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=> General Discussions => Topic started by: newgene87 on July 12, 2012, 11:27:50 PM
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so, just finished reading Ray's paper on the "Mark of the Beast" and gotta say i love it. no doubt, it's like my 5th time reading it (total). I understand I am the beast and you are the beast, WHY I am the beast: the falling away, my house on sand falling, leaving my first love and all that Great yadayada. BUT... why 666??? meaning, WHY did John use specifically those numbers?
"Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of man (i know not A man, but MANkind); and his number is Six hundred threescore and six. " (Rev 13:18)
other questions are: WHERE is the wisdom there? how are we counting (spiritually) this number of the beast (which is me)? and why o why is it "six hundred threescore and six"?
Now i may be looking too deep into this; but our beloved Ray taught me to PAY ATTENTION TO THE WORDS. and from what i see, he expounded on the verse being Man, and not a man, but not the issue on the number. Can anyone help me out. Thank you
Eugene to a NewGene
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might i add; i heard there's another rendering of it that it's not exactly 666, but it could be 616 or something like that. regardless, i know that, so if someone does bring that up; please just expound the spiritual significance of 666 or 616 and the counting of it
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For significant numbers try this. No guarantee of rightness.
777 is the number of completeness of God's plans.
666 is the number of man's ways in exercising his own will, doing what seems right to man.
It's just an old saying that may have no real meaning, so handle with gloves.
Bob
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For significant numbers try this. No guarantee of rightness.
777 is the number of completeness of God's plans.
666 is the number of man's ways in exercising his own will, doing what seems right to man.
It's just an old saying that may have no real meaning, so handle with gloves.
Bob
sooooo as i put these new heavy duty gloves on * :P slips on*, i will grasp these sayings, look at them with a bewildered look ( ??? ??? ??? ???) and ask the question why oh why 777? and 666 again?... like is there a spiritual match of scripture for it. now let me lay it down. i dont want to, ya kno, drop it like it's hot, cuz its not, but...frustrating :D
thanks tho Bob
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Not sure how you came up with "777" being the number of completeness, Bob, when I already told you that it's two 7's. ;D
If I may....
I've been told that the spirit behind the three 6's is like this:
66 books of the bible = the sum of God's word [two 6's down, 1 to go...]
6th day of creation = First Adam was made by God.
Tah dah!
Logically, that makes no sense and there seems to be something missing; maybe it's because we have the "letter" and we have "man"; but a man can read all sixty-six books of the bible every day for the rest of his life and still come up short of being "complete" because reading God's word will not impart the Holy Spirit; only God can do that.
Here is WISDOM, Eugene----------God's saying to us: You're one taco short of a combination plate. (Or to put it delicately: "You're not fully clothed.")
the end.
---------------------------Years ago my sister explained that the number 2 means "witness" to the truth of a matter.
Still someone else told me that 8 means "new beginning" since the week ends or completes on the 7th day and a "new" week begins with the 8th day, basically.
And that's all I know, Eugene! That's all I know. :) Which isn't much when you think about it. :P
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I've been told that the spirit behind the three 6's is like this:
66 books of the bible = the sum of God's word [two 6's down, 1 to go...]
6th day of creation = First Adam was made by God.
Tah dah!
Logically, that makes no sense and there seems to be something missing; maybe it's because we have the "letter" and we have "man"; but a man can read all sixty-six books of the bible every day for the rest of his life and still come up short of being "complete" because reading God's word will not impart the Holy Spirit; only God can do that. ...
oh but Sweet Gina, Ray teaches there are actually 49 books of the bible. quoted from his transcript on "how we got the bible"...
"I said there was 22 books written by 66 AD and by the end of John’s ministry, he added 5 more.
22 +5 = 27 + 22 OT books, all total 49.
7 x 7 = 49 = total completion.
That’s how many books there are suppose to be, that’s how many we have. So we’ve got the complete Bible.
There are some verses that are screwed up. We are going to go over some of those. But we have the complete Bible. In proper numbering it’s 7 x 7, count the number in the King James, how many are there? 66, whose number is that (man, Rev 13:18). The proper numbers are, 22 in the Old Testament and 27 in the New Testament 7 x 7 = 49. That’s how many it should be, we do have the whole Bible. There are either quotations, statements or they alluded to (in the New Testament) that pertain to over a thousand Old Testament Scriptures. Not one quote, from the Apocryphal books that are in the King James or the Catholic Bible or all Bibles before 1885.
