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=> General Discussions => Topic started by: lilitalienboi16 on October 15, 2007, 01:36:20 AM
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Anyone read this book? I read it a while ago, about 2 years ago back in highschool.
I wanted to share something that i just came across again as i was cleaning my room.
"We look for God to manifest Himself to His children. God only manifests Himself in His children. Other people see the manifestation, the child of God does not. We want to be consciouse of God, we cannot be conscious of our own consciousness and remain sane."
I though this statement was quiet beautiful, and i feel it has truth to it. The only part i would disagree on is that God doesn't ONLY manifests Himself in His children, He can manifest Himself anyway, but other then that this is a beautiful statement of truth. Atleast imo.
So anyone read the book, thoughts and comment on the quote?
I have others that i found quiet beautiful if you would like me to quote them.
God bless,
Alex
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I read that book for a long time. At first it was very hard to understand and then God started teaching me and I found things I didn't agree with. God used that book and many other things to teach me and encourage me on my journey.
I'll send you one I like in a PM because I think it may be against the forum rules to post it here.
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Hello Alex
Here is a quote ( not in the book you mention though) that comes to mind from your post.
Rev 3 : 20 Behold, I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears and listens to and heeds My Voice and opens the door, I will come in to him and will eat with him, and he with Me.
Mat 11 : 27 All things have been entrusted and delivered to Me by My Father; and no one fully knows and accurately understands the Son except the Father, and no one fully knows and accurately understands the Father except the Son and anyone to whom the Son deliberately wills to make Him known.
I would caution that the teachings you refer to more tend to feeding carnal comfort zones rather than inspiring obedience. Personally I find all the best sellers coming out of Christiandom, serve mammon and the needs to have our pains and fears appeased. They do little to nothing to reveal Christ. As Ray points out in his letter to James Kennedy :
First, let me state my position succinctly:
1. Whatever we teach must "glorify" God.
"Glory to God in the highest ... " (Lk. 2:14).
" ... that in all God may be glorified ... " (I Pt. 4:11).
2. Whatever we teach must not detract one iota from Christ's sacrifice for all humanity.
"For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men the man Christ Jesus; Who gave Himself a ransom for all to be testified in due time." (I Tim. 2:5-6)
"For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the savior of all men [mankind], specially [not exclusively] to those that believe. These things command and teach." (I Tim. 4:10-11)
I find that only in Ray's teachings the encouragement for us to labour and suffer reproach and follow Christ. Just look at what is revealed in Ray's teaching about the Beast that we are. This is what irks me that this very Beast will invent panacea's and opium's to pain kill our carnal deaths in order to satisfy our carnal flesh. I know I KNOW...I too need the comfort zones sometimes....I too yearn for relief and escape from agony. It is all too human a trait but as Jesus did not drink from the sponge when He thirsted on His Cross, neither should we and we should follow teachings that inspire us to follow Him and listen to Him.
Sorry Alex. I have read so many good sounding teachings that bring comfort and peace in the world but do little to encourage that through tribulation, not escape from it, we enter the Kingdom of God. Hope this does not sound too harsh and just gives to you another perspective to reflect on. It is not meant to hurt you or criticize you but only to caution against teachings that inspire the pleasing and gratifying fostering of errors and turn aside from hearing Christ.
Ray's teachings are far more worth while discussing. :)
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
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Greetings Arcturus,
You said,
"I too yearn for relief and escape from agony. It is all too human a trait but as Jesus did not drink from the sponge when He thirsted on His Cross, neither should we and we should follow teachings that inspire us to follow Him and listen to Him."
This really speaks to me, because the soldiers offered Christ vinegar, not water. True spiritual water comes from God, not man. Man's "water" is like vinegar to the spiritual pallet. It is bitter and leave us more thirsty than before. (BTW, I haven't read My Utmost for His Highest so I don't know what catagory it fits - so I'm not passing judgement on it) Christ said if we come to Him, he will give us water John.4:14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life
Peace
G.
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Hi Alex,
No I have not read this book, and while I agree with the words of caution from Arcturus, in that it is a fools paradise to chase after every word written. However, does not one use a blunt unassuming stone to keep the edge of sword keen?
This stone could if used improperly, destroy the knife; however, when used with discernment, it will give a sword a a razors edge. I have used many books such as you mentioned in my past; not as to weaken my faith, but to strengthen it. Truth is truth no matter where it is found just as a falsehood is a lie no matter who speaks it.
Not that I have need or the time to read such books now :)
Love to you in Christ our Saviour,
Darren
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Hello Gregor
I have randomly opened the book under discussion and have read the postulate that we get understanding of God through obedience. We know here in BT that we can not even obey without the Grace of God. Of course obedience is part of the process of Gods work in us but again, it is NOT mans work in himself or MANS achievement to choose Christ or obey Him. All good works are of God.
