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[lovepeace]

today i was having a fantastic day with my boyfriend 
we left to go out to lunch and then came back to his house
we ate are lunch's laughed and had conversations...when his mother's homeless friend came by

now, im not one to get upset this much when i see an older man or woman looking for cans, but it was a different story this time.

this man had his daughter with him...she couldn't be more then 12 years old!!
she barely had any teeth left
it broke my heart 
i immediately started to cry 
i fell into my boyfriends arms so fast and i couldn't hold it in

i'm not asking anyone why God lets this happen
i just want the pain to go away
i sometimes wish i did not care so much
i feel so selfish when i see these people

earlier today i was so mad because my laptop could not hook to the internet
and this girl barely has anything to eat

i just wanted to vent and tell people how i feel
and i thought saying it here would be the best place

thank you for taking the time to listen
i know i have posted things similar to this topic, but in this case
i am not asking any questions...because i have a feeling i know why God lets this happen
i just wish He didn't let it happen.

thank you again for listening
God bless

-Chanelle

[EKnight]

Hi Chanelle,

When I first started at BT I talked out loud about the things I had learned particularly about God being in control of everything.  My daughter (18) came to me with a picture of a disfigured girl.  She had a giant tumor which took up her whole face.  My daughter asked what kind of God would do this???  How do you feel about God now mom?  I said here is how this picture makes me feel.  I am so thankful and grateful to God at this very moment because this girls plight was not what God has chosen for me.  I am humbled by it and it helps me to realize just how blessed we are.  It was at the same time heartbreaking to look at and I told my daughter we need to pray that doctors will use their God-given talents to give this girl a better life.

I think this sounds similar to your experience today.  Remember it and allow it to humble you from this day forward.  Justify this child's suffering by using it to better yourself and others.

Eileen

[lovepeace]

i know exactly what picture your daughter is talking about!
i followed that story thoroughly...
it was horrible what they girl went through
i know she had a surgery and she is looking SO much better
which brightens my spirits...to see that God saved her from her pain and misery

my boyfriend told me a verse from the bible...i am not sure where exactly it is
but it says something like this

God Himself says he is working in strange ways

it helps a little to know even God knows He is working in a strange way
but it does not seem specifically strange 2 me,
it seems more cruel and mean, but I know God is NOT a cruel and mean being
but i guess sometimes we have to see what others go through
to see how lucky we are...

thank you for responding to my post
and telling me about what your daughter told you about
it was nice having that back in my mind 

-Chanelle

[deftarchangel]

"And passing by, he saw a man blind from birth,

and his disciples asked him, saying, `Rabbi, who did sin, this one or his parents, that he should be born blind?'

Jesus answered, `Neither did this one sin nor his parents, but that the works of God may be manifested in him'" - John 9:1-3

For me, the hardest part is waiting for that manifestation to occur in the lives of those that suffer, like that little girl and her father whom you encountered today.  I know it will, either in this age, or the ages to come.  But patience, faith and trust definitely are tested as you wait for that manifestation to occur.  And it's not an easy wait.  But I find encouragement in the above Scripture, as well as believing that we all feel pain at the suffering of another for a reason:

"But God has combined the members of the body and has given greater honor to the parts that lacked it, so that there should be no division in the body, but that its parts should have equal concern for each other.  If one part suffers, every part suffers with it; if one part is honored, every part rejoices with it.

Now you are the body of Christ, and each one of you is a part of it." - 1 Cor. 12:24-27

That you were so moved from seeing that man and his daughter is a good thing, and may be used by the Lord for some purpose so that the works of God may be manifested in them.  Who knows....except for Him of course! 

Anyways, for whatever it was worth.

Kind regards,

Rob

 

[lovepeace]

thank you for taking the time to respond to my post 

i absolutely love the first scripture you shared with me.
it made me smile. 
i have to be honest, i have never read the bible fully
so there are probably a lot of scriptures that explain the horrible things that occur in this world
i wish it was easier to understand, but i do not think it ever will be
and that is okay as long as i have people there for me to help me understand
why God lets these things happen

thank you so much for your words, they really helped me

-Chanelle

[daywalker]

Hello Chanelle,

It's good that you feel this way; your compassion, love, and care for humanity, specially those who are suffering, are all fruits of the Spirit. It's Godliness! And without all the evil, we would never experience these emotions. Though, this is very hard to accept at times, just remember, this "experience of evil" will one day come to an end.

