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Author Topic: Romans 7  (Read 3092 times)

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LiberatedEagle

  • Guest
Romans 7
« on: March 02, 2009, 12:52:46 AM »

Greetings Sisthren and Brethren,

Has Ray covered the topic of Romans 7 where Paul discusses being carnal sold under sin and he knows not how to perform that which is good. If so please direct me to that post. I tried the search option by putting certain words and phrases in the bar to no avail.

I don't want to break the rules by asking questions concerning scripture not yet covered by Ray.
That being said, I'm wrestling with Ezekiel 36:26,27 where it talks about God replacing the stony heart with a heart of flesh for His sake.

If it's ok to post my question would any of the mods respond accordingly?


Thanks in advance,


Charles
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EKnight

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2009, 01:09:27 AM »

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judith collier

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #2 on: March 02, 2009, 01:15:54 AM »

Charles, a little confused as to your wrestling with the stony heart vs. the heart of flesh. Our hearts are carnal through and through, judgemental, accusing, you name it.(hard) God's heart is loving, forgiving, merciful.(soft like flesh) Judy
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LiberatedEagle

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #3 on: March 02, 2009, 01:44:02 AM »

Thanks Eileen and Judy,

Eileen
Don't know if any of these help but you can check them out.

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php?topic=5545.0


http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php?topic=6442.0[/u
Eileen, the first link you posted was a little more pertinent. The fact that God causes everything reiterated to me that no matter how much I want to be righteous it's all in Gods timing.


Charles, a little confused as to your wrestling with the stony heart vs. the heart of flesh. Our hearts are carnal through and through, judgemental, accusing, you name it.(hard) God's heart is loving, forgiving, merciful.(soft like flesh) Judy




Judy,

I fully accept that I am a bag of sin. I apologize for not being clear, but I just didn't want to break any rules.

Here's my dilemma. First in Romans 7:14-25 Paul states that he is carnal, sold under sin and the actions he desires to perform are the exact opposite of what he actually does. At this point I'm feeling the same way, but I don't know if I'm interpreting this scripture correctly. At this point in my life I can say that spiritually I hate sin and desire to be pleasing to God, but my flesh loves to be appeased.

The reason Ezekiel 36 comes to mind is because God states that he would replace the children of Israel's stony heart with a heart of flesh. And that he would cause them to walk in statues. He also states that He would do it for His sake and not for theirs.

My question is am I to just except and embrace my sinful actions until this spiritual "heart surgery" takes place or am I to try to live a righteous life. I feel that God is working in me, but I continue to sin and I'm not talking about an occasional "mistake". I want to be pleasing to God, but I guess I'm in the same boat as Paul was at the point in time, I just don't know how.

Your responses are appreciated,


Charles
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mharrell08

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #4 on: March 02, 2009, 01:46:32 AM »

Greetings Sisthren and Brethren,

Has Ray covered the topic of Romans 7 where Paul discusses being carnal sold under sin and he knows not how to perform that which is good. If so please direct me to that post. I tried the search option by putting certain words and phrases in the bar to no avail.

I don't want to break the rules by asking questions concerning scripture not yet covered by Ray.
That being said, I'm wrestling with Ezekiel 36:26,27 where it talks about God replacing the stony heart with a heart of flesh for His sake.

If it's ok to post my question would any of the mods respond accordingly?


Thanks in advance,


Charles


Charles,

I don't see anywhere where you would be breaking any rules with these questions. There is no rule about 'asking questions concerning scripture not covered by Ray'. Ray has taught on what the scriptures are all about in God creating man into His image so why would we leave any scripture out since they all pertain to this one concept?


Marques
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EKnight

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #5 on: March 02, 2009, 01:57:00 AM »

Hi marques,

I think Charles may be referring to this:

Ray does not cover all that is within scripture but what he does cover we believe to be true; as such we try our best to keep discussions centered on Rayís teaching of the scripture and to keep out the leaven of other teachings.  If we didnít do this, how long do you think it would take for the forum to turn into chaos?  Who would you trust to determine what is right?  I say the Spirit revealed this to me and you say the Spirit revealed something entirely different, who do you trust?   What of this scripture?

