bible-truths.com/forums
=> General Discussions => Topic started by: aqrinc on November 23, 2008, 06:48:28 PM
-
Hi Walt, Marlene, Richard, Dave, David, Jackie, Dennis, Marques.
I wanted to Share this Good News.
A word about Patience. Here is a Fruit of The Spirit that Patience brings. This Morning at breakfast my
Wife wanted to Watch John Hagee; he was particularly working hard on why people must tithe to heal their
financial ills and not to cheat the church. Well surprise, surprise, surprise; the hook that he uses was the very
thing that caused my wife to see for the first time that maybe he is preaching another gospel.
We started to discuss why it is GOD'S will that only a few understand the parables using the Sower and the
Seed. (Re. church seed money and physical wealth vs Spiritual Wealth) Well for several days she has been
questioning why only a few will understand the parables versus all Christians understanding now. She said that
we all chose to do GOD'S Will of our own free will and of course i said; no so lets remember what we believe
(GOD IS IN CONTROL).
Well She said "Of course GOD Is In CONTROL but we have a free will to choose what we want to do". To which
i said "If GOD IS IN CONTROL; then HIS WILL and not our free will is what is happening now isn't it? And if it is
HIS WILL then where is our free will to do what we want; as opposed to choosing from things that HE WILLS".
After considering for a few seconds she said "i guess we do not have a free will then" as the light went on in
her Eyes. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
Our GOD IS SO ABLE To DO Anything HE WISHES WHEN HE IS READY; that is my lesson for today that patience
is a virtue we learn by waiting on GOD to DO HIS Good Work IN Us And FOR Us.
Pardon the all caps but i am shouting for Joy that HE IS FAITHFUL and PATIENT even when we are stumbling.
Romans 12:12:
Rejoicing in hope; patient in tribulation; continuing instant in prayer;
II Timothy 2:24:
And the servant of the Lord must not strive; but be gentle to all men, apt to teach, patient,
I Peter 2:20:
For what glory is it, if, when you be buffeted for your faults, you shall take it patiently? but if, when you do well,
and suffer for it, you take it patiently, this is acceptable with God.
In Love Patience and Longsuffering,
george. :o ;D 8) :-*
-
I move my response with your thread as it belongs here. :)
George.
What a beautiful testimony, that is awesome and I was so delighted to hear how your wife is excepting the truth.
Thank you for sharing and yes patience is something we all need so much of especially me, its funny because sometimes we think we have patience until something comes into our day and after we say the things we say we realize we have so far to go and so much to understand.
No doubt God is always showing me where I fail in all my ways maybe its at this point one sees how only God is sufficient for our lives, I guess there is a difference in knowing it and knowing of it.
Sometimes I feel the road we walk on is so long but it’s only as long as the numbers of our days. Thanks George for the reminder and also for the good news about your wife as well. :)
In God’s Love. Richard.
-
Hey this thread is for me too!! ;D
Thanks for sharing George
-
Richard, Akira,
Every day i learn how far much farther down GOD HAD to reach to even get to me. If HE could be Patient
enough with me ( and it took and is taking a lot) why is it that i should even dare have any less than HIM.
Now i also learn that it is HIS Patience in me that is working out the Good Work that HE Determined Before
the Foundations of The Worlds were even laid. (That is a Loooonnnnng Time at least 16 billion years).
Talk about longsuffering, i said at least 16 billion years but it was even before that. So what do we have
as an average here (85 to 90 years) not even the merest sprinkle to compare to. Once we come to start
to comprehend this Patience and Longsuffereing of GOD and Our Lord Jesus Christ; then we can like Paul
say with complete Faith:
Romans 2:4:
Or despisest thou the riches of his goodness and forbearance and longsuffering; not knowing that the goodness
of God leadeth thee to repentance?
Philippians 3:8:
Yes doubtless, and I count all things but loss for the excellency of the knowledge of Christ Jesus my Lord: for
whom I have suffered the loss of all things, and do count them but dung, that I may win Christ,
Galatians 5:22:
But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
george.
