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=> General Discussions => Topic started by: Daniel on June 02, 2006, 04:38:14 PM
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Can someone look at this with me?
Christ IS "THE END" of "THE LAW" and the "STONE" (the binding of the sacrifice) expressed This way....
Jerm 51:63 And it shall be, "WHEN" thou hast made AN END of reading "THIS BOOK[/u]", that thou shalt BIND A "STONE" TO IT[/u], and CAST IT INTO the MIDST of EUPHRATES:
Rev 9:14 Saying to the sixth angel which had the trumpet, "LOOSED the FOUR ANGELS[/u]" which are "BOUND" in the great river EUPHRATES[/u]
FOUR SOLDIERS ... pauls borrowed the term 2Titus 2:3... FOUR ANGELS
Mathew 13:39 ... the REAPERS are THE ANGELS[/u] John 4:38 I SENT YOU TO REAP .
SEE the BINDING of THE STONE (Jesus Christ) TO THE BOOK? HIS NAME is THE WORD OF GOD... HIS VESTURE DIPPED in BLOOD. Though YOUR SINS be AS SCARLETT they shall be AS WHITE AS SNOW
Romans 19:23 THEN the SOLDIERS, WHEN they had CRUCIFIED JESUS[/u], TOOK HIS GARMENTS[/u], and made FOUR PARTS, TO EVERY SOLDIER A PART[/u]; and "also his coat" now The COAT was WITHOUT SEAM, WOVEN FROM THE TOP and THROUGHOUT[/u]"
(GREAT "WHITE" SHEET Peter SAW ?The GRACE of God FROM the TOP HEAVEN)
Luke 23:31 or if they do these things in a green tree, WHAT SHALL BE DONE THE DRY"""?
Rev 16:12 And the sixth angel poured out his vial upon the great river Euphrates; and THE WATER THEREOF WAS "DRIED UP", that "THE WAY" of "the kings of the east" might be prepared. (we know HE is The Way")
These too I need to consider, kings of east "prepared" and the four angels which were "prepared"
Rev 9:15 And the four angels were loosed, which were prepared for an hour, and a day, and a month, and a year, for TO SLAY "the third part" OF MEN.[/u]
He said to Peter ARISE SLAY and EAT (seeing animals ) we know are MEN (Gentiles) this is after a VISION of a WHITE sheet, having FOUR corners coming down FROM HEAVEN) Sounds like the woven coat "without seam" FROM THE TOP throughout at The Cross of Christ.
Interestingly Peter being in prison expresses the same thing, there are TWO soldiers with "two chains" gaurding Him and FOUR quadrants of soldiers. There are TWO crucified with Christ and FOUR parts divided from Him.
Whats your thoughts? Any insights?
The thought came to me concerning this
Gal 4:10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.
Hours are missing, we know concerning the acceptable year of the Lord and "the hour" or "that day" I was wondering if anyone had anything else on this. These are peices and to me Jesus Christ is the center of them being they are a revelation of Him we hope to receive. I did not write everything down theres more concerning three men in the fire and the fourth likened unto the Son of God and they being "loosed". Four children and four carpenters of which He is THE Carpenter from which four sprang.
Just asking if you can see some obvious connections here.
Daniel
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Wow, Daniel -- that is deep!
I love how you explained the white sheet of God's grace and the garment sewn from the top as coming from heaven.
However, I'll have to give the rest some thought before I can comment.
Anyhow, good job! :)
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Hi Daniel:
Very nice! You said:
The thought came to me concerning this
Gal 4:10 Ye observe days, and months, and times, and years.
Hours are missing, we know concerning the acceptable year of the Lord and "the hour" or "that day" I was wondering if anyone had anything else on this.
Could it having anything to do with the fact that we KNOW NOT "the hour" of "the day" He is coming? Seems there might be something to that?
I started looking at "the third part" months ago and never got back to it, but have you ever noticed this verse?
Zec 13:9 And I will bring
THE THIRD PART through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.[/list:u]
Trying to reconcile this verse and several other verse in the OT about the "third part" to the "third part" that is mentioned several times in the Book of Revelation.
the seven angels which had the seven trumpets prepared themselves to sound.
Rev 8:7 The first angel sounded, and there followed hail and fire mingled with blood, and they were cast upon the earth: and the third part of trees was burnt up, and all green grass was burnt up.
Rev 8:8 And the second angel sounded, and as it were a great mountain burning with fire was cast into the sea (the law?): and the third part of the sea became blood;
Rev 8:9 And the third part of the creatures which were in the sea, and had life, died; and the third part of the ships were destroyed.
Rev 8:10 And the third angel sounded, and there fell a great star from heaven (satan cast out of heavern?), burning as it were a lamp, and it fell upon the third part of the rivers, and upon the fountains of waters;
Rev 8:11 And the name of the star is called Wormwood: and the third part of the waters became wormwood; and many men died of the waters, because they were made bitter.
Rev 8:12 And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise.
Rev 8:13 And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound![/list:u]
See how the last three woes (trumpet sounds) are to the inhabitant OF THE EARTH?
Sorry, I will have to look up what I have already done on this or start all over. :roll: (So I hope I can find it.)
Or is this off-topic?? :oops:
Chrissie
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Bless you Sandy and Chrissie
I thought on the "third part" both ways between Christ and ourselves) I know we are "body soul and spirit". Three parts?
I'm wondering if its not this body being destroyed or given to the flame. I was looking into "flesh" and "fire" as well
Isaiah 66:16 For by fire and by his sword will the LORD plead with all flesh: and the slain of the LORD shall be many.
There are THREE signified on the cross. ONE THIRD might representing the FLESH? Third part of men? FIRSTBORN was struck in Egypt right? Christ IS THE Firstborn of every "creature". The Lamb that had been SLAIN?
