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=> General Discussions => Topic started by: coryd123 on February 17, 2010, 11:29:19 PM
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God bless everyone. Fellow brethren, I just would like to know if anyone has had any kind of visions or super natural encounters with GOD? I can see the spirit of GOD moving through the people on this sight with wisdom and truth.
we all know that we serve a supernatural GOD and I came to realize that it's hard to turn a page in the bible without some kind of supernatural healing or miracle or casting out of demons.
I also came to realize that Jesus and his disciples were in the business to save souls ultimately, but in the midst of that they also had power to heal the sick and cast out devils, after all it is a battle between spiritual wickedness in high places.
GOD seemed to anoint most of the disciple with powers. We all know that Jesus is the same yesterday the same today and the same tomorrow and we are also only profound to the kingdom as what we know and believe.
I also know that there are different gifts within the body of Christ but it seems that mostly EVERYONE of the disciples that were in the bible had the power to cast out demons and heal the sick and many signs and wonders also.
I have not really heard anyone on here talk to much about the supernatural powers of GOD The scriptures declare that if you shall lay hands on the sick and they shall recover if it's in gods will to heal that person and he has anointed you. scriptures just sticking out to me like this one below.
Mat 21:21-22 Jesus answered and said unto them, Verily I say unto you, If ye have faith, and doubt not, ye shall not only do this which is done to the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done. And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.
I know there a lot more to it than what this scripture says but there are people that have understanding and believe the scriptures and have many signs and wonders and there are many false people that come in the name of the lord with signs and wonders to. Please advise me on some truth about the supernatural.
Gods purpose and plan is being done no matter what.
I just feel that the body of Christ will be more powerful if we learn about the supernatural because these are some promises that Jesus made for a reason to his disciples. Dont anyone get confused in thinking that just old anyone can ask to heal someone and it be done. I do understand that everything is a gift from god but if maybe we study and believe the scripture it might be in his will for some of us to lay hands hands on the sick and they recover.
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Thanks for your in-put Yea I agree that those are all miracles but I was mainly talking about visions and signs and wonders like healing.
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every second of every day is supernatural, I have had one that sticks out but to long to type
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Hi, this would be my opinion on this, :( I don't believe that anyone ever, outside of the bible has ever had a real encounter with God or ever will, until the end. If God does do, or has done supernatural (things) after the biblical days there is no proof of it or ever will be, and I like it that way knowing that I believe the truth without having a supernatural event with God.
Ricky
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The human eye, today, I have two, God gave them to me=supernatural. There is more. Ray said in one of his teachings that it takes a miracle of God to make one stubburn. I was that stubburn. God called me out=supernatural. Ray himself talks about his experience with casting out demons, bok buk and no were their names. Guess it is a matter of perspective. I understand your position Ricky, not debating or discounting you in anyway just sharing. God reveals Himself differently to different people. Peace
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Hi there coryd.
I have had several experiences that 1 might call 'supernatural' whilst in the charismatic churches. Healings, demons cast out . . . I have even done some of these - truly amazing experiences . . .and more than a few. God can and does heal physically.
However,
I have since come to realise that these wonders ABSOLUTELY PALE in comparison to the OVERWHELMING AWESOMENESS of the power of God as displayed when He SPIRITUALLY HEALS someone. The experience of rising from the dead (spiritually) was BY FAR the most MAGNIFICENT thing God ever did for me.
I think, perhaps, you put far too much stock in what the carnal mind can perceive, and not enough in those things that are FAR MORE POWERFUL, which the carnal mind can not even conceive of.
Peace to you, brother.
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Hi coryd123
John from Kentucky hits the nail bang on the head
Ray has brought the spiritual dead back to life; healed the spiritual sick; gave sight to the spiritual blind and hearing to the spiritual deaf.
Also F@lgn0n testifies well that
The experience of rising from the dead (spiritually) was BY FAR the most MAGNIFICENT thing God ever did for me.
We need to get untangled with the ways of the world and the manifestations of works of the flesh. God is calling us out of these deceptions to His Light and through His Spirit.
