bible-truths.com/forums
=> General Discussions => Topic started by: rick on February 26, 2015, 07:16:06 PM
-
Below is and actual film clip from July 12- 1952, no one can deny the evidence unless they simply close their eyes.
There is so much evidence on this planet that supports the UFO phenomenon that is totally mind blowing but are aliens real ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hObI12DD3-Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLA1zoWPDBs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDQ-0EaAFms
I believe the answers to the alien deception can be found in the book of Genesis.
Gen 6:4 The Nephilim were in the earth in those days, and also after that, when the sons of God came unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them: the same were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown.
These Nephilim are not of the line of Adam and Eve but I do believe these ancient people and their civilization can explain the alien phenomenon. ;)
-
I'm sorry rick, im not following you. What exactly are you saying?
To answer your question though; No.
-
No.
-
No. I don't believe in spooks. I don't believe in UFOs. I don't believe in anything that is believed by anyone in the modern 21st Century "culture." I don't let others influence my core beliefs.
Nothing challenges my faith. I'm a hardcore believer in the King of Kings.
My problem is in following His example in my day to day life. :(
-
No........only my sanity is
Rhys :P
-
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3621.msg27085.html#msg27085
Hi Ray, I stumbled upon your website and have spent the last couple of days
> glued to it as it's interesting stuff. In reply to someones email concerning
> aliens/UFO's you made this statement.
>
> "There are no alien beings that live on planets and have perfected
> interstellar space travel."
>
> Can you quote any scripture to prove this? If not, what is this statement
> based on?
>
> Thanks Azza.
Dear Azza:
The statement is based on science/astronomy, and the Scriptures.
Jesus died for the sins of the "world," not the sins of the "universe."
Eve is the "mother of all living," etc., etc., etc.
I should think that all people know that interstellar space travel is
physically impossible. Even traveling at millions of miles an hour,
there are very few places that one could go in less than a thousand years!
Everything is TOO FAR AWAY.
God be with you,
Ray
-
My "faith" in the ability of the human mind to make some sense of the unexpected and the unfamiliar would not be challenged. There has NEVER been an instance of unquestioned evidence of craft from other worlds visiting the earth. There HAVE BEEN many instances of hoaxes, doctored footage, and incorrect assumptions concerning explainable phenomenon. There have also been many instances of phenomenon yet unexplained. That doesn't mean that the 'explanation' must therefor be of alien visitation.
IF a spacecraft from a world other than the earth ever did appear (something I never expect to have happen), then my "faith" would absorb it, like it has every other new 'thing' I've learned in my life. It would absorb it with some difficulty (more or less difficulty, depending on what other knowledge came bundled with that event). But my "faith" has absorbed things more fantastic and unbelievable than that before, and has only grown. Grown to a point it barely resembles the "faith" of my childhood.
-
I believe the answers to the alien deception can be found in the book of Genesis.
Gen 6:4 The Nephilim were in the earth in those days, and also after that, when the sons of God came unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them: the same were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown.
These Nephilim are not of the line of Adam and Eve but I do believe these ancient people and their civilization can explain the alien phenomenon. ;)
Ray wrote a bit on this topic, and his conclusion is not yours. You assume these Nephilim (giants, great men) were not of the line of Adam and Eve? Why do you assume that? Because they are not in the 'geneology' presented in scripture? Do you have any idea how many people are left out of your OWN genealogy if you trace only back through your paternal line?
You make a very flimsy assumption here based on absolutely no evidence whatsoever, except that if fits your world-view. Once again, my "faith" is not challenged.
Is your "faith" challenged by anything we've said?
-
Hi Rick,
We have talked about the Nephilim many times... you seem to be saying that these are some other ancient civilization that was before Adam and Eve had greater knowledge than they did? I could not disagree more, if that is what you are hinting at. Those people had not even learned to till the ground (Gen 2:5), it was Adam and Eve whom God brought along and gave knowledge to really push the world into a 'civilized' state.
Now there is a "prince/ruler of the air," and "ruler of this world" (John 12:31; 14:30; 16:11), and this one and his many demon allies are capable and I believe are responsible for all these visions and delusions of UFOs.
Eph 2:2 in which you once walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit who now works in the sons of disobedience,
mercy, peace and love
Kat
-
I believe the answers to the alien deception can be found in the book of Genesis.
Gen 6:4 The Nephilim were in the earth in those days, and also after that, when the sons of God came unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them: the same were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown.
These Nephilim are not of the line of Adam and Eve but I do believe these ancient people and their civilization can explain the alien phenomenon. ;)
You assume these Nephilim (giants, great men) were not of the line of Adam and Eve? Why do you assume that? Because they are not in the 'geneology' presented in scripture? Do you have any idea how many people are left out of your OWN genealogy if you trace only back through your paternal line?
Hi Dave,
we can all trace our accessory back to Noah and his sons
Gen 6:7 And Jehovah said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the ground; both man, and beast, and creeping things, and birds of the heavens; for it repenteth me that I have made them.
Gen 6:13 And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.
Gen 9:1 And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.
-
I believe the answers to the alien deception can be found in the book of Genesis.
Gen 6:4 The Nephilim were in the earth in those days, and also after that, when the sons of God came unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them: the same were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown.
These Nephilim are not of the line of Adam and Eve but I do believe these ancient people and their civilization can explain the alien phenomenon. ;)
You assume these Nephilim (giants, great men) were not of the line of Adam and Eve? Why do you assume that? Because they are not in the 'geneology' presented in scripture? Do you have any idea how many people are left out of your OWN genealogy if you trace only back through your paternal line?
Hi Dave,
we can all trace our accessory back to Noah and his sons
Gen 6:7 And Jehovah said, I will destroy man whom I have created from the face of the ground; both man, and beast, and creeping things, and birds of the heavens; for it repenteth me that I have made them.
Gen 6:13 And God said unto Noah, The end of all flesh is come before me; for the earth is filled with violence through them; and, behold, I will destroy them with the earth.
Gen 9:1 And God blessed Noah and his sons, and said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth.
Rick,
You know the flood was not global right? In psalm we are told that through creation the water's were given bounderies so they could never cover the earth like they did in Genesis prior to noah's flood.
Psalm 104:5 Who laid the foundations of the earth, that it should not be removed for ever.
Psalm 104:6 Thou coveredst it with the deep as with a garment: the waters stood above the mountains.
Psalm 104:7 At thy rebuke they fled; at the voice of thy thunder they hasted away.
Psalm 104:8 They go up by the mountains; they go down by the valleys unto the place which thou hast founded for them.
Psalm 104:9 You set a boundary they cannot cross; never again will they cover the earth.
Genesis 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters.
The earth at this point is entirely covered over with water.
Genesis 1:3 And God said, Let there be light: and there was light.
Genesis 1:4 And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness.
Genesis 1:5 And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.
Genesis 1:6 And God said, Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.
Genesis 1:7 And God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament: and it was so.
Genesis 1:8 And God called the firmament Heaven. And the evening and the morning were the second day.
Genesis 1:9 And God said, Let the waters under the heaven be gathered together unto one place, and let the dry land appear: and it was so.
Now Land is coming up out of the sea. The sea is no longer covering the entire face of the earth as it was previous and we are told in Psalm that God set up a boundery to provent this from ever happening again. Noah's flood therefor was not global as it came to pass long after the creation when God brought forth the land and set up a boundery so that the ocean could not cover the face of the earth again.
Noah and his son's replenished the LAND and not the whole world. God destroyed all flesh in the LAND and not the whole world.
In Christ,
Alex
P.S. NO we cannot "all" trace our lineage back to Noah and his sons. That was only physical isreal after the physical seed that could but the promise is no longer after the flesh. The covenant is a new one not according to the old.