Revelations 21:3-4:
And I hear a loud voice out of the throne saying, "Lo! the tabernacle of God is with mankind, and He will be tabernacling with them, and they will be His peoples, and God Himself will be with them. And He will be brushing away every tear from their eyes. And death will be no more, nor mourning, nor clamor, nor misery; they will be no more, for the former things passed away.


May the "God of peace" be with you,

- Christopher.

[zander]

I had a similar feeling recently, there have been a few stories here in the UK about Dogs savaging babies to death. 

How utterly imcomprehensible and inexcusable for the owners.  It makes me mad actually.  These dogs must wear muzzles as law.

[lovepeace]

i never thought to talk to the child and get personally involved because i felt...well, like i would be intruding and that it was none of my business...

i told my boyfriend, when i started to cry, that i wanted to give her something to eat, i even told him i wanted to give her my slippers so at night her feet would not be cold.  i wanted to give this girl my very expensive jacket, at that moment my boyfriend was so helpful in telling me that he is happy that i have such compassion, but why does compassion have to be so painful?

i trust God has a plan and He knows what He is doing of course.  I trust in Him very much. I will never understand why He does these things, but i know He knows what He is doing.

Some of you said that God does these things to show others how "selfish" they truly are or how "lucky" they are.
i believe that.  i do believe that He wants people to see what they have and appreciate those things. i will tell you what! i certainly felt lucky when i saw this girl.

i wish i would have talked to her. i wish i would have given her something to eat, get to know her, something.
she could use a friend, at least i think so.
everyone needs a friend.
maybe it would help her through everything. i am not sure.
but maybe next time i will talk to her, but i feel scared and nervous...
i do not want to offend her in any way.

so...how would you approach her?? 
any ideas?

God bless
-Chanelle

[Dave in Tenn]

Lev 19:34  ...the stranger that dwelleth with you shall be unto you as one born among you, and thou shalt love him as thyself, for ye were strangers in the land of Egypt:  I am the Lord your God.

Matt: 22:36-39.  ...an expert in the law...asked Him, "Teacher, which is the greatest commandment in the law?"
Jesus said to him, "You must love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your mind."  This is the greatest and most important commandment.  The second is like it"  'You must love your neighbor as yourself.

Also read the parables in Matthew 25, particularly starting at verse 32 through verse 46.  Alex should well be able to help you there.

Approach her like you would yourself.  She's no different than you are.  And you are closer to Twelve than to my age.   

Ray has said elsehwere that it takes maturity to 'love others like yourself'.  Maturity only comes with experience.  Experience comes with 'putting it into practice'.  Practice includes failure.  The journey of 1000 miles begins with the first step--that might not be 'scripture', but it's true nonetheless.   

[judith collier]

lovepeace, perhaps what Jesus said might help you get over the inability to confront. When people will ask, "when did we see you Lord" and the Lord said, "when I was in prison, did you visit me" "when I was hungry, did you feed me" when I was naked, did you clothe me"  Tears are a waste of time and they only make your eyes swell, you will get a tougher hide eventually but you are still young and see through your emotions, the will is where it is at. Judy

[Patrick]

Tears are a waste of time

If Christ Almighty wept, I don't think it's a waste of time.

[cjwood]

so...how would you approach her?? 
any ideas?









hi chanelle,
i have had similar circumstances (minus the sitting in my boyfriend's bedroom part), with homeless people (men, women, children, and dogs). it honestly rips at my heart and causes me to be thankful and humbled by what my Father has blessed me with. with the children, i just talk to them as a child. i can guarantee, she was probably more guarded against you than you were afraid of approaching her. i have found the best way to ease their guardedness (not sure if that is a word.) is to just approach them with the love of Christ. i mean just let what is in your heart come out of your mouth. don't worry about what to say, just open your mouth and your heart and the compassion that God has blessed you with will come forth. you will find that if you give to those less fortunate, it really doesn't take much at all to make them smile and uplift them. if you are ever in a position again to help another person, as you were in this situation, and you feel led to do something, then do something. give of what you have to help their need in food, or clothing, or any amount of $$ you may feel led to share. you will not regret it. but always use wisdom of the Spirit within you when dealing with someone you know nothing about. if you will take the step to help, the Spirit will move your feet.

claudia

[Beloved]

It is good to feel sorrow for any one in need, but that is only an emotion. When you see the poor , you feel sad but that comes from a deeper fear that what you are seeing .......that could be you ....in that position.