The Eating of HIS FLESH?
Then order to SLAY and EAT to Peter ( was concerning Men) God made CLEAN by HIS WORD. In Revelation to SLAY the third part of MEN? This is seen on the Cross after the spiritual truths represented. Paul at one point said ye are NOT in the FLESH?
I need to further think on these first before writing :lol: But I've had glimmers to see they speak the same things, of Jesus Christ, just "differently" and in "various ways". All Him :D
Daniel
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Considering ALL the ABOVE :lol: It just got quicked to me another way too. HE is GOOD Bless our Great God in Jesus Christ!
Awesome!
John 5:39 Search THE SCRIPTURES; for IN THEM ye think ye have eternal life: and THEY ARE THEY WHICH TESTIFY OF "ME".
Jerm 51:63 And it shall be, "WHEN" thou hast made AN END of reading "THIS BOOK", that thou shalt BIND A "STONE" TO IT, and CAST IT INTO the MIDST of EUPHRATES:
The STONE!
Romans 10:4 For CHRIST IS "THE END" of "THE LAW" for righteousness to every one that believeth.
HE IS "THE STONE" who was BOUND TO "THE BOOK" (BIND THE TESTIMONY) HE is the FULFILLMENT and HIM IN US
LO I COME it IS WRITTEN "OF ME" IN THE VOLUME OF THE BOOK
Romans 3:21 But NOW the righteousness of God WITHOUT THE LAW is MANIFESTED, "being WITNESSED" BY "the law and the prophets"
The SUM of THY WORD IS TRUTH
I AM "THE TRUTH"
HE SURE IS!!!
Daniel
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Oh how He loves to hide a thing, don't He? :lol: And he's so GOOD at it! :D
Pro 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.
AMEN!!!!!! [-o<
Chrissie
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Oh how He loves to hide a thing, don't He? :lol: And he's so GOOD at it! :D
Pro 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.
AMEN!!!!!! [-o<
Chrissie
DID you just say KINGS? :shock: I was just looking at that above concerning preparing the "KINGS OF the EAST"
:lol: PRAISE HIS NAME!!! Amen Chrisse!
Daniel
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Yes, I did!! :wink:
And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
Rev 5:10 And hast made us unto our God kings and priests: and we shall reign on the earth.[/list:u]
Chrissie
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Very interesting thread, it's always good to learn. 8)
(Gen 49:24) But his bow abode in strength, And the arms of his hands were made strong, By the hands of the Mighty One of Jacob, (From thence is the shepherd, the stone of Israel),
It is a mighty stone that destroys the beast in us all:
(1Sa 17:49) And David put his hand in his bag, and took thence a stone, and slang it, and smote the Philistine in his forehead; and the stone sank into his forehead, and he fell upon his face to the earth.
(1Sa 17:50) So David prevailed over the Philistine with a sling and with a stone, and smote the Philistine, and slew him; but there was no sword in the hand of David.
(1Sa 17:51) Then David ran, and stood over the Philistine, and took his sword, and drew it out of the sheath thereof, and slew him, and cut off his head therewith. And when the Philistines saw that their champion was dead, they fled.
Becomes our foundation:
(Isa 28:16) therefore thus saith the Lord Jehovah, Behold, I lay in Zion for a foundation a stone, a tried stone, a precious corner-stone of sure foundation: he that believeth shall not be in haste.
This always peaked some interest:
(Gen 2:10) And a river went out of Eden to water the garden; and from thence it was parted, and became four heads.
The fourth river named is the Euphrates. That number four is used quite often, so I will stop here for now.
I'm watching and learning! 8)
God bless,
Gary
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Gary I like the river one myself, even note that A RIVER "went out" and FROM THENCE was PARTED FOUR WAYS... FOUR HEADS
Now we have "heads" :lol: Its these things I love that speak volumes when I can see Christ in them. The LORD is as a RIVER of LIVING WATER.
The fulfilling of His words as a fire infolding iself. It speaks of the LIVING CREATURES. I cant find what I just read concerning the "north" it would fit, darn :lol:
Ezek 1:4 And I looked, and, behold, a whirlwind came out of the north, a great cloud, and a fire infolding itself[/u], and a brightness was about it, and out of the midst thereof as the colour of amber, out of the midst of the fire.
Ezek 1:5 Also out of the midst thereof came the likeness of four living creatures[/u]. And this was their appearance; they had the likeness of a man. (the measure of a man too I'm thinking)
Ezek 1:12 And they went every one "straight forward": whither the spirit was to go, they went[/u]; and they turned not when they went.
Daniel
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Oh how He loves to hide a thing, don't He? :lol: And he's so GOOD at it! :D
Pro 25:2 It is the glory of God to conceal a thing: but the honour of kings is to search out a matter.
AMEN!!!!!! [-o<
Chrissie
nice verse!
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I hear ya, Daniel.
Many great things hidden yet to be revealed. Once out of the carnal and into the spiritual, wow, what a difference. New beginnings around every bend. Loving every minute! Yeah, I like that song. 8)
God bless,
Gary
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Yeah agreed, amen :D
If these things be great which speak OF HIM how much better is HE Himself and the fulness of Him? Sounds indescribable :lol: Out of seeing ourselves in anyway and caught up in Him alone to behold His glory!
Bless His name!
Daniel
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4 meaning the whole.
So the whole word of God is enough for the earth. I believe that is what the river parting into 4 heads means i could be wrong.
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Hi Daniel,
Here's some witnesses for consideration.
Luke 23:31 "For if they do these things when the wood is green, what's going to happen when its dry?"