Which is found under "How this forum is moderated".

Eileen
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mharrell08

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #6 on: March 02, 2009, 01:59:01 AM »

Thanks Eileen and Judy,
I fully accept that I am a bag of sin. I apologize for not being clear, but I just didn't want to break any rules.

Here's my dilemma. First in Romans 7:14-25 Paul states that he is carnal, sold under sin and the actions he desires to perform are the exact opposite of what he actually does. At this point I'm feeling the same way, but I don't know if I'm interpreting this scripture correctly. At this point in my life I can say that spiritually I hate sin and desire to be pleasing to God, but my flesh loves to be appeased.

The reason Ezekiel 36 comes to mind is because God states that he would replace the children of Israel's stony heart with a heart of flesh. And that he would cause them to walk in statues. He also states that He would do it for His sake and not for theirs.

My question is am I to just except and embrace my sinful actions until this spiritual "heart surgery" takes place or am I to try to live a righteous life. I feel that God is working in me, but I continue to sin and I'm not talking about an occasional "mistake". I want to be pleasing to God, but I guess I'm in the same boat as Paul was at the point in time, I just don't know how.

Your responses are appreciated,


Charles

Hello Charles,

Try the transcripts from 'Saved by Grace through Faith' (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,5417.0.html), 'How Hard is Getting Saved' (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3849.0.html), and 'Repentance' (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3709.0.html)...as well as audio if you'd like: http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,2641.0.html

Also, why do you keep mentioning 'I don't want to break the rules'? Asking questions about the scriptures is not against any rule (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3.0.html).

Ah, never mind...you're banned anyways....


just kidding  :D ;D :D ;D


Marques
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mharrell08

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2009, 02:03:40 AM »

Hi marques,

I think Charles may be referring to this:

Ray does not cover all that is within scripture but what he does cover we believe to be true; as such we try our best to keep discussions centered on Rayís teaching of the scripture and to keep out the leaven of other teachings.  If we didnít do this, how long do you think it would take for the forum to turn into chaos?  Who would you trust to determine what is right?  I say the Spirit revealed this to me and you say the Spirit revealed something entirely different, who do you trust?   What of this scripture?

Which is found under "How this forum is moderated".

Eileen


Oooooohhhhh....but this does not say we can't discuss certain scriptures. This means we do not allow anyone to teach about scriptures that are contrary to Ray's teachings on the scripture. There is nothing wrong with asking for help in understanding any scriptures...but when one attempts to teach that the scriptures mean contrary to what Ray has taught, then there's a problem. Hope that helps Charles...


Marques
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LiberatedEagle

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #8 on: March 02, 2009, 02:05:19 AM »

Thanks Eileen and Judy,
I fully accept that I am a bag of sin. I apologize for not being clear, but I just didn't want to break any rules.

Here's my dilemma. First in Romans 7:14-25 Paul states that he is carnal, sold under sin and the actions he desires to perform are the exact opposite of what he actually does. At this point I'm feeling the same way, but I don't know if I'm interpreting this scripture correctly. At this point in my life I can say that spiritually I hate sin and desire to be pleasing to God, but my flesh loves to be appeased.

The reason Ezekiel 36 comes to mind is because God states that he would replace the children of Israel's stony heart with a heart of flesh. And that he would cause them to walk in statues. He also states that He would do it for His sake and not for theirs.

My question is am I to just except and embrace my sinful actions until this spiritual "heart surgery" takes place or am I to try to live a righteous life. I feel that God is working in me, but I continue to sin and I'm not talking about an occasional "mistake". I want to be pleasing to God, but I guess I'm in the same boat as Paul was at the point in time, I just don't know how.

Your responses are appreciated,


Charles

Hello Charles,

Try the transcripts from 'Saved by Grace through Faith' (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,5417.0.html), 'How Hard is Getting Saved' (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3849.0.html), and 'Repentance' (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3709.0.html)...as well as audio if you'd like: http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,2641.0.html

Also, why do you keep mentioning 'I don't want to break the rules'? Asking questions about the scriptures is not against any rule (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3.0.html).