-
Hi George, I am so happy to hear about your wife. I really liked the verses you gave. Indiana Bob, really helped me today. He taught me alot about being patient waiting on God to help me understand better. What, I really liked he saw my concern for the lost. He made me look at the fact they will be safe in Gods judgements and care of the elect. Joe, also told me not to have anxiety for them. This is so true. God gave me great peace , when I found out that there is no Hell. It really doesn't matter who is the elect and who will be in the second judgement. This is Gods choice. No matter where we end up it is still all of God.
All I know, I want to run a race. I feel more accountable now that I know truths. Just as I believe it is Gods time when he called me out. I also, believe he can take me to the finish line if that is his will. I know, he is patient with me and I have to learn the same patience. Also, I know that whatever I do he wants it done in love. We can't beat others up with the truth and I see that you waited on God to lead your wife. Just as we have to wait on God to help us understand his truths.
All, I can say the truths of Rays, like tithe, trinity and no Hell I understand and belive. What, I love about Ray is when you read and see the scriptures they stand out. It was advice like yours and Joe and Indiana Bob that spoke to me. God loves us all he died for all.
Love To All.
Marlene
-
Patience is like watching a drop of water put a hole in a rock. ;)
Antaiwan
-
Thanks George for this message to us.
When you really think about it there could be no freewill, I really fought it for a time.
I don't worry about how the government is run or what our new pres.will come up with.
It is all God.
Since I gave up thinking anything and all things in my life was my doing.
I am really free now knowing all is in the hands of God.
I am where I am at physically and spiritually because God has me at this place.
I am learning to be more patient just a bit at a time, but makes me appreciate each day that I no longer worry about things that is not my concern anyway.
I give my worries to God and know it will be allright.
PS pretty neat how your wife came to the knowledge of no freewill.
I hope she saves herself the aggravation of fighting like I did. :D
Oh well I am no longer fighting and now I feel so much better.
-
Hi Jackie,
Isint that the truth, the fighting and resisting is ferocious. I have learned to rest and grow stronger now.
That is where the rubber meets the road in this Spiritual Growth of ours. Now i am waiting to really learn
how to love my enemies, i know it is happening even as i type. ;D
george.
-
God gave me great peace , when I found out that there is no Hell. It really doesn't matter who is the elect and who will be in the second judgement. This is Gods choice. No matter where we end up it is still all of God.
Hi Marlene (and everyone else),
I have to give a big AMEN to that quote above, we all should have a certain peacefulness in the knowledge that it will be ALL inclusive once His Kingdom is fully established and that not one will be lost! Is being one of the elect something to strive for? Paul for one felt it was and I have to agree but God has a plan for each and every one of us, in here, outside of here, in the churches, in the world and past, present and future!
Patience is certainly one of the fruits of His Spirit and it is something that also must be strived for, jumping to conclusions about what people might say, do or write without first seeking to understand is carnal and impatient, definitely not the nourishing fruit that promotes health and growth as we journry and learn together.
George,
It was great to read the testimony about your wife, it reminded me of my own wife a few months back and her own "discovery" or Eureka! moment. We speak of spiritual things from time to time as I no longer beat her over the head with my own beliefs. Our more casual conversations have definitely produced better results than when she was firmly in the church and I was battling her on every doctrinal front, slowly she began to see that the real driving force or spirit in her (Baptist) church was money, prestige, power and control, once her eyes were opened to this she decided to leave and study on her own, reading her bible daily and from time to time discussing with me any questions that arose as she read, we had plenty of conversations about "free" will and like with virtually everyone else she had a difficult time with understanding/accepting this concept.
One day as she read Romans Chapter 9 she became very excited and the joy on her face was very evident as she ran over to me and exclaimed; I get what you mean about "free" will, it's right here in Romans!
Rom 9:18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will have mercy, and whom he will he hardeneth.
Rom 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will?
Rom 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus?
Rom 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honor and another unto dishonor?
I will never forget the joy I experienced as she read these verses to me.