-
Hi Alex,
Ray has taught that the flood was a regional flood but nonetheless God said He was going to destroyed all flesh from the earth which He God did.
-
Hi Alex,
Ray has taught that the flood was a regional flood but nonetheless God said He was going to destroyed all flesh from the earth which He God did.
No Rick,
God did not say that. He destroyed all flesh in the land. You are misrepresenting that.
-
Rick, at the 08 Nashville conference Ray spoke extensively on the flood and many aspects of it and one of those was that none of the nations of that part of the world show any disruption in there history during that period of time of the biblical flood.
Here is a email that mentions that as well.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,8712.0.html --------------
Ray's response in red
I have a question regarding Humanity or Mankind after Noah’s Flood.
Are all the descendants from Noah and his family?
COMMENT: Do you mean is all humanity on earth today descendants from Noah and his family? No, I don't think so, as there were whole nations of people alive during the regional flood of Noah.
If not, is there any reference to descendants from Noah?
COMMENT: Yes, Genesis Chapter 10 gives a brief outline of their descendants.
If so, are these the ‘Godly Line’ which leads to Jesus Christ and Salvation?
COMMENT: Yes, Christ's genealogy goes back to Kind David, Abraham, and Noah's son S[he]M---S[e]M---SM---SM[ith].
See Luke 3:34-38.
God be with you,
Ray
-
I agree with Kat because of this_
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. (Ephesians 6:12).
There are so many things right here that we can't understand and can't see.
-
No
-
I agree with Kat because of this_
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. (Ephesians 6:12).
There are so many things right here that we can't understand and can't see.
I pretty much don't agree with Kat because of that same scripture. But I don't know that I'm completely right, even though I know that I am partly right for sure.
-
Mankind has been worshiping the works, and images they have created with their own hands, and gods that are no gods for thousands of years.
It would be easy to make an image out of something that a person saw in a night dream or vision, as did Nebuchadnezzar recorded in Daniel chapter 3.
Today we have believers in UFO's.
Believers in bigfoot, and to some that is their religion.
God does send strong delusion to some that have pleasure in unrighteousness.
No, my faith in what God has shown me is not challenged.
Joel
-
I agree with Kat because of this_
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. (Ephesians 6:12).
There are so many things right here that we can't understand and can't see.
I pretty much don't agree with Kat because of that same scripture. But I don't know that I'm completely right, even though I know that I am partly right for sure.
Could you go into what you believe this is saying ? I always value your insights.
-
Do I believe in UFO's? Yes, I do. Why? The first letter of UFO is 'U' and that stands for unidentified. Nothing more and nothing less. There are flying objects that have been seen and recorded. Many have been explained and others have not. Too many things going on in the life to spend precious time to try to explain that which is unidentified. Ray addressed such things a few different times;
Hi Ray, I stumbled upon your website and have spent the last couple of days
> glued to it as it's interesting stuff. In reply to someones email concerning
> aliens/UFO's you made this statement.
>
> "There are no alien beings that live on planets and have perfected
> interstellar space travel."
>
> Can you quote any scripture to prove this? If not, what is this statement
> based on?
>
> Thanks Azza.
Dear Azza:
The statement is based on science/astronomy, and the Scriptures.
Jesus died for the sins of the "world," not the sins of the "universe."
Eve is the "mother of all living," etc., etc., etc.
I should think that all people know that interstellar space travel is
physically impossible. Even traveling at millions of miles an hour,
there are very few places that one could go in less than a thousand years!
Everything is TOO FAR AWAY.
God be with you,
Ray
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3621.msg27085.html#msg27085
Hello Ray:
Scot from Cincinnati here......we have not communicated in awhile, but you have been gracious enough to respond to me in the past.
I think I might be one of those people spending WAY too much time on the Internet. I have been exploring UFO web sites as a form of entertainment and 99% of the time I usually laugh and just get a kick out of what they have to say. HOWEVER.......when they quote the Bible, and when I actually have the energy and the wherewith all to go back and confirm that what they say is Biblically accurate, it sort of makes me scratch my head.
Way back in Genesis....God said in the Bible Genesis 1-26 "God made man in OUR image"......not "His" or "MY" but "OUR". Why did the Bible specifically use the word "OUR"?
I know L. Ray Smith that you do not believe in the Trinity (Neither do I)....so what does "OUR" mean???
They (the web sites I have been researching) have lots to say about Aliens cloning us from other Aliens and all the stuff I am sure you know a lot about (as in where exactly did the Pyramids come from yada yada) but as your web site proclaims as seeking the truth I simply want to know your take on this matter........and trust me....I do NOT watch the Jerry Springer show!!!!! At first most normal Christians want to just laugh off these idiot web sites an move on. Myself, however, I am interested in TRUTH (That is why I have been looking at YOUR web site for the past 2 years!)
Is it POSSIBLE a higher Life form cloned us but that it does NOT negate what the Bible tells us? I am well aware that some of the "Fallen Angels" are higher spiritual Life forms and may be responsible for some of this confusion.
Feel free to Slap me....I think I am deserving of it.
Scot
Dear Scott:
I have "zero" confidence in all of the dozens of alien theories attached to different sections of the Scriptures. I wonder why all of these UFO advocates don't start calling them IFOs, seeing that they feel they have truthfully "identified" what these things really are--alien beings. There are no alien beings that live on planets and have perfected interstellar space travel.
God be with you,
Ray
PS That 1% out of a 100 that one gets deceived is just as effective as if he were deceived all of the time.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,1909.msg15786.html#msg15786
My personal belief is that the government does have some very high technologically advanced aerial platforms that some folks have seen and attributed as UFO's and that makes sense. At this point I think that this planet is the only one with 'life' on it and that by purpose. I think that we are still at the very beginning of God's plan for humanity and His ever expanding Kingdom. After the salvation of all mankind who knows what the Father has in store for the rest of the universe with millions of galaxies and billions of planets? Paul was taken up into the third heaven and shown some things that were not lawful for humanity to hear. They may not have life now but I think that some day they will and we will play a part in that in the distant future.
-
Just one related comment Rick,
Nothing that is presented in the 3 videos proves that the sightings were caused by beings from another star/galaxy or species foreign to this planet.
If something emitted light or reflected light so that it could be seen moving across the sky, that in and of itself doesn't establish that the UFO was from outside our solar system.
Many strange phenomenon may be caused by electromagnetic forces we have yet to discover. The fact that we don't know what it is or where it came from only proves that we have more to learn.
I-bob
Below is and actual film clip from July 12- 1952, no one can deny the evidence unless they simply close their eyes.
There is so much evidence on this planet that supports the UFO phenomenon that is totally mind blowing but are aliens real ?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hObI12DD3-Y
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qLA1zoWPDBs
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CDQ-0EaAFms
I believe the answers to the alien deception can be found in the book of Genesis.
Gen 6:4 The Nephilim were in the earth in those days, and also after that, when the sons of God came unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them: the same were the mighty men that were of old, the men of renown.
These Nephilim are not of the line of Adam and Eve but I do believe these ancient people and their civilization can explain the alien phenomenon. ;)
-
Bob,
I showed my fiance these things and she was wholly unconvinced it was aliens or even heavenly beings of some sort. She said it could very well have been something a long the lines you mentioned and I am tending to agree with that.
Either way, I don't believe there are aliens outside this planet somewhere. I also watched a video in my science class a long time ago while I was in school, it was a chemistry course don't ask me why we were watching this video, in which scientists explained it was physically impossible for any being to travel from a distance planet to our let alone for them to move in the ways that are often described of them to be moving by those who claim to see them or capture them on video. They said scientifically, unless the laws change and are not constant across our physical universe, that aliens have not visited us.