Ah, never mind...you're banned anyways....


just kidding  :D ;D :D ;D


Marques


Your cruel Marques. My heart sank when I read "you're banned anyways" I'm kinda of gullible so be gentle ;)


P.S. I know it's all in fun brother and thanks for the links. I'm going to check them out now
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aqrinc

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #9 on: March 02, 2009, 02:05:47 AM »

Charles,

This is a link where we previously discussed some of your question.

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,8748.msg72627.html#msg72627

george. ;D

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LiberatedEagle

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #10 on: March 02, 2009, 02:09:03 AM »

Also thank you Eileen. That's exactly what I was referring to. Now I have a better understanding. You all are GRRRReeeat!!



Everyone except Marques :P
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mharrell08

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #11 on: March 02, 2009, 02:11:05 AM »

Your cruel Marques. My heart sank when I read "you're banned anyways" I'm kinda of gullible so be gentle ;)


P.S. I know it's all in fun brother and thanks for the links. I'm going to check them out now


Also thank you Eileen. That's exactly what I was referring to. Now I have a better understanding. You all are GRRRReeeat!!



Everyone except Marques :P


LOL...my bad, buddy  ;D  :D ;D :D



Marques
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Akira329

  • Bible-Truths Forum Member
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  • Posts: 718
  • "Freedom is the right of all sentient beings."
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #12 on: March 02, 2009, 02:18:12 AM »

Thanks Eileen and Judy,

Eileen
Don't know if any of these help but you can check them out.

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php?topic=5545.0


http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php?topic=6442.0[/u
Eileen, the first link you posted was a little more pertinent. The fact that God causes everything reiterated to me that no matter how much I want to be righteous it's all in Gods timing.


Charles, a little confused as to your wrestling with the stony heart vs. the heart of flesh. Our hearts are carnal through and through, judgemental, accusing, you name it.(hard) God's heart is loving, forgiving, merciful.(soft like flesh) Judy




Judy,

I fully accept that I am a bag of sin. I apologize for not being clear, but I just didn't want to break any rules.

Here's my dilemma. First in Romans 7:14-25 Paul states that he is carnal, sold under sin and the actions he desires to perform are the exact opposite of what he actually does. At this point I'm feeling the same way, but I don't know if I'm interpreting this scripture correctly. At this point in my life I can say that spiritually I hate sin and desire to be pleasing to God, but my flesh loves to be appeased.

The reason Ezekiel 36 comes to mind is because God states that he would replace the children of Israel's stony heart with a heart of flesh. And that he would cause them to walk in statues. He also states that He would do it for His sake and not for theirs.

My question is am I to just except and embrace my sinful actions until this spiritual "heart surgery" takes place or am I to try to live a righteous life. I feel that God is working in me, but I continue to sin and I'm not talking about an occasional "mistake". I want to be pleasing to God, but I guess I'm in the same boat as Paul was at the point in time, I just don't know how.

Your responses are appreciated,


Charles

Hey Charles,
I know how you feel, I believe we all do here.
Our struggle with the flesh is a life long process
As Paul says,

Rom 8:13  For if ye live after the flesh, ye shall die: but if ye through the Spirit do mortify the deeds of the body, ye shall live.
Col 3:5  Mortify therefore your members which are upon the earth; fornication, uncleanness, inordinate affection, evil concupiscence, and covetousness, which is idolatry:
Col 3:6  For which things' sake the wrath of God cometh on the children of disobedience:
Col 3:7  In the which ye also walked some time, when ye lived in them.
Col 3:8  But now ye also put off all these; anger, wrath, malice, blasphemy, filthy communication out of your mouth.
Col 3:9  Lie not one to another, seeing that ye have put off the old man with his deeds;
Col 3:10  And have put on the new man, which is renewed in knowledge after the image of him that created him:
Col 3:11  Where there is neither Greek nor Jew, circumcision nor uncircumcision, Barbarian, Scythian, bond nor free: but Christ is all, and in all.
Col 3:12  Put on therefore, as the elect of God, holy and beloved, bowels of mercies, kindness, humbleness of mind, meekness, longsuffering;
Col 3:13  Forbearing one another, and forgiving one another, if any man have a quarrel against any: even as Christ forgave you, so also do ye.
Col 3:14  And above all these things put on charity, which is the bond of perfectness.

