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=> General Discussions => Topic started by: rvhill on June 07, 2006, 02:54:22 PM
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Matthew 11:11 I tell you the truth: Among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
This a powerful thing to think about. For many reason it mean all the great men of history or less then the least in heaven. Name the great people you admirer the mos in life and they are less then the least in heaven. Also, who really want to be the least in the kingdom of heaven. I don't know about you, but I want to be first. Being first is what Paul race was all about.
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i was talking to a freind and we where discussing non beleivers who
do wonderfull things and help other people out.
seems they actually do more and live better lives than alot of "christians"
we came to the conclusion, that these people might actually be better off than alot of "christians"
and that possible God has blinded them for that very reason.
and that they might not beleieve because of the hypocrasy they see.
many so called christians will see these non beleivers rewards and gnash
thier teeth.
Da 12:2
And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame and everlasting contempt.
D@ra'own TWOT - 450a
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
der-aw-one' Noun Masculine
Definition
aversion, abhorrence
they will be abhored by the way they acted. thinking themselves better
just because ""they""" chose Christ.
did i get this across right???
euty
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Hey Chuck,
I totally see it that way too.
Luk 12:47
And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. 48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more
In Love :wink:
Deedle
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First one in Gospels to be filled with the Holy Spirit is Elizabeth (Elizah's house) in Luke 1:41 then next is Zacharias (the high priest of Israel) in Luke 1:67 then the song of Zacharias is amazing. Of course you have Luke 1:65-66 that says "And fear came on all that dwelt round about them: and all these sayings were noised abroad throughout all the hill country of Judea. And all they that heard them laid them up in their hearts, saying, What manner of child shall this be! And the hand of the Lord was with him. Talking about John.
Pretty amazing child. "Unto us a son is born. Unto us a child is given."
CIY
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Hey Chuck,
I totally see it that way too.
Luk 12:47
And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes. 48 But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more
In Love :wink:
Deedle
God is sooooo Good.
let us all be humble and praise him.
Mat 5:46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?
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Mat 5:47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more [than others]? do not even the publicans so?
grace
chuckt
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Okay, this always stumped me :lol:
Matthew 11:11 I tell you the truth: Among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Mathew 5:9 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven:[/u] but whosoever shall do and teach [them], the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
As of yet I'm truly missing this one by comparison :lol:
Daniel
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Okay, this always stumped me :lol:
Matthew 11:11 I tell you the truth: Among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Mathew 5:9 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven:[/u] but whosoever shall do and teach [them], the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
As of yet I'm truly missing this one by comparison :lol:
Daniel
this is where we must follow the subject matter :wink:
dan, go back and read the whole chapter of mathew5, then tell us what you see.
peace
chuckt
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Matthew 11:11 I tell you the truth: Among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
This a powerful thing to think about. For many reason it mean all the great men of history or less then the least in heaven. Name the great people you admirer the mos in life and they are less then the least in heaven. Also, who really want to be the least in the kingdom of heaven. I don't know about you, but I want to be first. Being first is what Paul race was all about.
Seems to me that John the Baptist represented the law, preparing the way for Christ. Our tutor to lead us to Christ.
The kingdom of God represents those who have died to the law, and risen with Christ, so are greater than what John represents.
Just as we have to die to the law, John himself was beheaded. We have to lose our head, to have the true Head, Christ, the head of the "body".
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Okay, this always stumped me :lol:
Matthew 11:11 I tell you the truth: Among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Mathew 5:9 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven:[/u] but whosoever shall do and teach [them], the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
As of yet I'm truly missing this one by comparison :lol:
Daniel
this is where we must follow the subject matter :wink:
dan, go back and read the whole chapter of mathew5, then tell us what you see.
peace
chuckt
I was not going to say anything :lol: I got it Euty :wink:
Acts 1:5 For John truly baptized with water; but ye shall be baptized with the Holy Ghost not many days hence.
1Cr 1:14 I thank God that I baptized none of you, but Crispus and Gaius;
1Cr 15:9 For I am the least of the apostles, that am not meet to be called an apostle, because I persecuted the church of God.
Ephes 3:8 Unto me, who am less than the least of all saints, is this grace given, that I should preach among the Gentiles the unsearchable riches of Christ;[/u]
Ephes 3:7 Whereof I was made a minister, according to the gift of the grace of God given unto me by "the effectual working" of his power.[/u]
Ephes 3:2 If ye have heard of the dispensation of the grace of God which is given me to you-ward:
Got it
Gal 5:4 Christ is become of no effect unto you, whosoever of you are justified by the law; ye are fallen from grace.[/u]
He would BE CALLED "The LEAST" but was NOT the LEAST of them :lol:
Then theres THAT which is CALLED the circumcision and THAT which is CALLED the uncircumsion. AWESOME how He hides stuff aint it? :lol:
Daniel
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Quote Rocky Balboa :D .Seems to me that John the Baptist represented the law, preparing the way for Christ. Our tutor to lead us to Christ.
