I tried to tell him differently, but he said something that had me thinking. He said the phrase "God hardened Pharaoh's heart" means that "the idea of Israel's God hardened Pharaoh's heart", and not that God took an active role in hardening his heart.
Exo 10:20 But the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart...
Exo 10:27 But the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart...
Exo 11:10 ...and the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart..
You've straddled the fence long enough, now is the time to get on your feet and start maturing in the word of God.
Craig
Hello. I've been talking with someone, who is a very big believer in "free-will". He stated that he "firmly believes that Pharaoh could have at any time chosen to repent
he "firmly believes that Pharaoh could have at any time ………….come to God,
and God wouldn't have done anything else to him, but would have accepted him and his repentance."
I tried to tell him differently, but he said something that had me thinking. He said the phrase "God hardened Pharaoh's heart" means that "the idea of Israel's God hardened Pharaoh's heart",
and not that God took an active role in hardening his heart. I really don't care to talk to this person anymore, he won't listen, but this question is for me. Do we have proof that God actively hardened the Pharaoh's heart?
And that the Pharaoh had no choice in the matter? Thanks. (I'm reading Ray's paper on "free-will" for about the third time, there's so much in it.)
Hi, Lupac
I'm called Billy Bob White. I have read all the comments on your thread "could the pharoah have done it any different"? I'm sure with the reading that you've done on Bible Truths you know the answer to this. But just in case you don't, would you please consider reading Matthew 11:25-29. And pray for understanding about the yoke of Jesus. It makes living a life as a human being so very simple and without worry. And then there is this: John 6:44 once you have read these I have to ask you a question. Are you serious about asking this question about the pharoah or are you playing games with the forum members? Whichever it is, you're doing a good job. I see that you have at least 2 or 3 members breaking forum rules and trying to teach you something that can only be accomplished by God.
Your friend in Christ
B.B.W.
Hello. I've been talking with someone, who is a very big believer in "free-will". He stated that he "firmly believes that Pharaoh could have at any time chosen to repent and come to God, and God wouldn't have done anything else to him, but would have accepted him and his repentance."
I tried to tell him differently, but he said something that had me thinking. He said the phrase "God hardened Pharaoh's heart" means that "the idea of Israel's God hardened Pharaoh's heart", and not that God took an active role in hardening his heart. I really don't care to talk to this person anymore, he won't listen, but this question is for me. Do we have proof that God actively hardened the Pharaoh's heart? And that the Pharaoh had no choice in the matter? Thanks. (I'm reading Ray's paper on "free-will" for about the third time, there's so much in it.)
You have TWO choices:
A. You believe what the Scriptures say.
-or-
B. You don't believe what the Scriptures say, and be like your friend who adds/takes away words from the Scriptures to fit his man-made doctrines.
Yes.. It IS that simple!
QuoteYou have TWO choices:
A. You believe what the Scriptures say.
-or-
B. You don't believe what the Scriptures say, and be like your friend who adds/takes away words from the Scriptures to fit his man-made doctrines.
Yes.. It IS that simple!
Just a point of information, The Bible/s are not the inspired word of God, they are all bollixed up by man's traditions and doctrines being substituted many places in every translation. If any open eyed person is expected to take the Bible/s as written for the inspired word, we have a problem Houston.
Now if we are talking Scripture (Inspired Word Of God) that is a whole different story, but that is why we study, question ,search, Pray, prove and test every single word any man utters or writes.
Mat 9:16-17 (MKJV)
16 No one puts a piece of new cloth onto an old garment; for that which is put in to fill it up takes from the garment, and the tear is made worse.
17 Nor do men put new wine into old wineskins; else the wineskins burst, and the wine runs out, and the wineskins perish. But they put new wine into new wineskins, and both are preserved together.
The chapter below is now starting to make a lot more sense, if new wine is poured into the old containers, it is way too strong and will get all those using the old containers for their new wine drunk (confused?).
Isa 28:1-29 (BBE)
1 Ho! crown of pride of those who are given up to wine in Ephraim, and the dead flower of his glory which is on the head of those who are overcome by strong drink!
