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1 John 4:17….. As He is, so are we in the world.

Mark 13:13 and Luke 21:17…. You will be hated by all for My name sake……….

From …. Where we got the Bible, Ray writes
2 Tim. 3:16… All Scripture is given by inspiration of God.

“ All Scripture, okay.  One of the definitions of prophecy or prophesying, is inspired teaching, singing and writing, it’s prophesying.

Prophesying does NOT mean solely predicting the future. Any singing, teaching, or
writing is prophesying.
See 2 Peter 1: 19.

ANY SCRIPTURE.If it’s inspired of God it’s a spirit of prophecy, even if it’s a song that you sing, [ the psalms are songs, they are prophecy]. If it’s inspired of God it’s prophecy.

 You got that? That’s an important point because you need to remember as you study the Scripture from here on out.” Ray.



So we got teaching, and writing and singing 🎶 ( a New Song) on Bible- Truths.com
The Title stands up to its name , inspired by God. That makes it prophecy.

Wow 😮 I just learned this today about the Psalms and prophecy not about predicting the future, that makes sense now. Awesome.

Yeah, Ray took a lot of  hate because they despise the word of God.

Isa 30: 12-14,, Isa. 30: 8-11, Ezekiel 13 and 1 Sam.9:9.

I want to paraphrase something Ray said in His TEACHING on The sovereignty of God and Him repenting of creating humanity. That’s a great study by the way.😁
He said something like” who wants to attribute these meanings ( talking about
a definition of the word repent) to God and not expect a lightening bolt to come
through the ceiling?  Woe, it will be ill with them.

God taught the angels to sing. And they all sang together. Keep the unity of the Spirit.
In Christs name , Amen.

About a year ago YouTube decided 'universalism' is something I'm interested in and found about a dozen universal channels for me.

One of the universalism channels was devoted to disproving certain L Ray Smith's teachings and I watched several of these videos and foolishly commented in a few of them.

Watching these other channels I was always able to find errors in their teachings with a few exceptions like Tent Maker.

Ray received many thousands of emails over the years challenging his teachings. A few were legitimate minor points and Ray had me correct the text. And some were just typo's that got past myself and others that helped with the text proofing before publishing.

I don't know of any other universalism site that received even a fraction of the scrutiny in the emails/comments Ray received.

I just watched it so here is what I gleaned from it.

I will repeat a couple of statements that were made. He said,

1)” to return them to the pure state that they were originally created to be.”

My understanding is that humanity was created (originally) with carnal minds
and enmity against God.

2) He said” God is going to do this without violating anybody’s free will”

FREE WILL IS A MYTH, man has no free will.

I stopped watching after I heard this. It’s just more of the rot that’s on YouTube
They all start out sounding so wonderful don’t they.

2 Tim. 3:13…. But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse
                      deceiving and being deceived.  (and Rev.22:11)


There is always some truth mixed in with the lies.They blaspheme our Lord.

In Christ, Pamela

Pam, you have reminded me of something that Ray had said quite often about scripture… that we must “pay attention to all the words”. I guess it holds true with everything everywhere in life, both written or spoken. However, from my perspective (and mine alone), it didn’t matter. I’ve long since grown past those statements that I missed. I was so intrigued by the primary core of the video backing up Ray’s teaching on the lake of fire that the underlying statements flew right over my head. I’m not excusing myself. I’m thanking you for bringing it to my attention. I’m surprised, as I usually catch those things. I’m glad I put it to the test on this forum. With that being said, I don’t believe the man is lying in the pure sense. He knows what he knows… as do we all. And within the confines of what he knows, he has done his homework. It reminds me to always stay humble in the gift of any knowledge we’ve been granted. It can be a long bumpy road from perceived certainty to actual fact.

Which brings me to your response, Dave.

I'm always a little leery even discussing "free will" because the term is usually without a definition.  People can say they believe in free will simply out of ignorance or laziness when what they truly believe is the sovereignty of God. 

That said, I "feel" you on the "disappointment or worse".  If we are focused on theology, we have to admit that there are many, many flavors of so-called "universalism".  Through that theological lens, it is no less a babel than any other segment of "the church".  Evidence is very near. 

I mentioned my sister recently.  I joined a face-book group that she is involved in.  It is pretty much the exact type of forum that BT set out so intentionally to NOT become.  Everybody has an opinion on everything and most of it seems to flow out of either their "former" christian experience or as a reaction to it.  At times it's thought-provoking, at times edifying, at times (way too often) stupefying, and at times (many times) so reminiscent of what I do NOT miss about church doctrine that I can see no difference at all, and it "feels" like blasphemy--and likely is.  I've put it this way before--there are a lot of people who haven't been "out of her" far enough or long enough, and too many of them are teaching. 

