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=> General Discussions => Topic started by: Robin on February 13, 2007, 03:57:46 PM
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Here's my background. I have Post Traumatic Stress Disorder and because of prolonged stress my nervous system is very sensitive. I can't handle noise and isolation is the only comfort I find in complete silence. The doctor told me I don't have lupus, but my neck is bad and I have chronic pain.
So I feel like one big lump of carnal mind because of this. My brain doesn't work right and I can't change that. It never turns off and I'm exhausted from thinking too much. So this leaves me very grumpy and grouchy most of the time. I don't have peace. I've never experienced happiness, which I don't put much importance on, but it feels all so carnal. God healed all my emotional pain in a miraculous way, but I'm still left with my bad brain and nervous system. I don't believe in positive self talk or hypnotism or neurofeedback or behavior modification and things like that. I can't take medication to ease any of this because I have a rare side effect of extreme muscle pain with all of it. I've tried many.
I think if my mind wasn't so carnal I could overcome all of this, but I'm at a loss. The more God puts me through fiery trials the worse my brain and nervous system seem to get. I know it's all in God's hands, but I hate being like this and there is nothing I can do about it. It is not pleasant to be around me. I am fortunate to have a loving family who understands me.
Will I always be a lump of carnal because of this?
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Certainly not!
Being confident of this very thing, that he which hath begun a good work in you will perform it until the day of Jesus Christ: (Php 1:6 KJV)
Like Peter said, all believers pass through the following:
The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the great and the terrible day of the LORD. (Joe 2:31 KJV)
But Peter, standing up with the eleven, lifted up his voice, and said unto them, Ye men of Judaea, and all ye that dwell at Jerusalem, be this known unto you, and hearken to my words: For these are not drunken, as ye suppose, seeing it is but the third hour of the day.
But this is that which was spoken by the prophet Joel; And it shall come to pass in the last days, saith God, I will pour out of my Spirit upon all flesh: and your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams:
And on my servants and on my handmaidens I will pour out in those days of my Spirit; and they shall prophesy: And I will shew wonders in heaven above, and signs in the earth beneath; blood, and fire, and vapour of smoke: The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before that great and notable day of the Lord come:
So we must pass through these fiery trials, but every day we are closer to salvation:
And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed. (Rom 13:11 KJV)
Hope this helps you,
Eirik
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Hey Robin,
I'm sorry to hear about your pain and stress. I had no idea how bad it was for you. Thanks for sharing with us so we can pray for you! It helps us to know each other better to know what trials we are going though. It is sad that you say you have never experienced happiness. I don't know that I understand that. Surely at one time you were happy. I can't imagine living with pain though. I'm sure it would rob you of much happiness. My husband lives with chronic arthritis pain. Sometimes the pain brings him to tears.
I know I have called you super woman because of how much you have going on in your life- maybe it is all too much stimulus and it may be what makes it more difficult to rest.
Those were great scriptures Eirik! Thanks! I love the scripture you quoted :
"now is our salvation nearer than when we first believed." Praise God!
Of course Eirik is right you will not always be a lump of carnal because He who began a good work in you will be faithful to complete it! I wish I had something to add but that says it all. We are all waiting on Christ to overcome our carnal self- none of us have arrived yet!
You are in my prayers! I will also pray that you will be happy :) as well as healed and painfree!
Bless you!
~Paula
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Here's my background. I have Post Traumatic Stress Disorder and because of prolonged stress my nervous system is very sensitive. I can't handle noise and isolation is the only comfort I find in complete silence. The doctor told me I don't have lupus, but my neck is bad and I have chronic pain.
M.G.
I am sorry to hear this, I don't have the extreme pain issues to deal with but often I do find myself seeking solitude and back away from most social events, even only if it involves family and/or friends. This is a rather recent feeling as I used to be the fascillitator and organizer for get togethers, parties, picnics, etc. I usually feel devoid of connecting with those around me, alone in a crowd so to speak, this is something I disguise pretty well but my lack of actively persuing or in attending many events has some wondering what is going on, myself included.
So I feel like one big lump of carnal mind because of this. My brain doesn't work right and I can't change that. It never turns off and I'm exhausted from thinking too much. So this leaves me very grumpy and grouchy most of the time. I don't have peace. I've never experienced happiness, which I don't put much importance on, but it feels all so carnal. God healed all my emotional pain in a miraculous way, but I'm still left with my bad brain and nervous system. I don't believe in positive self talk or hypnotism or neurofeedback or behavior modification and things like that. I can't take medication to ease any of this because I have a rare side effect of extreme muscle pain with all of it. I've tried many.
That is certainly a dreadful feeling, body exhausted but the brain racing all over the place.
I believe He is drawing you closer to Him, putting you in a place where only you and Him can occupy. Is this the "strange thing" Peter spoke of?
(1Peter 4:12)
I think if my mind wasn't so carnal I could overcome all of this, but I'm at a loss. The more God puts me through fiery trials the worse my brain and nervous system seem to get. I know it's all in God's hands, but I hate being like this and there is nothing I can do about it. It is not pleasant to be around me. I am fortunate to have a loving family who understands me.
Actually I have always found you to be edifying, pleasant, uplifting and a very valued Sister, I always look forward to your posts and miss you when you are away for a while. M.G. have faith He will calm the storm and the boat will be still and you will have some tranquility, He must be preparing you for something really special.
Will I always be a lump of carnal because of this?
No! You are being transformed into His Daughter, what a glorious promise!
His Peace and Comfort to you Sister,
Joe
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M.G.,
Might I point you to Paul. Think of all that he has done and all that he has written. Think upon on all the lives that he changed for the good. Now he had a thorn in his flesh and begged God 3 times to remove it. God did not, becuase he told Paul, my grace is sufficient for you. When you feel down, look to Paul. I am sorry that I could not find this Scripture, Kat, once again I enlist your help.
He was certainly no carnal lump and neither will you. I have migraines and a terrible back ache that pervades much of my everyday life. I am glad I have these, even though my pain threshold is very high becuase of the pain that is present, becuase it keeps me humble and focused on God. I would not trade this for all the world.
God bless you and I will pray for you.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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M.G.,
Might I point you to Paul. Think of all that he has done and all that he has written. Think upon on all the lives that he changed for the good. Now he had a thorn in his flesh and begged God 3 times to remove it. God did not, becuase he told Paul, my grace is sufficient for you. When you feel down, look to Paul. I am sorry that I could not find this Scripture, Kat, once again I enlist your help.
He was certainly no carnal lump and neither will you. I have migraines and a terrible back ache that pervades much of my everyday life. I am glad I have these, even though my pain threshold is very high becuase of the pain that is present, becuase it keeps me humble and focused on God. I would not trade this for all the world.
God bless you and I will pray for you.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
2Co 12:7 And lest I should be exalted above measure through the abundance of the revelations, there was given to me a thorn in the flesh, the messenger of Satan to buffet me, lest I should be exalted above measure.
2Co 12:8 For this thing I besought the Lord thrice, that it might depart from me.
2Co 12:9 And he said unto me, My grace is sufficient for thee: for my strength is made perfect in weakness. Most gladly therefore will I rather glory in my infirmities, that the power of Christ may rest upon me.
2Co 12:10 Therefore I take pleasure in infirmities, in reproaches, in necessities, in persecutions, in distresses for Christ's sake: for when I am weak, then am I strong.