Then Catholics played games with it for a while. They saw that 66 was kind of ominous, but the Protestants came up with 66 and the Catholics said, boy that doesn‘t sound right. So at one point they added 14, so it was 80. Most had 80 and even the later additions all had 80.
But the Apostles had it right, it was 27. They knew how many the Old Testament had, they could just go to the local Rabbi and ask him, it was 22. 27 and 22 is 49, that is 7 x 7. [End quote]
so yea, that throws out the 66 books thing. which actually means, man CAN be complet reading the scriptures :P. now, understanding and revelation is only from God of course :D. but thanks Gina. the random info on 8 and 2 was interesting i guess. still doesnt fulfill the 666 deal ::)
Eugene
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Hello Newgene
I think of it this way.
1.FIRST 6=Man
2.second 6=thoughts=mind
3.third 6=mans actions
its in these three actions that complete a man.
Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and sentence of judgment was given unto them; and I saw the souls of them who had been beheaded because of the witness of Jesus and because of the word of God, and such as had not done homage unto the wild-beast or unto his image, nor had received the mark upon their forehead or upon their hand; and they lived and reigned with the Christ, for a thousand years.
upon their forehead or upon their hand;Christ will renew our minds=renewed actions.
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You are absolutely right Eugene.
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Hello Newgene
I think of it this way.
1.FIRST 6=Man
2.second 6=thoughts=mind
3.third 6=mans actions
its in these three actions that complete a man.
Rev 20:4 And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and sentence of judgment was given unto them; and I saw the souls of them who had been beheaded because of the witness of Jesus and because of the word of God, and such as had not done homage unto the wild-beast or unto his image, nor had received the mark upon their forehead or upon their hand; and they lived and reigned with the Christ, for a thousand years.
upon their forehead or upon their hand;Christ will renew our minds=renewed actions.
alright, that got me step closer to an understanding butttttt, how did that equation work out with the 6's being man's thoughts and actions?? thanks for your input Truth, i was waiting on you because you put some deep stuff. now, i will put back on my handy dandy snorkel and dive into this post of yours but can you help me out? how did you come up with that equation?
Thanks
Eugene
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Hey Eugene -
Through my study of the scriptures I have found if the number 6 has any symbolical or spiritual meaning it probably should identify with work. The number 6 signifies a theme of man's work illustrated throughout scripture:
God worked 6 days to create the universe, man was created on the 6th day, men are appointed 6 days to labor, a Hebrew slave was to serve 6 years and be released on the 7th, 6 years were appointed for the land to be sown and harvested, etc. And the number 666 of Revelation 13:18 identifies with the unbeliever non elect who essentially are working to get right with God.
You are correct in saying that the number is not a number of "a" man, but the number of man. Just like we don't translate Christ as the Son of a Man... He was the Son of Man. He was of mankind. In other words He was a human being.
And here also in Rev. the same word is used, so it would have to mean that it is the number of man, the number of mankind, the number of the human race. Anyone who is an unbeliever symbolically has the number 666 on his forehead. It is assigned to the non elect who is destined to the lake of fire after the first resurrection. To make this more apparent of mankind working for their salvation, here are a couple of examples:
In Zechariah 13 in verse 8: Two-thirds I will cut off and destroy, but one-third..." and then it goes on to speak about the redemption of the one-third. The number two-thirds, if written as a decimal, is .666666, and if we just use the first three numbers, we have 666. We read about David, when he defeated the Moabites, that he caused them to lie down in three lines. Two of the lines he put to death. One line he spared, and they served him. David there was a type of Christ, the two-thirds a figure of those who are under the judgment of God and the one-third a figure of those who are the elect. In II Kings I we read of Elijah, that he was sent for by the wicked king of Israel. And a company of men came to take him and he called down fire from heaven, and they were destroyed. A second company of men came to take him, and he called down fire from heaven and they were destroyed. A third company of men came to take him, and plead for mercy, and they were spared. Again we have two-thirds being destroyed, and one-third being spared.
Now with what I have shared... I wouldn't take it as "thus saith the Lord" but what I have observed, and so it could possibly change with newer understanding with others comments.
doug
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Hey Eugene -
Through my study of the scriptures I have found if the number 6 has any symbolical or spiritual meaning it probably should identify with work. The number 6 signifies a theme of man's work illustrated throughout scripture:
God worked 6 days to create the universe, man was created on the 6th day, men are appointed 6 days to labor, a Hebrew slave was to serve 6 years and be released on the 7th, 6 years were appointed for the land to be sown and harvested, etc. And the number 666 of Revelation 13:18 identifies with the unbeliever non elect who essentially are working to get right with God.
