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=> Off Topic Discussions => Topic started by: Ricky on October 26, 2019, 01:16:48 PM
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Does Ray say anything about this story ? I have big trouble believing Noah's Ark. According to scripture Noah was 500 years old, and he built a boat 7 stories high and longer than a football field, hard to believe. But this, he was to bring aboard the ship 2 of every kind of animal there was for 40 days and nights. How did he travel the world to do this ? He would have needed a million pounds of food to feed them for 40 days. Where did the food come from ? There would have been thousand's of animal 'a on the boat. How could he clean up after them. This story is very hard to buy.
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Ray talks about the flood in this video: https://youtu.be/qh9qBUg8lVQ (https://youtu.be/qh9qBUg8lVQ)
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Hi Ricky,
First let me confess that I'm a believer, so you know which side I'm on... ::)
Just one little point to begin.
Noah didn't have to travel to collect the "one pair of each kind" of animals.
e.g. one pair of puppies, one pair of infant pigs, seven of infant cattle etc. and they grew and matured for one year.
God "sent them" to the ark location at the appropriate time and they went in to feed. Why not? Plus it was a miracle.
Gen 6:20, Gen 7:9, Gen 7:15-16
Of course my view is based upon possibility rather than upon provable Bible facts, but you can see where I am going with my understanding.
If we can believe in our own resurrection after rotting in the grave for centuries, then maybe we can give God credit for doing the humanly impossible to accomplish His loving purpose.
Kindly offered, Bob
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Start the video around 42 minutes in where Ray mentions Noah and the flood.
You can also listen to this where Ray goes into more detail: https://bible-truths.com/audio/Nash08ConfSession8A.mp3 (https://bible-truths.com/audio/Nash08ConfSession8A.mp3)
Or watch these two videos: https://youtu.be/PszDw1lr9MY (https://youtu.be/PszDw1lr9MY) and https://youtu.be/z9E0p_zDjsY (https://youtu.be/z9E0p_zDjsY)
Noah's flood was not global, it was a local flood. Noah did not take two of every animal on the planet. There was not enough room for that many animals. And there was not enough room for all the food required to keep the animals alive. And there were not enough people to feed and dispose of all the waste from so many animals, etc.
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Pardon my two cents, but for the unclean animals not being allowed on the ark this is what I found:
Gen 7:2 - Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female.
If Noah was 600 by the time the flood came I believe that was a miracle itself. I don't have a big opinion or scripture on whether it was global/local. I just assume the former and try to find the meaning behind it.
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I must be missing something here, 2 doves, 2 puppies, 7 cattle, you must be right, all these animals could never fit inside a ship that is bigger than a cruise ship 7 stories high longer than a football field, an impossible, right Dennis . Why would God tell Noah to build a ship that big for 2 puppies, 2 doves. Dennis said it would not be big enough for all the animals, Even though Noah was 500 years old, it would have taken this senior citizen 400 years to build it. How much help did he have, he only had 8 family members, is also hard to believe if he was that old.
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Pardon my two cents, but for the unclean animals not being allowed on the ark this is what I found:
Gen 7:2 - Of every clean beast thou shalt take to thee by sevens, the male and his female: and of beasts that are not clean by two, the male and his female.
If Noah was 600 by the time the flood came I believe that was a miracle itself. I don't have a big opinion or scripture on whether it was global/local. I just assume the former and try to find the meaning behind it.
I said I didn't think Noah would take pigs but then I started thinking about it and deleted the post but you must have been posting at the same time I deleted it. So there were unclean animals on the boat.
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I must be missing something here, 2 doves, 2 puppies, 7 cattle, you must be right, all these animals could never fit inside a ship that is bigger than a cruise ship 7 stories high longer than a football field, an impossible, right Dennis . Why would God tell Noah to build a ship that big for 2 puppies, 2 doves. Dennis said it would not be big enough for all the animals, Even though Noah was 500 years old, it would have taken this senior citizen 400 years to build it. How much help did he have, he only had 8 family members, is also hard to believe if he was that old.
The best thing would be to watch the three videos I referenced.
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I unlisted the two Noah's Ark videos on YouTube and replaced them with this new video "Noah's Flood was Not Global": https://youtu.be/Fie4lGQ_9kU (https://youtu.be/Fie4lGQ_9kU)
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What makes the most sense to me is at the time of Noah, there wasn't as many species of animals, insects etc as there is now. Psalm 104 29 hints at the destruction of all man and animals that breathe that weren't on the ark. v 30 God sends forth his spirit and the earth is renewed.
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Psalm 104:
7 But at your rebuke the waters fled, at the sound of your thunder they took to flight;
8 They flowed over the mountains, they went down into the valleys, to the place you assigned for them.
9 You set a boundary they cannot cross; never again will they cover the earth.
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Does this story have to be accepted as literal?
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Lareli,
I don't believe that we are on safe footing in our bible study if we can pick and choose what to believe.
If we accept that some statements are spiritual and others literal so be it, but we should evaluate how to decide based upon a set of principles rather than upon our feelings or what someone has shared with us.
Even the extensive training Ray Smith has shared with us will be understood differently by each individual. That is why the forum is so valuable as it allows us to examine one another.
My experience over about 50 years of Bible study is that I learned to correct what I once accepted out of ignorance.
When my wife and I were striving to raise four kids and tithe and make ends meet in our home, I didn't have the time or the resources to actually study correctly or to double check the meaning of every single word in a questionable scripture.
That was when I bought a Strong's Concordance and learned to use it.
Later when the kids were grown and bible study resources became available on the internet, I came to understand a lot that had been hidden from me previously.
In much counsel there is wisdom! So we need to believe that learning truth is HARD even when God's spirit is with us.
God wants it to be hard, so that we learn most importantly that without God's spirit we cannot grow in grace and knowledge. It is part of the lesson, to come to believe, that we are weak and simple and need the leading of God's spirit in everything we do.
There must be a valid reason for every word in the original scripture or God would not have provided it.
So it is most helpful to carefully compare scripture with scripture in the original meaning before translation has confused it for many.
Hope that my comments help a little. Indiana Bob
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Does this story have to be accepted as literal?
Properly translated, yes. Noah and the food are mentioned many times throughout the bible.
Luk 8:10 And he said, Unto you it is given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God: but to others in parables; that seeing they might not see, and hearing they might not understand.
As Ray puts it, you can shine the sun on it but they will never be able to see because they are blinded.
Joh 12:40 He hath blinded their eyes, and hardened their heart; that they should not see with their eyes, nor understand with their heart, and be converted, and I should heal them.
https://youtu.be/DALXJvHxMjs (https://youtu.be/DALXJvHxMjs)
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What is the value of believing this story as a literal and historical fact as opposed to believing that the story was written by divine inspiration to teach spiritual principles?
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What is the value of believing this story as a literal and historical fact as opposed to believing that the story was written by divine inspiration to teach spiritual principles?
It does seem a little odd, but who are we to question. It can be both a fact and a teaching story. Why not?
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1 Corinthians 10:1-11 reveals both the spiritual and literal application of Moses and the Israelite journey and disobedience in the wilderness, and how those literal situations happened as spiritual "examples" for the Elect (verses 6 and 11).