Peace,
Joe
-
Joe,
Heartfelt congratulations for the joy you have received as a gift from our God. Romans 9 was right there all the time and God gave your wife eyes to see and a heart to understand. Thanks for sharing.
Bob
-
Thank you Bob,
Let me take this opportunity to thank you as well, your peaceful and patient fellowship is greatly appreciated, it is very evident that you seek understanding through His Spirit of discernment in dealing with your brethren. A fine example of how we all should interact with others here and outside of here.
Back to my wife's experience.... When she first left her church and began to study on her own she started right at Genesis 1:1 and proceeded through every book in the OT and into the NT, when she showed me what she had "found" about the potter and the clay in Romans I then showed her what is written in Isaiah 64 and Jeremiah 18 in regard to this matter. It was a moment of amazement to her and she asked me "how could I have missed that?" ;)
Haven't we all had that feeling when verses suddenly come alive with relevence? I loved it when she said "I can't wait to see what I find when I read through again!"
Peace,
Joe
-
Thank you Bob,
Let me take this opportunity to thank you as well, your peaceful and patient fellowship is greatly appreciated, it is very evident that you seek understanding through His Spirit of discernment in dealing with your brethren. A fine example of how we all should interact with others here and outside of here.
Back to my wife's experience.... When she first left her church and began to study on her own she started right at Genesis 1:1 and proceeded through every book in the OT and into the NT, when she showed me what she had "found" about the potter and the clay in Romans I then showed her what is written in Isaiah 64 and Jeremiah 18 in regard to this matter. It was a moment of amazement to her and she asked me "how could I have missed that?" ;)
Haven't we all had that feeling when verses suddenly come alive with relevence? I loved it when she said "I can't wait to see what I find when I read through again!"
Peace,
Joe
That is wonderful new Joe. I remember when we talked in Nashville about our respective wives in regards to having a knowledge of the truth so this especially is an inspiration to me as well. I have learned from your testimony and have weaned away from 'beating her over the head' with the spiritual truths we have been given. Thanks again Joe :)
Marques
-
Great News George,
I just woke up about 15 minutes ago, was drinking my first cup of coffee,
boy it's good, but this wonderful news regarding your wife discerning God's
Will, not our Will and the beginning in her mind of no Free Will tastes even
better.
We desire that God Works in us to acquire Patience and in your case, another
Fruit of the Spirit was experienced and that is Joy upon hearing your Wife's
response. God is starting to remove the scales from your wife's eyes and I'm
very happy for you and her.
In regards to the discussion that you and Marques had about your wives while
at the conference, my experience with my wife was similiar. A few years ago she
would argue every point regarding the Scriptures, if brought up to even the
smallest degree. Once I shut my big overzealous mouth and let her be, she began
to examine the information from Ray, eventually asking sincere questions, 1Peter3:15.
Below is a new Email to Ray that " seems " to provide an example of someone
starting to Spiritually see with the eyes of understanding.
Anyway, it's the new Email and it's titled " Going to Heaven " and now I'm
getting trained to be patient, because I Copied it and attempted to paste
it and it didn't work, perhaps if someone feels like it, they could do it for me.
This Email indirectly relates to the kind of experience George received with his
Wife.
Again, Great News, Samson.
-
Here is that email Samson,
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,8766.0.html -------
I've been going to a "Christian" school since K5 and am now a senior.
They've always instilled truth in me but it was until I came across
your website that I found out that they've only been telling me half of
the truth. I've been reading a lot.. Especially the bits about hell and
who belongs there.. But I need to know one thing. You said that the
Bible says It is God's will and desire to save ALL MANKIND (I Tim.
2:4). And God will certain fulfill ALL THAT HE HAS PURPOSED (Isaiah
46:10-11). And if this is true... And I believe it is, because the
Bible says so.. It says that we will all be judged and purged of our
transgressions upon the return of Jesus Christ.. Then why do preachers,
chaplains, priests, and people like yourself even care, since we will
all go to heaven? I know about all of the money schemes. Like I said,
I've been reading a lot. But what is our purpose then if we don't
really need to lead anyone to him in order to save them from damnation?