You are correct in saying that the number is not a number of "a" man, but the number of man. Just like we don't translate Christ as the Son of a Man... He was the Son of Man. He was of mankind. In other words He was a human being.
And here also in Rev. the same word is used, so it would have to mean that it is the number of man, the number of mankind, the number of the human race. Anyone who is an unbeliever symbolically has the number 666 on his forehead. It is assigned to the non elect who is destined to the lake of fire after the first resurrection. To make this more apparent of mankind working for their salvation, here are a couple of examples:
In Zechariah 13 in verse 8: Two-thirds I will cut off and destroy, but one-third..." and then it goes on to speak about the redemption of the one-third. The number two-thirds, if written as a decimal, is .666666, and if we just use the first three numbers, we have 666. We read about David, when he defeated the Moabites, that he caused them to lie down in three lines. Two of the lines he put to death. One line he spared, and they served him. David there was a type of Christ, the two-thirds a figure of those who are under the judgment of God and the one-third a figure of those who are the elect. In II Kings I we read of Elijah, that he was sent for by the wicked king of Israel. And a company of men came to take him and he called down fire from heaven, and they were destroyed. A second company of men came to take him, and he called down fire from heaven and they were destroyed. A third company of men came to take him, and plead for mercy, and they were spared. Again we have two-thirds being destroyed, and one-third being spared.
Now with what I have shared... I wouldn't take it as "thus saith the Lord" but what I have observed, and so it could possibly change with newer understanding with others comments.
doug
now that's more like it. now i can work with that. while i'm still swimming in thetruths post, i can see how 6 can signify work. or man's action, what he will do and etc. thanks doug
it's just so easy to read commentaries on this matter; and they are OFF THE WALL. one shows an equation of the greek letters of the number forming a title, which means "Messiah of Satan" (like really ??? ??? ???). and the number actually stood for ceasar of the day or something like that; an actual man during that time; obviously most biblical interpretations today are SO FRAUD. Just seeking the truth.
thanks again Doug
Eugene
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Hi,
Those who have the mind set of english will only see in english & since the letters are not english there wont be any english numbers there in so what langage is it writen in .
Versucuchen Sie r'o'mische Zahlen.
vielleicht sogar Brefe.
und wenn
& does it refer to one man or more,& when,
...noeleena...
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I'm listening noeleena. :)
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Hi,
Those who have the mind set of english will only see in english & since the letters are not english there wont be any english numbers there in so what langage is it writen in .
well it was written in Greek, but the translation is correct. combining 600, 60 and 6. "εξακοσια εξηκοντα εξ" is the words for this, but that does no good. the translation, i believe, would still be six hundred threescore and six.
the question is still; how does these numbers, count to be the number of the beast??
Versucuchen Sie r'o'mische Zahlen.
vielleicht sogar Brefe.
und wenn
speaking of translation; translation please? ;) :D
& does it refer to one man or more,& when,
...noeleena...
and in the words of our beloved Ray...
"The Greek word used when only man is meant (always excluding woman), is aner. But the Greek word translated "man" in Rev. 13:18 is not aner, but rather the word anthropos, which means "a human being, male or female." Strong’s Concordant.
Furthermore, it is not the number of "a" anything. It is just the number of human or of mankind! Even the Revised Standard Version translators saw this and therefore, states, "It’s number is six hundred sixty-six." The number of the wild beast is not the number of "a" man, but rather the number of "man" or "mankind." [end quote]
Eugene
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I think where we're all going wrong is, we're looking at the 666 number and taking it literally. Remember how we looked at 144,000 literally? But it's not literally 144,000 thousand. And it can't be literally six hundred and sixty-six either. I can't believe that just occurred to me. Shame on me.