The kingdom of God represents those who have died to the law, and risen with Christ, so are greater than what John represents.
Just as we have to die to the law, John himself was beheaded. We have to lose our head, to have the true Head, Christ, the head of the "body".
Agreed Rocky representing the law, as all those in Christ will loose their Head for HIM
Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and [I saw] the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received [his] mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years
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Okay, this always stumped me :lol:
Matthew 11:11 I tell you the truth: Among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
Mathew 5:9 Whosoever therefore shall break one of these least commandments, and shall teach men so, he shall be called the least in the kingdom of heaven:[/u] but whosoever shall do and teach [them], the same shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.
As of yet I'm truly missing this one by comparison :lol:
Daniel
The Kingdom is not heaven. The kingdom is right now on earth. It is among us, at hand. We are the kingdom. But remember, the kingdom is like a large net filled with fish. The Fisherman spreads the fish on the deck and starts to separate some fish from other fish, for many are called a few are chosen. There are many wicked servants in the kingdom, who will be separated out. That is the kingdom we wish to enter into, that which will judge the world and deliver creation.
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the kingdom is and will be. :wink:
i have had people tell me that following the commandments produces love.
when i tell then NO its the otherway around they say i am saying its ok to sin, it breaks my heart.
Exd 14:3 For Pharaoh will say of the children of Israel, They [are] entangled in the land, the ((((wilderness hath shut them in)))).
they focus on the law, they deny Christ in the flesh, Christ fullfilled the law
christ is the end of the law for us, amen
no longer shut up in the wilderness, from where John preached.
peace
yall
chuckt
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The Kingdom is not heaven.
Are we not seated with Christ in the 'heavenlies'.
no man hath ascended up to heaven, but he that came down from heaven, even the Son of man which is in heaven.
Joh 14:3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also.
Rev 11:12 And they heard a great voice from heaven saying unto them, Come up hither. And they ascended up to heaven in a cloud; and their enemies beheld them.[/list:u]
Blessings,
Chrissie
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Yes, but the kingdom is not a matter of waiting to die and go to heaven. Those scriptures testify to that. The reason that the least in the kingdom are greater than John the Baptist, is because the least of these have the spirit of Christ within them.
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Yes, but the kingdom is not a matter of waiting to die and go to heaven. Those scriptures testify to that. The reason that the least in the kingdom are greater than John the Baptist, is because the least of these have the spirit of Christ within them.
also,
think partical excelleration :shock:
think molecular structures not bound by laws of the physical universe :shock:
small is big and big is small :shock: :shock: click on link.
some here have seen this before notice the numbers
http://micro.magnet.fsu.edu/primer/java/scienceopticsu/powersof10/index.html
:P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P :P
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Dang that's cool. How long have you been waiting to link that one? ;)
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Yes, but the kingdom is not a matter of waiting to die and go to heaven. Those scriptures testify to that. The reason that the least in the kingdom are greater than John the Baptist, is because the least of these have the spirit of Christ within them.
Oh, sorry. I don't think Daniel was saying that. If so, I missed it. Daniel's repeatedly said that we don't die (physically) for these things to be true.
So what you said threw me off. :oops:
Chrissie
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Yes, but the kingdom is not a matter of waiting to die and go to heaven. Those scriptures testify to that. The reason that the least in the kingdom are greater than John the Baptist, is because the least of these have the spirit of Christ within them.
Amen Love_magnified, Children born NOT of FLESH NOR OF BLOOD but BORN OF GOD.
No physical truths spiritual truths
Daniel
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Yes, but the kingdom is not a matter of waiting to die and go to heaven. Those scriptures testify to that. The reason that the least in the kingdom are greater than John the Baptist, is because the least of these have the spirit of Christ within them.
Oh, sorry. I don't think Daniel was saying that. If so, I missed it. Daniel's repeatedly said that we don't die (physically) for these things to be true.
So what you said threw me off. :oops:
Chrissie
No I wasn't, sorry if I caused confusion. I had asked a question only to show "the point" by way of comparison found in Paul. I'm not sure how Love_magnified was seeing what I was sharing, I didn't catch that one. I actually agree with what Love_Maginified said. The not dying to "go to" heaven. I think your both right on.
Daniel
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E.
Awesome link .
He who is the greatest will become the least , He who is the Least the Greatest. :D
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Yes, but the kingdom is not a matter of waiting to die and go to heaven. Those scriptures testify to that. The reason that the least in the kingdom are greater than John the Baptist, is because the least of these have the spirit of Christ within them.
Oh, sorry. I don't think Daniel was saying that. If so, I missed it. Daniel's repeatedly said that we don't die (physically) for these things to be true.
So what you said threw me off. :oops:
Chrissie
No I wasn't, sorry if I caused confusion. I had asked a question only to show "the point" by way of comparison found in Paul. I'm not sure how Love_magnified was seeing what I was sharing, I didn't catch that one. I actually agree with what Love_Maginified said. The not dying to "go to" heaven. I think your both right on.
Daniel
Actually I wasn't disagreeing. I should have made that more clear. I was responding to this from the very first post.
