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Endures to the end shall be saved
CrossoverManiac:
Here's my question to you: if all shall be saved anyway, then how come the Scriptures speaks of enduring persecution and enduring it to be saved?
musicman:
All are not saved anyway. But all will be saved through Christ.
gmik:
Come on Musicman. ??? Give an answer to an honest question. 8)
Crossover, probably has to do w/ the audience-who it was referring to and who was reading/listening. Or saved as in the chosen for reigning not saved as in the end- all in all... Get a good translation of the words too.
I don't know how to find Ray's answer to put on here, but that would be the best place to look. Be patient someone will do it I hope. :-[ 8)
mharrell08:
Hello Crossover and welcome to the forum,
Musicman actually gave a simple but truthful answer...no scripture states that people will be saved 'anyway'.
Here is a good study if you are interested, 'How Hard is Getting Saved' (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3849.0.html).
Marques
Kat:
Hi CrossoverManiac,
Here is a part from the article 'You Fools! You Hypocrites! You Snakes!'
http://bible-truths.com/fools.htm ----------------------
"Whosoever will come after Me, let him DENY himself, and TAKE UP HIS CROSS, and FOLLOW ME" (Mark 8:34).
This is not an "option" to salvation; this is an absolute REQUIREMENT. I am not trying to paint a picture of doom and gloom, but the reality of living as Jesus Christ demands is not a walk in the park or a stroll through a rose garden. You can pursue a life obsessed with beauty, fame, vanity, materialism, and worldliness, but don’t think you can also coordinate all that with a life of following Jesus Christ.
"For even hereunto were ye called; because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example that ye should follow [By suffering with Him—‘Yea, and ALL that will live godly in Christ Jesus SHALL SUFFER persecution’ II Tim. 3:12] His steps" (I Pet. 2:21).
"He that says he abides in Him ought himself also so to walk, even as He [Jesus] walked" (I John 2:6).
"Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as He IS, SO ARE WE in the world" (I John 4:17).
If you do not "suffer persecution," then you clearly are not "living godly in Christ Jesus."
"To him that OVERCOMES; To him that OVERCOMES; To him that OVERCOMES; To him that OVERCOMES; To him that OVERCOMES; To him that OVERCOMES; To him that OVERCOMES" (Rev. 2:7; 2:11; 2:17; 2:26; 3:5; 3:12; 3:21).
"Overcomes" WHAT?
Overcomes the sins of the FLESH, the sins of the CHURCH, and the sins of the whole WORLD. We must overcome just "AS" Jesus overcame:
"To him that overcomes will I grant to sit with Me in My throne, even AS I also overcame, and am set down with My Father in His throne" (Rev. 3:21).
Jesus Christ overcame His own FLESH (Heb. 4:15), and Jesus overcame the sins of the whole WORLD:
"These things I have spoke unto you, that in Me [Jesus] ye might have peace. In the world ye shall have tribulation: but be of good cheer: I have OVERCOME THE WORLD" (John 16:33).
We must all overcome as Jesus overcame, and we must all live as Jesus lived, and anything less is a shame and heresy.
And just how long must we be put up with all this persecution and trials of the cross? Again, let Jesus answer:
"And ye [Gk: ‘all of you’] shall be hated of all men for My Name’s sake [Does that include ALL Believers? ‘YEA, and ALL that will live godly in Christ Jesus, SHALL suffer persecution’]: but he that endures [Gk: "remain, under go, bear trials, have fortitude, persevere, suffer’] TO THE END shall be saved" (Matt. 10:22).
Are we to foolishly conclude that "he that endures NOT to the end," and "he that does NOT overcome," and "he that does NOT suffer persecution," and "he that does NOT take up his cross," and "he that is NOT baptized into Christ’s death," and "he that does NOT live godly and righteously," shall ALSO be saved just as long as he speaks a twenty-second sinner’s prayer? Nonsense. There are HUNDREDS of Scriptures which tell us the many, many things that God will do in and through us before He actually "SAVES us."
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mercy, peace and love
Kat
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