2 See, the Lord has a strong and cruel one; like a rain of ice, a storm of destruction, like the overflowing of a strong river, he will violently overcome them.
3 The crown of pride of those who are given up to wine in Ephraim will be crushed under foot;
4 And the dead flower of his glory, which is on the head of the fertile valley, will be like the first early fruit before the summer; which a man takes and puts in his mouth the minute he sees it.
5 In that day will the Lord of armies be a crown of glory, and a fair ornament, to the rest of his people;
6 And a spirit of wisdom to the judge, and strength to those who keep back the attackers at the door of the town.
7 And further, these are uncertain through wine, and have gone out of the right way through strong drink: the priest and the prophet are uncertain through strong drink, they are overcome by wine, they have gone out of the way through strong drink; their vision is false, they go wrong in their decisions.
8 For all the tables are covered with coughed-up food, so that there is not a clean place.
9 To whom will he give knowledge? and to whom will he make clear the word? Will it be to those who have newly given up milk, and who have only now been taken from the breast?
10 For it is one rule after another; one line after another; here a little, there a little.
11 No, but with broken talk, and with a strange tongue, he will give his word to this people:
12 To whom he said, This is the rest, give rest to him who is tired; and by this you may get new strength; but they would not give ear.
13 For this cause the word of the Lord will be to them rule after rule, line after line, here a little, there a little; so that they may go on their way, and falling back may be broken, and taken in the net.
14 Give ear then to the word of the Lord, you men of pride, the rulers of this people in Jerusalem:
15 Because you have said, We have made death our friend, and with the underworld we have made an agreement; when the overflowing waters come through they will not come near us; for we are looking to false words for help, taking cover in what is untrue:
16 For this cause says the Lord God, See, I am placing in Zion as a base, a stone, a tested stone, an angle-stone which is certain and of great value: and he who has faith will not give way.
17 And I will make right decision the measuring-line, and righteousness the weight: and the ice-storm will take away the safe place of false words, and the secret place will be covered by the flowing waters.
18 And the help you were looking for from death will come to nothing, and your agreement with the underworld will be broken; when the overflowing waters come through, then you will be overcome by them.
19 Whenever they come through they will overtake you; for they will come through morning after morning, by day and by night: and the news will be nothing but fear.
20 For the bed is not long enough for a man to be stretched out on: and the cover is not wide enough for him to be covered with.
21 For the Lord will come up as on Mount Perazim, he will be moved to wrath as in the valley of Gibeon; so that he may do his work--strange is his work; and give effect to his act--unnatural is his act.
22 And now, take care that you do not make sport of him, or your bands will be made strong; for I have had word from the Lord, the Lord of armies, of an end, of a complete end, which is to come on all the land.
23 Let your ears be open to my voice; give attention to what I say.
24 Is the ploughman for ever ploughing? does he not get the earth ready and broken up for the seed?
25 When the face of the earth has been levelled, does he not put in the different sorts of seed, and the grain in lines, and the barley in its place, and the spelt at the edge?
26 For his God is his teacher, giving him the knowledge of these things.
27 For the fitches are not crushed with a sharp instrument, and a cart-wheel is not rolled over the cummin; but the grain of the fitches is hammered out with a stick, and of the cummin with a rod.
28 Is the grain for bread crushed? He does not go on crushing it for ever, but he lets his cart-wheels and his horses go over it without crushing it.
29 This comes from the Lord of armies, purposing wonders, and wise in all his acts.
(GNB)Isa 28:29 All this wisdom comes from the LORD Almighty. The plans God makes are wise, and they always succeed.
george ;D.
Excellent cp! 8)
It helps everyone when Ray's papers have been integrated to become one's own. It looks like that is what you have been blessed to have recieved regarding this topic that encourages us all.
Adding the web address where others can go and see the specific reference, is an additional plus and benifits even us more veteran members to keep off the dust! :D
Arc
Hi Lupac,
Yes there is proof.
Exo 10:20 But the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart...
Exo 10:27 But the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart...
Exo 11:10 ...and the LORD hardened Pharaoh's heart..
There it is, plainly stated in the Scripture. Either you believe what the Scripture says, are you don't.
mercy, peace and love
Kat