Charles this change can only happen through the Spirit of God
Some sins you will stop doing immediately others will take time maybe years to overcome.
When you begin hating your deeds(in essence your life)you will see the change after it has already happened!
Joh 12:25  He that loveth his life shall lose it; and he that hateth his life in this world shall keep it unto life eternal.
Joh 12:26  If any man serve me, let him follow me; and where I am, there shall also my servant be: if any man serve me, him will my Father honour.

2Ti 2:19  Nevertheless the foundation of God standeth sure, having this seal, The Lord knoweth them that are his. And, Let every one that nameth the name of Christ depart from iniquity.
2Ti 2:20  But in a great house there are not only vessels of gold and of silver, but also of wood and of earth; and some to honour, and some to dishonour.
2Ti 2:21  If a man therefore purge himself from these, he shall be a vessel unto honour, sanctified, and meet for the master's use, and prepared unto every good work.
2Ti 2:22  Flee also youthful lusts: but follow righteousness, faith, charity, peace, with them that call on the Lord out of a pure heart.

Hope this helps
Antaiwan
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LiberatedEagle

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #13 on: March 02, 2009, 03:14:28 AM »

Your cruel Marques. My heart sank when I read "you're banned anyways" I'm kinda of gullible so be gentle ;)


P.S. I know it's all in fun brother and thanks for the links. I'm going to check them out now


Also thank you Eileen. That's exactly what I was referring to. Now I have a better understanding. You all are GRRRReeeat!!



Everyone except Marques :P


LOL...my bad, buddy  ;D  :D ;D :D



Marques

It's all good Marques, just know you're on my hit list 8)

BTW the links you shared were just what the doctor ordered. Thanks a bunch.

Also thanks to Akira and aqr. It's comforting when true spiritual brothers and sisters understand where you're coming from and can direct you to scripture that corroborates any view or understanding.

I know God is working in me and I have to just let Him finish the work He started in me by His grace; Grace that I've come to understand is His divine influence. If He wasn't influencing and conforming me into His image I wouldn't think twice about my sinful nature. I anxiously await the day God hires me to labour in His vineyard.

You all keep me in your prayers as the scripture states the harvest is great, but the labourers are few. Pray ye therefore God sends labourers to His harvest.

Peace and Blessings,


Charles
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Robin

  • Guest
Re: Romans 7
« Reply #14 on: March 02, 2009, 05:53:06 AM »

Here is something that might help Charles.

2 Corinthians 3
Christís Epistle
 1 Do we begin again to commend ourselves? Or do we need, as some others, epistles of commendation to you or letters of commendation from you? 2 You are our epistle written in our hearts, known and read by all men; 3 clearly you are an epistle of Christ, ministered by us, written not with ink but by the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of flesh, that is, of the heart.

The Spirit, Not the Letter
   
4 And we have such trust through Christ toward God. 5 Not that we are sufficient of ourselves to think of anything as being from ourselves, but our sufficiency is from God, 6 who also made us sufficient as ministers of the new covenant, not of the letter but of the Spirit;[a] for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

Glory of the New Covenant
   
7 But if the ministry of death, written and engraved on stones, was glorious, so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of the glory of his countenance, which glory was passing away, 8 how will the ministry of the Spirit not be more glorious? 9 For if the ministry of condemnation had glory, the ministry of righteousness exceeds much more in glory. 10 For even what was made glorious had no glory in this respect, because of the glory that excels. 11 For if what is passing away was glorious, what remains is much more glorious.
12 Therefore, since we have such hope, we use great boldness of speechó 13 unlike Moses, who put a veil over his face so that the children of Israel could not look steadily at the end of what was passing away. 14 But their minds were blinded. For until this day the same veil remains unlifted in the reading of the Old Testament, because the veil is taken away in Christ. 15 But even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil lies on their heart. 16 Nevertheless when one turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. 17 Now the Lord is the Spirit; and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty. 18 But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as by the Spirit of the Lord.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2009, 05:54:23 AM by M.G. »
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