"Name the great people you admirer the mos in life and they are less then the least in heaven. Also, who really want to be the least in the kingdom of heaven. I don't know about you, but I want to be first. Being first is what Paul race was all about."
The reason I quoted both was not to disagree with Daniel, but to to emphasize the point if rvhill is believing that we are waiting to get to heaven to enter the kingdom and be great in Christ.
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The reason I quoted both was not to disagree with Daniel, but to to emphasize the point if rvhill is believing that we are waiting to get to heaven to enter the kingdom and be great in Christ.
Nicely explained L-M.
For the Kingdom is now.
As Chrissie mentioned, sitting in the heavenlies.
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Yes, but the kingdom is not a matter of waiting to die and go to heaven. Those scriptures testify to that. The reason that the least in the kingdom are greater than John the Baptist, is because the least of these have the spirit of Christ within them.
Oh, sorry. I don't think Daniel was saying that. If so, I missed it. Daniel's repeatedly said that we don't die (physically) for these things to be true.
So what you said threw me off. :oops:
Chrissie
No I wasn't, sorry if I caused confusion. I had asked a question only to show "the point" by way of comparison found in Paul. I'm not sure how Love_magnified was seeing what I was sharing, I didn't catch that one. I actually agree with what Love_Maginified said. The not dying to "go to" heaven. I think your both right on.
Daniel
Actually I wasn't disagreeing. I should have made that more clear. I was responding to this from the very first post.
"Name the great people you admirer the mos in life and they are less then the least in heaven. Also, who really want to be the least in the kingdom of heaven. I don't know about you, but I want to be first. Being first is what Paul race was all about."
The reason I quoted both was not to disagree with Daniel, but to to emphasize the point if rvhill is believing that we are waiting to get to heaven to enter the kingdom and be great in Christ.
Agreed we do desire to run the race set before us knowing only ONE gets the prize, Christ in us as the strong man running that race. I see it being in Him. How we veiw even this is spoken of by Christ.
Mathew 23:11 But he that is greatest among you shall be your servant.[/u]
Paul was a bondservant of Christ, He was "CALLED" the LEAST but He was in fact GREATER then John
Mark 9:35 And he sat down, and called the twelve, and saith unto them, If any man DESIRE to BE FIRST, the same shall be LAST of all, and servant of all.[/u]
Mathew 20:16 So THE LAST shall BE FIRST, and the first LAST: for many be called, but few chosen.[/u]
Whats CALLED one THING is not nessesarily what it truly IS. He was called a heretic but was true, least but the greatest of them being a bondservant of Christ. He becoming of no "reputation" and "all things" to all men had nothing it it "for himself". He did not to appear to be anything "of himself". The weighter glory that comes from God and not men was his desire. He was a true servant of the Lord. No man would come forth not "announcing HIMSELF" but Paul lost that rep and became like others in order to HELP THEM (wherever they were).
I love that about Paul, being last is truly being "first"
Daniel
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Amen to all of the above. It is worth noting that Paul is saying to run as though to be first not to be first. He is simply speaking about desire, being earnest in pursuit of the prize. The kingdom is now, yes, but the kingdom we enter into is the same kingdom without "wicked servants" and it is the crown of righteousness we run to recieve. His metaphor is about being persistent and eager, knowing that God will have no pleasure in them who fall away. Good words.
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Amen to all of the above. It is worth noting that Paul is saying to run as though to be first not to be first. He is simply speaking about desire, being earnest in pursuit of the prize. The kingdom is now, yes, but the kingdom we enter into is the same kingdom without "wicked servants" and it is the crown of righteousness we run to recieve. His metaphor is about being persistent and eager, knowing that God will have no pleasure in them who fall away. Good words.
I agree with this
I did not really use the part about Paul's race well, simply, because Paul's race is about faith as much as anything else. I do agree with Paul being greater then John the Baptist, but I believe when Jesus is talking of the kingdom of heaven, Jesus is talking about the resurrect, the next life. I believe that the least in the kingdom of heaven will be greater then Paul. Neither John or Paul were perfect, but those in the kingdom will be. I just do not see the Kingdom as being now in us.
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Matthew 11:11 I tell you the truth: Among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
This a powerful thing to think about. For many reason it mean all the great men of history or less then the least in heaven. Name the great people you admirer the mos in life and they are less then the least in heaven. Also, who really want to be the least in the kingdom of heaven. I don't know about you, but I want to be first. Being first is what Paul race was all about.
Good topic, there are things that we have to fix in our thinking. We should not desire to be first, that is what servanthood is all about. When Paul spoke about the race, this was another of the first things the Lord told me about the race and being a ruler with Christ is for the sake of others, servanthood. It is to be last, our REWARD is others. The FIRST will be last, the LAST will be first.
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Just curious. How is Paul greater than John the Baptist?
CIY
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I agree with Love_magnified here as well Rvhill. Not sure I agree with the Kingdom thought on not being here, I see it a bit differently as I believe is comes to us but is not observable by the natural eye.