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just a thought, i believe that whenever God was emphasizing the great importance of certain matters in the Scriptures, He would declare it three times. maybe, the number 6 for mankind was being emphasized by God the Father by the combination of the three 6's. okay, maybe it is way off target, but, it was just a thought. and of course, as we have learned, all of revelations is symbolic and not literal.
claudia
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I think where we're all going wrong is, we're looking at the 666 number and taking it literally. Remember how we looked at 144,000 literally? But it's not literally 144,000 thousand. And it can't be literally six hundred and sixty-six either. I can't believe that just occurred to me. Shame on me.
not implying that all scripture has "reason" but the 144,000 had reason. John did list each tribe of Israel, stating specifically 12,000 of each tribe. i missed that
Rev 7:5 Of the tribe of Judah were sealed twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Reuben twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Gad twelve thousand:
Rev 7:6 Of the tribe of Asher twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Naphtali twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Manasseh twelve thousand:
Rev 7:7 Of the tribe of Simeon twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Levi twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Issachar twelve thousand:
Rev 7:8 Of the tribe of Zebulun twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Joseph twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Benjamin were sealed twelve thousand.
but, of course it's spiritual, and it's a totality figure. but 666? naw, i dont take ANYTHING literal in Revelations. John said, " I was in the Spirit on the Lord's day, and I heard behind me ...". yet, again, why 666? what is spiritual about it?
now this can be wrapped in an enigma at the end of it all. it's fine with me. Jesus is still my Savior, my Lord, and my God :D :D. I'm just so hungry to see things i never saw before. :D
and thanks Cj. that is food for thought. God did call Samuel 3 times -1Sam 3:8 -....but he called Moses name 2 times (Exo 3:4); and Jesus seemed to love, "Verily, Verily...". ah 2, 3, tomato, tomahto; i get the picture. i'm going to get this enigma one day. but it wont be an idol tho. I'm just fascinated with Scripture and how it eventually lines up :D :D
Eugene
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Hi,
So if we leave out the numbers & looking at what was going on around that time before & after who were the people it concerned was it the ( r'o'mische ) roman,
There is a name it refered to some thing in detail concerning the romans, roman letters ,
change the numbers to letters in = like as for english 1 = a , 2 =b it was done in such a way to fool the romans,
its over 25 years since i went through it ,i got sick of hearing the same claptrap so i just left it alone walked away, so my info went as well.
When i saw you's talking about it, i though okay. & the people who used to stir up others with in some groups i knew , allways said what was writen in the letters ( bible ), its just translated all wrong allthough it got the people in to fear mode. thats what these so called pastors did, so if you dig some more up will see what you come up with. see if its close to what i have, there was one name given just could be spelt slightly different , i cant think of the names, i bury things away ,in my mind so takes a while to find them.
...noeleena...
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Hi Eugene,
Did you notice that the tribe of Dan was not mentioned among the twelve tribes of Israel?
I wonder why?
Indianabob
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Gen 30:1 And when Rachel saw that she bare Jacob no children, Rachel envied her sister; and said unto Jacob, Give me children, or else I die.
Gen 30:2 And Jacob's anger was kindled against Rachel: and he said, Am I in God's stead, who hath withheld from thee the fruit of the womb?
Gen 30:3 And she said, Behold my maid Bilhah, go in unto her; and she shall bear upon my knees, that I may also have children by her.
Gen 30:4 And she gave him Bilhah her handmaid to wife: and Jacob went in unto her.
Gen 30:5 And Bilhah conceived, and bare Jacob a son.
Gen 30:6 And Rachel said, God hath judged me, and hath also heard my voice, and hath given me a son: therefore called she his name Dan.
= = = =
I think where we're all going wrong is, we're looking at the 666 number and taking it literally. Remember how we looked at 144,000 literally? But it's not literally 144,000 thousand. And it can't be literally six hundred and sixty-six either. I can't believe that just occurred to me. Shame on me.
not implying that all scripture has "reason" but the 144,000 had reason. John did list each tribe of Israel, stating specifically 12,000 of each tribe. i missed that
Rev 7:5 Of the tribe of Judah were sealed twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Reuben twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Gad twelve thousand:
Rev 7:6 Of the tribe of Asher twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Naphtali twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Manasseh twelve thousand:
Rev 7:7 Of the tribe of Simeon twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Levi twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Issachar twelve thousand:
Rev 7:8 Of the tribe of Zebulun twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Joseph twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Benjamin were sealed twelve thousand.
Eugene
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Hello newgene
Sorry newgene if I didnt explain more clearly in my post.Just a fine line in teaching and answering a question here on the forum.I think Doug expressed the just of what I am saying though.The number 666 completes the order in which the state or condition the un-converted man rest.....in carnality.
example: Heb 4:12 For, living, is the word of God, and, energetic, and more cutting than any knife with two edges, and penetrating as far as a dividing asunder of soul and spirit, of joints also, and marrow, and able to judge the impulses and designs of the hear
1Th 5:23 But, the God of peace himself, hallow you completely, and, entire, might your spirit, and soul, and body,— so as to be unblameable in the Presence of our Lord Jesus Christ,—be perserved.