Witness references: 1 Pet. 4:18 If the righteous is barely delivered, where will the ungodly and sinful end up? Prov. 11:31 If the righteous are paid what they deserve here on earth, how much more the wicked and the sinner.
Rev. 16:12 "The sixth one poured out his bowl on the great river Euphrates, and its water dried up, in order to prepare they way for the kings from the east."
Witness references: Isa. 11:15 The Lord will divide the tongue of the Egyptian sea. He will wave his hand over the Euphrates to bring a mighty wind, and will spllit it into seven wadis so that it may be crossed dry-shod.
Isa. 11:16 So there will be a CAUSEWAY for the remnant of his people, for the remnant rescued from Assyria, as there was for the Israelites when they came up from Egypt. Isa. 35:8 And a CAUSEWAY will appear there; it will be called the Way of Holiness. No one unclean will pass along it; it will become a pilgrim's way, and no fool will trespass on it. Isa. 35:9 No lion will come there, no savage beast go by; no one will be found there. But by THAT WAY those the Lord has redeemed will return.
Chrissie's input on Rev. 8 requires more meditation and prayer, however for Rev. 8:10 you might re-read Lake of Fire part 9, wherein Isa. 14:4 & 11 would indicate this proverb was addressed to the King of Babylon.
For Rev. 8:11 look at these witnesses: (I believe wormwood represents the aftereffects of immorality, injustice and unrighteousness.) Deut. 29:18 So let there not be among you a man, woman, family or tribe whose heart turns away today from the Lord our God to go and serve the gods of those nations. Let there not be among you a root bearing such bitter poison and wormwood. Deut. 29:19 If there is such a person, when he hears the words of this curse, he will bless himself secretly, saying to himself, "I will be all right, even though I will stubbornly keep doing whatever I feel like doing; so that I, although "dry" (sinful,) will be added to the "watered" (righteous.) Deut. 29:20 But the Lord will not forgive him. Rather, the anger and jealousy of the Lord will blaze up against that person.
The second witness is Amos 6:12 Do horses run on rock? Does one plow there with oxen? Yet you have turned justice into poison and the fruit of righteousness into bitter wormwood.
The third witness would be Prov. 5:3-4 For the lips of a woman who is a stranger drop honey, her mouth is smoother than oil; but in the end she is as bitter as wormwood, sharp as a double edged sword.
The fourth witness would be Jer. 23:15 Therefore, this is what the Lord of Hosts says concerning this prophets: "I will feed them bitter wormwood and make them drink poisonous water, for ungodliness has spread through the land fro the prophets of Jerusalem."
Grace be with you.
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Considering ALL the ABOVE :lol: It just got quicked to me another way too. HE is GOOD Bless our Great God in Jesus Christ!
Awesome!
John 5:39 Search THE SCRIPTURES; for IN THEM ye think ye have eternal life: and THEY ARE THEY WHICH TESTIFY OF "ME".
Jerm 51:63 And it shall be, "WHEN" thou hast made AN END of reading "THIS BOOK", that thou shalt BIND A "STONE" TO IT, and CAST IT INTO the MIDST of EUPHRATES:
The STONE!
Romans 10:4 For CHRIST IS "THE END" of "THE LAW" for righteousness to every one that believeth.
HE IS "THE STONE" who was BOUND TO "THE BOOK" (BIND THE TESTIMONY) HE is the FULFILLMENT and HIM IN US
LO I COME it IS WRITTEN "OF ME" IN THE VOLUME OF THE BOOK
Romans 3:21 But NOW the righteousness of God WITHOUT THE LAW is MANIFESTED, "being WITNESSED" BY "the law and the prophets"
The SUM of THY WORD IS TRUTH
I AM "THE TRUTH"
HE SURE IS!!!
Daniel
Hi Daniel, this made me think about bondage, the law; and the fear it brings.
But Christ is the end of the law, the end of bondage; and when He comes, fear is thrown out.
(Joh 12:15) `Fear not, daughter of Sion, lo, thy king doth come, sitting on an a@@' colt.'
(Rom 8:15) for ye did not receive a spirit of bondage again for fear, but ye did receive a spirit of adoption in which we cry, `Abba--Father.'
(2Ti 1:7) for God did not give us a spirit of fear, but of power, and of love, and of a sound mind;
(1Jo 4:18) fear is not in the love, but the perfect love doth cast out the fear, because the fear hath punishment, and he who is fearing hath not been made perfect in the love;
The Sum of the word is truth, He is truth. HE IS LOVE.
1Co 13:10 and when that which is perfect may come, then that which is in part shall become useless.
The stone had to be rolled away. He is the end of the law. YEHAAA. Move over, let LOVE/HIM take over.
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Rocky your hearing the same joyful sound! :lol: AMEN BRO!!! The GRACE that shall come to us, the REVELATION of our FOR EVER BLESSED SAVIOUR who died for us and WHO COMES and MANIFESTS HIMSELF TO US! I''m behind you on that bro. The PERFECT COME to whom we look all else be done away in our experience and the FULNESS of GOD. Being made PERFECT IN LOVE (GOD).
What a time of inexpressible and glorious joy, and power in THAT.
Great verses Rocky, LO I COME. Its ME I AM the TRUTH and the TRUTH MANIFESTED IN US, not in word only but DEED and POWER. WITHOUT HIM we can DO NOTHING :D Faith worketh by LOVE and the labouring TOGETHER WITH GOD IN LOVE IS WHAT ITS ALL ABOUT.
The EXCELLENCY OF HIM our HOPE OF GLORY :D :D :D
Now HE is "something" to get EXCITED ABOUT :wink:
Blessings
Daniel
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Jennifer I missed you back there :lol:
Wonderful verses, just wonderful!