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Thanks Joe,
<hugs> and not the Judas kind either. LOL ;D
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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Hello Robin. This is Susan. I will be praying for God to bless you with the peace and joy that His daughters so rightly deserve. Just don't let satan steal these gifts from you. I too know what it is like to live with constant pain; (I slept on the couch again last night due to the lower back problems...I sat too long yesterday on the BIBLE TRUTHS FORUM, and paid for it last night. ;) I have Gulf War Syndrome (exhaustion from having too much DU(depleted Uranium) and too many other toxins in my system), no PTSD, but, I don't have to be in a war to experience that kind of stress, b/c last year was the worst year for stress in my walk with God!!!, amongst many other physical problems, but, GOD is my strength and, this too shall pass! :D
PLEASE DO YOURSELF A FAVOR AND GET SOME (NATURALPATHIC) "B-COMPLEX" (SUBLINGUAL; UNDER THE TONGUE) TABLETS... these are all of the B vitamins that your body needs for a healthy nervous system and it DOES MIRICLES...AND PLEASE LET ME KNOW HOW YOU FEEL AFTER YOU START TAKING THEM. THEY ARE TRULY A GODSEND!!! ANNE, WHEN ARE WE GOING TO THE STORE TO GET YOUR B COMPLEX, FEVERFEW AND SOMETHING ELSE ???
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Susan,
When the bank account magically fills itself again. I do not like the balence to fall below 25.00 dollars. I will give you a call soon.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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cash, what is cash??? ??? (We have to get electrocuted in order to get cash ;)
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Susan,
You know the green stuff that supposedly grows off of treese, but everyone is watching those trees and they are bare LOL?
Now that was horrible and sick, but funny. I guess I have a weird dry sense of humor today.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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Hi M.G.,
When I read a post like yours, it makes my little problems seem so small.
I will say that your testimony is to help us understand others better.
We do not know what others may be enduring and we should try to always be considerate and kind to other, showing agapao love.
Because we may not like it when someone is grumpy or grouchy, but we should realize we don't know their situation, they make indeed be under tremendous mental or emotional stress.
I will pray for you and your family.
Psa 33:22 Let Your mercy, O Jehovah, be on us, according as we hope in You.
mercy, peace, and love
Kat
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Beautiful post Kat, that is so true.
His Peace to you,
Joe
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Hi mg believe me you are not alone, I hope this may help you.
In 2000 I was diagnosed with Lupus and Scleroderma.
I had lost over 50% of my hearing in one ear and over 30% in the other.
I don't grasp things much because I can't hear.
In 2001 my pelvis fractured for no reason.
I walked around months hobbling around until the doctor finally found the fracture with a MRI.
I am not that old so this shouldn't be happening.
Then in 2005 I was diagnosed with cancer, the doctor told me he had bad news and good news, the good news they believed it hadn't spread. I had surgery, as best I know I am clear now for 16 months.
Thank God I didn't have to have chemo but it has been a rough road.
My husband is totally indifferent to all my problems this left me leaning on God.
This has been a rough journey but if I had not had all these health problems I may not have searched so hard for the good in all these things.
I really believe sickness is a way to stop one in their tracks and make one regroup.
I know it did me.
Maybe if you just realize even though this is bad good can come from it.
I will be praying things get better and only good comes from this.
I pray you find happiness and joy.
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MG I am sorry I didn't capitalize your screen name in my post.
I sent before I realized.
I am new here couldn't find the edit button.
God Bless... Jackie
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I recommend sub-lingual JD Red Label.
Longhorn
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Robin, Susan, Jackie Lee and Anne,
My dear sisters, my heart goes out to all of you. I feel for all of you and pray the our Lord will give each of you a way that you may be able to bear. This seems to go beyond words, all of us must take you all to the Lord and lift you up before Him.
"3 Blessed be God, even the Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies, and the God of all comfort;
4 Who comforteth us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort them which are in any trouble, by the comfort wherewith we ourselves are comforted of God.
5 For as the sufferings of Christ abound in us, so our consolation also aboundeth by Christ.
6 And whether we be afflicted, it is for your consolation and salvation, which is effectual in the enduring of the same sufferings which we also suffer: or whether we be comforted, it is for your consolation and salvation.
7 And our hope of you is stedfast, knowing, that as ye are partakers of the sufferings, so shall ye be also of the consolation." ll Cor. 1: 3-7.
My prayers are with you all.
Dwight
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Here are a couple of emails I got from Ray that were helpful and might be helpful to some others who are struggling.
Dear Robin:
We are all hard nuts to crack, as you state. There are so many areas of our lives that can cause us heartache, and depression. Few indeed have financial independence, freedom from aches and pains, marital problems, children problems, mental and spiritual problems, plus the evil of the world that we witness daily. Even the Apostle Paul had to proclaim that he had "to LEARN" to be content. But here is the full context (in the Concordant Version) of his statement:
Phi 4:5 Let your lenience be known to all men: the Lord is near.
Phi 4:6 Do not worry about anything, but in everything, by prayer and petition, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God,
Phi 4:7 and the peace of God, that is superior to every frame of mind, shall be garrisoning your hearts and your apprehensions in Christ Jesus."
Phi 4:8 For the rest, brethren, whatever is true, whatever is grave, whatever is just, whatever is pure, whatever is agreeable, whatever is renowned - if there is any virtue, and if any applause, be taking these into account."
Phi 4:9 What you learned also, and accepted and hear and perceived in me, these be putting into practice, and the God of peace will be with you."
Phi 4:10 Now I rejoiced in the Lord greatly that at length, for once your disposition toward me blossomed, to which you were disposed also, yet you lacked occasion."
Phi 4:11 Not that I am hinting at a want, FOR I LEARNED to be content in that in which I am."
Phi 4:12 I am aware what it is to be humbled as well as aware what it is to be superabounding. In everything and among all am I initiated, to be satisified as well as to be hungering, to be superabounding as well as to be in want."
Phi 4:13 For all am I strong in Him Who is invigorating me - Christ!
Phi 4:14 Moreover, you do ideally in your joint contribution in my affliction."
Phi 4:15 Now you Philippians also are aware that, in the beginning of the evangel, when I came out from Macedonia, not one ecclesia participates with me in the matter of giving and getting, except you only,
Phi 4:16 for in Thessalonica also, you send, once and twice, to my need."
Phi 4:17 Not that I am seeking for a gift, but I am seeking for fruit that is increasing for your account."
Phi 4:18 Now I am collecting all, and am superabounding. I have been filled full, receiving from Epaphroditus the things from you, an odor fragrant, a sacrifice acceptable, well pleasing to God."
Phi 4:19 Now my God shall be filling your every need in accord with His riches in glory in Christ Jesus.
Phi 4:20 Now to our God and Father be glory for the eons of the eons! Amen!
Our prayers are with you, Robin, and with all those who are struggling through life. There is a great reason for it all. It is a painful thing to be birthed into the family of God.
God be with you,
Ray
Dear Robin:
I think that you are confusing "gift" with "fruit." God gives us the "gift" of faith to start the ball rolling , so to speak, but he does not at the same time gift us with "love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithFULNESS, gentleness and self-control" so that we can then live a righteous and good life. We must all PRODUCE, YIELD, BRING FORTH, and BEAR much fruit. All of these terms are used in Scripture and all of them are a process of growth, they are not supernatural gifts.
God be with you,
Ray
Both of these emails were very helpful with my understanding. I had it all wrong. I thought we would have a Pentecostal type of filling of the Holy Spirit that would give us fruit as a gift. Ray explained that it is faith that is the gift and the fruit is a process of growth. God promised me at one point that he would write the laws on my heart, which to me meant that Christ would be written on my heart. It really took my breath away when I learned that. I think now though that it won't truly be completed until we are resurrected. I was a little disappointed when learning that after I got here, but that does not take away from that amazing promise. I just jumped the gun with my interpretation of it. I could just imagine being totally filled with Christ to overflowing. I just could hardly wait. Then as time went on and it didn't happen I thought maybe my Pastor was right and my beliefs were only leading me to despair. I was fortunate to find Ray and all you when I did. I was starting to doubt that I knew the truth. You all confirmed that I did and there was a lot more truth to add to it here.