Heb-4-12-the un-converted man spirit is ruled BY his soul.
I believe Ray has something in his writings in regards to how I got the "what each 6 stood for not sure.
1-Thess 5-23 man his spirit rules his soul
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Claudia's on to something.
You figure - there were 7 lampstands (ref. Rev.) and 7 "signifies" all churches [albeit not "complete" churches because they're lacking]. And God repeats that number 7 again and again, but it's all speaking to the same thing: the churches
So,just like Claudia said, when God repeats something, He's trying to drive home a point. So to me, 666 stands for mankind without the Holy Spirit of God -- which is at its very core nothing more than a carnal-minded BEAST.
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Hi Eugene,
Did you notice that the tribe of Dan was not mentioned among the twelve tribes of Israel?
I wonder why?
Indianabob
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Gen 30:1 And when Rachel saw that she bare Jacob no children, Rachel envied her sister; and said unto Jacob, Give me children, or else I die.
Gen 30:2 And Jacob's anger was kindled against Rachel: and he said, Am I in God's stead, who hath withheld from thee the fruit of the womb?
Gen 30:3 And she said, Behold my maid Bilhah, go in unto her; and she shall bear upon my knees, that I may also have children by her.
Gen 30:4 And she gave him Bilhah her handmaid to wife: and Jacob went in unto her.
Gen 30:5 And Bilhah conceived, and bare Jacob a son.
Gen 30:6 And Rachel said, God hath judged me, and hath also heard my voice, and hath given me a son: therefore called she his name Dan.
= = = =
I think where we're all going wrong is, we're looking at the 666 number and taking it literally. Remember how we looked at 144,000 literally? But it's not literally 144,000 thousand. And it can't be literally six hundred and sixty-six either. I can't believe that just occurred to me. Shame on me.
not implying that all scripture has "reason" but the 144,000 had reason. John did list each tribe of Israel, stating specifically 12,000 of each tribe. i missed that
Rev 7:5 Of the tribe of Judah were sealed twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Reuben twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Gad twelve thousand:
Rev 7:6 Of the tribe of Asher twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Naphtali twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Manasseh twelve thousand:
Rev 7:7 Of the tribe of Simeon twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Levi twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Issachar twelve thousand:
Rev 7:8 Of the tribe of Zebulun twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Joseph twelve thousand: Of the tribe of Benjamin were sealed twelve thousand.
Eugene
Whats even more interesting is that the tribe of LEVI is placed there and they were to have NO inheritance whatsoever. they only had the priesthood. It's expressed in Judges 18, Dan is singled out falling into idolatry, so maybe that's why Levi is all of sudden listed here and Dan wasnt. i did notice there were still 12 listed. and Mannaseh is listed, the SON of Joseph, and Ephraim isnt... idolatry befalls both Ephraim and Dan (hosea 4:17 and Judges 17-18) and in that same Judges18 text, that Micah, with the graven images is an Ephraimite.....what's even more interesting, Dan uses 600 armed men to take that land (which they did in sin) Judges 18:11. AND the takes the Levite Priest from Micah...... hmmm...hmmm all interesting. 600, dan, levite, ephraimite.....
and Gina and Truth; i think you both are putting the pieces together
thanks for the replies! ;D
thanks for all the replies
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the question is still; how does these numbers, count to be the number of the beast??
The word that is translated count is the greek word psephizo, which only occurs two time in the new testament. The other place is in:
Luke 14:28 For which of you, intending to build a tower, sitteth not down first, and counteth the cost, whether he have [sufficient] to finish [it]?
Psephizo is also translated reckon, so the spiritual meaning,the way I see it, of Rev 13:8 is let him who has understanding (the mind, comprising alike the faculties of perceiving and understanding and those of feeling, judging, determining) reckon/ take into account the number of the beast
Like David we have to face Goliath!!
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That makes sense, Eagle. to me it's like God's saying: Consider that I made mankind on the "sixth day" of creation, and creation was not yet complete as God had not rested from His works and man, without Rest (Christ) is not complete -- hence, the beast.
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the question is still; how does these numbers, count to be the number of the beast??
The word that is translated count is the greek word psephizo, which only occurs two time in the new testament. The other place is in:
Luke 14:28 For which of you, intending to build a tower, sitteth not down first, and counteth the cost, whether he have [sufficient] to finish [it]?
