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What part of this Book is not for you?
rocky:
1Th 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
1Th 5:4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
1Th 5:5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
1Th 5:6 Therefore let us not sleep, as [do] others; but let us watch and be sober.
1Th 5:7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night.
1Th 5:8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation.
1Th 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
1Th 5:10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.
Luk 3:7 Then said he to the multitude that came forth to be baptized of him, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
Jhn 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
Rom 2:5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
Rom 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
Rom 13:4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to [execute] wrath upon him that doeth evil.
Eph 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
Eph 5:6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things
1Th 2:16 Forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.
Rev 19:15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.
1Th 5:2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
1Th 5:3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
1Th 5:4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief.
1Th 5:5 Ye are all the children of light, and the children of the day: we are not of the night, nor of darkness.
1Th 5:6 Therefore let us not sleep, as [do] others; but let us watch and be sober.
1Th 5:7 For they that sleep sleep in the night; and they that be drunken are drunken in the night.
1Th 5:8 But let us, who are of the day, be sober, putting on the breastplate of faith and love; and for an helmet, the hope of salvation.
1Th 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ,
1Th 5:10 Who died for us, that, whether we wake or sleep, we should live together with him.
Luk 3:7 Then said he to the multitude that came forth to be baptized of him, O generation of vipers, who hath warned you to flee from the wrath to come?
Jhn 3:36 He that believeth on the Son hath everlasting life: and he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him.
Rom 2:5 But after thy hardness and impenitent heart treasurest up unto thyself wrath against the day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God;
wrath against the day of wrath???
Rom 5:9 Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.
Rom 13:4 For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to [execute] wrath upon him that doeth evil.
Eph 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
Eph 5:6 Let no man deceive you with vain words: for because of these things cometh the wrath of God upon the children of disobedience.
1Th 2:16 Forbidding us to speak to the Gentiles that they might be saved, to fill up their sins alway: for the wrath is come upon them to the uttermost.
Rev 14:10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
Daniel:
SteveB great topic, you got me thinking and searching. I was thinking of "The prophecy" the "testimony", what it is we keep and I wrote down what I found. No doubt He remains the same, but He came only once to bear sin, not again and again and again thats made clear. The word needs to be rightly divided as well, thats scriptural. Rvhill and feat brought up excellent thoughts, I feel very much the same. Sorry a little long, I really got into this one.
The testimony of Jesus Christ IS the Spirit of prophecy, keep HIS sayings, HIS words. The book is a complete and beautiful revelation OF HIM
Rev 22:7 Behold, I come quickly: blessed is he that "keepeth the sayings" OF the prophecy OF this book.
Rev 19:10 I am thy fellowservant, and of thy brethren that have the testimony of Jesus: worship God: for the testimony of Jesus IS the spirit of prophecy.[/u]
Like the covenant no man addeth or taketh away from it if it be confirmed. The law itself was added but (but watch the "untils") there was no law that could justify. The first itself is taken away. We are not to add or take away from the prophecy (Jesus Christ) of this book. Keep his sayings.
We abide in his word and His word in us. His doctrine. We have this "testimony" IN US
2Peter 1:19 We have also a MORE SURE WORD OF PROPHECY; whereunto ye do well that ye take heed, as unto a light that shineth in a dark place, until the day dawn, and the day star arise IN YOUR HEARTS:[/u]
1John 5:10 He that believeth on the Son of God hath THE WITNESS IN HIMSELF[/u]...
We are told abide in Him as it hath taught us being true and no lie. We abide in His word and His doctrine and Gods love is perfected in us.
Looked up say, sayings and word then fell on this which speaks of the way we walk, (our path, hearing him obeying him walking in love)
John 8:52 Verily, verily, I say unto you, If a man keep my saying, he shall never see death.[/u]
Prov 12:28 In the way of righteousness is life; and in the pathway thereof there is no death.[/u]
John 8:55 Yet ye have not known him; but I know him: and if I should say, I know him not, I shall be a liar like unto you: but I know him, and keep his saying.[/u]
1John 2:4 If a man say, I love God, and hateth his brother, he is a liar: for he that loveth not his brother whom he hath seen, how can he love God whom he hath not seen?
1John 3:14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.[/u]
Luke 11:28 But he said, Yea rather, blessed are they that hear the word of God, and keep it.[/u]
The Son of God (comes to "give us understanding" HE is the VOICE of "MY WORDS") Hearing His voice as God says, hear ye HIM.
Job 34:16 IF NOW thou HAST UNDERSTANDING, HEAR THIS: hearken to THE VOICE of MY WORDS.[/u]
Which is?
Psalm 119:101 I have REFRAINED MY FEET from every EVIL WAY, that I might KEEP THY WORD.[/u]
Job 28:28 Behold, the fear of the Lord, that is wisdom; and to DEPART FROM EVIL IS UNDERSTANDING.