When I saw that Peace and Joy were fruit it prompted me to email Ray. Through the email I realized that I was being carnal in my desire to have Peace and Joy. I was wanting to escape from the fiery trials. The fruit that we bear we bear unto God. It is for his pleasure, not mine.
Romans 7:4
Wherefore, my brethren, ye also are become dead to the law by the body of Christ; that ye should be married to another, even to him who is raised from the dead, that we should bring forth fruit unto God
The lessons get harder and harder.
Luke 12:48
But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.
I can see the truth in the absolute that Ray speaks of that I'm thankful that Arcturus kept pointing out. I can shout it out for everyone, but when it comes to myself in the relative it's like Peter trying to walk on water. I doubt and I sink sometimes. The obstacles in my life seem as impossible as trying walk on water. And Jesus said "Why do you doubt?"
Matthew 14
28And Peter answered him and said, Lord, if it be thou, bid me come unto thee on the water.
29And he said, Come. And when Peter was come down out of the ship, he walked on the water, to go to Jesus.
30But when he saw the wind boisterous, he was afraid; and beginning to sink, he cried, saying, Lord, save me.
31And immediately Jesus stretched forth his hand, and caught him, and said unto him, O thou of little faith, wherefore didst thou doubt?
I thank you all for giving me a boost in my faith. I feel like I have multiple personalities at times the way I can go back and forth between faith and doubt. Walk on water one minute and sink the next. Another parable. Paul made it to the end and I find courage from his testimony. The things he went through by the grace of God can give us all hope.
Many prayers for you all!
I think I've rambled on and on again. :)
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MG & Jackie. Thank you for sharing from your hearts w/ us. I stand in awe at your strong testimony of the power of God in your lives. Think of the joys that await you!
For years I had the migraines, and then muscle/joint pain which I thought was Fibromyalgia. I did some holistic treatments but I was in pain all the time and then depression, menopause, and TMJ adn Mortons Neuroma. What it boiled down to was I resorted to prescription drugs. Well, I broke out in a horrible rash and gained weight like crazy!!!! After about 5 years I quit the sleeping pills, now have a low dosage anti-depressant/pain reliever, and thyroid pill and cholesterol. My pain in my joints have settled into my hands and knees (old arthur itis).
Some might remember I was in hospital for 5 days last October w/ anemia.
You know, I prayed all that time but never thought I was REALLY sick. I hardly let anyone know(except at home). I know I need to lose weight and exercise but I am half hearted at best.
I am not comparing myself to you two, because your trials are much more serious. I just want you to know that you are not alone and we love you and care about you. MG has been around for a long time (Robin!) but Jackie you are part of this family now too.
Let us pray one for another and build each other up. This has been a blessed thread.
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I want to say (before I forget) that I believe that Pauls' infirmities were (as he stated in 2Cor.12:7)....simply that due to all of his worldly wisdom and knowledge then he was in danger daily of exaulting himself instead of the Lord. (Pau knew as many as 7 languages), he had worldly and religious power and prestige, spiritual revelations and spiritual knowledge...in other words, he was so smart both physically and spiritually that he could very easily bragg on himself and the spiritual power/revelations that God had imparted to him alone; thus, he had to work hard to keep that boasting in check! How many men are used of God as Paul was used to carry the good news to so many Jews and Gentiles?
Thank you Dwight for your blessings and prayers. I did not write all of my ailments in the last post b/c I don't want to sound like I'm a hypochondriac or like I am trying to get attention or sympathy; but since we are sharing, I might as well be open and honest while we are all on the subject so that everyone here might have a better understanding of what goes on physically with me on a daily basis, that way, if you notice an inconsistancy or something else, it is probably attributed to one of the following health problems.
Gena, I can feel for you and all of the ailments that you suffer with everyday, and I can relate \with you b/c I too suffer with anemia, how is yours right now? ...I have PICA (where I crave ice...I eat 4+ bags of soft Sonic ice per week; ha, I keep them in business ;)) and have had to have a unit of bovine (cow) iron in the past...then once I was filled with this iron, I didn't eat ice for a year. :) I am also on prenatal vitamins with iron (ha... prenatal for an ole' menopausal lady ;).) (This anemia still zaps my energy even while being on all of these things)...
Then there is the thyroid disease...If I do not take this synthetic thyroid meds each day, then my heart will eventually slow down so much that it would STOP ...lol.)
So, between the Gulf War Syndrom/DU poisoning, anemia, pica, thyroid problems/ and peri menopusal hormones getting low, I tend to get exhausted quite often...But, what is truly amazing is that God is so good to give me strength everyday b/c i could easily be bedridden everyday for sure! I look healthy enough and get around alright (and I am a bit overweight b/c I have NO metabolism due to the last lobe of my thyroid getting nuked in the war)...the left lobe was surgically removed before the war....which when they took my thyroid, they cut off my 'para thyroid' glands to where now I have been zapped of my calcium in my blood too), so...all of the above as well as major back problems/aches and spasms ...degenerative disc disease and scoliosis...(they want to do back surgury, but I refuse to let them)/ peri menopausal which causes hormonal imbalances...(all of this and I am only 45 yo).... these are my thorns in the flesh and I try to thank God for them, but, I throw a pitty party at times too :'( :'( ...talk about energy zappers! So, now if I don't say anything and you notice a poor attitude, it could be these trials; just PM me and tell me about it! I do take plenty of suppliments to try to aleviate all that I can without an MD and I thank God for them b/c they help alot. I know that others suffer much worse than I, and I will be praying for you all.
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To All,
Wow, sounds like the saints are having some battles. I will pray for all of you as I have begun to do, so I will continue to do so. I believe it is our ailements that will in the end bring us closer to God, and looking back on it, it that is the case, it will be worth.
I count all things but loss....hmmm I know what Scripture I want to say, but it slipped my memory. Basically it is talking about that all things do not matter, except the writer going on and pursuing Christ. I wanna say this is Phillipians. <shakes head over lack of Scripture prowess that others show> The problem when I wish to post Scriptures, I cannot remember them word for word, or even get them close, I tend to paraphrase and shorten them. Susan any suggestions, this is the trouble that I am running into about using the concordance?
Please pray for the Migraines and back ache.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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I was going to ask for prayer for my newly aquired paper cut, but after reading some of these post, I think I will just conjure me up an old poltus wrap and deal with it.
Longhorn
P.S. I know some of you city slickers have NO idea what a poltus wrap is.
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Anne, You were close.
(Philipians 3:8)...YEA DOUBTLESS, AND I COUNT ALL THINGS BUTLOSS FOR THE EXCELLENCY OF THE KNOWLEDGE OF CHRIST JESUS MY LORD: FOR WHOM I (PAUL) HAVE SUFFERED THE LOSS OF ALL THINGS, ANDDO COUNT THEM BUT DUNG, THAT I MAY WIN CHRIST,
:9...AND BE FOUND IN HIM, NOT HAVING MINE OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS, WHICH IS OF THE LAW, BUT THAT WHICH IS THROUGH THE FAITH OF CHRIST, THE RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH IS OF GOD BY FAITH:
:10...THAT I MAY KNOW HIM, AND THE POWER OF HIS RESURRECTION, AND THE FELLOWSHIP OF HIS SUFFERINGS, BEING MADE CONFORMABLE UNTO HIS DEATH
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Sorry guys, I have this laptop and whenever my thumb accidentally drops down it seems to send off my messages without them being complete...so here goes the completed version ::)
Anne, You were right, it was in Phillipians.
