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Philippians 2:12-13 - a simple question
mhykx:
A follow-up question:
If a person did a terrible sinful act, who worked in him to will and do it? Whose will is it to do wrong?
-Mike
Marky Mark:
--- Quote from: mhykx on May 12, 2009, 12:50:43 AM ---A follow-up question:
If a person did a terrible sinful act, who worked in him to will and do it? Whose will is it to do wrong?
-Mike
--- End quote ---
Mike,email to Ray,Hope it helps.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,6440.0.html
If it is God who controls our every thought and action, would'nt your teachings be in vain? If we cant make the decision to renew our minds, then why waste your energy and time trying to convince us of truth? I agree with 99.9% of your teachings, but I'm struggling with this one. God Bless Your Heart, Chad
Dear Chad: I get asked this question about every 72 hours, month after month. You make all your own choices and you think all your own thoughts, and you have a "will" to do so. What you don't have, is a will that is FREE FROM CAUSALITY to do these things. People will say things like: "What ever MADE you think that; or what ever MADE you do such and such." There is your answer. We know inherently that there are reasons CAUSES for your thoughts and choices. You can't make a choice that does not have a cause somewhere, and if something is caused to happen it could not have been otherwise. I teach the truths of God because this is just one way that God CAUSES people to see the truth (I Cor. 1:21). The foolishness of teaching and preaching CAUSES people to see and understand and believe and act accordingly. It is not correct to state as you have that "God CONTROLS our every thought and action." He does not need to "control" us, as He already knows far in advance exactly what we WILL DO AND THINK based on the conditions and circumstances of our individual lives.
God be with you,
Ray
Peace...Mark
Kat:
Hi Mike,
God is soveriegn! That means that His plan for humanity is being worked out down to the least detail according to His will.
Eph 1:11 In Him also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestined according to the purpose of Him who works all things according to the counsel of His will,
Now do understand a person desires to sin, because our heart is too weak to resist sin. Even if we do resist a sin, that is God that causes that too.
Jer 17:9 "The heart is deceitful above all things,
And desperately wicked;
Who can know it?
Here is an excerpt from part C of 'The Myth of ‘Free Will’ Exposed.'
http://bible-truths.com/lake15-C.html ---------------------------
GOD HAS PERFECTLY CHOREOGRAPHED HIS CREATION
All that has been, and is, and will be, has been planned and choreographed down to the movement of the last atom, by the Designer and Operator of the Universe, without Whom everything would fall apart in oblivion:
“For by Him [Jesus] were ALL things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible [unseen powers], whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers; all things were created by Him, and for Him. And He is before all things and by Him all things consist [‘has its cohesion,’ ]” (Col. 1:16-17).
Since “by Jesus all things consist and have their cohesion,” why is it that only man and his fabled “free-moral-agency-will” is the only truly “free radical” in the universe? Nonsense! Even “free radicals” operate under law—God operates all that exists, by law. Jesus did not create the universe and all that in it is, and then goes off on a trip to let the universe fend for itself. God presently is “working—operating” all that exists, and that includes the “will” of all mankind. Here’s some more Scriptural proof:
“…God which works [‘operates’] all in all ” (I Cor. 12:6). God works all that there is in all that there are. Pretty neat, huh? When we have a God this great, we can expect nothing but perfect assured success. The Christian teaching that God only can “desire” great things, but He cannot actually “accomplish” great things is absurd.
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mercy, peace and love
Kat
daywalker:
--- Quote from: mhykx on May 12, 2009, 12:50:43 AM ---A follow-up question:
If a person did a terrible sinful act, who worked in him to will and do it? Whose will is it to do wrong?
-Mike
--- End quote ---
Short answer: Satan.
daywalker:
--- Quote from: jacobbsladdr on May 12, 2009, 01:38:45 PM ---I am so very thankful that God never saw fit to make this truth hidden from me. I've understood it completely from the day it was explained to me. However, I never thought that mankind had a free will to begin with. I just never thought about it ever.
--- End quote ---
You know, as soon as I saw the definition of "free will" in one of Ray's writings, I ceased to believe it. I've known about "cause and effect" and how people can be manipulated, programmed by propaganda and media, and drugs, etc. But I thought free will just meant that we had the ability to change ourselves... control our own destiny... direct our own paths. Of course, that's all silly, and I know that now. But as soon as I saw what "free will" actually meant, and confirmed it with a few other dictionaries [just to be sure], I knew it didn't exist. It's so obvious!
...but in a similar way, I just never really thought about it enough before...
- Daywalker. 8)
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