Daniel :D
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Chrissie's input on Rev. 8 requires more meditation and prayer, however for Rev. 8:10 you might re-read Lake of Fire part 9, wherein Isa. 14:4 & 11 would indicate this proverb was addressed to the King of Babylon.
Yes, I am familiar with the verse and the proverb taken up against the King of Babylon. However, I still see a relationship there to Satan; where is Satan’s seat? I was more specifically relating that verse to:
Luk 10:17-18 And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord,
even the devils are subject unto us through thy name. And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.
Joh 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.[/list:u]
For Rev. 8:11 look at these witnesses: (I believe wormwood represents the aftereffects of immorality, injustice and unrighteousness.) Deut. 29:18 So let there not be among you a man, woman, family or tribe whose heart turns away today from the Lord our God to go and serve the gods of those nations. Let there not be among you a root bearing such bitter poison and wormwood. Deut. 29:19 If there is such a person, when he hears the words of this curse, he will bless himself secretly, saying to himself, "I will be all right, even though I will stubbornly keep doing whatever I feel like doing; so that I, although "dry" (sinful,) will be added to the "watered" (righteous.) Deut. 29:20 But the Lord will not forgive him. Rather, the anger and jealousy of the Lord will blaze up against that person.
The second witness is Amos 6:12 Do horses run on rock? Does one plow there with oxen? Yet you have turned justice into poison and the fruit of righteousness into bitter wormwood.
The third witness would be Prov. 5:3-4 For the lips of a woman who is a stranger drop honey, her mouth is smoother than oil; but in the end she is as bitter as wormwood, sharp as a double edged sword.
The fourth witness would be Jer. 23:15 Therefore, this is what the Lord of Hosts says concerning this prophets: "I will feed them bitter wormwood and make them drink poisonous water, for ungodliness has spread through the land fro the prophets of Jerusalem."
Grace be with you.
All a result of serving the lusts of the flesh, which is what Satan dines on, right?
Wormwood (la‛ănâh) means curse or to curse and what do we know about Satan?
Gen 3:14 And the LORD God said unto the serpent, Because thou hast done this,
thou art cursed above all cattle, and above every beast of the field; upon thy belly shalt thou go, and dust shalt thou eat all the days of thy life:[/list:u]
Even the ground (earth) was cursed because of Adam’s transgression. And where did this star called wormwood fall from and to? That is what I was looking at and considering when I mentioned Satan in relation to the star falling from heaven (called wormwood)… but really I was asking more about the ‘third part’.
There is lots of stuff about the ‘third part’ in the scriptures. Some having to do with the temple sacrifices, that verse about God bringing ‘the third part’ through the fire and making them His people and the verses in Revelation.
I was looking at all the things that are addressed or that happen to the ‘third part’ prior to the LAST three sounds of the trumpet (called “woes� to the earth), and wondering how they tie into ‘the third part’ that God BRINGS THROUGH THE FIRE and the four angels who are not allowed to release the winds from the four corners of the earth UNTIL GOD’S PEOPLE ON THE EARTH ARE SEALED (even prior to last seal being opened)?
So just looking at this third part and what it means and how it relates to those verses in Zec.
When the Lord comes He comes with judgment (fire), right? And judgment has begun at the house of God, for that is who He comes to first, right?
the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.
Joh 5:25 Verily, verily, I say unto you, The hour is coming, and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live.
Joh 12:31 Now is the judgment of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
Rom 13:11 And that, knowing the time, that now it is high time to awake out of sleep: for now is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
2Co 6:2 (For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, now is the accepted time; behold, now is the day of salvation.)
Col 1:26 Even the mystery which hath been hid from ages and from generations, but now is made manifest to his saints:
Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.[/list:u]
What does the third part in Zec and/or in Rev have to do with these verse?
For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.
1Pe 4:12 Beloved, think it not strange concerning the fiery trial which is to try you, as though some strange thing happened unto you:[/list:u]
Just some things I am looking at and trying to work out…. :wink:
Chrissie
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Daniel,
I had some further witnesses for your post on Rev. 16:12. "Considering the water thereof":
1st witness is Rev. 17:15-He continued, the waters you saw, where the great whore sat enthroned, represent nations, populations, races and languages.
2nd witness is Isa. 57:20-The wicked are like the restless sea--unable to be still, it's waters toss up mud and dirt.
Rev. 16:12 "was dried up":
1st witness is Jer. 50:38-A drought hangs over her waters; they will be dried up. For this is a land of idols; they go mad over these horrors of theirs.
2nd witness is Matt. 13:19-Whoever hears the message about the Kingdom, but doesn't understand it, is like seed sown along the path-the Evil One comes and seizes what was sown in his heart.
Considering next, kings of the east "prepared":
1st witness is Isa. 13:4 Listen! A tumult on the mountains-it sounds like a vast multitude! Listen! The uproar of the kingdoms of the nations gathering together! The Lord of Hosts is mustering an army for war.
2nd witness is Isa. 13:5 They come from a distant land, from beyond the horizon, the Lord with the weapons of his wrath, to lay the whole earth waste.
Considering next, and the four angels which were "prepared":
1st witness is Jer. 49:36-I shall bring four winds against Elam from the four quarters of heaven; I shall scatter them to all these winds, and there will be no nation to which the exiles from Elam do not go.
2nd witness is Zech. 2:6-Away, away! Flee from the land of the north, says the Lord, for I have dispersed you to the four winds of heaven, says the Lord.
3rd witness is Zech. 2:7-Away! Escape you people of Zion who live in Babylon.
4th witness is Matt. 24:31-With a trumpet blast he will send out his angels, and they will gather his chosen from the four winds, from the farthest bounds of heaven on everyside.