(Philipians 3:8)...YEA DOUBTLESS, AND I COUNT ALL THINGS BUT LOSS FOR THE EXCELLENCY OF THE KNOWLEDGE OF CHRIST JESUS MY LORD: FOR WHOM I (PAUL) HAVE SUFFERED THE LOSS OF ALL THINGS, AND DO COUNT THEM BUT DUNG, THAT I MAY WIN CHRIST,
:9...AND BE FOUND IN HIM, NOT HAVING MINE OWN RIGHTEOUSNESS, WHICH IS OF THE LAW, BUT THAT WHICH IS THROUGH THE FAITH OF CHRIST, THE RIGHTEOUSNESS WHICH IS OF GOD BY FAITH:
:10...THAT I MAY KNOW HIM, AND THE POWER OF HIS RESURRECTION, AND THE FELLOWSHIP OF HIS SUFFERINGS, BEING MADE CONFORMABLE UNTO HIS DEATH.:
:11...IF BY ANY MEANS I MIGHT ATTAIN UNTO THE RESURRECTION OF THE DEAD
I do relate to the FELLOWSHIP OF HIS SUFFERINGS, but at least I have HIM ;D and that is all that matters to me!
Poor Longhorn...now you keep that pultice on that poor paper cut!! I hope you can make it through the day without going and having to go to the ER!! Then they would have it amputate if the poultice didn't work ;) ;) (I do hate paper cuts. Have you ever had cardboard cuts? Nasty.)
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Hi Robin,
I hope everything is better for you today and that you're feeling better.
Thanks for sharing the emails from Ray.
My prayers go out to you.
Iris
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Susan,
Thanks for posting the Scripture for me.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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Grace be with you, mercy, and peace, from God the Father, and from the Lord Jesus Christ, the Son of the Father, in truth and love.
Hebrews 12
1Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,
2Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.
3For consider him that endured such contradiction of sinners against himself, lest ye be wearied and faint in your minds.
2 Timothy 4
6For I am now ready to be offered, and the time of my departure is at hand.
7I have fought a good fight, I have finished my course, I have kept the faith:
8Henceforth there is laid up for me a crown of righteousness, which the Lord, the righteous judge, shall give me at that day: and not to me only, but unto all them also that love his appearing.
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God Bless each and every one of you.
It is good to lean upon our God and trust him in all things. :)
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Jackie,
Yes it is. God bless you as well.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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Did you reads rays write on praying by God's rules that really help me to know to pray God's will in everything.
He even thanks God for his pillows his bed and his wife beside him.
I never even thought of that before. :D
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Anne you and your little one looks so cute together.
God Bless you.... Jackie
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From out of the e-mail from Ray to Robin, Ray kindly presents a sequence of scriptures for consideration from which this one verse particularly strikes me as revealed through the Concordant version:
Phi 4:12 I am aware what it is to be humbled as well as aware what it is to be superabounding. In everything and among all am I initiated, to be satisified as well as to be hungering, to be superabounding as well as to be in want."
This is very revealing. Paul says that he knows what it is to be humbled. Do we know? Do I know? Have I known? Am I finding out? NO and YES. In the past I have thought being humbled was my bad luck, bad karma, being punished, getting what I deserved, feeling like a victim,that made me defensive while blaming others all because I did not know and could not see God. God says ABSOLUTELY Isa 45 : 7 I form the light and crate darkness; I make peace, national well-being and I create physical evil, calamity; I am the Lord, Who does all these things. Isa 46 : 10 Declaring the end and the result from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all My pleasure and purpose.
RELATIVE to us, the above scripture can make us do and think all sorts of stupid foolish things! :D..before we get/I got edified and shown the meanings and significance and insights of these scriptures here in BT and in Rays teachings. We know that the Church does not teach that God is Sovereign and they miss out on this Scripture!
So before I got dragged here, I too did not know that God is the potter and I am the clay. I was full of myself. The self part is not going to go away either until Jesus returns. But when I was very thick and very full of my self the world loved me. Then I got empty as God turned me on His potters wheel. I got confused, dizzy and hopeless as God drove a hole right into my self assurance with his thumbs as easy as a hot knife through butter. ;D Everything I had believed became empty. :o God made me get thinner on myself through a process that continues.... ;D
I thank God he brought me to BT. As I read Ray’s teachings I saw that God controls EVERYTHING and that it is my ignorance to blame, accuse and compare myself with other vessels that GOD is making. As I begin to see that EVERYONE is in GODS control I am starting to understand that when I get slapped down by a person it is not because God was not looking, or that I was not praying hard enough or that I< I< I< did something to earn pain or disappointment or grievances…but that it is all from GOD….not me, me, me as the Church would have me believe. It is GOD who is Sovereign…NOT ME! It is HE who knows the beginning from the end, ….not ME.
PAUL GOT! HE KNEW THIS! HE WROTE….. among all am I initiated, to be satisified as well as to be hungering, to be superabounding as well as to be in want."………..Paul was initiated with the knowledge of God’s Sovereignty. Paul was satisfied when hungering and superabounding in want…WHY….because he knew…Ray also knows….we are still learning! :D ;D
I still at first see the person and not the hand of God when things do not go MY way….I am getting better though :D…I still see the sickness and not the plan of God when I feel helpless for others pains and sufferings rather than seeing the love of God in action in the lives of them who are being judged now… :'( I still do not enjoy pain or sickness, loss or dismay, suffering or tauma and it is still difficult to see that these things God takes full responsibility over and it is as we who God will bring to account for how we respond! Do we hate God or know and understand Him. That is for God to decide. He is the potter and there are pots being made for God glory and God's wrath!
With Paul and Ray…Much has been given by God to them.....God has revealed Himself, removed the obscurity of veiled bllindness showing that we are NOT creatures of free will..... and WE are blessed to share in the insightful knowledge and teachings we have been placed by God's hand to receive through Ray's teachings that expose to our minds, hearts, eyes and ears, Ray's knowledge and comprehensive insight into the ways and purposes of God. Yes truly Christ is being written into our hearts MG. :D
Even as our brother Dwight in an another thread was caused to present...1 Peter 1 12.....It is these very things which have now already been made known plainly to you by those who preached the good news, to you by the same Holy Spirit sent from heaven . Into these things the very angels long to look! It is our eyes that see into what the angels have longed to look! We are indeed blessed beyond merit but not outside the bounds of HIS love!
When Paul was superabounding, he could still say he was in want because he was never SELF SUFFICINT. Self sufficiency is the mark of a fool. When Paul was superabounding he was at the same time in want because of his dependence on Christ that had become ceaseless and detatched from Pauls circumstantial lack or abundance. CHRIST was Pauls supply in all circumstances in prison or out of prison. Paul was initiated with Gods stamp of Sovereignty. This is a Hallmark of wisdom and Pauls comprehensive insight into the ways and purposes of God that his epistles bring to us in exhortation, encouragement and edification.
Proverbs 12 : 8 A man shall be commended according to his Wisdom, godly Wisdom, which is comprehensive insight into the ways and purposes of God,….
Ecc 3 : 14 I know that whatever God does, it endures; nothing can be added to it nor anything taken from it. And GOD DOES IT so that men will reverently fear HIM, revere and worship HIM, knowing that He IS.
Ecc 12 : 13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter; Fear God, revere and worship HIM, knowing that He IS….
Paul knew it! Peter too was in Gods purpose.
1 Peter 4 : 8 Above all things have intense and unfailing love for one another, for love covers a multitude of sins, forgives and disregards the offences of others…..
In other words….see GOD in EVERYTHING! In all circumstances ups and downs…He is the potter we are on the wheel for a short time that is all!
Among others in the OT someone else got the revelation that God is sovereign….God told Habakkuk 1 : 5 Look around you, among the nations and see! And be ASTONISHED! ASTOUNDED! For I am putting into effect a work in your days such that you would not believe it if it were told you……and then God SHOWED him….