Notice what Jesus said to Peter :)
Mat 16:23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.
The Church is minding the things that tickle, impress, influence and manipulate the feelings and esteem of carnal man. These shows of spiritual works of the flesh are actually leading people further into dependence on the flesh for their sense of well being. The condition of the soul is more important.
For what does it profit a man if their body is flawlessly healthy and they lose their soul?
What does it profit a man if their mind is brilliantly functional if they lose their soul?
The Church is practicing works of the flesh and mind because they savor not the things that are of God, but those that be of men.
And yes, I have experienced many unexplainable circumstances that can be categorized as paranormal. So greater has been my handicap!
The quote you refer to in Mat 21 shows us where we are heading not where we are.
Non of us are yet perfected into the Image of Christ. When we are, then, and not before, we shall have the Faith of Christ. We only have the deposit of such Faith. Once this Faith is fully accomplished in us, through our trials and tribulations, then, we shall no longer doubt, then, ye shall not only do this which is done to do the fig tree, but also if ye shall say unto this mountain, Be thou removed, and be thou cast into the sea; it shall be done. And all things, whatsoever ye shall ask in prayer, believing, ye shall receive.\....but not today….
Church leaders love to ascribe “gifts of the Holy Spirit” to its own appointed hierarchy, showing itself guilty in the practice of theft and fraud. They have their reward and their correction is reserved for them. these following Scriptures are really good pointers for anyone being called out of the deceptive practises of demons.
Rev 13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
Rev 16:14 For they are the spirits of devils, working miracles, which go forth unto the kings of the earth and of the whole world, to gather them to the battle of that great day of God Almighty.
Leaving extravagance, continue to Live simply. Live faithfully. Live peacefully. Live trustfully.
Arc
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Well said Arc,
I too have seen and/or been involved in casting out demons and witnessed heeling's that boggle the mind. I must concure that raising the spiritually dead is far greater. I try to see the super natural power of God every day in everything I do, see, touch etc, especially the spiritually raised. Peace
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It crystalises the priority doesn't it Roy?
Joh 11:25 "I am the Resurrection and the Life," said Jesus; "he who believes in me, even if he has died, he shall live; 8)
What is better: seeing the Palace of the King ( the trinkets and the delights ) or being in the King's Presence? Need I ask..... :)
Arc
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Mat 24:24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
Babylon claims to be the wonder and the sign!
Arc
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Several people are experiencing the Super Natural right now in
British Columbia, Canada!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xwSCHRQCIBY
Gotta be there!
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Thank you for all your responses. I agree the saving the soul is more precious than miraculous healing or wonders and that every day is supernatural but I was just trying to get more understanding on visions, casting out demons and healing because it's definably part of the body of Christ and it's still going on today as Roy said he experienced it and it is spiritual warfare going on and as it is in heaven it will be done on thy earth and god works through his people especially HIS SAINTS, ELECT, OR CHOSEN for it to be established and I was just seeing if anyone on here has been anointed to do that. Also I know that GOD is the cause behind all things and he causes and prompts us to pray for ourselves and other people. Where im going with this is that I stand on the promises of GOD and I don't want to be as Babylon that my main focus is on the carnal glamor of gods word. Ok let me get to the point. I have read all about rays teachings on praying and asking god for his will to be done and we will always have are prayers answered and I have found that to be true to a certain degree because gods will will be done no matter how we pray because what ever you pray is what GOD already pre-ordained for you to pray but that is the correct way to pray in most cases but that was not always true in the bible especially when it came to casting out a devil or healing someone. Most the disciples said I command or come out of her and used Jesus name they did not always say father let thy will be done because they new they were anointed with the power under certain circumstances to have signs and wonders and (SPIRITUAL TRUTH TO GO ALONG WITH THE SIGNS AND WONDERS) to ask in thy name and receive. I just would like to know more truth about what authority GOD has given us to prompt us to have a vision or maybe cast out a devil or heal someone physically. Again let me reiterate that spiritual healing is more important than physical healing and that THROUGH MUCH TRIBULATION WILL WEE SEE THE KINGDOM OF GOD so sometimes we have to go through sickness and oppression. I pray that someone on here gives me a clear understanding on what authority we may have as as far as gods promises ON what I can stand on with the supernatural of GODS kingdom? And also am I wrong for wanting to know the truth about this subject because it has not been taught much on here and I know one can deny that it was a nice size part of Jesus ministry matter a fact somewhere around 2/3 of Jesus meetings with multitudes he was healing or casting and yea I do understand that a lot of them did not repent after his miracles but it may have converted some of them to the knowledge of the truth and its still a nice part of ministry and Paul and many other disciples and is still going on today and also I have read the scripture as you all pointed out that there are many that will come with signs and wonders that are false and I definably don't wish to be one of them. Please correct me if anything I said does not line up with scripture. Help! Thank you all.