Chrissie,
Looking at Zech. 13:9-And I will bring THE THIRD PART through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I WILL SAY, IT IS MY PEOPLE; AND THEY SHALL SAY, THE LORD IS MY GOD.
Here's what I notice: The phrase "THE THIRD PART" is shown in Zech. 13:8-In time, throughout that land, says the Lord, "two-thirds of those in it will be destroyed--they will die, but one-third will remain.
Breaking down Zech. 13:9 into bites, I will give you the appropriate witnesses (as I see them):
THE THIRD PART through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined:
1st witness is Isa. 48:10-"Look, I have refined you, but not (as severely) as silver; (rather) I have tested you in the furnace of affliction.
And will try them as gold:
1st witness is 1 Pet. 1:6-Rejoice in this, even though for a little while you may have to experience grief in various trials.
2nd witness is 1 Pet. 1:7-Even gold is tested for genuineness by fire. The purpose of these trials is so that your trust's genuiness, which is far more valuable than perishable gold, will be judged worthy of praise, glory and honor at the revealing of Christ the Messiah.
They shall call on my name and I will hear them:
1st witness is Ps. 50:15-and call on me when you are in trouble; I will deliver you; and you will honor me.
2nd witness is Zech. 10:6-I will strengthen the house of Judah and save the house of Joseph. I will bring them back in my compassion for them; they be as if I hadn't driven them out; for I am the Lord their God, and I will answer them.
I will say it is my people and they shall say, the Lord is my God.:
1st witness is Jer. 30:22-You will be my people, and I will be your God."
2nd witness is Ezek. 11:19 & 20-"And I will give them unity of heart. I will put a new spirit among you. I will remove from their bodies the hearts of stone and give them hearts of flesh; Ezek. 11:20-so that they will live by my regulations, obey my rulings and act by them. Then they will be my people, and I will be their God.
Grace be with you both.
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Amen Jennifer! GREAT POST!!!
Lots of wonderful thought out verses :D
The Lord bless YOU too sister
Daniel
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Chrissie,
Looking at Zech. 13:9-And I will bring THE THIRD PART through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I WILL SAY, IT IS MY PEOPLE; AND THEY SHALL SAY, THE LORD IS MY GOD.
Here's what I notice: The phrase "THE THIRD PART" is shown in Zech. 13:8-In time, throughout that land, says the Lord, "two-thirds of those in it will be destroyed--they will die, but one-third will remain.
Breaking down Zech. 13:9 into bites, I will give you the appropriate witnesses (as I see them):
THE THIRD PART through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined:
1st witness is Isa. 48:10-"Look, I have refined you, but not (as severely) as silver; (rather) I have tested you in the furnace of affliction.
Jennifer, Are those words in parenthesis yours or are they in the translation that you are using? Just curious. :D
The KJV, which I usually reference has “but not WITH silver�, rather than “but not as silver� (in Isa). That doesn’t even make sense!! :lol: But I do see where some of the other translations do have not as silver.
And will try them as gold:
1st witness is 1 Pet. 1:6-Rejoice in this, even though for a little while you may have to experience grief in various trials.
2nd witness is 1 Pet. 1:7-Even gold is tested for genuineness by fire. The purpose of these trials is so that your trust's genuiness, which is far more valuable than perishable gold, will be judged worthy of praise, glory and honor at the revealing of Christ the Messiah.
I wonder if there is a difference between being tried as silver and being tried as gold?
Silver here:
Psa 12:6 The words of the LORD
are pure words: as silver tried in a furnace of earth, purified seven times.[/list:u]WOW!! :shock: Maybe being tried WITH silver DOES make sense?? :D
Psa 66:10 For thou, O God, hast proved us:
thou hast tried us, as silver is tried.
Zec 13:9 And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.[/list:u]BOTH mentioned there!!
Gold here:
Job 23:10 But he knoweth the way that I take:
when he hath tried me, I shall come forth as gold.
Zec 13:9 And I will bring the third part through the fire, and will refine them as silver is refined, and will try them as gold is tried: they shall call on my name, and I will hear them: I will say, It is my people: and they shall say, The LORD is my God.
1Pe 1:7 That the trial of your faith, being much more precious than of gold that perisheth, though it be tried with fire, might be found unto praise and honour and glory at the appearing of Jesus Christ:
Rev 3:18 I counsel thee to buy of me gold tried in the fire, that thou mayest be rich; and white raiment, that thou mayest be clothed, and that the shame of thy nakedness do not appear; and anoint thine eyes with eyesalve, that thou mayest see.[/list:u]
They shall call on my name and I will hear them:
1st witness is Ps. 50:15-and call on me when you are in trouble; I will deliver you; and you will honor me.
2nd witness is Zech. 10:6-I will strengthen the house of Judah and save the house of Joseph. I will bring them back in my compassion for them; they be as if I hadn't driven them out; for I am the Lord their God, and I will answer them.
AMEN!!
I will say it is my people and they shall say, the Lord is my God.:
1st witness is Jer. 30:22-You will be my people, and I will be your God."
2nd witness is Ezek. 11:19 & 20-"And I will give them unity of heart. I will put a new spirit among you. I will remove from their bodies the hearts of stone and give them hearts of flesh; Ezek. 11:20-so that they will live by my regulations, obey my rulings and act by them. Then they will be my people, and I will be their God.
Amen, the Lord is my God!!!! [-o<
Grace be with you both.
Grace and Blessings, to you too!!
Chrissie
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Hi Chrissie,
I'm behind on answering all your questions, so I'll start with your post from Saturday, June 3 at 10:34 am.
First question you asked: Where is Satan's seat?