Look at the scriptures

Mar 14:7  for the poor always ye have with you, and whenever ye may will ye are able to do them good, but me ye have not always;

 
(Mat 25:44)  `Then shall they answer, they also, saying, Lord, when did we see thee hungering, or thirsting, or a stranger, or naked, or infirm, or in prison, and we did not minister to thee?
(Mat 25:45)  `Then shall he answer them, saying, Verily I say to you, Inasmuch as ye did it not to one of these, the least, ye did it not to me.


(Jas 2:15)  and if a brother or sister may be naked, and may be destitute of the daily food,
(Jas 2:16)  and any one of you may say to them, `Depart ye in peace, be warmed, and be filled,' and may not give to them the things needful for the body, what is the profit?
(Jas 2:17)  so also the faith, if it may not have works, is dead by itself.

I do not write these scriptures  to make you feel guilty or in any way judge you,  rather to encourage you to be braver and bolder.   A fancy coat and slippers is a nice jester but it is not the most practical or helpful thing to do. This was an opportunity for you and hopefully this experience will help you to prepare for the next one.

Think about how our Savior felt dealing with the teaming mass of sinners, blind and helpless. All He did was deal with them daily for the Father , one person at a time. The feeding of the two large groups was just one event on the day that He fed them .

I never cease to wonder how even the unbelieving world gives generously to feed the poor a nice dinner on Thanksgiving and Christmas.....but then never seems to be concerned about how they will be fed all their other meals on all of the remaining 354 days of the year.

Chanelle try to think about what you have been given and what you can do with it..., you do not have to take on the whole load and responsibility for the person...... but you can provide for the need of that present at that moment...it is the daily bread...that we can provide in the name of our Master.  

Don't you realize that whatever you could have given them from your pantry would have been a blessing?   I use to feel like you did...but now I feel so blessed to be able to help them when the opportunities presents. In fact I prepare for these moments. This is not a "works thing". This is truly effortless now for me and even joyful.

I make a point of buying things at stores that I can give out or donate to groups that take care of the homeless.  In the winter I buy different types of winter clothing, I buy food all year round.  You can also go through your stuff and see what would be practical, bedding coats gloves etc and give it out. I donate to local small food banks, the larger ones get stuff from  the supermarkets, I also try to donate stuff that I myself would eat/wear etc.

Channell you have to find peace with this whole episode and then find out what works for you. Whatsoever you do, do all to the glory of our Master

Beloved

[judith collier]

Beloved, you hit the nail on the head! I think some young people get overwhelmed and not quite as trusting in God yet. A person does what they can and then has to let go and trust the providence of God. Judy

[judith collier]

Patrick, I know Jesus wept but then he did go to the cross willingly. There are times when the sorrow is so great we weep but if we weep and make no difference, what do our tears accomplish?  Maybe it's just I am an A type personality. I used to cry a lot when I was younger but found out if I made a plan for the next time a simaliar(?) situation came up I felt better. I had to train myself. Judy

[lilitalienboi16]

Patrick, I know Jesus wept but then he did go to the cross willingly. There are times when the sorrow is so great we weep but if we weep and make no difference, what do our tears accomplish?  Maybe it's just I am an A type personality. I used to cry a lot when I was younger but found out if I made a plan for the next time a simaliar(?) situation came up I felt better. I had to train myself. Judy

I'm sorry judy but i disagree with you. I don't think it's a qustion of what our tears accomplish. It is GOD who accomplish anything and all things anyway.  However The tears we shed and the tears she shed, simply show us that God is MOVING her to action. It shows us that God is indeed REAL and that if She shed tears, how much more did the Lord shed tears and yet still does? Does the Lord not see the pain and suffering of this world? Offcourse He does, does He not also feel the worlds pain? Yes He does! How much patience must God have to truly accomplish his plan for all mankind? Far more than i could ever have...

Don't feed a baby steak, but rather milk, until they can handle the milk and than SLOWLY give them PIECES of the STEAK until they can consume the WHOLE!