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Thank you for all your responses. I agree the saving the soul is more precious than miraculous healing or wonders and that every day is supernatural but I was just trying to get more understanding on visions, casting out demons and healing because it's definably part of the body of Christ and it's still going on today
Hello Cory,
Paul spoke of the 'gifts' within the body of Christ 'vanishing away', so I don't know why you believe it would 'still be going on' in any great capacity.
as Roy said he experienced it and it is spiritual warfare going on and as it is in heaven it will be done on thy earth and god works through his people especially HIS SAINTS, ELECT, OR CHOSEN for it to be established and I was just seeing if anyone on here has been anointed to do that.
Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places
But 'how' do we wrestle with this powers and principalities? Do we 'shout & yell' that people be healed in the name of Jesus or tell demons to come out of a person?
2 Cor 10:3-5 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh: (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;) Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;
God gives us His spirit and works in us to repent and overcome our flesh. God tells us that in establishing the new covenant, He put His spiritual law into our hearts & minds [Heb 8:10, 10:16]. It's a matter of one's thoughts & desires being aligned with the righteousness of God...for out of the heart, the mouth speaks [Matt 12:34, Luke 6:45]
Also I know that GOD is the cause behind all things and he causes and prompts us to pray for ourselves and other people. Where im going with this is that I stand on the promises of GOD and I don't want to be as Babylon that my main focus is on the carnal glamor of gods word. Ok let me get to the point. I have read all about rays teachings on praying and asking god for his will to be done and we will always have are prayers answered and I have found that to be true to a certain degree
'To a certain degree'? That's not true at all...God works all things (not all things to a certain degree) after the counsel of His own Will.
because gods will will be done no matter how we pray because what ever you pray is what GOD already pre-ordained for you to pray but that is the correct way to pray in most cases but that was not always true in the bible especially when it came to casting out a devil or healing someone. Most the disciples said I command or come out of her and used Jesus name they did not always say father let thy will be done because they new they were anointed with the power under certain circumstances to have signs and wonders and (SPIRITUAL TRUTH TO GO ALONG WITH THE SIGNS AND WONDERS) to ask in thy name and receive.
What kind of reasoning is that? Just because the apostles didn't make a big spectacle of saying 'thy will be done' does not mean that was not in their heart. The apostles did not will, of their own independence, any of the miracles they performed nor even thought that what they were doing was not of the Father's Will:
Paul - 1 Cor 1:1 Paul called to be an apostle of Jesus Christ through the will of God...
Writer of Hebrews - Heb 6:3 this will we do, if God permit.
James - James 4:15 For that ye ought to say, If the Lord will, we shall live, and do this, or that
Peter - 1 Pet 3:17 For it is better, if the will of God be so...
John - John 15:5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
I just would like to know more truth about what authority GOD has given us to prompt us to have a vision or maybe cast out a devil or heal someone physically.
When has the Lord ever given someone authority to bring about their own visions? God always brings the vision to the individual.
If the Lord moves or inspires someone, anyone, on this earth to 'cast out a demon' or 'heal someone' then that person will do it. We shouldn't worry about potentially missing the calling that God has for us...it is God who works IN us both to will and to do [Phil 2:13]...He does the works.