It is the world-wide CHURCH of APOSTATE RELIGION. Read Jer. 51:9-We tried to heal Babylon, but she cannot be healed. So leave her alone and each of us will return to his own country. For the judgement against her rises to the skies and reaches even the clouds. His ministers are listed in 2 Corn. 11:13-15 -The fact is that such men are pseudo-emissaries: they tell lies about their work and masquerade as emissaries of the Messiah. There is nothing surprising in that, for the Adversary himself masquerades as an angel of light; so it's no great thing if his workers masquerade as servants of righteousness. They will meet the end their deeds deserve. Satan is the god of this world: 2 Corn. 4:4-They do not come to trust because the god of this world has blinded their minds, in order to prevent them from seeing the light shining from the Good News about the glory of the Messiah, who is the image of God.
In reference to Luke 10:17-18 -And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through they name. And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.
First, finish reading the thought by finishing verses 10:19 & 20: -"Remember, I have given you authority; so you can trample down snakes and scorpions, indeed, all the Enemy's forces; and you will remain completely unharmed. Nevertheless, don't be glad that the spirits submit to you; be glad that your names have been recorded in heaven." This helps you to see that Jesus was speaking figuratively, alluding to the future ousting of Satan from heaven spoken of in Rev. 12:9-12. Re-read especially verses 12:10 & 12 -Then I heard a loud voice in heaven saying, "Now have come God's victory, power and kingship, and the authority of his Messiah; because the Accuser of our brothers, who accuses them day and night before God, has been thrown out! (12)-"Therefore, rejoice, heaven and you who live there! But woe to you, land and sea, for the Adversary has come down to you and he is very angry, because he knows that his time is short!"
John 12:31 Now is the judgement of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
Can you see how this verse (John 12:31) relates to Rev. 10 & 12?
What does Satan dine on? (paraphrasing you)
He dines on the manifestations from the carnal mind which is at eminity with our spiritual body.
Regarding Gen. 3:14, what is your question?
Your next question regarding the star Wormwood-where did it fall from/to?
Looking at other witnesses in the bible we can see that stars can represent rulership: Num. 24:17-I see him, but not now; I behold him, but not soon-a star will step forth from Jacob, a scepter will arise from Israel, to crush the corners of Mo'av and destroy all descendants of Shet.
In the taunt-song against the king of Babylon we see the king's thoughts of raising himself above the earth making himself like God: Isa. 14:13-16
(13)-You thought to yourself, "I will scale the heavens, I will raise my throne above God's stars. I will sit on the Mount of Assembly far away in the North. (14)-I will rise past the tops of the clouds, I will make myself like the Most High! (15)-Instead you are brought down to Sh'ol, to the uttermost depths of the pit. (16)-Those who see you will stare at you, reflecting on what has become of you: "Is this THE MAN who shook the earth, who made kingdoms tremble,"
Even cities are portrayed as stars: Luke 10:15-And you Capernaum, will you be exalted to heaven? No, you will be brought down to Sh'ol!
Both these examples represent Wormwood qualities of ungodliness actions which take carnal self-exaltation to the grave.
For your questions regarding the "third part" I believe I've responded already.
As far as what happens to the third part prior to the LAST three sounds of the trumpet in Revelation and their relationship to sealing, these are best to be left to the anticipated papers from Ray, hopefullly soon forthcming.
Meanwhile, regarding Jn. 4:23,25,31 and Rom. 13:11 and 2 Cor. 1:26 and Rev. 12:10, try looking again at them with your spiritual eyes in the context of 'WAS,IS,WILL BE' and see if you can find the witnesses. You are on to something---Now is profound.
Grace be with you.
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Some good points Jennifer, The locusts CAME OUT OF THE SMOKE, these are they which are "holier then thou" God speaks of in Isaiah, twice the "son of" in appearance as scorpions which have a "sting" given power to torment, I'm remembering "the tormentors" of the parable and being handed over to Satan for the "destruction of the flesh".
Satan the "flesh King" :lol: He is King of all the children of PRIDE. Conceited (the trap of the devil) falling into the same condemnation. Pride goeth before destruction.
Having King over them the angel of the bottomless Pit (Abaddon and Apollyon) is Destroyer and Destruction (broad way leadeth to). The King of Pride goes before them. Paul had been there and noow boasted in the power God gave him which was NOT for unto destruction (as these were "given" power) but unto their "edification".
Notice the pit is "opened" as death and destruction (which are "a way" we take) is naked before HIM how much MORE the HEARTS of MEN. Makes sense.
Locusts have no King and they yet they are shown having one, both arre true at the same time, its a paradox. They are led about by their pride, which is the very scales on their eyes. The term "pit" I'm thinking is as the blind leading the blind both fall into the pit (appointed). Under the images in revelation it helps to speak concerning the spirit of a thing.
The Sun and air are "darkened" by "reason" of the "smoke of the pit". The God of "this world" blinding them ( the pride of this life) through which one cannot see the light of the glorious gospel.
Pharoah references the locusts as "death", there are whats called "messengers of death". Your right they have no power over you. Their power is in fact given to them but in Christ you have been given power over them (scorpions). Even John ate locusts. Elizabeth was "hid" for five months, this is all the time they have, five months.
God does everything so perfectly, those who walk in pride He is able to abase and those scales in His time fall right off :lol:
This is a wonderful study
Daniel
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Hi Chrissie,
I'm behind on answering all your questions, so I'll start with your post from Saturday, June 3 at 10:34 am.
First question you asked: Where is Satan's seat?