Romans 2:9 Tribulation and anguish, upon every soul of man that DOETH EVIL, of the Jew first, and also of the Gentile
Ecc 8:5 Whoso keepeth the commandment shall feel no evil thing: and a wise man's heart "discerneth" both time and judgment.[/u]
John 13:34 A new commandment I give unto you, That ye love one another; as I have loved you, that ye also love one another.[/u]
Prov 16:17 The highway of the upright is to depart from evil: he that keepeth "his way" preserveth his soul.[/u]
1John 5:18 We know that whosoever is born of God sinneth not; but he that is begotten of God keepeth himself, and that wicked one toucheth him not.[/u]
1John 4:7 Beloved, let us love one another: for love is of God; and every one that loveth is born of God, and knoweth God.[/u]
Obviously I love the scriptures as most here, Jesus does say you can search the scriptures thinking in them you have eternal life ( to know God ). The scriptures bear witness of Him. He is supposed to be revealed in you and is evidenced by Gods love you have toward His name. I believe its Him alone who opens any book to us. Afterall only He can reveal Himself to whom He chooses. Again I love the book of revelation. So "in that" you could say I "keep" the words of that "book of prophecy". Its the "words" OF the "prophecy" (Jesus Christ) of the book. Keeping His word, his sayings, his word. Isn't it walking in love? in his commandment? the commandments? The anointing is to teach us and we are also to abide in "that" as scripture says. I can't "literally" walk across a dry Euphrates :lol:
So its hard to figure out how another might boldly exclaim concerning "keeping the words". No doubt its clearly written and I love meditating therein but to one it can mean a completely different thing then it means to another. If the book of revelation is a "revealing" of Him. You aint gonna get even a glimpse without obedience to Him. Its through obedience to Him that He manifests (reveals) Himself as He said.
Daniel
bobf:
--- Quote from: SteveB ---
--- Quote ---and [spiritually] keep those things [which are, were, and will be] which are [spiritually] written therein: for the [spiritual] time [that is, was, and will be] is [spiritually] at hand" (Rev. 1:1-3).
--- End quote ---
--- Quote ---The testimony of Jesus Christ does not change, and Christ Himself does not change, and therefore His dealings with humanity do not change, other than that there is coming a consummations of sin and death. Christ is not changed, but WE WILL BE CHANGED to conform to the Image of Jesus Christ.
--- End quote ---
This was posted a few months back. And agree with it. Seems as though Rays has changed his mind yet is keeping this paper teaching this Truth on his site and yet says its not true.
I'm confused.
Love...Steve
--- End quote ---
How has Ray changed his mind on this??
jerreye:
Here is how I currently see the "rift" between Mike and Ray...
Ray believes that we (the elect) are NOT appointed unto wrath, (which is MORE THAN CLEAR in scripture, is it not?) Mike teaches that we ALL must go through the 7 last plagues (that which FILL UP the wrath of God). But then Mike states that he will NOT have to go through the wrath of God (7 last plagues?) because he already went though it (when he was in Babylon I suppose?)
SO, perhaps they are BOTH correct, but are both looking at it from different perspectives. :idea: The ELECT are NOT the "ELECT" until he/she comes OUT of Babylon (which is possibly where we experience these 7 plagues -- IF we do NOT "come out of her"?), but once we come OUT of Babylon, we are no longer under the wrath of God (and therefore no longer have to go through the 7 LAST PLAGUES), but under Grace? :?
Jeremy
SteveB:
--- Quote ---
For me, if someone tells me to 'do' or 'not' do something solely based on scriptures from revelation, then i'm afraid i can't put much stock into it. There is plenty of plainly expressed instruction within the new testament to be concerning myself with, without getting 'hung-up' upon the many different interpretations of revelation. You want to know how many different views there are on revelation? :lol:
--- End quote ---
You'd be right if revelation was the only book. The sum of Gods Word is Truth. Its all or none. And there is only one interpretation of revelation and its the one explained in the bible.
--- Quote ---Steve, do you believe that one has to understand this vision in its entirety and then keep/follow/apply it? (still don't quite understand how anyone uses a vision as cryptic as revelation, and with no clear interpretation within the rest of scripture, and turns it into instruction.) What if i choose to accept my ignorance on the book and not get too involved in the different views on it? Does that mean that i can't be a true disciple?
--- End quote ---
Depends on your def. of 'understand'. If you mean LIVED(i.e-keep) then yes you do have to keep it. If you mean understand EVERY mystery of the bible then, no. You choose to accept ignorance? The only way you can have eternal life is to know God and Jesus who He sent. Christ is the Word. Revelation is the Word of God. See?
--- Quote ---Edit: I wonder how the elect 'kept' this book before it was written :-k And did it only get sent to the churches in Asia?
--- End quote ---
Keeping the book doent mean you have to have read what John wrote. Keeping it, is living it. Before the book of Revelation was written the saints(if they were overcomers) kept the 'book' because the Book is Christ.
Love...Steve
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