Again let me reiterate that spiritual healing is more important than physical healing and that THROUGH MUCH TRIBULATION WILL WEE SEE THE KINGDOM OF GOD so sometimes we have to go through sickness and oppression. I pray that someone on here gives me a clear understanding on what authority we may have as as far as gods promises ON what I can stand on with the supernatural of GODS kingdom?
Cory, what you are basically saying is that someone who repents of the hellfire doctrine, free will, and any other corrupt, pagan doctrine by the spirit of God is not 'supernatural' enough for you...you need to 'see' a miracle. That is carnal reasoning and understanding at it's worse.
Do you know that 'carnal' can also be defined as 'natural'? So technically, you are seeking a super carnal display of the flesh. Why would you want to have authority and dominion of the flesh seeing that the flesh profits nothing? God is making us into ministers of flames [Heb 1:7, Ps 104:4] for the express purpose of judging the world and the heavenly hosts [1 Cor 6:2-3].
Also remember, this current wicked age belongs to Satan [2 Cor 4:4, Matt 4:8-9]...though all power comes from above [John 19:11]. That is why sickness, death, pain, etc. runs rampant...and it is only going to get worse and worse until Christ comes to put all enemies (including sickness, false doctrines, pain, character flaws, and ultimately death]) under His footstool [1 Cor 15:25].
And also am I wrong for wanting to know the truth about this subject because it has not been taught much on here and I know one can deny that it was a nice size part of Jesus ministry matter a fact somewhere around 2/3 of Jesus meetings with multitudes he was healing or casting and yea I do understand that a lot of them did not repent after his miracles but it may have converted some of them to the knowledge of the truth and its still a nice part of ministry
Yes, it certainly was a wonderful attribute of Christ's ministry but no, it did not convert many, if at all:
John 6:26 Jesus answered them and said, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Ye seek me, not because ye saw the miracles, but because ye did eat of the loaves, and were filled.
Matt 27:25 Then answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children
Christ healing the multitudes and calling out His disciples was a shadow of 'greater things to come' [John 5:20, 14:12].
and Paul and many other disciples and is still going on today and also I have read the scripture as you all pointed out that there are many that will come with signs and wonders that are false and I definably don't wish to be one of them. Please correct me if anything I said does not line up with scripture. Help! Thank you all.
John 6:27-29 Labour not for the meat which perisheth [or works of the flesh which do not SPIRITUALLY make one whole], but for that meat which endureth unto everlasting life [conversion of mind & heart; seeking after the Kingdom], which the Son of man shall give unto you: for him hath God the Father sealed. Then said they unto him, What shall we do, that we might work the works of God? Jesus answered and said unto them, This is the work of God, that ye believe on him whom he hath sent.
Hope this helps,
Marques
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Marques nice work
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So technically, you are seeking a super carnal display of the flesh.
LOL - Been there, done that .... ::)
Coryd - there is at least ONE promise of God that you can unequivocally count on:
Isa 46:10
"Declaring the end from the beginning, and from ancient times the things that are not yet done, saying, My counsel shall stand, and I will do all my pleasure: "
Peace.
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(ps)
Please don't be discouraged.
I also have wrestled endlessly with the issue of not knowing where I stand exactly, or what to do next, or what to ask God, or to "trust Him for" ...
I was taught in Babylon to "excercise my faith" and "stand" on the promises of God, and "believe God for my miracle".
For a veeery long time I just could not get my head around this idea that we TRUST GOD - No matter WHAT THE OUTCOME! We ask Him to help people, we ask Him to heal people, we ask Him to deliver people from demonic oppression or influence, but WE TRUST HIM FOR THE OUTCOME - WHATEVER THAT MAY BE.
Here is the lesson I started learning BEFORE I finally left Babylon - in fact, it was a KEY THING that brought about my decision to eventually leave:
Job 13:15 Though he slay me, yet will I trust in him
Peace.
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Hi coryd123
I have had what I believe to be a super natural encounter with GOD? Actually two.
Firstly, just as you described, I believe the spirit of GOD dragged us and personally, me to Ray's Site. The first time I read the emails from others to him, and his replies, I thought he was deluded and in gross error. Then miraculously I was drawn there again and it was as if scales fell off of my eyes. I then started studying many of his articles and rejoiced in the liberating truth.