Perhaps these tears did not move her to action, not this time and perhaps not the 100 times after but one day, God will give her the strength and it will be HIS strength, to act and to indeed do good to the Glory of GOD.

For we know it takes spiritual strength to do what is good and that only comes from God. No where else, not even ourselves.

In Christ,

Alex

[Robin]

I know I don't have all the details of this situation, but if they are homeless and without food, shelter, and medical attention you can make some calls and offer assistance.

http://www.unitedwayoc.org/basic_needs.asp
http://www.mercyhouse.net/?page_id=28
http://www.thomashouseshelter.org/index.asp
http://www.211oc.org/default.asp

If they are unable or unwilling to provide shelter, food, and medical attention for this child contact CPS. She should also be in school.

http://www.ssa.ocgov.com/Abuse_Reporting/Child_Abuse/Making_a_Report/default.asp

I am a mandated child abuse reporter in California and I would have to report this by law.
You can report it anonymously.

California Statutes

Neglect
Citation: Penal Code § 11165.2

Neglect means the negligent treatment or the maltreatment of a child by a person responsible for the child's welfare under circumstances indicating harm or threatened harm to the child's health or welfare. The term includes both acts and omissions on the part of the responsible person.

Severe neglect means the negligent failure of a person having the care or custody of a child to protect the child from severe malnutrition or medically diagnosed nonorganic failure to thrive. Severe neglect also means those situations of neglect where any person having the care or custody of a child willfully causes or permits the person or health of the child to be placed in a situation such that his or her person or health is endangered, including the intentional failure to provide adequate food, clothing, shelter, or medical care.

General neglect means the negligent failure of a person having the care or custody of a child to provide adequate food, clothing, shelter, medical care, or supervision where no physical injury to the child has occurred.

[lilitalienboi16]

I disagree with both Alex and Judy.

Spiritual strength is the FAITH God gifts us all with, but how we nurture our FAITH.  Be it in Loving actions, Spirit Study.... etc.

cause and effect.  God causes us to have FAITH as a GIFT, how we go about effecting others with this FAITH is our choices in Life.

Obadiah 1:10 - 11
"Because of violence to your brother Jacob, You will be covered with shame, And you will be cut off forever.
 
"On the day that you stood aloof, On the day that strangers carried off his wealth, And foreigners entered his gate And cast lots for Jerusalem-- You too were as one of them [/color]
 
Yes Jesus did wept but he was moved by the Spirit as well, Jesus doing the WILL of God resurrected Lazarus and this action Glorified God, this action of the Spirit overcame the weakness of the flesh. Again Jesus just showed us a pattern to follow, when the weakness of the flesh presents itself.

If we, the believers. should claim any part of having Eyes and Ears open to the TRUTHS of GOD , there leaves no excuses to go back into babehood.



Dear Falcon,

I did not read your entire post because when i reached a certain point and read what you said i full heartedly disagreed. You said "Jesus wept and was moved by the spirit.

Dear falcon, whatever is the moving of the spirit? If it not be the strength of God in Christ? If it not be God in Christ doing the good works? Though Christ is God and indeed The spirit of the Father is His, nonetheless it is still God who does the good and is the only one who is good.

Are you suggesting that chanelle find her own strength from within to do what is right? Or wait with patience that God grant her, until He see it fit for her to be moved to action?

You also said that "Spiritual strength is the FAITH God gifts us all with." I completely disagree, simply because i have FAITH in God does not mean i have SPIRITUAL STRENGTH to not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. That takes the chastening and grace of God upon my heart to accomplish. Yes faith is indeed a step towards God and what is good, however it is not the ONLY and SOLE reason to why one does what is good.

I just cannot read further your post falcon because i just don't agree with what you have to say at the very start. I don't agree with it.

If i am wrong than God forgive me for my blindness.

With love,

Alex

[lilitalienboi16]

Dear Falcon,

I did not read your entire post because when i reached a certain point and read what you said i full heartedly disagreed. You said "Jesus wept and was moved by the spirit.

Dear falcon, whatever is the moving of the spirit? If it not be the strength of God in Christ? If it not be God in Christ doing the good works? Though Christ is God and indeed The spirit of the Father is His, nonetheless it is still God who does the good and is the only one who is good.

Are you suggesting that chanelle find her own strength from within to do what is right? Or wait with patience that God grant her, until He see it fit for her to be moved to action?