John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be "born again", he cannot see the kingdom of God.[/u]
John 1:13 Which "were born", not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor "of the will of man", but of God.[/u]
We know flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God, the change is walking not after the flesh but the spirit
1Peter 1:23 Being born again, NOT OF "corruptible seed", BUT OF "incorruptible", by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
Saying the Kingdom is not here would then be saying we haven't the righteousness, peace and Joy in the Holy Spirit.
Romans 14:17 For the kingdom of God "is not meat and drink"; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in "the Holy Ghost".
Heb 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.[/u]
Paul says,
Phil 3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
Job could NOT SAY what God declared OF HIM
Job 9:20 If I justify myself, mine own mouth shall condemn me: if I say, I am perfect, it shall also prove me perverse.[/u]
Yet
Phil 3:15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.
Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,[/u]
1Cr 4:6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:
If perfection comes not while we are here then what of being made complete in Him and perfected in love? Is that not what its all about?
1Jon 2:2 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
1John 4:12 No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.[/u]
1John 4:17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, "so are we" in this world.
God has not given us a spirit of fear
1John 4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.[/u]
To know God is eternal life and we are to have this "in us" and this is evidenced by love. And nothing can separate you from his love life or death for both are ours. In fact the "passing over" from death to life is evidenced of the same (as is darkness into the light).
Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:[/u]
Ephes 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, "unto" the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:[/u]
James 3:2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.
John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
If we have not been the power to actually "become" the Sons of God why bother? Wouldn't that just be like the rest of men who have a "form of Godliness but deny the "power"? The power "to become" (like Him) in this world, the "manifestation" of The Sons of God. Isnt that our hope our earnest expectation? To be a partaker of His divine nature as I see it.
God hath given us power, if he hasnt let us eat and drink for tommorrow we do die you would think?
Col 1:28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:[/u]
Daniel
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Just curious. How is Paul greater than John the Baptist?
CIY
I see it as what the law could not do being weak because of the flesh. Grace could do mightily. The effectual working of the power of God in them which came not by the law but through faith they had access into it.
Paul spoke of others being made a partaker of this grace in Him. His gospel which came not by word but with power that worked in them who believed.
Thats how I see it in "comparing ministries"
Daniel
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Matthew 11:11 I tell you the truth: Among those born of women there has not risen anyone greater than John the Baptist; yet he who is least in the kingdom of heaven is greater than he.
This a powerful thing to think about. For many reason it mean all the great men of history or less then the least in heaven. Name the great people you admirer the mos in life and they are less then the least in heaven. Also, who really want to be the least in the kingdom of heaven. I don't know about you, but I want to be first. Being first is what Paul race was all about.
Good topic, there are things that we have to fix in our thinking. We should not desire to be first, that is what servanthood is all about. When Paul spoke about the race, this was another of the first things the Lord told me about the race and being a ruler with Christ is for the sake of others, servanthood. It is to be last, our REWARD is others. The FIRST will be last, the LAST will be first.
SOTW
I see this a little different , the rewards are two things which = the prize of which we recieve.
Those of the LAW and Flesh their reward was thus :-to BE SEEN OF MEN
Mat 6:5 And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites [are]: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.
For those who continue in the FAITH their PRIZE is Christ , its when we fall from Grace back to Law we lose that prize as it it makes Christ of Non effect.
Had paul fell from Grace then surely like the rest of us he would lose HIS PRIZE.
Press on under pressure , to continue in the FAITH.
Christ is the reward for those who believe.
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I agree with Love_magnified here as well Rvhill. Not sure I agree with the Kingdom thought on not being here, I see it a bit differently as I believe is comes to us but is not observable by the natural eye.
John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be "born again", he cannot see the kingdom of God.[/u]
John 1:13 Which "were born", not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor "of the will of man", but of God.[/u]
We know flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God, the change is walking not after the flesh but the spirit
1Peter 1:23 Being born again, NOT OF "corruptible seed", BUT OF "incorruptible", by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
Saying the Kingdom is not here would then be saying we haven't the righteousness, peace and Joy in the Holy Spirit.
Romans 14:17 For the kingdom of God "is not meat and drink"; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in "the Holy Ghost".
Heb 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.[/u]
Paul says,
Phil 3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
Job could NOT SAY what God declared OF HIM
Job 9:20 If I justify myself, mine own mouth shall condemn me: if I say, I am perfect, it shall also prove me perverse.[/u]
Yet
Phil 3:15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.
Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,[/u]
1Cr 4:6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:
If perfection comes not while we are here then what of being made complete in Him and perfected in love? Is that not what its all about?
1Jon 2:2 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
1John 4:12 No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.[/u]
1John 4:17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, "so are we" in this world.
God has not given us a spirit of fear
1John 4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.[/u]
To know God is eternal life and we are to have this "in us" and this is evidenced by love. And nothing can separate you from his love life or death for both are ours. In fact the "passing over" from death to life is evidenced of the same (as is darkness into the light).
Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:[/u]
Ephes 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, "unto" the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:[/u]
James 3:2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.