So what's my stance?  I don't focus on theological agreement.  I'm so incredibly at peace with what I've come to see in scripture.  And that "peace" is what I want, not "being right" or "certitude" or "debate" and not even "agreement".  Everybody is wrong about 'something' because God is too big for our boxes.  Understanding is not equal.--some 30 fold, some 60 fold, some 100 fold.  Everybody gets what they get.  Nobody can be convinced of anything other by argument, clever or otherwise.  Only God un-closes eyes, and no man can convert another from carnally minded to spiritually minded.  Can't even do it for himself/herself.  I'm happy and feel some kinship and meeting of mind if their "faith" is optimistic and realistic...the rest of it, they are welcome to.  Lord knows I don't want much of it.  I haven't made any friends, though I have had a person or two ask me to "follow" them.  I don't want to be unequally yoked even WITH believers. 

I remember my involvement with the World Wide Church, when I thought I’d found it for sure. And the strange miracle which quite literally blocked me from entering any further into the depths of that church—something I described in my very first post. This was followed by decades of pretty much just being out there in the world. And here I am now with Bible Truths.

Porter, I hear what you’re saying, brother.

The good part about all this is I learned way more about the law of Moses and law of Christ because of my discussions with this mystic. But the best part was the fact I learned I'm not a teacher and that I need to be more careful with what I say. I think I prefer to be a student as that is more my speed. Students are allowed to make mistakes, whereas teachers must be perfect in what they say.

I believe Satan and by extension his children are cunning and subtle, and the moment I think that I can't be deceived is the same moment that I am being deceived. Even to his children is Satan cunning and subtle so they can't know the truth.

What we have here at BT is very unique in my opinion. I've seen the spiritual truths seperate many and it genuinley makes me sad because of the incredibly good news and better things contained in the spirit. It's like a taste of Jesus.

I've studied many beliefs through the testimony of others, especially the beliefs found in universalism. Many of their beliefs are tame and loveable even. However, when it comes to "free will" and "the problem of evil" and parables in general, it convinces me that I was never looking for God to begin with.

While I might check out some more of this man’s videos sometime due to a certain inquisitiveness, I have no intention of delving into various forms of universalism or anything else for that matter. And like you, I am no teacher. I have been given revelations in scripture that I realize to be true and yet have never seen or heard anywhere else. Nevertheless, I cannot express them openly. I know where I am. I know where I’ve been led.


Thank you all. This has been quite helpful for me.

Mike

Hi all,

Something has bothered me from time to time and maybe one of you all can explain. 

In Matthew 24, there is a lot about very visible troubles if they are literal.  For example, "You will hear of wars and rumors of wars, but see to it that you are not alarmed. These things must happen, but the end is still to come. 7Nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom. There will be famines and earthquakes in various places."  And then there's this: "How miserable those days will be for pregnant and nursing mothers! 20Pray that your flight will not occur in the winter or on the Sabbath. 21 For at that time there will be great tribulation,unmatched from the beginning of the world until now, and never to be seen again. 22If those days had not been cut short, nobody would be saved. But for the sake of the elect, those days will be cut short."

Now, given all these things that would presumably not being done in a corner and have the whole world on edge.  How then can we have this: "As it was in the days of Noah, so will it be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark. 39And they were oblivious, until the flood came and swept them all away. So will it be at the coming of the Son of Man."  So, how can they be oblivious of the above events such that they are marrying and are given in marriage. It seems like it's hard to be oblivious to events that are rocking the world to such an extent that you're like yeah let's get married next week.

Thanks,
Josh

I just watched it so here is what I gleaned from it.

I will repeat a couple of statements that were made. He said,

1)” to return them to the pure state that they were originally created to be.”

My understanding is that humanity was created (originally) with carnal minds
and enmity against God.

2) He said” God is going to do this without violating anybody’s free will”

FREE WILL IS A MYTH, man has no free will.

I stopped watching after I heard this. It’s just more of the rot that’s on YouTube
They all start out sounding so wonderful don’t they.

2 Tim. 3:13…. But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse
                      deceiving and being deceived.  (and Rev.22:11)


There is always some truth mixed in with the lies.They blaspheme our Lord.

In Christ, Pamela

"The best lie is one closest to the truth."

I engaged in a discussion with a universalist mystic several months back, and I'm not gonna lie, he fooled me good. I started beliving some of the lies he was saying because he talked with such eloquence and intelligence. Like Pamela said, he mixed truth with lies and it was very convincing - probably one of the most convincing liars I've ever come across.

It wasn't until I realized that he had been passively accusing me of "literalizing" the bible and beliving in "legalism" that I finally stopped engaging him and following him, but not after I told him I knew what he was doing. He continued to indirectly accuse me and boy I began to hate him. I'm still a little sore about it, but my wounds are slowly healing.

The good part about all this is I learned way more about the law of Moses and law of Christ because of my discussions with this mystic. But the best part was the fact I learned I'm not a teacher and that I need to be more careful with what I say. I think I prefer to be a student as that is more my speed. Students are allowed to make mistakes, whereas teachers must be perfect in what they say.

