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=> General Discussions => Topic started by: jennie on January 20, 2007, 07:46:43 PM
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My neighbor called me over the other day to get a book. She wanted me to read it and told me that it had helped her so much to accept her husband's passing. the book is called "90 Minutes in Heaven". I read it and am still trying to "puzzle out" what I think about it. Has anyone read this? If so, what did you think? Much love, Jennie
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Hi Jennie,
No I have never read that book, but, I would be careful if anyone said that they had experienced a physical heaven. I have learned through Ray's site that heaven is not a physical place but that it is a spiritual state of mind and heart. (Just as hell is not a physical place,rather a state of ones heart and mind.)
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True!
be very careful with that stuff!
Mary K Baxter claims to have been to Heaven, but She also claims to have been to Hell, and it is completely see through but someone more clever might not be.
having said that, I read the final quest before I came to any sort of understanding of the truth, and I still can't find fault with it!
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Marty,
What is the final truth? (a book?) :D
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True!
be very careful with that stuff!
Mary K Baxter claims to have been to Heaven, but She also claims to have been to Hell, and it is completely see through but someone more clever might not be.
having said that, I read the final quest before I came to any sort of understanding of the truth, and I still can't find fault with it!
You mentioned the "Final Quest." Are you referring to the book by Rick Joyner? I read that book years ago, as well as "The Call," and "The Torch and the Sword."
I've thought about those books a little bit since coming to this understanding of there being no such thing as an eternal hell, and universal reconciliation. There may be some truth in them. I just wondered if you had any more input on that.
- Jason
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The funny thing is, since I come to understand the truths on this website, I would have expected to have looked back on those books and realised they were fake however there is this one particular part that perplexes me.
Rick Joyner as far as I know is just a standard Hell believing Christian type, However in "The Call" He talks to Jesus about the last vision He had and is talking about how the earth seemed so full of God's glory but then He lost that feeling and went completely the opposite way and He felt that He was in Hell it self, but this is what Jesus says,
"You walk on the edge of Hell everyday"
Now how I see it is that Jesus means there is no Hell but what you make for yourself in this life!
for someone who believes in a literal Hell, that seems a little strange!
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There is chastisement and there is correction. God is a consuming fire. This could be experienced as proverbial but not eternal Hell for some, >:((and a process that leads to a reward for others. 8)
1 Cor 3 : 13 The work of each one will become plainly, openly known, shown for what it is; for the day of Christ will disclose and declare it, because it will be revealed with fire, and the fire will test and critically appraise the character and worth of the work each person has done. 14. If the work which any person has built on this Foundation, any product of his efforts whatever, survives this test, he will get his reward. 15. But if any person’s work is burned up under the test, he will suffer the loss of it all, losing his reward, though he himself will be saved, but only as one who has passed through fire.
Peace be to you
Arcturus :)
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but this is what Jesus says,
"You walk on the edge of Hell everyday"
Now how I see it is that Jesus means there is no Hell but what you make for yourself in this life!
for someone who believes in a literal Hell, that seems a little strange!
Hello Marty,
This quote from Mr. Joyner that he attributes to Jesus strikes me as "adding to the Words of this book" does he (Joyner) have the scriptural witnesses to validate these words?
How can one walk on the edge of a non existent place? Unless he is speaking of the true definition of hell which is the grave.
His Peace and Wisdom to you,
Joe
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To add Joe
...even if Jesus meant Hell as grave....even that statement would make Jesus a liar, a fool and a looser through the statement claimed to have been quoted from HIm because He knows the number of our days and He has the keys of death. Rev 1 : 18 :D
I have not read Joyner but it sure shows who he has been listening to is not Jesus!
Brings to mind 2 Tim 4 : 3 For the time is coming when people will not tolerate, endure sound and wholesome instruction.... :D
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
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Rick Joyner is a phony and needs to be kicked in the crotch. I would love love to do it.
Longhorn
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;D ;D :D ;D ;D
God grant me the
Serenity to accept the things
I cannot change.
Courage to change the things
I can; and
Wisdom to know the difference.
Living one day at a time;
Enjoying one moment at a time;
Accepting hardship
As the pathway to peace.
Taking as Jesus did,
This sinful world as it is,
Not as I would have it;
Trusting that He will make all things
Right, if I surrender to His will.