John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
If we have not been the power to actually "become" the Sons of God why bother? Wouldn't that just be like the rest of men who have a "form of Godliness but deny the "power"? The power "to become" (like Him) in this world, the "manifestation" of The Sons of God. Isnt that our hope our earnest expectation? To be a partaker of His divine nature as I see it.
God hath given us power, if he hasnt let us eat and drink for tommorrow we do die you would think?
Col 1:28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:[/u]
Daniel
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1Cr 13:10 But when that which is perfect is come, then that which is in part shall be done away.
1Cr 13:11 When I was a child, I spake as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child: but when I became a man, I put away childish things.
1Cr 13:12 For now we see through a glass, darkly; but then face to face: now I know in part; but then shall I know even as also I am known.
1Cr 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these [is] charity.
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I agree with Love_magnified here as well Rvhill. Not sure I agree with the Kingdom thought on not being here, I see it a bit differently as I believe is comes to us but is not observable by the natural eye.
John 3:3 Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be "born again", he cannot see the kingdom of God.[/u]
John 1:13 Which "were born", not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor "of the will of man", but of God.[/u]
We know flesh and blood cannot inherit the Kingdom of God, the change is walking not after the flesh but the spirit
1Peter 1:23 Being born again, NOT OF "corruptible seed", BUT OF "incorruptible", by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.
Saying the Kingdom is not here would then be saying we haven't the righteousness, peace and Joy in the Holy Spirit.
Romans 14:17 For the kingdom of God "is not meat and drink"; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in "the Holy Ghost".
Heb 10:14 For by one offering he hath perfected for ever them that are sanctified.[/u]
Paul says,
Phil 3:12 Not as though I had already attained, either were already perfect: but I follow after, if that I may apprehend that for which also I am apprehended of Christ Jesus.
Job could NOT SAY what God declared OF HIM
Job 9:20 If I justify myself, mine own mouth shall condemn me: if I say, I am perfect, it shall also prove me perverse.[/u]
Yet
Phil 3:15 Let us therefore, as many as be perfect, be thus minded: and if in any thing ye be otherwise minded, God shall reveal even this unto you.
Heb 12:23 To the general assembly and church of the firstborn, which are written in heaven, and to God the Judge of all, and to the spirits of just men made perfect,[/u]
1Cr 4:6 Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought:
If perfection comes not while we are here then what of being made complete in Him and perfected in love? Is that not what its all about?
1Jon 2:2 But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him.
1John 4:12 No man hath seen God at any time. If we love one another, God dwelleth in us, and his love is perfected in us.[/u]
1John 4:17 Herein is our love made perfect, that we may have boldness in the day of judgment: because as he is, "so are we" in this world.
God has not given us a spirit of fear
1John 4:18 There is no fear in love; but perfect love casteth out fear: because fear hath torment. He that feareth is not made perfect in love.[/u]
To know God is eternal life and we are to have this "in us" and this is evidenced by love. And nothing can separate you from his love life or death for both are ours. In fact the "passing over" from death to life is evidenced of the same (as is darkness into the light).
Col 1:13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:[/u]
Ephes 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, "unto" the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:[/u]
James 3:2 For in many things we offend all. If any man offend not in word, the same is a perfect man, and able also to bridle the whole body.
John 1:12 But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:
If we have not been the power to actually "become" the Sons of God why bother? Wouldn't that just be like the rest of men who have a "form of Godliness but deny the "power"? The power "to become" (like Him) in this world, the "manifestation" of The Sons of God. Isnt that our hope our earnest expectation? To be a partaker of His divine nature as I see it.
God hath given us power, if he hasnt let us eat and drink for tommorrow we do die you would think?
Col 1:28 Whom we preach, warning every man, and teaching every man in all wisdom; that we may present every man perfect in Christ Jesus:[/u]
Daniel
Jesus is the embodiment of the Kingdom. We have the promise of the kingdom to come though Jesus' resurrection. When Jesus walked the kingdom was present, because Jesus was present. I just do not see the kingdom being fulfilled in us tell the second coming.
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food for thot
"And if I go and prepare a place for you, I WILL COME AGAIN, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there ye may be also." John 14:3
Jhn 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
Jhn 14:17 [Even] the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.
Jhn 14:18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.
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When Jesus walked the kingdom was present, because Jesus was present. I just do not see the kingdom being fulfilled in us tell the second coming.
Where is Jesus Christ?
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Did he not send a Helper
Jhn 14:16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;
Jhn 14:26 But the Comforter, [which is] the Holy Ghost, whom the Father will send in my name, he shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
Jhn 15:26 But when the Comforter is come, whom I will send unto you from the Father, [even] the Spirit of truth, which proceedeth from the Father, he shall testify of me:
Jhn 16:7 Nevertheless I tell you the truth; It is expedient for you that I go away: for if I go not away, the Comforter will not come unto you; but if I depart, I will send him unto you
Hbr 9:28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation .
Is not Salvation now?