I believe Satan and by extention his children are cunning and subtle, and the moment I think that I can't be deceived is the same moment that I am being deceived. Even to his children is Satan cunning and subtle so they can't know the truth.

What we have here at BT is very unique in my opinion. I've seen the spiritual truths seperate many and it genuinley makes me sad because of the incredibly good news and better things contained in the spirit. It's like a taste of Jesus.

I've studied many beliefs through the testimony of others, especially the beliefs found in universalism. Many of their beliefs are tame and loveable even. However, when it comes to "free will" and "the problem of evil" and parables in general, it convinces me that I was never looking for God to begin with.

The aforementioned procedure did not turn into a "treatment" and was ultimately simply diagnostic.  The only firm date I have for another procedure is also only diagnostic.  Between the two, perhaps there is some procedure they can do that is "treatment".  At present, I am on the medical assembly line waiting for all the stars and planets to align.  Apparently.  Nobody has told me anything different and no firm decisions and dates have been made.  I'm likely here till the end of the year, or close to it anyway.  I hope to take my life back about then and spend what's left of it somewhere besides a bedroom in my sister's house.  Somewhere with pineapple and an ocean breeze would be nice.  Somewhere I could actually begin to use all the Spanish I've been learning.  I know just the place.  It's not paradise, but it ain't bad.   

I'm always a little leery even discussing "free will" because the term is usually without a definition.  People can say they believe in free will simply out of ignorance or laziness when what they truly believe is the sovereignty of God. 

That said, I "feel" you on the "disappointment or worse".  If we are focused on theology, we have to admit that there are many, many flavors of so-called "universalism".  Through that theological lens, it is no less a babel than any other segment of "the church".  Evidence is very near. 

I mentioned my sister recently.  I joined a face-book group that she is involved in.  It is pretty much the exact type of forum that BT set out so intentionally to NOT become.  Everybody has an opinion on everything and most of it seems to flow out of either their "former" christian experience or as a reaction to it.  At times it's thought-provoking, at times edifying, at times (way too often) stupefying, and at times (many times) so reminiscent of what I do NOT miss about church doctrine that I can see no difference at all, and it "feels" like blasphemy--and likely is.  I've put it this way before--there are a lot of people who haven't been "out of her" far enough or long enough, and too many of them are teaching. 

So what's my stance?  I don't focus on theological agreement.  I'm so incredibly at peace with what I've come to see in scripture.  And that "peace" is what I want, not "being right" or "certitude" or "debate" and not even "agreement".  Everybody is wrong about 'something' because God is too big for our boxes.  Understanding is not equal.--some 30 fold, some 60 fold, some 100 fold.  Everybody gets what they get.  Nobody can be convinced of anything other by argument, clever or otherwise.  Only God un-closes eyes, and no man can convert another from carnally minded to spiritually minded.  Can't even do it for himself/herself.  I'm happy and feel some kinship and meeting of mind if their "faith" is optimistic and realistic...the rest of it, they are welcome to.  Lord knows I don't want much of it.  I haven't made any friends, though I have had a person or two ask me to "follow" them.  I don't want to be unequally yoked even WITH believers. 

So, the shorter answer:  No, I've not heard of this channel before.  He's one of quite a number that I both have--and I'm very sure have not--heard of.  My YouTube algorithm is almost blissfully unaware of my "interest" in "theology" and just keeps showing me music education/appreciation, history, and my hobbies and leaves me be otherwise.  When I do watch or engage with a BT video, I normally see an uptick in atheist and "deconstructionist" content, though a few "church history" things and "comparative denominations" things may sneak in and catch my attention.  But things usually settle down after a while.

Sorry for the rant.   

 



               

I agree with Pamela

My view is:
WE die.
Then our Lord returns to resurrect all previous believers such as Abe, Issac, Jacob, David, the 12 who will rule.
Those folks live through the 1000 years governing the survivors of the Trib. all under Christ.
Then the Great White throne or judgment seat of Christ where the books are opened and folks are judged on how they lived.
If some didn't make it to the book, into the Lake of Fire they go.
To be reserved dead until the consumation, 1Cor 15:24   

= =
As to a reason for the 2nd death in LoF. The new earth is a reward to those whose acts were good and thus in the book of life. The 2nd death is a means to exclude the really bad actors, setting them aside temporarily.

I just watched it so here is what I gleaned from it.

I will repeat a couple of statements that were made. He said,

1)” to return them to the pure state that they were originally created to be.”

My understanding is that humanity was created (originally) with carnal minds
and enmity against God.

2) He said” God is going to do this without violating anybody’s free will”

FREE WILL IS A MYTH, man has no free will.

I stopped watching after I heard this. It’s just more of the rot that’s on YouTube
They all start out sounding so wonderful don’t they.

2 Tim. 3:13…. But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse
                      deceiving and being deceived.  (and Rev.22:11)


There is always some truth mixed in with the lies.They blaspheme our Lord.

In Christ, Pamela