bible-truths.com/forums

=> General Discussions => Topic started by: Mbwa on January 14, 2009, 09:36:06 PM

Title: Quickie on Babel
Post by: Mbwa on January 14, 2009, 09:36:06 PM: I'm sorry I ask so many question. I just can't help but question every little thing I do.

Anyway, a little while ago, some of you helped me when I asked about creating languages. I have since gotten bored with that, or at least I became more interested in learning real languages. I of course questioned this activity, but dismissed it almost immediately. But then I thought, the more languages you speak, the more people you can communicate with, and then I thought of Babel. All the humans understood each other, and because of this they were able to organize and challenge God, so he confused their language. Now, by learning as many languages as I can, am I doing the same? As aqr (may I call you George?) said in my other thread "Since God confused the language at Babel, are you now God to unconfuse it?"

I'd like to hear you guy's opinions, as the regulars here seem more reliable than my own head to me on this kind of stuff, but of course I argue against myself, so forgive me if I answer my own question right here. I reasoned, through diplomats, and translators and such, the governments of the world can still come together if need be. I have heard it said that the Babel story really wasn't about language, it was about "putting humans in their place." I get hung up on the language part, but was that just put to show that God was more powerful than humans, and their sin was not a common language, but a lust for power, and pride?

If you feel I need to elaborate, I can. Once again, I appreciate the help. Thanks,

Mbwa ???
Title: Re: Quickie on Babel
Post by: John9362 on January 15, 2009, 05:55:22 AM: Mbwa ???

John ???
Title: Re: Quickie on Babel
Post by: Mbwa on January 15, 2009, 05:32:22 PM: John:

Do you not understand what I'm asking?
Title: Re: Quickie on Babel
Post by: aqrinc on January 15, 2009, 06:14:48 PM: Hi Mbwa,

Thought you had this at least answered before; go back and read this complete thread:

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,9031.msg75396.html#msg75396

it should give you a place to at least rest for a while. There were several good answers.

george. :)
Title: Re: Quickie on Babel
Post by: Mbwa on January 15, 2009, 08:10:15 PM: Thanks aqr, and sorry if you feel like I'm being too paranoid, or if this is in the wrong forum.

So, you say these two threads are related? In the first one, I was concerned that humans should not be creating new languages. Now I'm concerned because, in the Babel story, widespread communication among the humans led to an attempt to become more powerful than God. Learning languages leads to more possibility for communication. Do you see where I'm coming from?

Also, I'd like to know more about the Babel story. I always focus on the language aspect of it, but as I said, I've heard that that's not the main focus. I'm gonna try to start studying more, maybe soon I won't ask so many questions. :-[

Mbwa
Title: Re: Quickie on Babel
Post by: mharrell08 on January 15, 2009, 08:33:43 PM: Excerpt from LOF#6 (http://bible-truths.com/lake6.html):

MYSTERY, BABYLON THE GREAT,
THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS AND
ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH"

This church system is the apex, the zenith, the epitome of ALL THAT IS DECEITFUL, AND WICKED!

IT ALL BEGAN AT BABEL

This world’s counterfeit religious and political systems began at BABEL (Babylon).

"And the whole earth was of one language … they found a plain in the land of Shinar [Iraq--Babylon] … And they said, Go to, let us build us a CITY and a tower … and let us make us a NAME, lest we be scattered abroad upon the face of the WHOLE EARTH … And the Lord came down to see the city … Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language … So the Lord scattered them abroad from thence upon the FACE OF ALL THE EARTHY…" (Gen. 11:1-9).

God confounded their languages and He scattered them over the face of all the earth, but they took their rebellious, self-centered, godless religion and government WITH THEM.

Have we forgotten how that later mankind once again regrouped under one central government? There was a time in ancient history when officials gather the educated and scholars from around the world, and once again shared philosophies, religions, laws, sciences, and other academia at a central location which they would then once more take back to their respective countries and share, worldwide? And what was that great nation called? That’s right, BABYLON! But that great Gold-Headed Kingdom also came crashing down under the Medes and the Persians. Well guess what? Babylon is rising once more. This time God calls it:

"MYSTERY BABYLON THE GREAT, MOTHER OF HARLOTS, AND THE ABOMINATIONS OF THE EARTH" (Rev. 17:5).

Email reply from Ray regarding Babel (http://bible-truths.com/email4.htm#babel):

What exactly was the reason they set out to build Tower of Babel?

If Heaven is not in outer space, and if Outer space then was the same as now, that labor would have amounted to nothing.

[Ray Replies]

Jeff,

The purpose for the Tower of Babel was the same as it was for all tower-building down through history. A huge tower is a sign and symbol of power and unity. Nimrod built it as a rallying point for the people.

All great empires have built huge towers, cathedrals, buildings, pyramids, etc. Same reason.

Nimrod did not think that he could really build a tower that would go to heaven, but rather to reach into the heavens as a tall tree or mountain.

Seeing that Jesus said while He was on this earth, that He was also at the same time, IN HEAVEN, ought to dispel and fanciful idea that the Heaven of God's Throne is in outer space on some huge galactic rock.

God's heaven is a higher spiritual realm of life and existence, not a geographical location in outer space.

Hope that helps a little.