Astonished...ASTOUNDED....kind of how I felt as I read Ray's teachings.. 8) ;D :D
Then once Habakkuk got it he wrote : 3 : 17 Though the fig tree does not blossom and there is no fruit on the vines, though the product of the olive fails and the fields yield no food, though the flock is cut off from the flood and there are no cattle in the stalls, 18 YET I WILL REJOICE IN THE LORD; I WILL EXULT IN THE VICTORIOUS GOD OF MY SALVATION. 19 The Lord God is my Strength, my personal bravery, and my invincible army; he makes my feet like hinds feet and will make me to walk not to stand still in terror, but to walk and make spiritual progress upon my high places of trouble, suffering or responsibility.
God showed Habakkuk that HE is Sovereign. Paul knew it. Ray teaches it!
As we suffer and strain in the kiln of the potters fires we can look ahead to the fact that Jesus when He comes, it is He who will fill us, it is He who is our strength, personal bravery, army making our feet walk in spiritual progress upon our high places of trouble and suffering. We can look forward to HIS return with expectant hearts of joy and as Jackie Lee notes...praying by God's rules is an insightful aid in our race towards His return.
Hurry up Lord! We are looking for you with great excitement and anticipation! as we learn patience, long suffering and endurance....as You bring us to know that whether inside Your consuming fire or on the shelf of abounding supply...we still need YOU.
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
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Arcturus,
There was much to respond. All your comments will be in black, and mine are in red, and in by no means is red a fiery angry color, it just shows up easier.
From out of the e-mail from Ray to Robin, Ray kindly presents a sequence of scriptures for consideration from which this one verse particularly strikes me as revealed through the Concordant version:
Phi 4:12 I am aware what it is to be humbled as well as aware what it is to be superabounding. In everything and among all am I initiated, to be satisified as well as to be hungering, to be superabounding as well as to be in want."
This is very revealing. Paul says that he knows what it is to be humbled. Do we know? Do I know? Have I known? Am I finding out? NO and YES. In the past I have thought being humbled was my bad luck, bad karma, being punished, getting what I deserved, feeling like a victim,that made me defensive while blaming others all because I did not know and could not see God. God says ABSOLUTELY Isa 45 : 7 I form the light and crate darkness; I make peace, national well-being and I create physical evil, calamity; I am the Lord, Who does all these things. Isa 46 : 10 Declaring the end and the result from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all My pleasure and purpose.
RELATIVE to us, the above scripture can make us do and think all sorts of stupid foolish things! :D..before we get/I got edified and shown the meanings and significance and insights of these scriptures here in BT and in Rays teachings. We know that the Church does not teach that God is Sovereign and they miss out on this Scripture!
I too thought being humbled was the bad things that happened in my life becuase I deserved them. I am so glad that you shared this becuase well I am in the process of getting humbled as well. The more that I read on the website and the more that I learn from all of you here at the forum, I am constantly reminded and humbled that I do not have all the answers. I am glad that I can learn from others, especially those that pursue the Truth.
So before I got dragged here, I too did not know that God is the potter and I am the clay. I was full of myself. The self part is not going to go away either until Jesus returns. But when I was very thick and very full of my self the world loved me. Then I got empty as God turned me on His potters wheel. I got confused, dizzy and hopeless as God drove a hole right into my self assurance with his thumbs as easy as a hot knife through butter. ;D Everything I had believed became empty. :o God made me get thinner on myself through a process that continues.... ;D
This is the paragraph that I wanted to orginally post my reply in, but the more that I read, I knew I wanted to share some things based off of what you said. I loved this what you said, becuase it is what God is doing for me. I cannot believe that he can easily get into my self assurance and knock holes in it so easier, but when he does, it drives me to my knees and into His word. I am glad to see that it is a process that will continue, becuase I am so stubborn-headed that I do not think a couple times will be enough for me. ;D I wanted to add if I might, I would rather God be molding me, becuase if I fall or crack I am already in His hands. To me, when I read that, I was reminded I am already in His hands and he will catch me. And that has given me peace, thanks for sharing that.
I thank God he brought me to BT. As I read Ray’s teachings I saw that God controls EVERYTHING and that it is my ignorance to blame, accuse and compare myself with other vessels that GOD is making. As I begin to see that EVERYONE is in GODS control I am starting to understand that when I get slapped down by a person it is not because God was not looking, or that I was not praying hard enough or that I< I< I< did something to earn pain or disappointment or grievances…but that it is all from GOD….not me, me, me as the Church would have me believe. It is GOD who is Sovereign…NOT ME! It is HE who knows the beginning from the end, ….not ME.
Thank you , thank you, thank you. I sometimes wonder why things happen or someone hurts me. I usually fall into the guilt trip of not being there for them or not saying enough, you know that routine. I am going to post this on an index card and put it on the front door. If I could remember that God is in control I could avoid much pain and guilt in my life. This paragraph that you have written is a beautiful and eloquent statement of humility. I only pray that I too will be able to resound this as convicted as you have.
PAUL GOT! HE KNEW THIS! HE WROTE….. among all am I initiated, to be satisified as well as to be hungering, to be superabounding as well as to be in want."………..Paul was initiated with the knowledge of God’s Sovereignty. Paul was satisfied when hungering and superabounding in want…WHY….because he knew…Ray also knows….we are still learning! :D ;D
I still at first see the person and not the hand of God when things do not go MY way….I am getting better though :D…I still see the sickness and not the plan of God when I feel helpless for others pains and sufferings rather than seeing the love of God in action in the lives of them who are being judged now… :'( I still do not enjoy pain or sickness, loss or dismay, suffering or tauma and it is still difficult to see that these things God takes full responsibility over and it is as we who God will bring to account for how we respond! Do we hate God or know and understand Him. That is for God to decide. He is the potter and there are pots being made for God glory and God's wrath!
With Paul and Ray…Much has been given by God to them.....God has revealed Himself, removed the obscurity of veiled bllindness showing that we are NOT creatures of free will..... and WE are blessed to share in the insightful knowledge and teachings we have been placed by God's hand to receive through Ray's teachings that expose to our minds, hearts, eyes and ears, Ray's knowledge and comprehensive insight into the ways and purposes of God. Yes truly Christ is being written into our hearts MG. :D
Even as our brother Dwight in an another thread was caused to present...1 Peter 1 12.....It is these very things which have now already been made known plainly to you by those who preached the good news, to you by the same Holy Spirit sent from heaven . Into these things the very angels long to look! It is our eyes that see into what the angels have longed to look! We are indeed blessed beyond merit but not outside the bounds of HIS love!
When Paul was superabounding, he could still say he was in want because he was never SELF SUFFICINT. Self sufficiency is the mark of a fool. When Paul was superabounding he was at the same time in want because of his dependence on Christ that had become ceaseless and detatched from Pauls circumstantial lack or abundance. CHRIST was Pauls supply in all circumstances in prison or out of prison. Paul was initiated with Gods stamp of Sovereignty. This is a Hallmark of wisdom and Pauls comprehensive insight into the ways and purposes of God that his epistles bring to us in exhortation, encouragement and edification.
Proverbs 12 : 8 A man shall be commended according to his Wisdom, godly Wisdom, which is comprehensive insight into the ways and purposes of God,….
Ecc 3 : 14 I know that whatever God does, it endures; nothing can be added to it nor anything taken from it. And GOD DOES IT so that men will reverently fear HIM, revere and worship HIM, knowing that He IS.
Ecc 12 : 13 Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter; Fear God, revere and worship HIM, knowing that He IS….
Paul knew it! Peter too was in Gods purpose.
1 Peter 4 : 8 Above all things have intense and unfailing love for one another, for love covers a multitude of sins, forgives and disregards the offences of others…..
In other words….see GOD in EVERYTHING! In all circumstances ups and downs…He is the potter we are on the wheel for a short time that is all!
Among others in the OT someone else got the revelation that God is sovereign….God told Habakkuk 1 : 5 Look around you, among the nations and see! And be ASTONISHED! ASTOUNDED! For I am putting into effect a work in your days such that you would not believe it if it were told you……and then God SHOWED him….