As someone who is fairly studied in the sciences and believes that science can offer us sufficiently reasonable explanations for the way our world functions, I am inclined to agree with the notions that even if aliens exist (which like I said, I don't believe they do), they cannot nor have they visited us.
God bless,
Alex
-
It's life Jim but not as we know it :P
As the former commander of the Starship Enterprise of course aliens exist but there ships cannot match the awesomeness of the Starship Enterprise.
Warp speed Mr Sulu ???
-
For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places. (Ephesians 6:12).
Octoberrose, if I can be brief and not open too big a can of worms, I'll try.
I've never consciously or unconsciously 'wrestled' against 'spirits' or 'spirit-beings' that seemed bent on deceiving me...except maybe in my youth when we were encouraged to raise our hands or pray 'against' unseen beings. I have wrestled with -isms, and ideologies, and religions, and movements, and myriad other 'things' cooked up in the minds of men to win my loyalty, or support, or money or to control my thoughts, emotions, and actions. That's the 'darkness' of this world--murders, envy, strife, the lust of the eyes, of the flesh, and the pride of life, etc. These things have a spiritual basis--spiritual wickedness--and "rulers" in this world that are not flesh and blood, but ideas, thoughts, concepts, etc.
Among these is the fascination with "extra-terrestrials" and all the baggage that goes with that. Sometimes they are relatively harmless. Sometimes not so much.
Not to forget that I also have "high places" even within myself. Seems like every time one has been 'out-wrestled', the gospel gets better.
-
To all who responded,
First I thank all you for some great responses, I wasn’t aware Ray had some things to say about UFO’s in some of his e-mails and I thank all of you who put those e mails out there for me to read, they were very helpful.
Im somewhat perplex as to the people who were here before Adam and Eve, these giants or the Nephilim, the ones Cain referred to when he said to God anyone who finds me will kill me.
Now I discovered there are people alive today that may not be in the lineage of Adams and Eves and if this is true would not God extend salvation to these people also ?
Moreover how can one know if they are from the lineage of Adam and Eve or from the lineage of these Nephilims or giants ?
-
To all who responded,
First I thank all you for some great responses, I wasn’t aware Ray had some things to say about UFO’s in some of his e-mails and I thank all of you who put those e mails out there for me to read, they were very helpful.
Im somewhat perplex as to the people who were here before Adam and Eve, these giants or the Nephilim, the ones Cain referred to when he said to God anyone who finds me will kill me.
Now I discovered there are people alive today that may not be in the lineage of Adams and Eves and if this is true would not God extend salvation to these people also ?
Moreover how can one know if they are from the lineage of Adam and Eve or from the lineage of these Nephilims or giants ?
You don't know that these 'giants' or Nephilim were the ones Cain referred to, so there's no reason to be perplexed. God is the Father of ALL MANKIND, and it doesn't matter what your understanding (or lack thereof) of 'lineages' may be. God said, LET US MAKE MANKIND IN OUR IMAGE. Rest on that even if you want to grapple with the other.
-
To all who responded,
First I thank all you for some great responses, I wasn’t aware Ray had some things to say about UFO’s in some of his e-mails and I thank all of you who put those e mails out there for me to read, they were very helpful.
Im somewhat perplex as to the people who were here before Adam and Eve, these giants or the Nephilim, the ones Cain referred to when he said to God anyone who finds me will kill me.
Now I discovered there are people alive today that may not be in the lineage of Adams and Eves and if this is true would not God extend salvation to these people also ?
Moreover how can one know if they are from the lineage of Adam and Eve or from the lineage of these Nephilims or giants ?
You don't know that these 'giants' or Nephilim were the ones Cain referred to, so there's no reason to be perplexed. God is the Father of ALL MANKIND, and it doesn't matter what your understanding (or lack thereof) of 'lineages' may be. God said, LET US MAKE MANKIND IN OUR IMAGE. Rest on that even if you want to grapple with the other.
Pretty much this. Also, the promise is no longer after the flesh but after the spirit. Those in Christ are the Jews now. Circumcision is of the heart and not of the penis. Its a new covenant not in accordance with the old so it matters not who is of the lineage of Adam and Eve any more. It was a big deal though to physical Isreal back in the day. First the natural then the spiritual. The physical covenant was merely a shadow of a spiritual reality to come in Christ.
Jeremiah 31:31 Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, that I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel, and with the house of Judah:
Jeremiah 31:32 Not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to bring them out of the land of Egypt; which my covenant they brake, although I was an husband unto them, saith the Lord:
Hebrews 8:8 For finding fault with them, he saith, Behold, the days come, saith the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah:
Hebrews 8:13 In that he saith, A new covenant, he hath made the first old. Now that which decayeth and waxeth old is ready to vanish away.
-
Hi Rick,
Act 17:26 “And He has made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth, and has determined their preappointed times and the boundaries of their dwellings,
v. 27 “so that they should seek the Lord, in the hope that they might grope for Him and find Him, though He is not far from each one of us;
v. 28 “for in Him we live and move and have our being, as also some of your own poets have said, ‘For we are also His offspring.'
Paul here states that God "made from one blood every nation of men to dwell on all the face of the earth," this means of the human race, as the word "blood" is used as a metaphorical term to denote race here. Paul even goes further to state "every nation... on earth" is God's "offspring." So yes I would certainly believe those before Adam will ultimately be save.
Now this may be different from what we have always heard, but that should not keep us from accepting the truth and when you realize this truth many Scripture begin to make more sense. Now this is not an idea that I came up with, it is what Ray began to understand and present to us.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,12719.msg111472.html#msg111472 ---
RAY'S COMMENT: Chapter two does not contradict chapter one. The order in chapter one is plants, animals, and then humanity. Is this not the order found in the geologic table? Chapter two does not recount the creation of humanity, but rather the creation of Adam and Eve. In Genesis 1:26 God "made" [Heb: 'asah'] male and female. In Gen. 2:6 God "formed" [Heb: 'yatsar'] Adam--two difference Hebrew words: two different formations. Notice that it doesn't say in chapter 2 verse 3 that there was no man on earth at this time, but rather that there was "no man to till the ground." There were men, but they were hunters/gatherers, not farmers. God is now going to make a more advance human to cultivate and farm the land.
The phrase "dress it and keep it" in verse 15, is "tend and cultivate." God is teaching Adam to be a farmer. When in doubt, read a proper translation. God did not create the animals AFTER He created Adam. Notice a proper translation from the Concordant Literal Old Testament: "And furthermore, Ieu Alueim ['the Lord God'] HAVING FORMED [yes, having ALREADY formed, millions of years in the past] all field life and every flyer of the heavens." God is bringing to Adam the Animal species which He had already created millions of years in the past, to have Adam give names to them. This obviously took years. Some, such as the dinosaurs (the reptilian 'tannyin, tannyim,' of Gen. 1:21 had already been extinct for many millions of years. These were decidedly not, "great whales," as the King James erroneously translates it).
It was from this first group of humanity that Cain apparently got his wife, cities were built, etc.
Chapter two does not cover the creation of plant life. That began hundreds of millions of years earlier. What God is doing in Chapter two is He is planting a garden for the man to cultivate, farm, and harvest. The word "planted" in Gen. 2:8 is from the Hebrew meaning "to sprout." God "sprouted" newly planted trees, etc. They were mere buds, which would require years to produce fruit to eat. What was Adam expected to eat until these trees matured?
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
mercy, peace and love
Kat
-
That God has made from one "blood" all of mankind obviously does not mean we all share the same Original Ancestor. Or do some of you maintain that it does?