When I shared that in my introduction to this forum, other members expressed that they had similar experiences. To me that's pretty miraculous, since I was "christened" as a Catholic, then moved to evangelical fellowships in my earlier adulthood. So you know how messed up I was with firstly the catechism and then all the stuff that most "Christians" believe such as everlasting torture in hell for unbelievers, the trinity, etc.
But secondly, I had a physical experience which I believe is a super natural encounter with GOD. It happened a few years ago. I awoke one Thanksgiving morning with severe vertigo. The slightest movement would cause me to become extremely dizzy and nauseous. I suffered for almost 2 weeks and found a way to cope with much discomfort. Then one Tuesday evening I went early to a prayer meeting in Brooklyn, NY. About an hour before the start, I was up at the front of the chapel with other believers. I was standing there reflecting on the scene in Revelation 5. And I remember just praising God and saying "Worthy is the Lamb, who was slain, to receive power and wealth and wisdom and strength and honor and glory and praise!" I was filled with a desire to praise and worship God, and with my eyes closed I raised my hands and just started thanking and praising Him. All of a sudden I heard a loud popping sound. It sounded somewhat like the popping of a champagne cork. And instantly I knew my vertigo was gone. I shook my head vigorously, made sudden turns which would have brought on the dizziness, and there was no more discomfort. I was perfectly fine, and all I could do was to thank God for that miraculous healing. Since then, I have shared that experience with many fellow believers.
I do not know if my fellow members on this forum would agree that this was supernatural, but I have to say that I am convinced it was. And since then that condition has never returned. I think that God is omniscient, but He has His purposes and plans. So if there is no miraculous sign from Him, that's cool with me. I just want to know Him more and to be counted worthy. I have the utmost confidence in His wisdom and none in my self without His spiritual empowerment. But He can do all, He operates all and He is all powerful and wise.
I hope that helps answer some of your question
Onelovedread
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Hi Coryd,
Here is an email on this subject.
http://bible-truths.com/email10.htm#miracles -------------
Hello Ray,
I have three questions:
I would like to know what you believe scripture to say on the subject of healing for today.
Do you think we are able to do the same miracles as Jesus? If so, why do we not see this more often?
The scripture in John 14: 13, 14. Why don't our petitions get answered like Jesus said?
Thank you for your time,
Cindy
[Ray Replies]
Dear Cindy:
Many assume that the statements that Jesus made to his eleven apostles on the evening of His arrest, were a blanket statement to all believers to follow, for all time. This is not so.
Jesus did do many miracles through His apostles after His death and resurrection. He promised them the gift of the Holy Spirit (Comforter), which would give them faith and power to spread His gospel message.
This came true fifty days later on the Day of Pentecost. The apostles were given the gift of tongues so that they could even speak in foreign languages which none of them had ever studied. They were able to heal the sick. And they even RAISED THE DEAD. Peter and Paul both RAISED THE DEAD.
These special miracle gifts did not follow all generations of the church. Even later in the ministry of the apostles, God began to withdraw these gifts. No one was raised from the dead in their later ministry. Paul said that "tongues would cease" in I Cor. 13. Only "faith, hope [expectation] and charity [love]" were to "NOW remain...." Some of Paul best friends and servants in spreading the gospel were sick and not healed. Paul told his dear friend Timothy, to "take a little wine for thy stomach's sake, and thine OFT [MANY] INFIRMITIES. God did NOT heal them. Do we think that Paul did not even ask?
Many in the charismatic church try to make a carnival exhibition of such gifts, but I am afraid all they do is deceive.
However, with that said, does God no longer perform miracles or healings? Yes, He does. I have seen and experienced them. Does He always heal? Does He always alleviate our problems and trials? NO. Why should we pray for God to TAKE AWAY all the things that are absolutely NECESSARY FOR OUR FAITH AND PERFECTION?