You also said that "Spiritual strength is the FAITH God gifts us all with." I completely disagree, simply because i have FAITH in God does not mean i have SPIRITUAL STRENGTH to not eat from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. That takes the chastening and grace of God upon my heart to accomplish. Yes faith is indeed a step towards God and what is good, however it is not the ONLY and SOLE reason to why one does what is good.

I just cannot read further your post falcon because i just don't agree with what you have to say at the very start. I don't agree with it.

If i am wrong than God forgive me for my blindness.

With love,

Alex

What i am saying is you want to justify weakness of the Spirit even though the Scripture speaks clearly of this stance.

What the carnal church calls the strength of God is God Spirit, it is God ((i AM that I am )). God does not put any of his strength into you, God puts his SPIRIT in you. God's Spirit in you is God Spirit, it is God ((ever wondered why he said love your enemies)). The gift of FAITH is believing in the Spirit of God, a leap of FAITH.

The "God give me strength" is such an old addage from the carnal church i am not surprised you cling to it staunchly.

Has it ever crossed your Spirit just once, why Jesus never asked for God's strength, as you proclaim there is,  on the way to SUFFERING and crucifixion

Instead Jesus Prayed " Father, let your Will be done and NOT mine"  where is your God's strength in the perfect man who ever walked the earth ?? Did Jesus submitt to and become obedient the strength of God or to God's will you can not choose both.

But what else is new these days.

You want to advocate your argument to God by all means have at it.

If you would open your eyes from the crying you would see you are basically saying the SAME THING i am.

Have you any Spiritual Knowledge why the COMFORTER is sent by Jesus to begin with

DO you understand what a COMFORTER is What purpose it serves ??

And yet you disagree and i will abide by your choice, and bid you well on your journey. need anything more be said.

I doubt it.

Rodger

Dear Rodger,

I don't know if you are reading my posts or jumping around. In nearly the first line, i called God's spirit, His strength in us.

Dear falcon, whatever is the moving of the spirit? If it not be the strength of God in Christ?

I don't believe their is anything wrong, scripturaly, with relating God's spirit in us as His strength in us. It's a metaphor. All life is grass. All life [is like] grass [in certain ways.]

You said; "What i am saying is you want to justify weakness of the Spirit even though the Scripture speaks clearly of this stance."

Why would i want to justify weakness in the spirit, if their is no weakness in God? Hence no weakness in His spirit.

You said; "God does not put any of his strength into you, God puts his SPIRIT in you. God's Spirit in you is God Spirit, it is God"

I am well aware that God puts His spirit into us. That the spirit in us is indeed Christ in us, for Christ is that spirit. He is coming to make His home within us. There is no disagreement here. I'm not sure why you speak down to me, as if i didn't know this.

You said; "Has it ever crossed your Spirit just once, why Jesus never asked for God's strength, as you proclaim there is,  on the way to SUFFERING and crucifixion" [/font]

I don't remember saying Jesus every asked for "God's strength." Like i said, God's strength is nothing LITERAL. God is not literally lifting or moving things. It's just a metaphor, it's symbolic. His spirit in us, is like His mighty hand within us. Would you accuse me of saying that Jesus asked for "Gods mighty hand" in Him, if i likened His spirit to that?

You said; "Have you any Spiritual Knowledge why the COMFORTER is sent by Jesus to begin with"
              "DO you understand what a COMFORTER is  What purpose it serves ??
             [fcolor=red] "I doubt it.

Excuse me, but who are you to ASSUME such an answer? YOU DOUBT IT?

Does one require such a knowledge to be allowed to cry? Does one require such a knowledge to be allowed a post on these forums? Does one require such a knowledge to be able to fellowship with those of like minds here?

I assure you, rodger. I do have such a knowledge and i thank God as often as i can for it.

Chanelle does not YET, but God have mercy upon you if you are judging her for not having it or looking down on her in anyway. Not all of us, are where you might be rodger and to be quiet frank some us might never get there. Than again, it's entirely up to God.. I hope you remember that.

Your sir are in seriouse need of friendly rebuke. So here it is;

Get OFF your high horse.

God be with you,

Alex




 

[mharrell08]

This topic seems to have run it's course...please continue any direct discussions in PM. Thanks


Marques