If by "blood", the scriptures mean "human type" or "species", that is a group that is inter-fertile, then I agree with the above statement. In other words, I do not think all of humanity today shares the same Original Ancestor. But, I am open to correction on that.
So, Kat, I wonder if I see it as (I think) you do...The flood of Noah entirely destroyed all the "sons of God"--that is the bloodline from Adam, except for Noah and his sons. Those 'others' who survived on the earth (the Nations) were therefore not of the line of Adam.
I think if this view is correct, it explains the existence of the Reptilians... (politicians, authoritarians, warmongers, and other heathenist psychopathic types).
Also, I wonder about the folks Jesus referred to as being "of their father, the devil"...Was there any literal/physical sense to his observation? And, is it possible Cain and Able had different fathers?
-
That God has made from one "blood" all of mankind obviously does not mean we all share the same Original Ancestor. Or do some of you maintain that it does?
If by "blood", the scriptures mean "human type" or "species", that is a group that is inter-fertile, then I agree with the above statement. In other words, I do not think all of humanity today shares the same Original Ancestor. But, I am open to correction on that.
So, Kat, I wonder if I see it as (I think) you do...The flood of Noah entirely destroyed all the "sons of God"--that is the bloodline from Adam, except for Noah and his sons. Those 'others' who survived on the earth (the Nations) were therefore not of the line of Adam.
I think you are correct here Neo, although I don't know if we can be sure that all of the sons of God were destroyed in the flood unless all of the sons of God were in that part of the land that was destroyed. Is it possible that there were other "sons of God" that had migrated elsewhere over the previous centuries prior to the flood?
I think if this view is correct, it explains the existence of the Reptilians... (politicians, authoritarians, warmongers, and other heathenist psychopathic types).
The term "reptilians" is used by those who believe in a literal serpent seed (ie those who falsely believe that Eve had sex with Satan and created a separate race of people on this earth through the bloodline of Cain). It is clear from Scripture that Adam had sex with Eve and she conceived Cain: "And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord." (Gen 4:1).
Also referring to reptilians as "politicians, authoritarians, warmongers, and other heathenist psychopathic types" as if they are inherently more evil than the "sons of God" is also a fallacy. Just look at the nation of Israel and the many times they (the people and leadership) fell into "heathenish" behavior and turned their back on God. All have sinned and fallen short of the glory of God and all are capable of every sort of evil.
Also, I wonder about the folks Jesus referred to as being "of their father, the devil"...Was there any literal/physical sense to his observation? And, is it possible Cain and Able had different fathers?
"And Adam knew Eve his wife; and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord." (Gen 4:1). Again, no Cain is not literally the son of the devil. Christ's words are spirit and that statement He made is to be spiritually discerned.
Angels or spirit beings don't procreate with mankind. The whole reptilian/serpent seed/human hybrid doctrine is very popular among certain groups out there, but it is complete fantasy.
-
Hi Michael,
As I had posted the section where Ray spoke about the Genesis 1:26-27 as being the first time when God "made" male and female humans to live on earth, I believe this was long before Adam and Eve were "formed" (Genesis 2:6). So we have 2 separate times of man being created and I believe that the nations are the descendants of the first people of Genesis 1 that were already living at the time Adam was formed in Genesis 2. Though they certainly intermixed (Genesis 6:2), there was plenty of the first people that did not and lived as separate nations all the way down to new testaments times, I believe they were then referred to as Gentiles/foreigners/stranger/aliens, depending on the translation.
Actually Cain had left the land of his parents, Adam and Eve.
Gen 4:16 Then Cain went out from the presence of the LORD and dwelt in the land of Nod on the east of Eden.
So it is possible that not every single descendant of Adam was in the area of the flood. I think the flood, though certainly literal and did wipe out those descendants of Adam that were there in that part of the land. But it has great symbolism... the ark representing Christ and Noah and his family the few that are 'in' Christ, and the flood the judgment to come on the world.
The term "of their father, the devil" is also symbolic, of the carnal minded people being influenced by Satan. But the idea that Satan fathered Cain is just not a possibility to me. Here is one place Ray mentions this.
http://bible-truths.com/lake2.html -----------------------------
Is this really describing something physical?
[Ray's reply]
Satan is a spirit being, seeing that he has been around for thousands of years. He is called a devil, serpent/snake, dragon, etc. We are not exactly sure what a dragon looks like, but supposedly it is in the reptile family as are snakes.
Nowhere that I can think of, did Satan ever appear visibly to anyone. Therefore his serpent/dragon qualities (or lack thereof) must be spiritual. Satan is a SPIRITUAL SNAKE. He has the secret, stealth qualities of a snake moving unseen in the dark. Although he is "like" [in certain characteristics] a roaring lion, he is not a lion, but "as" a lion he goes about seeking whom he may devour [Gk: 'swallow up' as in 'swallow a camel']. Spiritually devour/swallow.
So, did Eve talk with a literal, physical, snake, face to face, in the garden? I don't think so.
God be with you all,
Ray
-
I'll bow out with this (hopefully--no promises). Genesis 6:4 is not it's own interpretation either. Jesus and the Apostles explained to my complete satisfaction just who the 'children of God' are. I'm at perfect peace with that, and see absolutely no reason to 'interpret' Genesis 6:4 in any other way. Wrestle all you want with genealogies and how they work. Cain didn't reference "giants". Not even Abraham was a "Jew". Not even Isaac was Jew. There are tons more people NOT mentioned in scripture either by name or 'nationality' than ARE. They all live(d) and moved(d) and have/had their being in Him. He has made all things, and without Him nothing that was made was made. Without Him--nothing.
-
Well, I guess the question of the true nature of the Flood still haunts me...Being a once hardened 'global flood' guy who knew all the scriptures inside and out regarding it... I absolutely understand it now as local; I am convinced of it scripturally and 'scientifically', but I'm still hung up on the very precise wording of the scripture as to "all that have the breath of life perished" (and so forth). It just seems like God went through a whole lot of trouble enacting the Flood, then inspiring the precise words about it to be recorded and remembered in almost every culture to this day, if He only meant to just wipe out a few evil people in a very small land, in order to make a (minor) spiritual point to a very small sect of His followers.
I just think there was something a bit more profound to it.
Anyway, Nathan, thanks for the response! I guess I should have used an emoticon or something though to show I was being a bit facetious.. I know Cain was literally not the 'spawn of Satan', and the Pharisees were likewise not the descendants of the Devil, or Nephilim, or ET. So I get that.. BUT, (and by 'Reptilians', I was just using the parlance of the herd!) I still see something fundamentally different with some people--actually a large minority of people I've been blessed/cursed with having the acquaintance of... many of whom were among my own family.
If you want to see it through my eyes, read The Mask of Sanity. There really is something different about some people. Something wholly intangible, which cannot be described with the tools of science, perhaps, but something nonetheless. It's not that they're "more evil than the sons of God", rather, something darker, obscure, something lacking..
Kat, I do see it your way as well. But, there is certainly something very much unexplored regarding the idea that we don't all share the same common ancestor! This is crypto-archaeology teetering on paranoid delusion! No sect of modern science (that I know of) even hints at this. And yet, what does that say about someone like me, who, possibly, believes it? Really, isn't that exactly what the "Reptilian" cult teaches? :o
Curious too...what percentage of humanity today, do you reckon, are actual descendants of Adam?
-
Kat, I do see it your way as well. But, there is certainly something very much unexplored regarding the idea that we don't all share the same common ancestor! This is crypto-archaeology teetering on paranoid delusion! No sect of modern science (that I know of) even hints at this. And yet, what does that say about someone like me, who, possibly, believes it? Really, isn't that exactly what the "Reptilian" cult teaches? :o
Curious too...what percentage of humanity today, do you reckon, are actual descendants of Adam?