Don't neglect to ask God for EVERYTHING you feel you should have. But don't be disappointed if God allows you to CONTINUE IN YOUR TRIALS. Sometimes He removes certain trials after a period of time. We do not know when and how or even if God will do this that or the other thing, so we keep praying. I ask for STRENGTH AND FAITH to face my trials and OVERCOME my flesh. I no longer pray for God to make me HEALTHY, WEALTHY AND WISE, with absolutely no price to pay for such privileges.
This site is an answer to prayer. My understanding of the Scriptures is an answer to prayer. Everything I have is an answer to prayer. I pray for others and many times, GOD ANSWERS MY PRAYERS! But I do NOT always heal the sick through my prayers, I do not make people wealthy through my prayers, and I have NEVER raised the dead through my prayers. So don't stop praying!! And ALWAYS, ALWAYS, ALWAYS, thank God for all that you have.
And then, don't WORRY about anything. Phil. 4:6 is a terrible translation in the KJV. Instead of "Be careful in nothing..." it should read:
"DON'T WORRY ABOUT ANYTHING..."
God be with you,
Ray
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Amen.
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Hi, I am a bit confused on something, maybe the mods. can help out with this. I am very happy for anyone that believers they have had a healing from God. Onelovedread was in a chaple when this event happened. My question is how does this event fit with Rev.18. 4 and it sounds like the Lord does dwell in some churches hmmm, maybe I should start checking out a few.
Ricky
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Hi, I am a bit confused on something, maybe the mods. can help out with this. I am very happy for anyone that believers they have had a healing from God. Onelovedread was in a chaple when this event happened. My question is how does this event fit with Rev.18. 4 and it sounds like the Lord does dwell in some churches hmmm, maybe I should start checking out a few.
Ricky
Ricky,
Being in a church or chapel has nothing to do with healing. Christ healed the multitudes in and out of the synagogue, all throughout the towns [Matt 4:23, 9:35].
Yes Christ 'walks in the midst' of the church [Rev 2:1], but He nonetheless tells 'His people' to come out of Babylon [Rev 18:4].
Excerpt from Lake of Fire Part 7 (http://bible-truths.com/lake7.html):
These evil and unscriptural doctrines are idols in the hearts of millions! And until they repent and get rid of these "idols of the heart" (Ezek. 14:4), they cannot be Christ’s disciples or apostles. They may say that they are "apostles," but they are not. The very church of God where Jesus Christ "walks" in their midst and "holds the seven angels of the seven churches in His hand," nonetheless, has in its midst, "…them which say they are apostles, and ARE NOT … but LIARS." They say that they are circumcised in heart Jews, but they are NOT,
"I know the BLASPHEMY of them which say they are [circumcised in heart] Jews, and are NOT, but are the SYNAGOGUE OF SATAN." (Rev. 2:1, 2, 9).
Hope this helps,
Marques
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Hi Ricky,
Here is another excerpt to go along with what Marques posted.
http://bible-truths.com/lake10.html -----------------------
A TRUTH NO LONGER TOLD IN SUNDAY SCHOOL OR CHURCH
John tells us that Satan has a "synagogue." Synagogue means "a gathering together, an assembly, a congregation." This should not sound strange to our ears, seeing that we have already learned from Paul’s writings:
"For such are false apostles, deceitful workers, transforming themselves into the apostles of Christ. And no marvel; for Satan himself is transformed as into an angel of light. Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as the minister of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their work."
And so Satan has "false apostles," and "ministers of righteousness." Where then would we expect these false apostles and ministers of righteousness that belong to Satan, to reside? Why in "The synagogue of Satan," of course! And what do Satan’s ministers do that enables them to "deceive the whole world?" Paul again tells us:
"Even him, whose coming is after the working of Satan with all power and signs and lying wonders."
And just where might we find such a "synagogue of Satan, with false apostles, and false ministers of righteousness, witnessing to the world with power, and signs and lying wonders?"
Certainly not in some macabre-looking, haunted-house structure with a giant marquee out front reading: "COME AND WORSHIP WITH SATAN AND HIS DEMONS"!
WHERE IS THE SYNAGOGUE OF SATAN?
The synagogue of Satan is located in the churches—in The Church!