That I may be reasonably happy
In this life,
And supremely happy
With Him forever in the next.
AMEN. :)
Longhorn don't you know you will judge the angels?... ;D :D :)
Peace and joy to you
Arcturus :)
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To add Joe
...even if Jesus meant Hell as grave....even that statement would make Jesus a liar, a fool and a looser through the statement claimed to have been quoted from HIm because He knows the number of our days and He has the keys of death. Rev 1 : 18 :D
Very true and an excellent point, Jesus would know our time and season but we live by faith and do not know and can not add one minute to our life or one inch to our stature.
Thanks Arcturus.
His Peace and Wisdom to you,
Joe
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You know Jesus did talk about Hades aswell but I don't think that He believed in the mythology of the Greek underworld, but He used it because it was a word people were familliar with.
I didn't say that Rick Joyer wasn't a phony, and neither did I recomend and buying all His books!
I just said it seemed a little strange.
I personally have not found anything in those books that seems untoward at all.
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Hello Marty,
Actually it is the translator's bias that influences Matt. 16:18 and other verses, Jesus was saying that death and the grave would not prevail against His Chosen.
As far as Rick Joyner goes have you seen his "Joint Prophecies" with Rabbi Cohen?
Here they are;
The 1970s, when Jerusalem returned to Jewish hands, was the end of the Gentile Age.
The 1990s are moving on the spirit of revival that began with the Jesus Movement, which was the source of the Messianic movement.
The Messianic people are a prophetic righteous remnant, "that are calling the Church back to their Jewish roots" and "they are back to become a prophetic call to the nation of Israel."
Messianic people are, "THE HEAD," meaning, of the Body of Christ and the First Fruits.
Whole communities will come to Y’eshua because of their witness.
Jews and Gentiles will be looking to the Messianics to explain the Word of God.
Joyner expressed a concern that Messianics: ". . .would not be corrupted by too many relationships with the Church" and that they are not supposed to be like the Church nor the Church like them as that would, "mess everything up."
Racism is one of the ultimate enemies.
There is a revolution going on in the Church.
Reconciliation happens when there is restitution, and there’s going to be a lot of restitution for the Messianic people as Jews.
Messianic people will have a better ability to witness, heal, discern and utilize spiritual gifts than others.
Messianics are going to help us (the Church) restore our foundations to where they belong -- and we won’t get where we’re supposed to be without their help.
Very much in the physical, very light on the spiritual, there is much more of this kind of stuff that can be found in his ministry. This is just the very tip of the iceburg.
His Peace and Wisdom to you,
Joe
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Thank you for clearing that up for Me hillsbororiver!
I admitt that I was wrong, thank you for showing my error!
Martinez.
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Rick Joyner is a phony and needs to be kicked in the crotch. I would love love to do it.
Longhorn
I can't believe you said that! No spirit of religion there.... just say what you mean. he he ;)
~Paula
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Longhorn,
I'll be more than willing to hold him down while you deliver that glancing blow. ;D
Sincerely,
Anne C. McGuire
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Hello Marty,
Actually it is the translator's bias that influences Matt. 16:18 and other verses, Jesus was saying that death and the grave would not prevail against His Chosen.
As far as Rick Joyner goes have you seen his "Joint Prophecies" with Rabbi Cohen?
Here they are;
The 1970s, when Jerusalem returned to Jewish hands, was the end of the Gentile Age.
The 1990s are moving on the spirit of revival that began with the Jesus Movement, which was the source of the Messianic movement.
The Messianic people are a prophetic righteous remnant, "that are calling the Church back to their Jewish roots" and "they are back to become a prophetic call to the nation of Israel."
Messianic people are, "THE HEAD," meaning, of the Body of Christ and the First Fruits.
Whole communities will come to Y’eshua because of their witness.
Jews and Gentiles will be looking to the Messianics to explain the Word of God.
Joyner expressed a concern that Messianics: ". . .would not be corrupted by too many relationships with the Church" and that they are not supposed to be like the Church nor the Church like them as that would, "mess everything up."
Racism is one of the ultimate enemies.
There is a revolution going on in the Church.
Reconciliation happens when there is restitution, and there’s going to be a lot of restitution for the Messianic people as Jews.
Messianic people will have a better ability to witness, heal, discern and utilize spiritual gifts than others.
Messianics are going to help us (the Church) restore our foundations to where they belong -- and we won’t get where we’re supposed to be without their help.