While there are many points that Oswald Chambers brings forward I find that these high points are sullied by his uniformed knowledge that Free Will is a Myth. Chambers has writing flare and poetic licence but to me a Roofer has more clarity of Christ mindedness that this author. For me, it is frustrating to see the subtlelies meshed in with what at a superficial glance, apprears to be spiritual illumination.
We are told that the beginning of Wisdom is to fear God and for me to fear God is to apprehend and acknowledge and have the comprehensive insight into the sovereignty of our Father....and that is just the start!
I hope I have not offended you Alex. I just do not desire that in order to go from a to b that you take the highway of the entire alphabet first. The Myth of Free Will is a most important first step not only in our studies here in BT but as said and written. Prov 1 : 7 The reverent and worshipful fear of the Lord is the beginning and the principal and choice part of knowledge, its starting point and its essence....Prov 4 : 7 the beginning of Wisdom is: get Wisdom.
Some can be wise without knowledge of God as was Solomon and some I believe can be knowledgeable without Wisdom....We just have to be aware of where the teachings show Sovereignty of God and like mindedness with Christ. For me, Chambers has wisdom and much of it but lacks in knowledge of the fact that man can not choose from FREE WILL and that mans greatest virtues are not his own.
I feel this way because I have seen S-O-O-O many look good false teachings and feel good errors of intentions that miss the mark. I am not a teacher but a student who knows a true teacher that is Ray Smith. Others I have seen have not cracked the most important lines of deception and bars of bondage like I have experienced from reading Rays revelations. This might not be everyone's experience I am aware of that but it is mine as I can testify to be able to see the Mind of Christ in clear profile in the work given to us through Ray. Every other teaching or sermon has only been a sensual meal that wears off and is forgotton but Ray's teachings! I have read them and don't ever want to be who I was before I read them! Know what I mean?
Peace to you
Arcturus :)
Peace to you
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Take courage Alex we all did this seeking ....
(Ecc 12:9 KJVR) And moreover, because the preacher was wise, he still taught the people knowledge; yea, he gave good heed, and sought out, and set in order many proverbs.
(Ecc 12:10 KJVR) The preacher sought to find out acceptable words: and that which was written was upright, even words of truth.
(Ecc 12:11 KJVR) The words of the wise are as goads, and as nails fastened by the masters of assemblies, which are given from one shepherd.
(Ecc 12:12 KJVR) And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh.
(Ecc 12:13 KJVR) Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
(Ecc 12:14 KJVR) For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.
Just keep your discenment beanie on, Remember The Word is the Only Source.
Even though I have read and owned many of these books... I now really look at most of these publications as sellers of God's word.....as a result you tend to always find things within them like Arcturus said that appeal to the carnal...that is why many are best sellers.
I like the facts that you are seeing the good and the limitations in this arthors thinking.
(Phi 4:8 KJVR) Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.
Beloved
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Take courage Alex we all did this seeking ....
(Ecc 12:9 KJVR) And moreover, because the preacher was wise, he still taught the people knowledge; yea, he gave good heed, and sought out, and set in order many proverbs.
(Ecc 12:10 KJVR) The preacher sought to find out acceptable words: and that which was written was upright, even words of truth.
(Ecc 12:11 KJVR) The words of the wise are as goads, and as nails fastened by the masters of assemblies, which are given from one shepherd.
(Ecc 12:12 KJVR) And further, by these, my son, be admonished: of making many books there is no end; and much study is a weariness of the flesh.
(Ecc 12:13 KJVR) Let us hear the conclusion of the whole matter: Fear God, and keep his commandments: for this is the whole duty of man.
(Ecc 12:14 KJVR) For God shall bring every work into judgment, with every secret thing, whether it be good, or whether it be evil.
Just keep your discenment beanie on, Remember The Word is the Only Source.
Even though I have read and owned many of these books... I now really look at most of these publications as sellers of God's word.....as a result you tend to always find things within them like Arcturus said that appeal to the carnal...that is why many are best sellers.
I like the facts that you are seeing the good and the limitations in this arthors thinking.
(Phi 4:8 KJVR) Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.
Beloved
Thank you beloved for this, it was a blessing.
To arcturus, no you have not offended me one bit, i know there is much false teaching, but i picked this out because to me it stood out as haveing some merit to it. Offcourse, God is never limited in how He presents Himself, an error in which i feel the author has made.
God bless,
Alex
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"Man’s" ways are really insignificant, even though they may give (on the surface) some short-term relief.
A friend in Christ!
-jER