"…you have tried them which say they are apostles, and are not, and have found them liars" (Rev. 2:2).
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mercy, peace and love
Kat
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Hi everyone, I love this place. :) and its a good thing I don't talk to much. Christ does not dwell in temples made by hands but He walks in the midst of them getting all the credit for healing that Satan preforms. Would that be good or evil Christ would be doing? either way it does not fit right. I see it that any healing that Satan does in church and Christ gets the credit for will through Rev. 18.4 right out the window with these people and the church they are in. No wonder we cant caught a UFO, aliens don't want nothing to do with us, we would confuse then to death with this adventure we have going on in life.
Ricky
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Hi everyone, I love this place. :) and its a good thing I don't talk to much. Christ does not dwell in temples made by hands but He walks in the midst of them getting all the credit for healing that Satan preforms. Would that be good or evil Christ would be doing?
Ricky,
What scripture states Satan 'performs healing'?
Luke 13:15-17 The Lord then answered him, and said, Thou hypocrite, doth not each one of you on the sabbath loose his ox or his a@@ from the stall, and lead him away to watering? And ought not this woman, being a daughter of Abraham, whom Satan hath bound, lo, these eighteen years, be loosed from this bond on the sabbath day? And when he had said these things, all his adversaries were ashamed: and all the people rejoiced for all the glorious things that were done by Him [Jesus, as it was Jesus who healed this woman from under the 'bounds' of Satan].
Isa 54:16 ...I [God] have created the waster [Satan] to destroy.
John 10:9-10 I [Jesus] am the door. If anyone enters by Me, he will be saved, and will go in and out and find pasture. The thief [Satan] does not come except to steal, and to kill, and to destroy [not to 'perform healings']. I have come that they may have life, and that they may have it more abundantly.
No, it would not be 'evil' for Christ to heal people, no matter where they are...that is the same line of thinking the Pharisees thought of Christ when He healed on the Sabbath. It is NEVER evil to bless or to do good to someone.
Phil 1:18 What then? Only that in every way, whether in pretense [personal gain, insincere motives] or in truth, Christ is proclaimed; and in this I rejoice. Yes, and I will rejoice [ASV].
Hope this helps,
Marques
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aliens don't want nothing to do with us
Ricky, don’t be worried too much about “aliens” rather be looking out for the “Beast” :D
Gen 3:20 And Adam called his wife's name Eve, because she ( not some alien) was the mother of all living.
Also, bear in mind that there are many kinds of works. In Revelations 2 and 3, Jesus affirms that He knows our works.
Ephesus I know your works….But I have against you
Smyrna I know your works,
Pergamos, I know your works….But I have a few things against you
Thyatira, I know your works…..But I have a few things against you,
Sardis,I know your works, that you have a name that you live, and are dead.
Philadelphia and Laodicea, I know your works….
Our works are not judged. We, our spiritual condition is what will be judged according to our works.
Rev 20:13 And the sea gave up the dead in it. And death and hell delivered up the dead in them. And each one of them was judged according to their works.
Arc
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Hi Arc, aliens? that was a joke, they do not exist, and if they did I could battle an army of them, but not the beast right now he is to powerful. Marques, please do not get me wrong I was not implying that Jesus does healing under the power of Satan. The Lord does not dwell in temples made by hands. Temples, meaning buildings, churches etc. The body is also called a temple,I believe. Now if that temple is made up of lies and church doctrines, it would be made by man and the Lord does not dwell with that temple, that's what I was getting at. Kat, thankyou your replies always do good for me. I read somewhere in Rays writings that Satan throne is the church to me that means he owns it, runs it and guys like Benny Hinn is proof of that. But Jesus does heeling's in the churches that teach lies about Him and that would make people stay in that healing church regardless of what Rev.18.4 says. Kat, Marques, I have a ? for you, why is it that I believe what Ray teaches but I cannot grab onto it in understanding. When I left church 10 years ago because of the false teachings, I then separated the bible and God from all churches and religions and have convinced myself that they do not belong to Him. This may be where my problem is. Hope you can help.