Psephizo is also translated reckon, so the spiritual meaning,the way I see it, of Rev 13:8 is let him who has understanding (the mind, comprising alike the faculties of perceiving and understanding and those of feeling, judging, determining) reckon/ take into account the number of the beast
Like David we have to face Goliath!!
wowsers....that does make sense. that just blew me away. see, i'm raising a 3 year old; and teaching him to "count", i'm thinking "1.....2......3...*no not 8*....4...5" and so on ;D. so yeaaaaa i get. thanks Eagle. i can see the spiritual significance in that. God is saying take to account and reckon the number of the beast. and as truth revealed, God saying it is YOU YOU YOU without ME ME ME.
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666 in greek is Chi (600) -xi (60) stigma(6)
1 Samuel 17:4 And there went out a champion out of the camp of the Philistines, named Goliath, of Gath, whose height was six cubits and a span.
1 Samuel 17:7 And the staff of his spear was like a weaver's beam; and his spear's head weighed six hundred shekels of iron: and one bearing a shield went before him.
Goliath means splendour in hebrew.
Rev 13:3 ...and all the world wondered after the beast
Champion in hebrew is derived from Iysh which means Man. You can go on and on with this. But better yet check out what the Lord did for and through David in Davids fight against Goliath. David means beloved. That´s us !!! :)
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Such wisdom John, I'm impressed. :o
Craig
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6 + 6 + 6= 18
18 x 7 = 126
126 divided by 3 = 42
42 + 7 = 49
The square root of 49 = 7
Bingo 8)
Excellent. Glad we now know how to count. And I was under the impression that we are the beast or that VISA was the beast.
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Man was created on day six in Genesis along with the other beasts of the earth. That in and of it self should give us a good reason why we also are called beasts.The number six is that symbolic number of the beast [mankind] because man was created on the sixth day.
Gen 1:27 And creating is the Elohim humanity in His image. In the image of the Elohim He creates it. Male and female He creates them.
Gen 1:31 ...the sixth day.
As far as God is concerned we have no preeminence above a beast...
Ecc 3:18 I said in mine heart concerning the estate of the sons of men, that God might manifest them, and that they might see that they themselves are beasts.
Ecc 3:19 For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity.
The number three in Scripture is symbolic for the process of completion...
Luk 13:32 And he said unto them, Go ye, and tell that fox, Behold, I cast out devils, and I do cures to day and to morrow, and the third day I shall be perfected.
Joh 2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.
and judgement...
Exo 5:3 And they said, The God of the Hebrews hath met with us: let us go, we pray thee, three days’ journey into the desert, and sacrifice unto the LORD our God; lest he fall upon us with pestilence, or with the sword.
Rev 8:12 And the fourth angel sounded, and the third part of the sun was smitten, and the third part of the moon, and the third part of the stars; so as the third part of them was darkened, and the day shone not for a third part of it, and the night likewise.
Rev 8:13 And I beheld, and heard an angel flying through the midst of heaven, saying with a loud voice, Woe, woe, woe, to the inhabiters of the earth by reason of the other voices of the trumpet of the three angels, which are yet to sound!
Gen 40:19 Yet within three days shall Pharaoh lift up thy head from off thee, and shall hang thee on a tree; and the birds shall eat thy flesh from off thee.
Exo 10:22 And Moses stretched forth his hand toward heaven; and there was a thick darkness in all the land of Egypt three days:
Exo 15:22 So Moses brought Israel from the Red sea, and they went out into the wilderness of Shur; and they went three days in the wilderness, and found no water.
Num 22:28 And the LORD opened the mouth of the a@@, and she said unto Balaam, What have I done unto thee, that thou hast smitten me these three times?
What I can see from Scripture, three sixes are a symbolic way of seeing things Spiritually. Mankind/the beast [six] must be made complete[three] through the process and progression,into judgement. Hence the 6-6-6 symbol is for those who have eyes and ears to see things Spiritual.
Rev 13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.
Mat 13:15 ...lest at any time they should see with their eyes, and hear with their ears, and should understand with their heart, and should be converted, and I should heal them.
Hope this helps some.
Peace...Mark
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What I can see from Scripture, three sixes are a symbolic way of seeing things Spiritually. Mankind/the beast [six] must be made complete[three] through the process and progression,into judgement.Hence the 6-6-6 symbol is for those who have eyes and ears to see things Spiritual.