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If we are in this world as Christ is because he is in us, that makes us his body, and his kingdom of Sons.
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If we are in this world as Christ is because he is in us, that makes us his body, and his kingdom of Sons.
AMEN!!
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If we are in this world as Christ is because he is in us, that makes us his body, and his kingdom of Sons.
AMEN!!
I SECOND that AMEN!!! :D
Daniel
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If we are in this world as Christ is because he is in us, that makes us his body, and his kingdom of Sons.
ABSOLUTELY, AMEN TO THAT!
This is one thing that intrigues me. The whole christian community is awaiting the Second Coming. When the baptism of the Holy Spirit is His second coming. He is in us, we in Him and us in each other through the love that was declared by Jesus and witnessed unto us by the Spirit. And this love is what we are becoming, which is God the Father Himself, then He shall be all in all.
God bless,
Gary
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Amen. Christ is come in the flesh. OURS!!!! ;)
He represents us and we represent him right down to toppling the false doctrines of men and getting some folks mad at us. Of late I have realized through Mike's and Ray's teaching that Christ made himself a physical representation on earth in his ministry of his followers to come.
"These things and greater will ye do."
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For we are Born of Spirit Not Flesh , Flesh and Blood can not inherit the Kingdom.
as Paul says
Rom 8:9 But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his.
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Beautiful. We ought to be able to look at Matthew Mark Luke and John and know that the man who said those words is in us, so we are saying those words and doing those things right now. God's plan is amazing. He doesn't just want one begotten Son. HE WANTS BILLIONS! :D
Say that in many churches and you might get the boot. They can't face their inheritance right now. Soon!
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2Cr 4:18 While we LOOK NOT AT the things which are SEEN, BUT AT the things which are NOT SEEN: for the things which are seen are temporal; but the things which are not seen are eternal.
John 14:17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, "because" it SEETH HIM NOT, "neither" knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.[/u]
Heb 11:27 BY FAITH he forsook Egypt, not fearing the wrath of the king: for he endured, as SEEING HIM who IS INVISIBLE.[/u]
Heb 11:1 Now FAITH "IS" the SUBSTANCE of "things" HOPED FOR, "THE EVIDENCE" of things NOT SEEN.[/u]
CHRIST "IN US" is OUR HOPE of GLORY, and FAITH is the SUBSTANCE of things HOPED FOR... Faith, hope, and the Author of our faith perfects it in Himself as we are "perfected IN LOVE"
Its like the "tenth" in us that shall RETURN (as His word does not return VOID) but accomplishes what He has purposed. The Holy Seed is the Substance "thereof" who returns to be EATEN.
The HIDDEN MAN is as HIDDEN MANNA :D
TASTE and SEE, its HIM :D
Daniel
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Daniel Brother.
AMEN!
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John the baptists life has great spiritual meaning for us. And more so, his death.
(Mat 14:3) For seizing John, Herod bound him and put him into prison, because of Herodias, the wife of his brother Philip.
(Mat 14:4) For John said to him, It is not lawful for you to have her.
(Mat 14:5) And desiring to kill him, he feared the multitude, because they held him as a prophet.
(Mat 14:6) But a birthday feast for Herod being held, the daughter of Herodias danced in the midst and pleased Herod.
(Mat 14:7) So then he promised with an oath to give her whatever she should ask.
(Mat 14:8) But she being urged on by her mother, she says, Give me here on a platter the head of John the Baptist.
(Mat 14:9) And the king was grieved, but because of the oaths, and those who reclined with him, he ordered it to be given.
(Mat 14:10) And sending, he beheaded John in the prison.
(Mat 14:11) And his head was brought on a platter and was given to the girl, and she brought it to her mother.
(Mat 14:12) And having come, his disciples took the body and buried it; and coming, they reported to Jesus.
(Mat 14:13) And having heard, Jesus withdrew privately from there in a boat, into a deserted place. And hearing, the crowds followed Him on foot out of the cities.
Notice the reasoning of Herod beheading John. Also the daughter who pleased Herod and who was influencing her. I think they have spiritual applications. Also, when Jesus heard of Johns death, He withdrew privately in a boat, into a deserted place.
(Mat 3:1) Now in those days John the Baptist came preaching in the deserted places of Judea,
On news of his death, Jesus departs on a boat, into a deserted place. Interesting?
God bless,
Gary
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Christ is the same yesterday, today, and forever. He is, was, and will be. He was a quickening spirit. He is a quickening. He will be a quickening spirit. Christ never was a living soul. That was the first Adam.
I was listening to Ray and he said "Christ is in heaven." And he is because the heavens are within us.
It really is Christ in you, the hope of glory.
CIY
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Why do we live in the Heavens?
Christ Sits at HIS Fathers Right Hand , why the Right? not the Left?
What are Heavens ?
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(Mat 24:23) Then if anyone says to you, Behold, here is the Christ! Or, Here! Do not believe.
(Mat 24:24) For false christs and false prophets will rise up. And they will give great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect.
(Mat 24:25) Behold, I tell you beforehand.