Well it's interesting that their are indigenous people all around the world, some that continue to live a tribal lifestyle. They have lived an unsophisticated lifestyle for tens of thousands of years, then there arose a more dominate people that began colonization and domestication of these people.
As you mentioned Michael, there is absolutely no acknowledgment that there are 2 separate groups of people from separate ancestors. I can only say that this seems to be just another bit lost knowledge that has completely deceived the world... like the idea that the flood was worldwide, that there is a eternal hell, that we have free will, etc.
Here is a little bit I found on the indigenous people... there are at least 370 million people worldwide are considered to be indigenous. Most of them live in remote areas of the world. Indigenous peoples are divided into at least 5000 peoples ranging from the forest peoples of the Amazon to the tribal peoples of India and from the Inuit of the Arctic to the Aborigines in Australia.
The indigenous population for the Untied States, as of 8/12/12 is about 0.9% indigenous, 0.7% part-indigenous.
Indigenous people made up 3% of the total Australian population, there are 670,000 of Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islander people in 2011.
I believe the world at the time of the Apostles understood these things as they truly were; about Adam and his descendants, the flood being local and the indigenous peoples as well. It seems the church has brought in so many terrible deceptions (intended, interesting that Scripture wording allows for that) to the world, so that over the centuries so much knowledge of these things has been totally lost.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
-
I wonder if anyone has tracked the population growth of the earth...indigenous people vs. 'societal' people vs. time. When did the sons of God overtake the aboriginal humans in magnitude? Something happened, historically speaking, when that occurred.
And what, exactly, makes the sons of God fundamentally different from the aboriginals? We still have them today;we know their 'habitat'. And they don't seem any more evil than 'Us'. Matter of fact, they seem more sociable, more in tune with Creation, and closer (in mind set) with the Creator.
'We' build nuclear weapons. 'We' treat our fellow men like animals to be controlled, corralled, and consumed.. 'We' are the destroyers of the earth.
"Cain slew Abel Seth knew not why..."
(the song writer continues),
"Lord no man is free
The temples that we built to you
Have tumbled into the sea"
It is obvious, our Line (If I am of it) is no better than theirs. We are indeed of "one blood". We have all been murderers and liars from the beginning.
So what makes God's sons (his new ancestral line through Adam) different?
Knowledge. Interestingly, I was just reminded of the notion of "episodic memory", and how it differentiates humans from all other animals (the ability to understand the past and the future; a determinant in the 'sense of self'). Also known as the knowledge of Good and Evil. I think it's entirely possible the early humans lacked episodic memory... a condition whose sufferers today we would call anterograde amnesiacs.
But, the primitive humans appear to have learned this knowledge by now, if not barely, by watching us... The fact that they cannot compete with us and our capacity for evil is only because they currently lack the resources...
We are truly, fundamentally, different though..WE are held to a higher standard, and will bear a higher penalty, because we, as sons, (either literal, or adopted) have been given KNOWLEDGE, which convicts us of our sin...
"If I had not come and spoken unto them, they had not had sin: but now they have no cloak for their sin" (John 15:22)
That's us. Descendants of Adam. (And yes, for a very small group, He has given us a "cloak".)
Just wondering if anyone else sees it that way.
-
There may be life on other planets, but I don't think they have ever visited us. The distances are just to great. They are vast and if we wanted to travel to the nearest star would take 70 years at the speed of light, a speed we can't possibly reach. Then there is the issue of supplies and oxygen for 70 years. The logistics are mind boggling. Not just for us but for alien travellers as well. Any other means of travel than this is in the realms of science fiction and storytelling and are in the minds of future quantum physicists theorists. I have heard that there is an anti-matter engine in theory, but I heard to make just 1 teaspoon of anti-matter would bankrupt the planet. So we need to maintain perspective. Just an interested layman's POV.
8)
-
Just one related comment Rick,
Nothing that is presented in the 3 videos proves that the sightings were caused by beings from another star/galaxy or species foreign to this planet.
If something emitted light or reflected light so that it could be seen moving across the sky, that in and of itself doesn't establish that the UFO was from outside our solar system.
Many strange phenomenon may be caused by electromagnetic forces we have yet to discover. The fact that we don't know what it is or where it came from only proves that we have more to learn.
Hi Bob,
There is a wealth of information on line given as a testimony by credible people with very high credentials who tell what they saw and hear.
Videos and pictures mean nothing but the testimony of a credible person/s are as believable as the testimony of the apostles who were people of integrity and told what they saw and heard.
Luk 21:11 There will be terrible earthquakes, famines, and plagues everywhere; there will be strange and terrifying things coming from the sky.
I’m not talking about aliens Bob but this I will say, maybe demons like to fly in disks we call UFO”S
-
Ray says, Satan is a spiritual being and has not appeared to anyone. How did he communicate with Eve ? and Jesus ? It would have been impossible for Eve to know who Satan is. She would have done whatever he said, who did Eve think Satan was anyway ? Ricky
-
Hi Ricky,
Yes Satan is a spirit and he works through the carnal mind, and I'm sure he does not have a problem finding an easy to influence candidates among humans to do his bidding. So when you realize there were other people on earth at the time Adam was made/formed, well then you can understand it was not a literal snake speaking to Eve, but a person that Satan found with the right cunning attributes to influence and work through.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
-
Rick, most who answered have tried to answer your original question...is our faith challenged. I also asked YOU a question,. You haven't answered it yet. Is YOUR faith challenged by anything 'we've' said?
What is it these credible witnesses have reported? Are their reports consistent? Have they actually 'identified' the 'unidentified'? Or are they just grasping at explanations because they don't know themselves?
Anyway...this is the Bible-Truths.com forum. It's not the UFO identification forum. Believe what you want for as long as you do. For all I know, you are right. But please don't suggest that we just need to 'open our eyes'. It's insulting to assume we haven't.
-
Hi Dave,
My apologies for not answering your question straight away, is my faith challenged by what had been said.
I must admit after reading the Apollo moon missions transcripts and listening to the governor of Phoenix concerning the Phoenix lights and many other very creditable people I must conclude these are men and also women telling the truth!
At the risk of being met with hostility and ridicule on a Christian forum I thought I would ask regardless of the consequences and opposition I might be met with to gain a greater knowledge of God directly or indirectly.
I don’t recall suggesting or assuming any or all on this forum or off this forum open their eyes or close their eyes.
My only intentions here was to gather information concerning things that I have an interest in that I might reconcile the information I have come across with my creator and His creation.
I am also aware that this forum is Bible Truths .com and not UFO .com
Now to answer your question, my faith has actually increased because I know that anything that was made was made by Christ and our faith should be able to absorb all information or things that come into our life or if not what good is ones faith.
Thanks you for your response Dave .
-
Hi Dave,
My apologies for not answering your question straight away, is my faith challenged by what had been said.
I must admit after reading the Apollo moon missions transcripts and listening to the governor of Phoenix concerning the Phoenix lights and many other very creditable people I must conclude these are men and also women telling the truth!
At the risk of being met with hostility and ridicule on a Christian forum I thought I would ask regardless of the consequences and opposition I might be met with to gain a greater knowledge of God directly or indirectly.
I don’t recall suggesting or assuming any or all on this forum or off this forum open their eyes or close their eyes.
My only intentions here was to gather information concerning things that I have an interest in that I might reconcile the information I have come across with my creator and His creation.