Very much in the physical, very light on the spiritual, there is much more of this kind of stuff that can be found in his ministry. This is just the very tip of the iceburg.
His Peace and Wisdom to you,
Joe
Ok, alright already! I'll throw away my Rick Joyner books the Final Quest and The Call. :)
Actually I need to do some major housecleaning- I have many books that I need to
throw away now that God is opening my eyes to understand spiritual things. Praise God!
~Paula :)
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Thanks ya'll for all the input. I have a problem believing in what is written in the book but maybe that is just me. The author of the book said that God let him come into heaven for 90 minutes but sent him back to earth to tell others about what heaven is like. I've never really wondered too much about what is after this life. I just figure God has it under control so I don't have to wonder about it. I don't mean this as anything against someone else's questions and studies just that I have never felt the need myself. Much love, Jennie
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Mathew 6: 33-34
But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.
Therefore, take no thought for the morrow: for the morrow shall take thought for the things of itself. Sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof.
I'm with you Jennie. I want to learn to live right in this life, before worrying about the next. Most of the time, this means just getting thru the day for me (hopefully in a godly way). Of course, some days are better than others!
His love to you,
Lisa
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John 3 : 13....No one....NO ONE has EVER GONE UP TO HEAVEN but there is One Who has come DOWN FROM HEAVEN - the Son of Man Himself Who is dwells, has His home in heaven.
"Jesus said it I believe it and that is that." someone once said. ;D
Right on Lisa...sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof!
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
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Longhorn you are something else. You always make me laugh. So I guess this guy you want to kick in the nads is phony. Is that what you are trying to say? ;D ;D ;D
Your silly!!!!!!
bobby
PS. still laughing ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Martinez--
I've read a good deal of Rick Joyner's material in the past too....as a matter of fact, I've reviewed Christian books for about 4 years now and have been exposed to just about all that "Babylon" and others have to offer...I'm not an expert on anything...but I've just had time to ponder the following...
I've always been amazed at how an experienced blind person entering a new room for the first time, can figure out where to walk and sit and what to do right off the bat. But the fact remains that they have to rely upon:
(1) their hearing, sense of smell, taste, vibrations, sense of touch, etc.
(2) their "impressions" from echoes of their walking sticks and sometimes even "bumping into things"
(3) the guidance of others that "they trust" to help them...including their guide dogs if they have one
As spiritually blind people, I think we've all had to rely upon the same things to help us interpret the writing of God and of other people....we just didn't "get it" until our eyes were opened by God...until that happened, we relied upon:
(1) our hearing... "faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the Word of God..." (in other words...we can't have faith until we can hear...we can't hear until "the Word of God" Jesus, comes to us and gives us "ears to hear!" While in Babylon...our hearing seems very limited, if you will...
(2) our "impressions" of what is out there as we "bounce our own sounds/words" off of them
(3) the "guidance" of others that we trust; parent, spouse, clergy, world religious leaders, etc....
I really think that myself, Rick Joyner...and many other Christian authors, from what I've read, are trying very hard to "interpret" the dark without actually having true "vision" or "sight." Some work very hard at interpreting the "things" that are out there and come close in some cases....giving you some "truth" mixed in with the "lying." Being blind, however,they believe that they are giving you the "true picture." Do you get my point?
Now that Jesus is opening our eyes....we can really begin to "see" and discern for the first time!! This is both wonderful and frightening ....it gives us BOTH freedom....AND responsibility.....just as if someone had come along and given us the laser surgery necessary to remove physical blindness...in which case...we would then become BOTH free to move about and explore a world we'd never seen before AND RESPONSIBLE FOR WHAT WE SAW!
just my thought for the day...thanks for showing me something that helped me as well!
Joyce :)
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Hi Joyce,
I 'see' what your saying :)
mercy, peace, and love
Kat
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Joyce, You are so right!!! I AM AT A POINT IN MY LIFE TO WHERE I AM ACTUALLY BEING ABLE TO DISCERN GODS TRUTHS FOR THE FIRST TIME AND NOT ONLY THAT, BUT, AS YOU STATED, I AM BEING HELD ACCOUNTABLE BY HIM TO BACK UP MY BELIEFS AND TO 'EXPOSE THOSE WHOM CONTRADICT'. I get so excited that HE has blessed me with dicernment finally, as I have sought after it for the past 26 years and I must say that GOD opened my eyes just this past year AMEN!!!! I have been used by HIM to correct, rebuke, encourage etc..with these new found pearls, and my husband and I are equally yoked too. GOD IS SO Awesome!