Astonished...ASTOUNDED....kind of how I felt as I read Ray's teachings.. 8) ;D :D
Then once Habakkuk got it he wrote : 3 : 17 Though the fig tree does not blossom and there is no fruit on the vines, though the product of the olive fails and the fields yield no food, though the flock is cut off from the flood and there are no cattle in the stalls, 18 YET I WILL REJOICE IN THE LORD; I WILL EXULT IN THE VICTORIOUS GOD OF MY SALVATION. 19 The Lord God is my Strength, my personal bravery, and my invincible army; he makes my feet like hinds feet and will make me to walk not to stand still in terror, but to walk and make spiritual progress upon my high places of trouble, suffering or responsibility.
God showed Habakkuk that HE is Sovereign. Paul knew it. Ray teaches it!
As we suffer and strain in the kiln of the potters fires we can look ahead to the fact that Jesus when He comes, it is He who will fill us, it is He who is our strength, personal bravery, army making our feet walk in spiritual progress upon our high places of trouble and suffering. We can look forward to HIS return with expectant hearts of joy and as Jackie Lee notes...praying by God's rules is an insightful aid in our race towards His return.
Hurry up Lord! We are looking for you with great excitement and anticipation! as we learn patience, long suffering and endurance....as You bring us to know that whether inside Your consuming fire or on the shelf of abounding supply...we still need YOU.
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
Sister, thanks so much for posting this journey of Yours on the thread. I too am going through the fires of the kiln and it burns and it hurts. But now, I can see what the result of going through it is by looking at the Wisdom and the passion you have for the Truth. I am ready now. Thanks so much. Great post, and I cannot say how much you have blessed my life and it only being 0945 hours over here. May God bless you and yours.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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Thank you Anne
MG's plight has reminded me of this scripture.
John 9 : 1-7
As He passed along, He noticed a man blind from his birth.2 His disciples asked Him, Rabbi, who sinned, this man or his parents, the he should be born blind? ( or that we should be born carnal….)3Jesus answered, It was not that this man or his parents sinned,(…or were bringing upon themselves punishment for sin…for we have all sinned and we have all fallen short of God’s Glory…) but he was born blind in order that the workings of God should be manifested, displayed and illustrated in him. 4. We must work the works of Him Who sent Me and be busy with His business while it is daylight; night is coming on, when no man can work. 5. As long as I am in the world, I am the world’s Light.6When He had said this, He spat on the ground and made clay, mud (…this makes me think of potters clay….)with His saliva, and He spread it as ointment on the man’s eyes. 7. And He said to him, Go, wash in the Pool of Siloam – which means Sent.
MG's pain and all human suffering makes me think of what Jesus suffered on His cross. The speech arresting agony of torment and grief that disfigured His appearance, robbed Him of beauty and marred His flesh. Jesus went through this for us and our suffering shares in His suffering! We are made to go through it and like Jesus NO ONE wants to suffer. Jesus did not want to drink from the cup and God made Him. Ray points this out in his teachings on this subject.
I see human pain as a reminder to those of us less pained, that Jesus suffered pain that many of us will not ever know or share in our life times. I know that no human can say that they accept their suffering without HIS Strength.We can not will away our circumstances or imagine that we can accept pain in the place of any human being and do as good a job as Jeusus because only Jesus was the spotless sin offering. No human flesh is or can hold such a title. Yet Jesus does say that we can share in His sacrifice, carry our cross and see that our pain is a share of His own cross. For me MG fits this category as do all my brothers and sisters who recognise that their pain draws them closer to and not further away from Jesus. This is a privilage and not a guarantee. Many hate God for their sufferings.
Of course it is much easier to advise someone from standing at the foot of their suffering not being nailed to the pain they are in. Of course it is very much easier to tell Job what to do in his anguish. God was not too pleased with Job’s friends either. Being holier than thou as our passing by attempt at alleviation of another’s sorrow or suffering is not worthy to be called love yet it was Jesus who tarried when news came to him of Lazarus who was deathly ill.
MG'S pain and post stalled me....It got me thinking. In this I see MG as sent to show me that I should know it is HIM who has healed my emotions too and it is HIM who is leading me and strenghening me and blessing me and caring for me.....
Perhaps the scriptures tell us not to trivialize people’s pain, or try to adjudicate someone’s suffering but to wait….not until they die but until we know that God is in command of everything and everyone.
You hold a very important place in this Forum for me MG. Not because any one of my brothers or sisters are of lesser significance but because your pain is higher up in the rafters closest to the suffering that Jesus endured on Calvery.
Heb 4 : 15 For we do not have a High Priest Who is unable to understand and sympathize and have a shared feeling with our weaknesses and infirmities and liability to the assaults of temptation, but One Who has been tempted in every respect as we are, yet without sinning.
MG you have recognised andacknowledged His miraculous healing of your emotions….I see your flesh is uniting to His own that was crucified for our salvation…..This is how I see you MG….a reminder of His agony suffered for us all. Not to agrandise your suffering or make a display of your pain....but to draw nearer to the conclusion that God is doing with you exactly what He knows is best and what is so wonderful is that this understanding also shines through your awareness of His presence in your life.
I am not going through anything nearly like what you describe….neither was the thief that asked Jesus to remember him…………
I hope you remember me too MG
Peace be to you .......I see you too have been sent on your way to the pool of Siloam...as have we all who can say we are brothers and sisters. HE is the pool of Siloam....HE is the SENT ONE. He is coming back....
I hope this post lifts your burden just a little bit MG and all those who suffer in the hidden places of hurts and pains that are silent and unspeakable...for this reason I have written to you.
Peace be to you
Arcturus
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Anne
It blesses me to see His hands of holiness loosening you from your bondage...and captivity to human cruelty and false teachings.
Peace be to you
Arcturus :)
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Arcturus,
I guess where it could be in my life, the spirit is willing but the flesh is so weak. It hurts sometimes, and I am learning what I have been praying for paitence and perserverance <sic?>
Have a great day. Just out of curiosity, how many hours are you ahead of Central Time?
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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Hi Anne
According to the time zone chart I am about eight hours ahead of you. :)
That means I am asleep when you guys are awake....It figures! :D..blame it on the time zone! ;D
Peace to you....
Arcturus :)
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Thank you all for sharing your hearts and proclaiming your faith!
I do believe that God is in control of all. Sometimes when he deals with me I can see that even the words that others speak are in his control. I've experienced times when every circumstance in my life was directed at the one thing that God was working on in me. It seems that all of it is working on the carnal and putting it to death. Bringing that which is secret into the light and exposing it. The hard part for me is when that carnal within myself is sitting in the light and I have to sit in it as God leads me to repentance and deals with it. Sitting and looking at that beast is not much fun. That is harder than any of the suffering. Through it all I gain more faith and learn more truth. I decrease a little more and Christ increases a little more. Being conformed to his image. God forgive me for my attitude and complaints when I am being blessed so much by being called and hopefully chosen.
1 John 3
20For if our heart condemn us, God is greater than our heart, and knoweth all things.
21Beloved, if our heart condemn us not, then have we confidence toward God.
When I first started this journey I was tempted to try and fix the carnal. Now I know that I need to wait on God because he is the only one who can deal with my carnal mind and let me tell you it feels like a bottomless pit of carnal. I've been going through this for years and it just keeps coming. Different areas, but all the same beast. I will confess that at times I lose hope that God will ever be able to finish this work in me. When my carnal is exposed and put in the light it's hard to see past it and sometimes I panic for a little while. God always wins though. Always. Please never stop telling me who God is. There are many times when I am the weakest among us.
Matthew 23
25Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye make clean the outside of the cup and of the platter, but within they are full of extortion and excess.
26Thou blind Pharisee, cleanse first that which is within the cup and platter, that the outside of them may be clean also.
27Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.