Sincerely, Stephen
Dear Stephen: Do we think that God will "save" everyone by doing nothing? It is BY ministries like mine that those God is calling to repentance and into a knowledge of the truth, becomes the "firstfruits" of salvation (I Cor. 1:21). And it will BY similar ministries that all will eventually be judged, purified, and saved. (I have said nothing regarding "going to heaven." The Scriptures say nothing regarding anyone, ever, "going to heaven.)
God be with you, Stephen,
Ray
-
Thats great news George, any chance you could come and have a word or two with my wife and see if it works on her? :D ;D ;)
-
That is wonderful new Joe. I remember when we talked in Nashville about our respective wives in regards to having a knowledge of the truth so this especially is an inspiration to me as well. I have learned from your testimony and have weaned away from 'beating her over the head' with the spiritual truths we have been given. Thanks again Joe :)
Marques
Hi Marques,
Yes, I remember that evening very well, you, Antaiwan , Patrick and I were enjoying a great supper and we were discussing many scriptural things when this subject came up about witnessing to family and the frustration that usually accompanies this activity.
I hope things are improving in regard to your situation as well!
His Peace to you Brother,
Joe
-
Hi David,
Actually it was when she decided to have a word with me after my several hundred abortive
attempts (to convert and teach) that GOD Provided the opening chapter to Real Joy for us.
We all were lost before we were found and enlightened By GOD Through Jesus Christ our Chief
Shepherd And Lord. The Patience we need to learn is to wait on The Lord because He Is Always
on time Everytime.
All Glory And Power To GOD And Our Lord Jesus Christ.
In Humility,
george. ;D :-* ;D
-
Hi George,
Thanks for starting this thread. This is the type of subject that provides encouragement and guidance to others who come here seeking fellowship and understanding. There are many on this forum married to persons who have yet to be given "spiritual sight." We should strive to be helpful to one another in this spiritual journey. :)
Rene'
-
And thanks to you Rene and all the moderaters who i know many times are cringing about what is coming out next. Every
now and then we actually do a bit of good by The Grace Of GOD. I need to go home now but will be back later.
george. :-*
Hi George,
Thanks for starting this thread. This is the type of subject that provides encouragement and guidance to others who come here seeking fellowship and understanding. There are many on this forum married to persons who have yet to be given "spiritual sight." We should strive to be helpful to one another in this spiritual journey. :)
Rene'
-
George! this is really great news! Patience is the hardest thing, isn't it? :)
I told my husband the other night that he needs to read some of Ray's writings. I waited for years for him to give up and come to God, and quite suddenly one day he did. BUT he isn't the type who can easily turn over control of "his own destiny" Ha! My he has had a time of letting God do it for him. (Sometimes I have to admit I Do try to "help God out a little") I'm not very good at being God, I come off as sounding like a nag! ha! :D Oh well, I think he will read Ray's writings one day!
He really already agrees with much of the truth even though he doesn't realize it, he thinks he's just rebellious! :o ;D Well, anyway this is a blessing for you and for your wife! I know that is an answer to your prayers.
Loving it!
Kathy :)
-
Hey, I love this. But, let me share something. There is nothing more prescious to me then the truths Rays teachings have brought to be. He is truly led by God.
Something, I would like to share with you. Of course when we first see these truths we get excited for the whole world to know.
But, when I sometimes don't fully understand a scripture I leave it for God to show me in his own timing.
Now, I know God has made me want to run a race. But, tell you something he makes me pray for and also, read in the Bible.