Bless you all. Ricky
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Hi Ricky,
why is it that I believe what Ray teaches but I cannot grab onto it in understanding.
I can only tell you how it is for me personally. I believed what Ray teaches from the first time I read it, BUT it took over a year of intense study of his articles before I felt I had even a basic understanding of what he taught and I still need daily study in order to keep inching forward.
Of course understanding only comes as God grants it to you, that's why praying for Him to open our understanding is so important. I think believing is the start and as you apply diligent study and meditation on these truths your understanding grows accordingly. I know it is not by our own effort/works that we gain knowledge of these truths, but that is when His spirit teaches me, when I am studying and meditating, so I study as much as possible. Then I have information from studying that I can meditate on and be taught even more.
When I left church 10 years ago because of the false teachings, I then separated the bible and God from all churches and religions and have convinced myself that they do not belong to Him. This may be where my problem is.
I had been lead astray by a few churches over the years, but I would not let that experience prevent me from accepting the truth wholeheartedly once God lead me to it. I have found Ray's material to be the means by which God has taught me most of the truths so far. I think for me it was a question of realizing that the first experiences in the church was the darkness that had to come before the light/truth could shine in. I do not regret the time I was in the church, it was a valuable lesson, I just want to release any hold I have on the doctrines they taught. But certainly I don't want that experience to make me hesitate to embrace the truth I have found now. Anyway that's just what my experience has been.
mercy, peace and love
Kat
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why is it that I believe what Ray teaches but I cannot grab onto it in understanding.
Hello Ricky,
Well as you already know, understanding comes from the Lord [Luke 24:45, Ps 119:125]. He gives in part and continues to work in increments to help in our understanding. I really don't know why He gives more to some than others...but I only trust this is what is necessary for every believer's life.
For a sound foundation in your studies, I would suggest:
Lake of Fire Part 1 - This helps in understanding 'metaphors, figures of speech, symbols/types, etc.' The bible is FULL of these and wisdom helps one to discern and recognize in the OT as well as the NT.
12 Truths to Understanding God's Word - This should be the bedrock in understanding the scriptures...every TRUE belief and doctrine should be able to hold up to the scriptures presented in this study.
Foundational Truths bible study, Feb 08 - Help believers in understanding the 'basics' of the faith...great starting and growing point.
Hope this helps,
Marques
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Marques,
Thanks for your helpful input.
It is often necessary to be candid or even blunt.
It is good that you have this candor in balance with sincere love.
So thanks also for your diligence in attending to moderation for all of us.
I love to watch as you and Kat and others build upon each other's contribution to aid the spiritual growth of a brother.
Bob
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I'll tell you something that happend to me..long before I had ever even heard of Bible Truths or Ray Smith..it isn't proof that God answers prayer, I have learned that if we pray for HIS will then our prayers are answered! ( I learned that from our dear Ray)
My mother was my age when she passed away...she died I'm not afraid to say she died..lots of people have a problem with saying that...anyway...She was a terrible diabetic and thirty odd years ago they didn't have a lot of the good medical knowledge that we have now..My mother had a mild stroke, and suffered kidney failure and slipped into a coma...I just left her room and went to the little hospital chapel and sat down and prayed this prayer.."Lord, I know that you are able to heal my mother, if it is your will..If you would heal her and restore her to perfect health, that would be great and I would ask that you do that! If that is not in your plan or your will for her to be restored in perfect health then please just let her go. I'd rather be without my mother than to see her suffer anymore." (my mother had a very hard life and suffered more than any of us knew). Such a peace came over me and I knew that my mom was in God's care...someone met me outside of her room when I got back and said, "I'm sorry, your mother is gone..."
The emotion that passed through me at that moment wasn't deep sorrow or anger...It was peace in knowing that whatever the circumstances..God is always there and He is never too busy to hear the prayers of a little off the wall 24 year old! I will never forget that day.. I didn't realize it until these past few years when I learned that God does answer prayer like Ray says," Any time we pray for God's will to be done our prayers are answers!" that's the "supernatural" way I have experienced God!! I have had many such encounters with God!!
Kathy ;) :-*