(Mat 24:26) Then if they say to you, Behold, He is in the wilderness; do not go out. Behold, He is in the inner rooms; do not believe.
(Mat 24:27) For as the lightning comes forth from the east and shines as far as the west, so also will be the coming of the Son of Man.
(Mat 24:28) For wherever the dead body may be, there the eagles will be gathered.
(Luk 10:17) And the seventy returned with joy, saying, Lord, even the demons are subject to us through Your Name.
(Luk 10:18) And He said to them, I saw Satan falling out of Heaven as lightning!
(Luk 10:19) Behold, I have given you the authority to tread on snakes and scorpions, and on all the power of the hostile one, and nothing shall hurt you, no, never!
(Luk 10:20) But stop rejoicing in this, that the evil spirits submit to you. But rather rejoice that your names are written in Heaven.
(Luk 10:21) In the same hour Jesus rejoiced in the Spirit, and said, I praise You, Father, Lord of Heaven and of earth, that You hid these things from the sophisticated and cunning and revealed them to babes; yes, Father, because so it was pleasing before You.
(Luk 10:22) All things were delivered to Me by My Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father; and who is the Father, except the Son, and he to whom the Son may desire to reveal Him.
(Luk 10:23) And having turned to the disciples alone, He said, Blessed are the eyes seeing what you see.
(Job 36:31) For He judges the people by them; He gives plenty of food.
(Job 36:32) He covers His hands with the lightning, and commands it to strike the mark;
(Job 36:33) its thunder tells about Him; also the cattle, as to what is coming.
(Psa 144:4) Man is like to vanity; his days are like a shadow that passes.
(Psa 144:5) Bow down Your heavens, O Jehovah; and come down; touch the mountains and they shall smoke.
(Psa 144:6) Flash out lightning and scatter them; send out Your arrows and confound them.
(Psa 144:7) Send Your hand from above; rescue me and deliver me out of great waters, from the hand of a foreigner's sons,
(Psa 144:8) whose mouths have spoken vanity; and their right hand is a right hand of lies.
(Exo 19:4) You have seen what I did to Egypt; and I bore you on wings of eagles and brought you to Me.
(Exo 19:5) And now if listening you will listen to My voice, and will keep My covenant, you shall become a special treasure to Me above all the nations, for all the earth is Mine.
(Exo 19:6) And you shall become a kingdom of priests for Me, a holy nation. These are the words which you shall speak to the sons of Israel.
Sorry, for the many verses, but it is still good reading.
God bless,
Gary
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Gary
There will never be to many scriptures .
lightening ? thats interesting?
Mat 24:27) For as the lightning comes forth from the east and shines as far as the west, so also will be the coming of the Son of Man.
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WOW!!!
This thread TOOK OFF!!! :shock:
great stuff!!
2Ch 6:41 Now therefore arise, O LORD God, into thy resting place, thou, and the ark of thy strength:
let thy priests, O LORD God, be clothed with salvation, and let thy saints rejoice in goodness.
Rom 13:11 And that, knowing the time, that NOW it is high time to awake out of sleep: for NOW is our salvation nearer than when we believed.
2Co 6:2 (For he saith, I have heard thee in a time accepted, and in the day of salvation have I succoured thee: behold, NOW is the accepted time; behold, NOW is THE DAY :shock: of salvation.)
Phi 2:12 Wherefore, my beloved, as ye have always obeyed, not as in my presence only, but now much more in my absence, work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, NOW IS COME SALVATION, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the POWER of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night[/b].[/list:u]
Chrissie
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I am a Millenarianism, and it seem some here are Amillenialism. So, on this subject of the kingdom we will have to agree to disagree. That is not to say that Holy spirit of Jesus does not touch us. I simple believe there is much more to the Kingdom then we have now.
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I am a Millenarianism, and it seem some here are Amillenialism. So, on this subject of the kingdom we will have to agree to disagree. That is not to say that Holy spirit of Jesus does not touch us. I simple believe there is much more to the Kingdom then we have now.
Thats Fine rv. :D
Thanks for sharing.
Every Blessing
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I am a Millenarianism, and it seem some here are Amillenialism. So, on this subject of the kingdom we will have to agree to disagree. That is not to say that Holy spirit of Jesus does not touch us. I simple believe there is much more to the Kingdom then we have now.
If the kingdom has come to us.... and is IN us.... does that 'mean' that there is NOT 'more' to come?
The kingdom has yet to be turned over to the Father so that He may be all in all. Many are still dead. The resurrection is not 'past'.
Chrissie
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Hello Chrissie.