I am also aware that this forum is Bible Truths .com and not UFO .com
Now to answer your question, my faith has actually increased because I know that anything that was made was made by Christ and our faith should be able to absorb all information or things that come into our life or if not what good is ones faith.
Thanks you for your response Dave .
I'd becareful what I believe out of men, especially men in positions of power.
Romans 3:4 God forbid: yea, let God be true, but every man a liar;
Psalm 146:3 Put not your trust in princes, nor in the son of man, in whom there is no help.
Isaiah 2:22 Stop trusting in mere humans, who have but a breath in their nostrils. Why hold them in esteem?
Jeremiah 17:9 The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately weak: who can know it?
Acts 17:11 These were more noble than those in Thessalonica, in that they received the word with all readiness of mind, and searched the scriptures daily, whether those things were so.
1 John 4:1 Beloved, believe not every spirit, but try the spirits whether they are of God: because many false prophets are gone out into the world.
In Christ,
Alex
-
Hi Alex,
No offence my brother but would you also recite Rom 3: 4 concerning the apostles also who are as Isaiah coined it mere men ? We are to divide the word of God rightly and should not use scripture in an irresponsible way to present any argument.
If your argument is meant to persuade me that all men from the greatest to the least lie constantly without ever telling the truth you have failed to convince me.
I am in the Hvac business and go to peoples homes every day and if my employer should ask me a question about any job or repair I make I tell my employer the truth even if that truth condemns me, I do not twist the truth to suite me but tell the truth.
I assume I’m not the only person who tells the truth Alex,
-
Hi Alex,
No offence my brother but would you also recite Rom 3: 4 concerning the apostles also who are as Isaiah coined it mere men ? We are to divide the word of God rightly and should not use scripture in an irresponsible way to present any argument.
If your argument is meant to persuade me that all men from the greatest to the least lie constantly without ever telling the truth you have failed to convince me.
I am in the Hvac business and go to peoples homes every day and if my employer should ask me a question about any job or repair I make I tell my employer the truth even if that truth condemns me, I do not twist the truth to suite me but tell the truth.
I assume I’m not the only person who tells the truth Alex,
I'm sorry rick, I'm not sure if I understand you.
Did you ask me if I would apply what I just urged as caution towards men of this world, for all men are liars, to the apostles too?
1 Corinthians 14:37 If any man think himself to be a prophet, or spiritual, let him acknowledge that the things that I write unto you are the commandments of the Lord.
John 15:20 Remember the word that I said unto you, The servant is not greater than his lord. If they have persecuted me, they will also persecute you[APOSTLES]; if they have kept my saying, they will keep yours also.
1 Corinthians 2:12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
John 14:16-18 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever; Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you. I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
1 John 2:14-16 I have written unto you, fathers, because ye have known him that is from the beginning. I have written unto you, young men, because ye are strong, and the word of God abideth in you, and ye have overcome the wicked one. Love not the world, neither the things that are in the world. If any man love the world, the love of the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh, and the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life, is not of the Father, but is of the world.
The creation was subject to vanity (moral futility) and without God man cannot do good.
Romans 8:20 For the creature[Gk: Creation] was made subject to vanity, not willingly, but by reason of him who hath subjected the same in hope,
Jeremiah 13:23 Can the Ethiopian change his skin, or the leopard his spots? then may ye also do good, that are accustomed to do evil.
Romans 8:7 Because the carnal mind is enmity [Deep seated hatred] against God: for it is not subject to the law of God, neither indeed can be.
You don't have to lie constantly to be a liar. You don't have to fornicate constantly to be a fornicator. You don't have to murder constantly to be a murderer. You don't have to sin constantly to be a sinner.
The apostles were being tried and refined by fire. They were being transformed into the image of Christ. The "liar part" was being burned out of them hence why the lake of fire will not have any power over them. The same for all who overcome this world because the lake of fire is for ALL LIARS and then some.
Revelation 21:8 But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Revelation 2:11 He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death.
The apostles spoke by inspiration of God's spirit. To ask if what they wrote should be approached with the same scrutiny to that of carnal man is to reproach God as well. Its the same spirit that inspired Isaiah.
2 Peter 1:21 For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spake as they were moved by the Holy Ghost.
2 Timothy 3:16 All scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness:
The apostles and God's chosen have the spirit of God indwelling and not that of the worlds. If you have received this spirit you would receive the words of the apostle too as Christ said. So how can you even ask me such a thing?
In Christ,
Alex
P.S. Telling the truth does not change the fact that you are a liar (when you've lied). You have to overcome in Christ to finally do away with that part of the old man and all parts of the old man for that matter.
-
Hi Alex,
Yes Alex, that’s what I was asking you. Do you believe that people never tell the truth ? We live in a system that is corrupt but truth can always be verified so that we are not left in the dark so to speak.
I’m not saying that a person of higher rank than me cannot lie however what I am saying is when we have many people such as astronauts and aircraft pilots stating what they saw and we have access to the transcripts so we can read exactly what was said then we can reasonably assume they are telling the truth.
In the beginning we take mans word that the bible is the inspired word of God at least I did, meaning, God never spoke to me in an audible voice telling me the bible is His inspired word.
Once there was a time in my life Alex, I believed the ruling class wrote the bible to keep us peasants in line through fear of hell in order for them to not be over run by we peasants.
Today I know better than that, now the life of the apostles played a huge role in my belief in Christ due to the fact that if Christ was nothing more than a hoax, after His death the apostles would have saved their own skin and disperse but they did not, in fact every apostles was crucified except John who gave us through Christ the book of Revelation. What a incredible testimony the apostles gave the whole world.
God has brought me a long way from where I once was, I really do trust Christ for not only my spiritual life here and now but also my physical life too.
So Alex, I came across this scripture Luk 21:11 There will be terrible earthquakes, famines, and plagues everywhere; there will be strange and terrifying things coming from the sky.
I understand what earthquakes are and famine also plagues too, but strange and terrifying things coming from the sky, what is Jesus talking about ? Ray doesn’t believe in aliens and neither do I.
So what is Jesus referring to ? Is it a sin to ask such a thing ? According to this statement Jesus said something is coming out of the sky that is going to be terrifying , I want to know what it is that’s coming from the sky that is not only strange but terrifying . Jesus said that for a reason and I have no intention of hiding my head in the sand when it comes to anything God says.
You know Alex, if Ray never questioned what Christendom taught him or what this scripture or that scripture means most of us would still be in the dark, we should all be thankful Ray questioned everything.
-
Hi Alex,
Yes Alex, that’s what I was asking you. Do you believe that people never tell the truth ? We live in a system that is corrupt but truth can always be verified so that we are not left in the dark so to speak.
I’m not saying that a person of higher rank than me cannot lie however what I am saying is when we have many people such as astronauts and aircraft pilots stating what they saw and we have access to the transcripts so we can read exactly what was said then we can reasonably assume they are telling the truth.
In the beginning we take mans word that the bible is the inspired word of God at least I did, meaning, God never spoke to me in an audible voice telling me the bible is His inspired word.
Once there was a time in my life Alex, I believed the ruling class wrote the bible to keep us peasants in line through fear of hell in order for them to not be over run by we peasants.
Today I know better than that, now the life of the apostles played a huge role in my belief in Christ due to the fact that if Christ was nothing more than a hoax, after His death the apostles would have saved their own skin and disperse but they did not, in fact every apostles was crucified except John who gave us through Christ the book of Revelation. What a incredible testimony the apostles gave the whole world.
God has brought me a long way from where I once was, I really do trust Christ for not only my spiritual life here and now but also my physical life too.
So Alex, I came across this scripture Luk 21:11 There will be terrible earthquakes, famines, and plagues everywhere; there will be strange and terrifying things coming from the sky.