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Kat-- very intuitive-- you c-r-a-c-k me up! :)
Hebrewroots-- you go girl! Joyce
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My neighbor called me over the other day to get a book. She wanted me to read it and told me that it had helped her so much to accept her husband's passing. the book is called "90 Minutes in Heaven". I read it and am still trying to "puzzle out" what I think about it. Has anyone read this? If so, what did you think? Much love, Jennie
Hi Jennie, I have not read it, but I wouldn't waste my time with it eighter. It sounds fake to me. Just like that Mary K Baxter fraud, who supposedly went to hell and she was walking around hell with Christ and Jesus would go up to a person in like a prison cell and is being burned by actual fire and Jesus tells him to 'be still'. While your burning in flames??? Be still? Unbelievable!
There's one instance in where there's a fairly young female [teen years] locked in a cell and she is hugging her teddy bear while bracing herself for the inferno that comes upon all the prison cells, passes, and then comes again in a neverneding cycle. It's really sick disturbing evil stuff. Mary K Baxter is evil, more so than a liar.
I can't believe I blieved in hell and all that garbage, that was before finding bible-truths.com Since I was a new believer, regularly attending the synagogue, I am embarrassed to admit that I actually believed her.............. 'cause I believed in hell :-[
Now I'm more upset with the person who gave me the book, sadly he still believes in all that crap. Thank God for opening my eyes and ears, and for Ray for writing those papers on hell. How stupid can we [the carnal minded man] be? Very stupid.
Take care,
Sorin
I can't believe I read that book, it was not the english version, but still, same lies being spewed nonetheless.
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Basically I have stopped reading ANY book related to ANY "Christian" dogma and have stuck exclusively to reading the Bible (as well as Ray's stuff and a few other like-minded teachers over the Internet), and, instead of letting Joyner or Hagee or Lindsey or whoever "interpret" what's in the Bible I am letting the Bible "interpret itself" from discernment God has given me in the several years I have searched for the truth. Unfortunately, along with that I have had to deal with family members and former-church "friends" that can't believe I'd be so foolish as not to believe in the "rapture", "free will" and "hell for eternity", knowing full well that no matter how I use the Bible to explain the truth, God has hardened their hearts and they won't see the truth. My husband helped me get out of the church I was going to, but he just won't see the truth. He gets very upset with me when I argue humans have no free will...he really believes he chose to be a Christian on his own volition! At this point the only folks I can talk about the Bible to are those who Christendom would say are "not saved" because they are the only ones who don't believe all the bullcrap dogma!
Again I will repeat a quote above from 2 Timothy: 3-4 --"For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears; and they shall turn away their ears from the truth..."--Deb
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Dear Snorky,
I seriously thought that I had written your post! I had to check to see that the signature that was on your post wasn't by me; it sounds exactly what I AM saying and exactly what I am doing with readinig only BT and similar sites on line (and chunking the other crap that I used to hold as truth) at this very time in my life. Even the scripture that you used was one that I had used/shared this very week; (nothing different except the husband situation)... we are definately at the same place spiritually right now; that 's great to know that the Lord has been working the same things in each of us at the same times and we are 'strangers' (in the sence that we have never met oneanother and we probably live many miles apart. Another AMAZING example of what and AMAZING CREATOR that we serve. (Those words that you wrote were my sentiments exactly.) BTW, thanks for the reminder that GOD DOES HARDEN THE HEARTS OF THOSE WHOM WILLNOT HEAR THESE TRUTHS! For some reason I forget this at times; maybe b/c I still forget that it isn't up to me to try to 'convert' them.
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GOD DOES HARDEN THE HEARTS OF THOSE WHOM WILLNOT HEAR THESE TRUTHS! For some reason I forget this at times; maybe b/c I still forget that it isn't up to me to try to 'convert' them.
....and to add Sue and Deb...we would be THEM in the same circumstances! We would be Hitler or anyone else we think is less holier than moi!...Sobering, humbling corrective thoughts.....for me.... :( good medicine! :D
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
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Exactly Arturus."..by Gods' grace go I.." :)