Ray

Hope this helps Mbwa,

Marques
Title: Re: Quickie on Babel
Post by: Ninny on January 15, 2009, 08:36:51 PM: Mbwa,
If you recall in the story of Babel, the reason God confounded the languages was because people had begun to think that they could get to heaven if they built their own way! A tower that would take them there! It was their vanity and their pride that led to the downfall! They were devising their own way to heaven and God said well I'll just make it where they can't understand what anyone is saying and with no communication skills the project will be over. It is my understanding that God spread the people around with the language deal. He stopped the foolish attempt to build the tower! It was to stop the building of the tower and to separate the people into different places and languages.

There are many people who are multilingual and some know dozens of languages it is sometimes helpful to know other languages, some people just like to learn different languages! There is no harm in it generally. There are exceptions of course to that rule, but simply stated God wasn't just flexing his muscle over the language issue, He was putting people on a path that was right for them! He was working out his plan for mankind!
I didn't give you any scriptural proof for any of that, but i'm sure if you look it up you will discover many truths for yourself that you will understand :D I believe I have told you before to lighten up an little and just live your life, let God lead you in the way you should go! Study the scriptures, now GET going and learn what God wants you to learn! ;)
(I see that Marques has posted to you so his explanation is probably better than mine ;) )
Kathy :D
Title: Re: Quickie on Babel
Post by: aqrinc on January 15, 2009, 09:17:36 PM: No problem with the questions Mbwa and no paranoia i can percieve. When you have specific
questions about the babel story we most certainly can chat about them. Meanwhile it's a good
practice to stay in The Scriptures daily as much as possible, here are your Scriptures for now on
Babel and some pointers if you want to go forward with your research:

Genesis 10: 10-14
10-And the beginning of his kingdom was Babel, and Erech, and Accad, and Calneh, in the land of Shinar.

11-From that land he went forth to Assyria and built Nineveh, and Rehoboth the city, and Calah,

12-and Resen between Nineveh and Calah, which is a great city.

13-And Mizraim fathered Ludim, and Anamim, and Lehabim, and Naphtuhim,

14-and Pathrusim, and Casluhim, who from whom came the Philistines and Caphtorim.

Genesis 11:9:
On account of this its name is called Babel, because Jehovah confused the language of all the earth there.
And Jehovah scattered them abroad from there on the face of all the earth.

Amos 6:2:
Cross to Calneh and see; and from there go to the great Hamath; then go down to Gath of the Philistines.
Are they better than these kingdoms, or their border than your border?

There is a lot of Scripture that would profit you much more and prepare you for the task that you
are being called to do:

Proverbs 4:26:
Study the track of your feet, then all your ways will be established.

II Timothy 2:15:
Earnestly study to present yourself approved to God, a workman unashamed, rightly dividing the Word of Truth.

James 1:23:
Because if anyone is a hearer of the Word, and not a doer, this one is like a man studying his natural face in a mirror;

Are you hearing and doing. ???

george. :)
Title: Re: Quickie on Babel
Post by: Ninny on January 15, 2009, 09:41:09 PM: Oh, I knew that Marques and George would come to your rescue, Mbwa! Listen to them, they can give you good scripture references, I on the other hand will speak to you as if you were my child! When my sons were growing up and asked, "Mom, how to you spell...what verse says...or what does...mean?" My answer to them? "The best answer I can give you is LOOK IT UP!" I wasn't trying to be mean, but Spoon feeding is for babies! The best way you are going to learn the deep things of God is to study His word ask questions if you have to, certainly ask questions! Asking questions is like "looking it up", but don't expect people to just give you the answers! That is cheating!! ;) There is a lot of living you need to do to get the answers to some of the questions you ask. I just wanted you to know that it's ok to ask, but try to find the answers by reading "the book" first! ;D
Kathy ;)
Title: Re: Quickie on Babel
Post by: Mbwa on January 17, 2009, 07:27:00 PM: I've decided to start today to study the Scriptures more. No slacking off! I hope this will bring more understanding into my life.

As for the Babel story, I now see that it is more about the fact that humans cannot challenge God. Thanks to everyone who helped me out on this one. And about learning languages, I think I have my answer, taking que from the other advice I've gotten here: It is your intentions that matter most. If I were learning French to swear at people in French, then I'd have to reconsider. But that is not the case. I'm learning French because I'm taking a trip to a French-speaking area, and because my grandparents speak it.
I plan on learning Spanish because so many people speak it. I also might learn Mandarin Chinese, again because there are many speakers. Now, knowledge of these languages will of course allow me to communicate with more people, but God wasn't angry with all the people at Babel just because they all understood each other, was he? The majority of people in Spain understand each other, the majority of people in Germany understand each other. It was what they did with their ability to communicate that was the problem: they challenged God.

Now, I'm off to read some Scripture. See 'yall around!

Mbwa
Title: Re: Quickie on Babel
Post by: Ninny on January 17, 2009, 07:40:00 PM: Now that's more like it Doggy boy!! Get to work! No, God wasn't angry because the people could understand each other! NO!! It was their pride and disobedience that made Him angry! We need to understand each other. Now get out there and study!! ;D I hope you learn everything you want to! I wish I new some other languages. I know a few words of Spanish and can understand it only if the speakers are in slow motion!! :D :D
Now just do it!! :D
Kathy ;)
Title: Re: Quickie on Babel
Post by: aqrinc on January 18, 2009, 12:58:12 AM: Mbwa,

Well and truly done; again i write, do not ever stop asking questions. ??? Make sure though
that you are not just ignoring the answer staring at you; so as to try to get a different and
more favourable answer. While you are still young is the best time to get the basics right.

Note Basic#1 is prefaced by the above statement.

Basic #1. The only bad question is the one you did not ask; when you thought you should have.

george. ;D