Mark, I liked your great scriptural help into the understanding of Revelation 13:18. Your logic in using the number of the beast from the Genesis account was good and God's use of the number 3 was especially helpful.
I understand and agree with the first half of your quote but maybe I am misunderstanding the last highlighted part.
How would that statement then relate to the elect believers of the passage in Revelation 13:17 and also to 14:9-10?
17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
Isn't Wisdom for us who can see what the symbol 666 means but is it not put upon the unbeliever whose eyes and ears haven't been opened?
I'm sorry if I have misinterpreted what you had to say in the last part or your quote and maybe some additional clarification would help.
doug
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Ray pointed out that man is the beast. The reference in Rev. is describing the beast in 3 parts.
1) what we were before the fall.
2) What we are now.
3) what we will become.
The full cycle of the beast= mankind
tinknocker
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From: http://bible-truths.com/lake9.html (http://bible-truths.com/lake9.html)
Let me give you the history of the world including all future prophecies, in one sentence:
God perfectly planned and recorded His creation of the heavens, angels, the earth, and carnal humanity, who sinned wickedly and were all drowned (save a few); who then reached for their own heaven at the tower of Babel in rebellion to the God Who then scattered them (save a few); who later built Babylon into a great pagan empire which God destroyed (save a few); who have since built many wicked and fornicating Babylons collectively called, Mystery Babylon The Great, whom God warns before utterly destroying again (save a few); and of ‘the Few’ God is creating a New Spiritual Humanity of Son-and-Daughter Saviours like unto Jesus, in New Jerusalem on spiritual Mt. Zion, were ALL will be redeemed (NOT just a few); that God may be "ALL in All"!
Maybe I could shorten it down a smidgen, but there it is. The reality of most of the symbolism of Revelation is contained in that one sentence. "But Mr. Smith, I don’t see ‘666’ anywhere in your sentence." You don’t? I do. I see 666 followed by 777 in nearly every phrase of that sentence. "He that has an ear, let him hear what the Spirit says unto the Churches!"
From: http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,6452.0.html (http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,6452.0.html)
Mark 4:11 …Unto YOU it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that are without, all these things are done in parables:
Well wait a minute we have just learned something all over there again. What are the parables about? The called and the chosen, the many and the few.
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Isn't Wisdom for us who can see what the symbol 666 means but is it not put upon the unbeliever whose eyes and ears haven't been opened?
Hi Doug.
Yes, I would say that you are correct.The Lord certainly chooses whom He wants for His own,many are called but few are chosen,down through the ages,the calling out of His elect. Wisdom is for those whom He draws unto Himself. Without Gods grace teaching us we would not be aware of anything of the Spirit. But we must remember that Jesus is the Savior of all people,not just a few,eventually all eyes and ears will be opened,now in judgement,or later,in the LOF. Judgement will certainly make pure all people of all time, in His time,not ours.
I myself feel blessed that my Lord has caused me to understand some things of the Spirit. In times past,just as others here,I did not have a clue about His Word [but I thought I was a believer] and was chest deep in the babylonian system of things,thinking all along that I had a handle on Spiritual matters, but in reality, I was yet a babe in Christ. I feel it safe to say that all of us here have been through some of the same. Until He comes and lives within our hearts and minds, we are yet carnal, and dead to Him.
1Co 15:22 For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive.
Mat 10:39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.
Gal 2:20 I am crucified with Christ: nevertheless I live; yet not I, but Christ liveth in me: and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by the faith of the Son of God, who loved me, and gave himself for me.
Joh 3:30 He must increase, but I must decrease.
We must all go through all things,according to the Scriptures,even as others. Because all things come alike to all...
1Co 3:21 Therefore let no man glory in men. For all things are yours;
1Co 3:22 Whether Paul, or Apollos, or Cephas, or the world, or life, or death, or things present, or things to come; all are yours;
Eph 2:2 Wherein in time past ye walked according to the course of this world, according to the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that now worketh in the children of disobedience:
Eph 2:3 Among whom also we all had our conversation in times past in the lusts of our flesh, fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind; and were by nature the children of wrath, even as others.
Ecc 9:1 For all this I considered in my heart even to declare all this, that the righteous, and the wise, and their works, are in the hand of God: no man knoweth either love or hatred by all that is before them.
Ecc 9:2 All things come alike to all: there is one event to the righteous, and to the wicked; to the good and to the clean, and to the unclean; to him that sacrificeth, and to him that sacrificeth not: as is the good, so is the sinner; and he that sweareth, as he that feareth an oath.