More to come tomorrow. :D
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Hello mercie! :D
Not sure what you mean by that... :roll: you gonna add more tomorrow? Or you making a prophetic statement?? :lol: :lol:
Chrissie
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Hello mercie! :D
Not sure what you mean by that... :roll: you gonna add more tomorrow? Or you making a prophetic statement?? :lol: :lol:
Chrissie
Chrissie
The later. :D
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:lol: :lol: :lol: COOL!! 8)
Chrissie
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Chrissie
You look Good in shades. 8)
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im a goober :wink: a determinist if you will need a lable
13:5
Examine yourselves, whether ye be in the faith; prove your own selves *. Know ye not your own selves, how that Jesus Christ ((is in you)), except ye be reprobates
Adokimos 2:255,181
Phonetic Spelling Parts of Speech
ad-ok'-ee-mos Adjective
Definition
not standing the test, not approved
properly used of metals and coins
that which does not prove itself such as it ought
unfit for, unproved, spurious, reprobate
what is the test??
Luk 6:44 For every tree is known by his own fruit
Jhn 15:5 I am the vine, ye [are] the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing
Dan 4:12 The leaves thereof [were] fair, and the fruit thereof much, and in it [was] meat for all: the beasts of the field had shadow under it, and the fowls of the heaven dwelt in the boughs thereof, and all flesh was fed of it.
Eph 5:2 And walk in love, as Christ also hath loved us, and hath given himself for us an offering and a sacrifice to God for a sweetsmelling savour.
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(Exo 16:4) And Jehovah said to Moses, Behold, I AM! Bread will rain from the heavens for you. And the people shall go out and gather the matter of a day in its day, so that I may test them, whether they will walk in My Law or not.
(Exo 20:20) And Moses said to the people, Do not be afraid, for God has come in order to test you, and so that His fear may be on your faces, that you may not sin.
(Psa 17:3) You will test my heart; You will visit in the night; You will refine me; You will find nothing; my thoughts do not pass beyond my mouth.
(Psa 17:4) As to the doings of men, by the Words of Your lips I keep from the paths of the violent.
(Psa 15:1) A Psalm of David. O Jehovah, who shall dwell in Your tabernacle? Who shall live in Your holy mountain?
(Psa 15:2) He who walks uprightly and works righteousness, and speaks the truth in his heart.
(Psa 15:3) He does not backbite with his tongue, nor does evil to his friend, nor lifts up a reproach against his neighbor.
(Psa 15:4) In his eyes, the reprobate has been despised, but he honors those who fear Jehovah: He has sworn to his hurt, and will not change it.
(Psa 15:5) He has not given his silver at interest; nor has he taken a bribe against the innocent; he who does these things shall not be shaken forever.
(Rom 1:28) And even as they did not think fit to have God in their knowledge, God gave them up to a reprobate mind, to do the things not right,
(Rom 1:29) having been filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, iniquity, covetousness, malice, being full of envy, murder, quarrels, deceit, evil habits, becoming whisperers,
(Rom 1:30) slanderers, God-haters, insolent, proud, braggarts, devisers of evil things, disobedient to parents,
(Rom 1:31) without discernment, covenant breakers, without natural affection, unforgiving, unmerciful,
(Rom 1:32) who knowing the righteous order of God, that those practicing such things are worthy of death, not only do them, but also approve those practicing them.
Psalms, all of the 89th chapter is good, also.
God bless,
Gary
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Psalms, all of the 89th chapter is good, also.
God bless,
Gary[/quote]
psalms? is that in the new testament? icant find it?
did paul write it??
(http://bestsmileys.com/lol/19.gif)
psalms are most wonderful
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Chuckt, :lol: :lol: 8)
I hear ya, brother. The Psalms are great!!!
I think they are in the lost books of Fumanchu. :lol:
Gary
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I am a Millenarianism, and it seem some here are Amillenialism. So, on this subject of the kingdom we will have to agree to disagree. That is not to say that Holy spirit of Jesus does not touch us. I simple believe there is much more to the Kingdom then we have now.
If the kingdom has come to us.... and is IN us.... does that 'mean' that there is NOT 'more' to come?
The kingdom has yet to be turned over to the Father so that He may be all in all. Many are still dead. The resurrection is not 'past'.
Chrissie
I missed this Amen Chrissie! we know if "in this life only" we have hope in the THE "life" that "now is" (in Christ) we are the most miserable of men. "Eat and drink for tommorrow we die".
Christ is was and will be, He IS "the Ressurection". The only thing He has done which IS "past" was to bear sins (once and for all). He came ONCE to do "that".
He's not doing "that" anymore. HE "IS" and always will be the "first" and the "last", "the day" and by definition HE is "the Resurrection"
Good words Chrissie
Daniel
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I see what your saying Gary, but i am completely spiritual dry on this part, i have no clue what it means.. some eye drops would suit me good right about now ;)
God bless,
Alex
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Alex, those scriptures quoted help us to discern, who is in Christ and the ones who say they are Jews, but are not.
I live in rural eastern Ky., and here the tradition of hell has been passed down generation to generation. I have seen people who claim not to believe, yet they are kind to their neighbor never having a bad word to say about anybody. Then, which is the norm or the many, who go to hellfire churches, who are constantly gossiping, spreading rumors and such. It is all about how we outwardly or towardly treat others that speaks louder. It is not what goes into a man that defiles him, but what comes out of a man.
This is what these verses speak of. Hope this helps.
God bless,
Gary