Psalm 51:6-8
6Behold, thou desirest truth in the inward parts: and in the hidden part thou shalt make me to know wisdom.
7Purge me with hyssop, and I shall be clean: wash me, and I shall be whiter than snow.
8Make me to hear joy and gladness; that the bones which thou hast broken may rejoice.
Romans 8
30Moreover whom he did predestinate, them he also called: and whom he called, them he also justified: and whom he justified, them he also glorified.
31What shall we then say to these things? If God be for us, who can be against us?
32He that spared not his own Son, but delivered him up for us all, how shall he not with him also freely give us all things?
33Who shall lay any thing to the charge of God's elect? It is God that justifieth.
34Who is he that condemneth? It is Christ that died, yea rather, that is risen again, who is even at the right hand of God, who also maketh intercession for us.
35Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? shall tribulation, or distress, or persecution, or famine, or nakedness, or peril, or sword?
36As it is written, For thy sake we are killed all the day long; we are accounted as sheep for the slaughter.
37Nay, in all these things we are more than conquerors through him that loved us.
38For I am persuaded, that neither death, nor life, nor angels, nor principalities, nor powers, nor things present, nor things to come,
39Nor height, nor depth, nor any other creature, shall be able to separate us from the love of God, which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.
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This thread is totally awesome.
I at this time have no other words. :-X
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This thread is totally awesome.
I at this time have no other words. :-X
EXACTLY!!!!
Arcturus, you may have told us before, if so, I have forgotten. How did you happen upon Ray's site??? (PS-I (we) am so glad you did)
I LOVE that scripture from Habakkuk. I first heard it from Jimmy Swaggart (!) and have loved it for 20 years. Funny tho, in the last year I had forgotten all about it. Its all there in a nutshell--TRUST GOD. Period.
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Hi G
I have mentioned that the Church I was in Struck me! :D I opened a thread here as it was happening called I've been Struck! The Church I was in sent me an SMS to tell me they had struck me from their list! I had done two years bible study with them. They did not even send me my certificate or invite me to the function to which all students that had passed qualified.I had paid double the bible study course back to the Pastor in tithes but the Pastor had sponsored my bible college fees so I guess they could dismiss me as a student on that basis alone by the will of the Pastor! :D Only kidding....it was God's will to drag me out. HE used the pastor to boot me sharp and hard out of that henious place of deception and that is the irony. I had passed my exams but did not qualify for Mystery Babylon. :D I was a Cell Leader and in my last exam on "The Principles of Faith" I disclosed the following : I am daily standing the test to trust and know God knows all things, sees everything and is testing me not to promote me into leadership but to purify my faith by separating me from leadership." I was being tormented by the heresy teachings in the Church that had the underlying message of “ don’t trust yourself to understand God, trust only me the Pastor. I the Pastor am the way the truth and the life and you don’t get anywhere without me. I know better than you. You are expendable. Forget your bible. Don’t even refer to it or try to understand it. I, the Pastor knows everything you haven’t learnt yet and I am all powerful..”…That is just a little of what I saw G….
On the heals of my expulsion.....my darling husband found Ray's site. He said to me, "Debs, you should read this....." I was so amazed, excited, overwhelmed and totally thankful for such clarity, purity, truth and major insights, sharing and selfless passion that came vividly through whatever Ray wrote! It was like eating the real banquet of the Lord and not having to chew paper photographs of delicious food as the Church does. Cardboard with picture candy promises pained in heresy colors of deception and illusions.....I was so blessed to find the real thing, the real truths here at BT.
A few months into reading Rays teachings I began writing to him and he responded. With a bit of prompting I joined the Forum. I have had the distinct blessing of meeting sweet kind kindred spirits here and it has been a huge refuge from Mystery Babylon to have been granted refuge here in the Forum.
thanks for asking....
Peace be to you
Arcturus :)
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Arcturus,
Thanks so much for sharing your story. What words of encouragement and how exciting to see where your journey has taken you. God bless.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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Arcturus, that was interesting and thanks for sharing that! I had a similar experience while I was in bible college/seminary as well; they simply did not give me my certificate since I was unable (though all of my human efforts) to raise the finacial support in order to live overseas, or even stateside as an apprentice missionary. (of course, I knew that it was God's will that I didn't go with those groups in order for me teach certain doctrinal errors AND denominational deception to whomever would listen...but, of course these 'spiritual leaders' couldn't understand this, and they had already put in thirty+ yrs as bible professors!!!; afterall, I was just a babe in Christ and what did i know???) It is interesting to me that these men are in the exact same school, teaching the exact same errors and milk, to the exact same gullable students, ...THEY HAVE STAGNATED IN THEIR WALK WITH GOD AND FOR THEIR LOVE FOR THE TRUTH...(LORD FORBID!) There have been several of these men whom spent 50 years doing the same ole thing and then died without any peace in their hearts. (I wnated terribly to teach them these things, but God wouldn't allow me!) (One day while in Old Testament History class, I literally watched in amazement as the instructor was getting soooo into what he was teaching, he looked up at the clock as it rang for the class to be dismissed, and the countence of his face dropped from that of sheer delight to a literal depression of his spirit. I will never forget that, b/c it was so obvious and so sad that he had no clue as to what true joy is after nearly 50 yrs of being a missionary and bible instructor in a seminary!!!
But you are correct, these 'leaders' get terribly offended even hateful (as DH and I have recently experienced) when you don;t follow THEM. That is a very scarey thought indeed!
ps...it tis too much for me to stay away from alol of you for a month ;) ;) I have to keep up with you nearly on a daily basis.
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Arcturus and Susan,
Thank you both for sharing your stories. :) Although I never attended seminary college or the like, I was told by a Presbyterian Minister that I had no place in their church, and that because God had not yet put "understnading" in my heart, I should stay away.
It didn't help when I asked if one had "understanding" such as he, then why could not one "explain" it. The answer always blew me away! :D
I was always told that it was not up to "me" to know the mind of God! ??? And here I was thinking that he was a teacher! ::)
Well of course, I had had my fill of the church by then and was not suprised by his action; however, I was suprised that not one previous friend in the congregation ever contacted me to see if they could help a "lost lamb."
Really! If any should think that insights given by Ray are difficult to follow, they should try some of the church. I am so glad that God decided you all, my spiritual brothers and sisters and even myself, were worthy to learn the truth!
Pro 1:28 Then shall they call upon me, but I will not answer; they shall seek me early, but they shall not find me:
Thank you Heavenly Father. Amen
Love to all,
Darren
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Hello Sue
I know what you mean about not being able to stay away! :D At first, I did not even want to join the Forum! My priorities also needed adjusting! :)
As for the Church of Babylon, I am so glad that I learnt what they taught because it has helped me to encourage my sister who is in the path that lead to my exit from the Chruch. I know what they are teaching and am able to give exposing of heresy ecnouragements to her. I am very grateful for the way that something so evil as heresy well taught and well swollowed by me can now be used to help others not to swollow it! :D
I say to her....yes I know....I was taught all about that and it is wrong. Look at what Jesus says and I can quote her some insights. Babylon can not rest its heresy seductions with authority in scripture. They just can not. Their beliefs rely on idols of the heart and blind eyes and God not willing to show His ways to them at this time! His Sovereignty rules everywhere, in our darkness and in His light. All is of Him and I am so grateful that He has shown me His light through what Ray has taught and continues to teach. The Myth of Free will and the Sovereignty of God are pivitol teachings of truth, justice and wisdom.
How bazare that in Mystery Babylon the paster, Pope or leader is the flesh that needs to be followed whereas in BT it is the spirit of truth that is the light! The Pastor I had in the Church that I was in was so ill in soul that it made him a force to be reakoned with. ...but Jesus is my healing that reakoned with me and helped and lifted amd blessed me for which I am ever grateful.