It is the world-wide CHURCH of APOSTATE RELIGION. Read Jer. 51:9-We tried to heal Babylon, but she cannot be healed. So leave her alone and each of us will return to his own country. For the judgement against her rises to the skies and reaches even the clouds. His ministers are listed in 2 Corn. 11:13-15 -The fact is that such men are pseudo-emissaries: they tell lies about their work and masquerade as emissaries of the Messiah. There is nothing surprising in that, for the Adversary himself masquerades as an angel of light; so it's no great thing if his workers masquerade as servants of righteousness. They will meet the end their deeds deserve. Satan is the god of this world: 2 Corn. 4:4-They do not come to trust because the god of this world has blinded their minds, in order to prevent them from seeing the light shining from the Good News about the glory of the Messiah, who is the image of God.
In reference to Luke 10:17-18 -And the seventy returned again with joy, saying, Lord, even the devils are subject unto us through they name. And he said unto them, I beheld Satan as lightning fall from heaven.
First, finish reading the thought by finishing verses 10:19 & 20: -"Remember, I have given you authority; so you can trample down snakes and scorpions, indeed, all the Enemy's forces; and you will remain completely unharmed. Nevertheless, don't be glad that the spirits submit to you; be glad that your names have been recorded in heaven." This helps you to see that Jesus was speaking figuratively, alluding to the future ousting of Satan from heaven spoken of in Rev. 12:9-12. Re-read especially verses 12:10 & 12 -Then I heard a loud voice in heaven saying, "Now have come God's victory, power and kingship, and the authority of his Messiah; because the Accuser of our brothers, who accuses them day and night before God, has been thrown out! (12)-"Therefore, rejoice, heaven and you who live there! But woe to you, land and sea, for the Adversary has come down to you and he is very angry, because he knows that his time is short!"
John 12:31 Now is the judgement of this world: now shall the prince of this world be cast out.
Can you see how this verse (John 12:31) relates to Rev. 10 & 12?
What does Satan dine on? (paraphrasing you)
He dines on the manifestations from the carnal mind which is at eminity with our spiritual body.
Regarding Gen. 3:14, what is your question?
Your next question regarding the star Wormwood-where did it fall from/to?
Looking at other witnesses in the bible we can see that stars can represent rulership: Num. 24:17-I see him, but not now; I behold him, but not soon-a star will step forth from Jacob, a scepter will arise from Israel, to crush the corners of Mo'av and destroy all descendants of Shet.
In the taunt-song against the king of Babylon we see the king's thoughts of raising himself above the earth making himself like God: Isa. 14:13-16
(13)-You thought to yourself, "I will scale the heavens, I will raise my throne above God's stars. I will sit on the Mount of Assembly far away in the North. (14)-I will rise past the tops of the clouds, I will make myself like the Most High! (15)-Instead you are brought down to Sh'ol, to the uttermost depths of the pit. (16)-Those who see you will stare at you, reflecting on what has become of you: "Is this THE MAN who shook the earth, who made kingdoms tremble,"
Even cities are portrayed as stars: Luke 10:15-And you Capernaum, will you be exalted to heaven? No, you will be brought down to Sh'ol!
Both these examples represent Wormwood qualities of ungodliness actions which take carnal self-exaltation to the grave.
For your questions regarding the "third part" I believe I've responded already.
As far as what happens to the third part prior to the LAST three sounds of the trumpet in Revelation and their relationship to sealing, these are best to be left to the anticipated papers from Ray, hopefullly soon forthcming.
Meanwhile, regarding Jn. 4:23,25,31 and Rom. 13:11 and 2 Cor. 1:26 and Rev. 12:10, try looking again at them with your spiritual eyes in the context of 'WAS,IS,WILL BE' and see if you can find the witnesses. You are on to something---Now is profound.
Grace be with you.
:shock: I'm sorry I didn't realize that I didn't have on my spiritual eyes. No wonder it was so dark in here. :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:
Jennifer, my 'questions' were really meant to be rhetorical. :oops: I didn’t mean for you to go through so much trouble to give answers, so I'm sorry if I put you to any trouble. :oops:
But thank you for adding to the discussion and giving additonal witnesses. :mrgreen: =D>
Blessings,
Chrissie
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Hey Chrissie,
It's no trouble at all sharing God's word. Keep the questions coming!!! I'm learning more each time I search again for the answers to questions.
There is so much wisdom and understanding to be gleaned, and we can only take in so much food at a time for digestion.
Anyways, this is in answer to your post of today, at 11:36 am.
Are the words in parenthesis yours or are they in the translation that you are using?
They are in the translation. I am using the Complete Jewish Bible that has the translation of the NT from the ancient Greek originals. It doesn't use any Christian Old Testament because Christians modify the Masoretic text with information gleaned from the Septuagint and other versions.
My secondary Bible is the KJV from 1891.
To your question as to whether there is a difference between being tried as silver and being tried as gold:
Yes. Silver has other metals in it and requires more fire to burn out the dross, gangue and scummy foreign matter which is done in a crucible. Gold, however, is called a nobel metal as it occurs naturally with no impurities, and therefore is fired in a furnace.
Here's some interesting witnesses: Prov. 17:3-The crucible (tests) silver, and the furnace (tests) gold, but the one who tests hearts is God.
Prov. 27:21-The crucible (tests) silver, and the furnace (tests) gold, but a person (is tested) by (his reaction to) praise.
Contrast this with the wicked judged as dross:
Ezek. 22:18-Human being, the house of Isra'el has become an alloy of base metals for me; they are all copper, tin, iron and lead mixed together in the crucible, the dross left over from the silver.
Ezek. 22:20-Then, just as they collect silver, copper, iron, lead and tin into a crucible and blow fire on it to melt it down; so likewise I will collect you in my anger and fury, throw you in there and melt you down.
Ezek. 22:21-Yes, I will collect you and blow on you with the fire of my rage, and you will be melted down in it.
Here's a couple more:
Ps. 119:119-You discard the wicked of the earth like slag; this is why I love your instruction.