When we come to understand our journey in our walk with the Lord,its easy to see,and hear,that nothing is of ourselves,but rather,it is His gift from God.So yes,there are unbelievers whose eyes and ears haven't been opened,but for now,our time is at hand,for the children of Faith.
Eph 2:5 Even when we were dead in sins, hath quickened us together with Christ, (by grace ye are saved;)
Eph 2:6 And hath raised us up together, and made us sit together in heavenly places in Christ Jesus:
Eph 2:7 That in the ages to come he might shew the exceeding riches of his grace in his kindness toward us through Christ Jesus.
Eph 2:8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Hope this helps.
Peace...Mark
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Thanks Family....
I Got It !!! ;) I Just Wanted To See If We Were All In Agreement ! And We Are! :)
(it's had to interpret others meanings sometimes without some additional corroboration)
Blessings All,
doug
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yea...you all are AMAZING :D. im blown away by the wisdom displayed here from these complex numbers. but i got. thank you all. Regardless, Humility and Love are my focus now.
thank you all
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THE NUMBER 666
"Here is wisdom. Let him that has understanding count the NUMBER OF THE BEAST: for it is the NUMBER OF A MAN; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six [666]" (Rev. 13:18).
Is this indeed what the Greek manuscripts of Rev. 13:18 state? No, it is not.
The Greek word used when only man is meant (always excluding woman), is aner. But the Greek word translated "man" in Rev. 13:18 is not aner, but rather the word anthropos, which means "a human being, male or female." Strong’s Concordant.
Furthermore, it is not the number of "a" anything. It is just the number of human or of mankind! Even the Revised Standard Version translators saw this and therefore, states, "It’s number is six hundred sixty-six." The number of the wild beast is not the number of "a" man, but rather the number of "man" or "mankind."
Brothers and sisters, when reading the papers of Mr. Ray and try to look the It's in the Revised Standard Version, nowhere i can find it.
Can you please enlighten me this word and what is the significance of this word. What version of the Bible can we see the word IT's?
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I don't have access to the RSV.
To note: The RSV is a revised version of the King James, so that is most probably why Ray mentioned it.)
These translations also render it "its":
The ISV (which is a revision of the King James, if I'm not mistaken), the LITV, the YLT, and the CLV.
(corrected to make up for being half-asleep earlier).
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THE NUMBER 666
"Here is wisdom. Let him that has understanding count the NUMBER OF THE BEAST: for it is the NUMBER OF A MAN; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six [666]" (Rev. 13:18).
Is this indeed what the Greek manuscripts of Rev. 13:18 state? No, it is not.
The Greek word used when only man is meant (always excluding woman), is aner. But the Greek word translated "man" in Rev. 13:18 is not aner, but rather the word anthropos, which means "a human being, male or female." Strong’s Concordant.
Furthermore, it is not the number of "a" anything. It is just the number of human or of mankind! Even the Revised Standard Version translators saw this and therefore, states, "It’s number is six hundred sixty-six." The number of the wild beast is not the number of "a" man, but rather the number of "man" or "mankind."
Brothers and sisters, when reading the papers of Mr. Ray and try to look the It's in the Revised Standard Version, nowhere i can find it.
Can you please enlighten me this word and what is the significance of this word. What version of the Bible can we see the word IT's?
There are many online versions of the various bible translations. One I use is The Blue Letter Bible at blueletterbible.org.
Enter Rev 13:18. Then click the Letter "V" on the verse, which will give you several bible translations of the verse.
The RSV version of Rev 13:18 says, "...its number is six hundred and sixty-six."
I have already visited the site but nowhere i find the apostrophe in its. In English language(which of course i am not expert as obvious) Ray mentioned IT's with an apostrophe.
IT's means It has, and its means possessive form of it and varies in meaning.
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The revised standard uses the word "its" without the apostrophe. Perhaps the apostrophe is a typo by Ray. We can't ask him but that is what I assume.
Craig
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Remember also that the Greek language has no punctuation in it. Whenever punctuation is used it's always the work of the translators.
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The revised standard uses the word "its" without the apostrophe. Perhaps the apostrophe is a typo by Ray. We can't ask him but that is what I assume.
Craig
Thank you for the clarifications. I was explaining this to my family regarding the latest event that is happening. Then i quoted the revelations and suddenly my younger brother noticed the it's then. rest is history.... :-\
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http://www.its-not-its.info/
The versions I checked earlier have "its"...possessive. I messed up, but have corrected it.