Compare these two scriptures : Jer 3 : 15 And I will give you spiritual shepherds after My own heart in the final time, who will feed you with knowledge and understanding and judgment.
Jer 17 : 5 Thus says the Lord: Cursed with great evil is the strong man who trusts in and relies on frail man, making weak human flesh his arm and whose mind and heart turn aside from the Lord.
God is Sovereign! Man does not have free will!....we rely and some of us know, those to whom God has revealed that our "being" depends on His Son and our Father's Sovereign Mercy, Grace and and Unmeritted kindness. GOD is Love....not man...God is Love....
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
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Hi Everyone,
It's amazing when I hear all of your testimonies and how similar they all are. Mine is really the same; from being a fundamentalist to bible college, to being a pastor of a church to the Jesus movement of the sixties to following Witness Lee and the "local church," to being the prodical son and comig back to the Father, to finding BT and fellowshipping with you all. This only took fifty years, but boy was it worth it. I feel like the ones who were hired at the last hour of the day, but received a penney just like those who toiled all day in the heat of the sun. The first shall be last and the last shall be first, and it's all of God. :)
In Him,
Dwight
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Dwight,
.....And Life is Good and good is enough for me. :)
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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Oh Yeah, preach on brethren...I luv it and gotta have more of it!!! It is indeed all VERY good here. ;D
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Whew!! Some good testimony here. Arc, was your hubby looking for something on the web specifically. I mean how did he find Ray's site???
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Hi G
I asked my husband to answer your question! 8)
Here is what he wrote.
My experiences were in a way very similar to Dwight’s experiences. I went from mainframe protestant religion, where I was one of the Church leaders, to Pentecostal, to confusion. We all go through trials and tribulations!
I started to question issues, which we were always steered away from. The controversial issues, I found that the answers swayed between emotion to dogma where you had to conform to their way of thinking.
After extensive research on early Christian works, it occurred to me that what we were taught were the results of careful selection, indoctrination and manipulation. The content mostly seemed to be hinged on opinion based on expectations and assumptions. It is a world where everyone always want to be right. They want you to hear, accept and agree with what they say, think and do.
What makes it difficult is that most of the different opinions and conclusions are based on the basis of truth that God and Jesus exist but the rest is according to their own expectations and assumptions that address human needs and wants. So what interested me were not the half truths that were presented. I wanted the truth.
I started to search for the original manuscripts and writings from the early Biblical times. I started to search for the correct meanings of the words in these manuscripts.
During my research I came upon Ray’s teachings. It was like a pathway that was presented. Here was a person who quotes exactly from sources as close to the original Bible, but who dissects the words and compares it to exact meanings in context, without assumptions and without subjective opinions and conclusions. All of a sudden a lot of the Bible is starting to take a new form and sense. It has changed my own way of thinking, it established in me the knowledge that we all are mere mortals with twisted opinions based on the way our parents taught us and the society we grew up in and in our own experiences and interpretations of information presented and taught to us.
My attitude changed towards leaning on God and trusting in Him. My attitude changed from not caring about what people think and say but caring about what God wants and says.
God has blessed me with a fantastic wife and child and with wonderful parents. Above all, God blesses me with the knowledge that He is our God and that everything is about Him. God blesses Ray with an open and clear mind.
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
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Arcturus,
Wow, thanks for sharing your husband's testimony. What a blessing that is.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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Hi Arcturus,
Thanks for sharing with us your husbands experience.
May God bless you and your family.
Iris
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To Arcturus's husband:
I too had come from a very similar journey as yours was...back to out First Love! You said it so precisley!
GOOD TO HEAR FROM ARC'S OTHER HALF...(BUT...YOU WILL HAVE TO PROVE TO ME THAT YOU ARE HER 'BETTER' HALF'...SHE PRETTY HARD TO BEAT YA KNOW ;) ;D
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Anne Iris and Sue
Thank you for your sweet kind words.
Sue....He is my better half....he is my head I am his heart.....without him I have no beat nor rhythm or song ;D
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BEAUTIFULLY, VERY BEAUTIFULLY SAID SIS! ; I love that saying! I will definately remember this and I'll let you know if I ever get a chance to use it ;)
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Thank you Sue
I will certainly pray that you do!...
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
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That was a great testimony.
Isn't it amazing that half a world away, we were experiencing similar events. Thank God He put a hunger in us all to want MORE of Him and less of "churchianity". I am so glad He brought you two to HIM and to us!
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Oh G!
That is such a warm and loving thing to say. 8) Thank you!....me too....me too!
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
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Arturus,
I'm glad to finally meet all of you. ;D
God bless you my brother and sister,
Dwight
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Hi Arcturus,
Well that is so wonderful that you have your husband to share this truth with :)
It must be such a blessing to have a spouse that believes as you do.
I'm just thankful for all of you to share with :D
mercy, peace, and love
Kat
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Kat
I had to learn to trust Jesus with my husband.
My job is to appreciate my husband as unto the Lord and to love him and serve him. I can bet you that you do a better job than me in that department. :D I am not homely but am leaning. I could not cook very well but am getting better. I was a career woman and now am at home and I do not do that part nearly well enough in my estimate but I am being blessed to learn. :D
I am being taught to trust Jesus more and more and it hurts and blesses at the same time. Nothing is easy for me but there are many blessings to encourge me and help me.
I enjoyed what Dwight said, that :I am glad to finally meet all of you….
That was insightful and true….Thank you Dwight…….We also enjoyed your testimony …..
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
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Great thread! I am surprised to find out so many here have migraines, and even some who like me have migraines associated with mentrual/menopause problems, and even one of you who went through menopause suffering from rashes! I thought I was the only one!
First of all, if anyone needs cheap medications due to the fact that they don't have prescription/health insurance, PM me and I will refer you to a web site LEGITIMATE US-based pharmacy outlet where you can save between 70 and 80 percent on your prescriptins.
Second of all, as with so many other things (in fact all things) our infirmities are God's Will and certainly His way to humble us. As with Job, we don't have to like them. I really don't or can't think of a scripture that I can add to all you all have put in. I do believe whatever infirmities one has serve God's Purpose in some way. Thnking that prescription medicines targeted for migraines (called "triptans") have only recently arrived on the scene in the early 90s--when people have had migraines for thousands of years! when women were burned at the stake for "witchcraft" and "lunacy" when in fact they were going through menopause or difficult menses! when people have killed themselves because their migraines literally drove them to do it because of the pain--it is a wonder of God indeed that He finally in His purpose chosen men and women physicians to come up with these (I call them "wonder") drugs...I have had menstrual migraines for over 40 years, so yes, I appreciate what God has had people do. Praise God for the doctors who invented and continue to invent these medicines...but prainse God too for the conditions that provide people with God-chosen missions to alleviate these conditions!
We know that people will be judged for their works. Thank God He provides billions of people with opportunities to make other peoples lives less hard and more tolerable! Deb aka snorky
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Snorky,
Welcome to the migraine club LOL. I have got one today and has made things much harder. I was getting rather happy in thinking that I would be able to make it a whole week without one. Ahhhh, perhaps another time.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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Did you get some Fever Few Anne?
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Arcturus,
Not yet. Our finances are a mess right now, and the only things we can afford is to pay off bills and stuff for the baby. Hopefully next month, things will sort themselves out.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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Anne....have you tried the cup of warm water therapy yet????????
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Hi Rick,
I am interested in knowing what the cup of warm
water therapy is? I have never heard of this before.
Iris
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heat a cup of water in the microwave to about the same temp as cofee and drink it. one each morning and it will relieve constant headaches after only about a week. i dont know why it works, i just know it does.
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Hi Rick,
Thanks for the info. :o
Iris
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Rick,
Yes I have been doing it for a few days. It has reduced some pain down much to my delight. Thanks for sharing this with me, I have meant to get back to you, but I have been sick this weekend.
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire