get too cocky with the specks and beams,

Luke 11:34 and 35.  You eye is the lamp of your body.  When your eye is healthy, your whole body is full of light.  But when it is evil, your body is full of darkness.  Therefor, be careful that the light in you isn't darkness.

God give us healthy eyes.