Prov. 25:4,5-Remove the impurities from the silver, and the smith has material to make a vessel. Remove the wicked from the king's presence, and his throne will rest firmly on righteousness.
Regarding your comment:
WOW!!Maybe being tried WITH silver DOES make sense??
Don't you mean tried AS silver?
Regarding your two scriptures:
Psa 66:10 For thou, O God, hast proved us: thou has tried us, as silver is tried. & Job 23:10 But he knoweth the way that I take: when he hath tried me, I shall come forth as gold.
It is worded in my CJB thus: Psa. 66:10-For you, God, have tested us, refined us as silver is refined. Job 23:10-Yet he knows the way I take; when he has tested me, I will come out like gold.
Here's one I find inspiring:
2 Sam. 22:31-As for God, his way is perfect, the word of God has been tested by fire; he shields all who take refuge in him.
Grace be with you.
-
Very good thread, been reading and learning while watching.
I have a question for you Jennifer. The Complete Jewish Bible, is it available to download online anywhere? I've never heard of that one.
God bless,
Gary
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Hey Chrissie,
It's no trouble at all sharing God's word. Keep the questions coming
I'm learning more each time I search again for the answers to questions.
There is so much wisdom and understanding to be gleaned, and we can only take in so much food at a time for digestion.
Jennifer, thanks again. As I said the questions were rhetorical and I didn't mean for you to go digging for the answers. But I am glad that you getting something out of doing that. That's GREAT!! I am sure others are as well. And the more witnesses the merrier!! So dig away. :lol: :lol:
Anyways, this is in answer to your post of today, at 11:36 am.
Are the words in parenthesis yours or are they in the translation that you are using?
They are in the translation. I am using the Complete Jewish Bible that has the translation of the NT from the ancient Greek originals. It doesn't use any Christian Old Testament because Christians modify the Masoretic text with information gleaned from the Septuagint and other versions.
My secondary Bible is the KJV from 1891.
Thank you. I think my mother has that Bible. I have wanted to borrow it, but haven't done so yet. I so love e-sword and studying that way. I'll have to check to see if that is available online.
To your question as to whether there is a difference between being tried as silver and being tried as gold:
Yes. Silver has other metals in it and requires more fire to burn out the dross, gangue and scummy foreign matter which is done in a crucible. Gold, however, is called a nobel metal as it occurs naturally with no impurities, and therefore is fired in a furnace.
Here's some interesting witnesses: Prov. 17:3-The crucible (tests) silver, and the furnace (tests) gold, but the one who tests hearts is God.
Prov. 27:21-The crucible (tests) silver, and the furnace (tests) gold, but a person (is tested) by (his reaction to) praise.
Contrast this with the wicked judged as dross:
Ezek. 22:18-Human being, the house of Isra'el has become an alloy of base metals for me; they are all copper, tin, iron and lead mixed together in the crucible, the dross left over from the silver.
Ezek. 22:20-Then, just as they collect silver, copper, iron, lead and tin into a crucible and blow fire on it to melt it down; so likewise I will collect you in my anger and fury, throw you in there and melt you down.
Ezek. 22:21-Yes, I will collect you and blow on you with the fire of my rage, and you will be melted down in it.
Here's a couple more:
Ps. 119:119-You discard the wicked of the earth like slag; this is why I love your instruction.
Prov. 25:4,5-Remove the impurities from the silver, and the smith has material to make a vessel. Remove the wicked from the king's presence, and his throne will rest firmly on righteousness.
Thank you.
Regarding your comment:
WOW!!Maybe being tried WITH silver DOES make sense??
Don't you mean tried AS silver?
No, I did mean “with�. As I said, the translation that I was using (KJV) used the word “with� in that verse in Isa, which made no sense to me until I read the other verse about the pure word of the Lord being "as silver". That's why I mused about that making sense then, after all... Being tried WITH silver (the pure word of the Lord)?? Get it?? :lol: Sorry! :oops: :oops:
Regarding your two scriptures:
Psa 66:10 For thou, O God, hast proved us: thou has tried us, as silver is tried. & Job 23:10 But he knoweth the way that I take: when he hath tried me, I shall come forth as gold.
It is worded in my CJB thus: Psa. 66:10-For you, God, have tested us, refined us as silver is refined. Job 23:10-Yet he knows the way I take; when he has tested me, I will come out like gold.
Here's one I find inspiring:
2 Sam. 22:31-As for God, his way is perfect, the word of God has been tested by fire; he shields all who take refuge in him.
Grace be with you.
Thanks,
Grace be with you, too.
Chrissie
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Hi Orion77,
The CJB is produced by Jewish New Testament Publications, Inc. I only could find it at Barnes & Noble, a bookstore here in Michigan. You can go on their website and order: www.bn.com.
Grace be with you.
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Gary (or anyone else interested):
The CJB is available at: Crosswalk.com (http://bible.crosswalk.com)
Still looking for a module for download that would work in e-sword.
Is is available for palm or pocket pc Here (http://www.gmpsoft.com/newsletter/0222_05.html)
Chrissie
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Chrissie,
Thanks for the input. Let us know if you find the module.
Grace be with you.
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Chrissie,
Thanks for the input. Let us know if you find the module.
Grace be with you.
Hi Jennifer,
From what I can gather so far, it used to be available at The Chan website. Since it is not there anymore (for download) I'm thinking that they ran into copyright problems or did/do not have permission to distribute it that way. Also heard mention of it being at e-sword, so maybe they had to remove it as well??
I'll keep checking around, but having it over the internet may be the best we can do for now, unless we run out and buy the book. (Or borrow it from mom :wink: which is what I may do, to at least get a feel for it first before I decide.)
Chrissie