I like the scriptures that tell you what he is like. Now, I pray God make me in your image. Let me Love like you. Let me love without getting love back. Let me love with patience. He even used a difficult neighbor of 17 years. She choose to leave the relationship cause she could not see my love. But, I know I never gave her anything, but Love. I could not buy her things I could only Love her. I still Love her. Also, I belive there may have been some mental issues there I don't know. But, I have been so peaceful, even though she ended it. I am not well and God I believe worked this out for me. He taught me patience and he has taught me love over and over. He taught me long suffering. There is so much more for him to teach me. I forgive those who judge me even though they may not know my true heart. After, all isnt that what God did when we nailed him on the Cross. I love all the truths in the scriptures. But, my one on one time with him has taught me more. So, I dwell on the character of Christ. I want it and will keep in the race for it as long as he enables it to be so.
With Love like Christ there would never be wars. Someday, Dear Brothers and Sisters in Christ who I love very much, we will be living it in the real.
Gods Love To You,
Marlene
-
My husband was close minded to the forum here so much that I would wait till he was away or sleeping to get on line! But now... after our experiences, he walks by from time to time reading over my shoulder and even smiles!
-
Jennie, that is great! I share some of this with my husband, basically he's not real interested. I sit here at night when he's home I don't like the tv shows he watches, but my computer is right next to the den where he is so we are almost together! ;) I even occasionally have to tell him what I am laughing about! :D Or if I make a sound of frustration to a topic he'll ask what's wrong. (I never tell him anything negative about the forum)I have all the materials on the BT site printed off, he is welcome to read it anytime he wants! . It's great that you guys are now able to share it! ;D I am able to get online during the day when I'm at home and I just happen to be at home today! ;D
Kathy :)
-
Hi Everyone, I certainly loved to control situations. When, I had my what could had been a deadly out come, I had a lesson taught to me. I had a fever of 109 and 107 for several days. Had to wait 48 hours for a culture to let them know what would cure the blood stream infection.
I believe God did not want me to go unconscious so I could learn this less. It was as if he said, Now, what can you do about this. You are always trying to do my job. What are you going to do now? I said, to him in prayer well Lord it is all up to you. This, was before I found Rays website. Well, he showed me one I needed to lear patience and two its all up to him, and I don't have anyting in the matter. I now, belive this experience helped me to read Rays papers and except them. So, it was all Gods doing.
Now, when I feel that wanting to control come up I bite my tongue. You know, I even had anxiety about ones going through the fire . Joe, and Rodger and Indiana Bob helped to show me I had anxiety for the lost. That, came from always people telling you they have to get saved and not knowing how hard that is. Not a short prayer. Now, I know that it is like the fire we are going through here. I mean when you are new to all this all kinds of things come flying at your spirit. All, I can say I saw more growth in me then I had seen for years. Now, I try and have patience waiting on him cause it all depends on him.
We can't force people to grow faster then God allows us. So, we have to be patient with him and patient with those who are not grown in areas like others. I know and trust my Lord will show me my sins and areas of growth I need. If, when he shows it and we repent he is patienct to help us overcome. Thats, why we are learning to be like him. If, we don't have him put his traits in us how can we even be choosen. How and when is all his. Patience , longsuffering with all is what we need to learn.
-
I don't like those patience lessons too much! I don't seem to have much of it. God puts us still sometimes when we need to learn something and just don't slow down enough to listen! This past summer I was bitten by a brown recluse spider. They are poison and will just about kill you. I went to the doc. and was under treatment but my leg was worsening. I ended up in hospital out of my head for a while with the prospect of losing my leg. I was laying there in pain and confusion just asking God how a mountain woman is supposed to feel the trail of the earth walking through the woods with one leg. He gave me a lot to think on during that time. One thing that hurt my heart was one day my husband was coming beack into the hospital and a couple from our old church acted like they didn't know him. That was when God got me really thinking about things. You know like... was God ever in that church and why did I think that serving there meant serving Him? My eyes started opening while I was flat on my back! Good news.... they opened and I still have a leg. It doesn't work so well anymore but it keeps me balanced as I trek through the woods and reminds me everyday of what I am learning. I used to be mad and probably still will be some days at the people but most of the time I am sorry they don't know that all that work doesn't do a lot for God. He cares what is inside of us. Now I am going to wish ya'll a great day and hobble outdoors because the sun has just risen over the mountaintop good! Love to all, Jennie