I understand what earthquakes are and famine also plagues too, but strange and terrifying things coming from the sky, what is Jesus talking about ? Ray doesn’t believe in aliens and neither do I.
So what is Jesus referring to ? Is it a sin to ask such a thing ? According to this statement Jesus said something is coming out of the sky that is going to be terrifying , I want to know what it is that’s coming from the sky that is not only strange but terrifying . Jesus said that for a reason and I have no intention of hiding my head in the sand when it comes to anything God says.
You know Alex, if Ray never questioned what Christendom taught him or what this scripture or that scripture means most of us would still be in the dark, we should all be thankful Ray questioned everything.
Hi Rick,
Ray did not question the integrity (honesty) of the Apostles and their inspired words. There's a big difference.I sence a bit of dishonesty coming from you in trying to make it seem like questioning the church/christendom/babylon (which ray did do) and questioning the apostles (which he did not do) is the same thing. Ray spoke strongly against those who would dare make the argument that James and Paul contradicted or that we should throw out Paul's writings as uninspired by God. So I do not believe the apostles inspired words of God are to be approached with the same skepticism. Ray certainly did not wonder if the apostles were telling the truth or not. As I said, to look at their words in that manner would be to look upon God in that manner for they are His inspired words.
Regarding Luke 21:11, Its not sin to ask questions and you know that. I simply urged caution in putting so much confidence in the tales and stories of carnal men when it comes to matters of God. We are all trying to better understand these words of Christ. Just remember that His Words are spirit and that every word must be established in the mouth of two or three witnesses. Comparing spiritual with spiritual for the SUM of thy word is truth. Perhaps there is a physical and literal reality to what Christ said because we are told that the first is natural then the spiritual but I currently don't know entirely. Obviously the spiritual implications are far more important because they would ALWAYS apply so then maybe its best to try and understand spiritually what is going on before Christ returns.
We do have a really good discussion going on in the other thread you started about this stuff so perhaps try putting the verses together there and we can see what comes of it. In God's time it will be revealed to us completely but we have to obey God and humble ourselves before Him most importantly. As a dear sister in Christ once said to me "Obeying and studying is not a casual endeavor, we must put God first, and THEN He will bless our seeking more knowledge..." and as JFK is known for saying on the forums, to the man who trembles at God's Word.
God bless,
Alex
-
Could be this has nothing to do with anything, but I watched a documentary a few days ago about the bombing of Darwin, Australia during WWII. One Aussie veteran was recounting the dive-bombers screaming out of the sky and it was clear just 'remembering' this caused him to re-live the fear. That was a 'fearful thing' coming 'out of the sky'...and, if you think about it, in more ways than one.
One thing I could note to you in bible-study, Rick. You seem to gravitate towards 'paraphrases' and not translations. There's not always anything wrong with that. Sometimes the paraphrases are quite good and accurate. At other times, they can be misleading because they approach certain scriptural passages with a theological assumption that just really isn't in the words inspired.
Here's some other translations of that same verse:
(BBE) There will be great earth-shocks and outbursts of disease in a number of places, and men will be without food; and there will be wonders and great signs from heaven.
(CEV) There will be great earthquakes, and in many places people will starve to death and suffer terrible diseases. All sorts of frightening things will be seen in the sky.
(Darby) there shall be both great earthquakes in different places, and famines and pestilences; and there shall be fearful sights and great signs from heaven.
(DRB) And there shall be great earthquakes in divers places and pestilences and famines and terrors from heaven: and there shall be great signs.
(JUB) and there shall be great earthquakes in different places and famines and pestilences, and there shall be fearful sights and great signs from heaven.
(KJV) And great earthquakes shall be in divers places, and famines, and pestilences; and fearful sights and great signs shall there be from heaven.
(LEB) There will be great earthquakes and famines and plagues in various places. There will be terrible sights and great signs from heaven.
(LITV) Also there will be great earthquakes from place to place, and famines, and plagues. And also there will be terrors and great signs from Heaven.
(Murdock) and great earthquakes will occur in several places, and famines, and pestilences; and there will be terrors, and trepidations, and great signs from heaven will be seen, and there will be great tempests.
(WNT) And there will be great earthquakes, and in places famines and pestilence; and there will be terrible sights and wonderful tokens from Heaven.
(YLT) great shakings also in every place, and famines, and pestilences, there shall be; fearful things also, and great signs from heaven there shall be;
It takes study and 'comparing' spiritual with spiritual to get through such a diversity of possible 'translations' of the inspired words. We have to do that with some humility when we really don't know for absolutely sure what is actually being said, much less what it means.
-
Hi Alex,
I’m not sure what to say to you Alex, accusing me of being dishonest, that hurts, I think your zeal for the apostles lead you to read something I never wrote.
If I said Ray questioned the integrity of the apostles, please point it out to me as I do not recall making that statement.
I never said anything about James or Paul contradicting one another or even the bible having any contradictions either.
I do understand that you urged caution in putting so much confidence in the tales and stories of carnal men as you say and I thank you for that but are we so spiritual that we are no longer carnal men ourselves Alex ?
I apologize for the confusion Alex, You know Alex, I would of said the same thing to God that Moses said ,send another to Pharaoh for I’m not a good speaker. Lol
God bless you my brother in Christ. :)
-
Hi Dave,
I would agree if someone saw a dive bomber coming out of the sky it would be a fearful thing especially if one is on the ground under the dive bomber.
I use e sword and had downloaded all the free bibles and even purchased some to. The translation I used of Luk 21:11 best suited the point I had in mind.
I understand that paraphrase can be a good thing but can also be misleading as well. So I don’t rely on paraphrase but in this case of of Luk 21 :11 it seems to be on the money.
I have read many of the translations you had put down as to grasp exactly what its meaning is, my understanding of the term heaven is one in the same as sky.
But as I read these verses and many others whether it says ,
there shall be fearful sights and great signs from heaven
terrors from heaven: and there shall be great signs
fearful things also, and great signs from heaven there shall be;
there will be terrors, and trepidations, and great signs from heaven will be seen
there will be strange and terrifying things coming from the sky.
No matter how I look at these verses it leads me to believe something is coming out of the sky at some point in time that is going to be outright frightening.
-
I think this generation will be long gone before anything supernatural happens, we wont be alive. What kinds of questions will they be asking on BT 75 years from now.
-
I think this generation will be long gone before anything supernatural happens, we wont be alive. What kinds of questions will they be asking on BT 75 years from now.
I will be asking has anyone seen my teeth :P
Rhys
-
I think this generation will be long gone before anything supernatural happens, we wont be alive. What kinds of questions will they be asking on BT 75 years from now.
I will be asking has anyone seen my teeth :P
Rhys
You and me both Rhys! Actually, we might be pushing up daisies by then! O_O
-
I think this generation will be long gone before anything supernatural happens, we wont be alive. What kinds of questions will they be asking on BT 75 years from now.
I have to disagree with you Ricky, I think the all of creation is super natural and all the work God continues to do is also supernatural, anyhow we are closer then when we first believed!! 😀
-
I think this generation will be long gone before anything supernatural happens, we wont be alive. What kinds of questions will they be asking on BT 75 years from now.
Hi Ricky,
I do not know when this age will end but it seems to me the signs of the time are with us. I have research so much information concerning UFO and have concluded what ever comes out of the sky will be of demonic nature, yes probably flying disk but not from another galaxy but another dimension.
I have discontinued my research in this area, one is much wiser and better off studying the word of God than getting hung up on what is coming out of the sky.
One thing is for certain, if one has Christ in their life they need not worry about anything that comes out of the sky.
Also Rhys maybe on to something here, he knows more than he’s telling. Lol :)
-
I think this generation will be long gone before anything supernatural happens, we wont be alive. What kinds of questions will they be asking on BT 75 years from now.
I have to disagree with you Ricky, I think the all of creation is super natural and all the work God continues to do is also supernatural, anyhow we are closer then when we first believed!! 😀
I just want to say how close we really are! I am Fifty years old and if I live another 25 yrs and then die, well the next instant I will be resurrected. So that's 25yrs and then the next instant... Wow that's how close it is for me.
Ecclesiastes 9:5 (KJV)
[5] For the living know that they shall die: but the dead know not any thing, neither have they any more a reward; for the memory of them is forgotten.
We all know Lrays teaching on this! So to me Jesus's return is very near...
PS hope God will make that a little more than 25 but His will be done and not mine.😎
-
It is so, Jesus can return at any time for anyone, The world is waiting for some kind of supernatural event to SEE from God. maybe this event is UFO`S. Illusions from the spirit world. Aliens and other people from other worlds do not exist. So who is flying the UFOs`s, whose left, US and the spirit world. There is no other answer for them. Even with today`s technology we still have no clue as to what we see in the skies. UFOs`s would need to be from the earth, or from another dimension in time, there is no other way of getting to earth. Or maybe principalities of the AIR have something to do with all this unanswerable stuff. Ricky
-
Hi Ricky,
Whatever is coming can be found in Rom 8:38 and Rom 8 :39
Rom 8:38 For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor things present, nor things to come, nor powers,
Rom 8:39 nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Also checkout Rom 13 :12 and 14.
Rom 13:12 The night is far spent, and the day is at hand: let us therefore cast off the works of darkness, and let us put on the armor of light.
Rom 13:14 But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof.
-
Rhys good point, Here`s a verse for u, If u live past 120 years old, u will never see your teeth again.
Ricky
-
What do you think Rick...
http://news.yahoo.com/signs-alien-life-found-2025-nasas-chief-scientist-212655192.html
-
The research promoted in this video shows how naive the "travel to habitable planet" scientist truly are. Assuming that they can determine conditions on a distant star by the examination of a speck of light that left that region of space so far in the past and has been filtered through dark matter all the length of the journey.
At best it would be for an elite small group and even then there would be no way of determining conditions extant upon their arrival. At normal velocities achievable it would take one or more lifetimes to accomplish. Their bodies would be wasting and useless when they arrived; if they ever did arrive.
It truly is a fairy tale in the making. Especially so when we have so many achievable and helpful needs right here on the earth. We can't even provide agricultural water for the California vegetable gardens with the Pacific ocean right there.
Indiana bob
-
The research promoted in this video shows how naive the "travel to habitable planet" scientist truly are. Assuming that they can determine conditions on a distant star by the examination of a speck of light that left that region of space so far in the past and has been filtered through dark matter all the length of the journey.
At best it would be for an elite small group and even then there would be no way of determining conditions extant upon their arrival. At normal velocities achievable it would take one or more lifetimes to accomplish. There bodies would be wasting and useless when they arrived; if they ever did arrive.
It truly is a fairy tale in the making. Especially so when we have so many achievable and helpful needs right here on the earth. We can't even provide agricultural water for the California vegetable gardens with the Pacific ocean right there.
Indiana bob
"It truly is a fairy tale in the making. Especially so when we have so many achievable and helpful needs right here on the earth. We can't even provide agricultural water for the California vegetable gardens with the Pacific ocean right there.
Indiana bob" I was just telling my daughter that very thing the other day.
-
Not at all.
The so-called UFOs that are seen here and there are actually products of the government and military. They are top secret machines made at top secret bases, like Area 51. Not alien, government made.
The whole UFO hysteria was actually a CIA propaganda program that has been declassified and can be looked up online (I read part of it myself a while back). Essentially the CIA started the whole alien-UFO scare propaganda to cover up real top secret aircraft being invented and tested by the government. All UFOs you see are 100% man made. Since the average person doesn't believe in aliens, they automatically dismiss anyone claiming to see alien UFOs, and call them conspiracy theorists (another term coined by the CIA to use against govt whistleblowers).
Again, this is declassified documented facts that can be looked up. I just didn't take the time to do that for this post. :)
Daywalker
-
Hello Micah,
Seems that humble minds think alike. Your daughter is blessed.
Indiana bob
-
Friend Daywalker,
your quote: "All UFOs you see are 100% man made. Since the average person doesn't believe in aliens, they automatically dismiss anyone claiming to see alien UFOs, and call them conspiracy theorists (another term coined by the CIA to use against govt whistleblowers)."
Daywalker, I appreciate your comments about our government.
However I must question your belief that ALL UFOs are man made.
What about the lights over Washington D.C. shortly after WW2 that appeared to travel at Mach 3 and abruptly reverse direction of travel or stop and travel straight up at the same velocity?
Doesn't that example break the then known laws of physics and require a super natural explanation? Please help us understand...
Thanks, Indiana bob
-
My faith is not challenged. I don't believe that beings from another part of the universe are visiting earth, but I did actually see a ufo. It was in the mid 1970's, my grandmother who was with me also saw it, and others also called to report seeing the object. We were very close to it. It was an object about the size of an average house, flying level with the ground about tree top high, made absolutely no noise except the sound of the wind as it passed us, traveling at incredibly high speed and appeared as just a ball of light. I have no idea what it was and I have never seen anything like it again.....
-
What do you think Rick...
http://news.yahoo.com/signs-alien-life-found-2025-nasas-chief-scientist-212655192.html
Hi Laregli,
Listen to what Buzz Aldrin has to say what he saw on Apollo 11 moon flight, tell me what you think.
I listen to the people that were there, people of impeccable character, you know NASA does not send fruit cakes to the moon. Lol
You can tell after 45 years he’s still afraid to talk about it.
http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=buzz+aldrin+moon&FORM=VIRE5#view=detail&mid=F7878F0EE8F69B288A86F7878F0EE8F69B288A86
http://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=buzz+aldrin+moon&FORM=VIRE5#view=detail&mid=BB191EDAA9251E021D39BB191EDAA9251E021D39
-
Friend Rick,
I didn't sense that Buzz was afraid to comment, but rather declined to comment for the record on an issue that could only be speculation as far as we citizens know. That approach would be a function of wisdom rather than fear of consequences. :)
The moderators on this forum try to exercise the same level of wisdom with each of us when our speculation becomes too stimulating and subject to being grossly misunderstood by the unknown thousands who read the forum.
Just my view, indianabob
-
Rick
Interesting you would use the word 'impeccable' to describe someone's character.. Do you know what that word means?
Anyway I PM'd you so we could continue a discussion without offending any other members.
Whyte Baer I PM'd you also if you're still there.
-
Friend Rick,
I didn't sense that Buzz was afraid to comment, but rather declined to comment for the record on an issue that could only be speculation as far as we citizens know.
Hi Bob,
If you have the time to go through this video below you will see Buzz is afraid to come out and tell what he saw on the moon back in 1969.
The evidence is overwhelming , our government has been and still is covering up what they known for a long time.
I’m sure you as a former police offer who would be highly trained in gathering information to prosecute a guilty culprit could use that same training towards much information that is available on the internet to find the truth behind the UFO’s phenomenon.
My belief is that these entity that are manning these crafts are the angels the left their first estate
otherwise know as demons which are up to no good .
Since I discovered this and believe it this subject has become less interesting to me because of who and what they are, my fascination originally stems from life from other planets but as far as I’m concerned there is only life on planet earth and the demons that visit us.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2BHJfCTomXI
-
And that will be enough for now.