check out what john mcarthur said.

[B18bhatch]

I heard this on the radio the other day.

http://www.gty.org/resources.php?section=transcripts&aid=230952

[shibboleth]

I heard this on the radio too. He completely ignores 4:10 and says it can't possibly mean all men are saved because of hell. Then he talks about all the "facts" that prove hell and then he goes back to the word salvation and how it doesn't always mean saved, in the sense of final reconcilliation with Christ. He's very sneaky and he's a wolf in sheeps clothing for sure.

I was in a reformed church and they say a lot of the same things about salvation. They say there's a general call (many called) and a specific call (few chosen). This is John MacArthur. He really believes people only get the benefit of salvation here if they aren't called. Yet they will burn forever if they don't accept Jesus.

[mannonthecross]

Hi everyone,

Thanx for the link.

Eons ago, it seems now, we listened to John MacArthur's radio program; until he made a few comments that seemed to show his spiritual arrogance & superiority.

Anyway, with regard to this teaching, I wanted to say that within our little Fellowship, we meet weekly with many different people, some from denoms, some from no denoms, some looking for truth & some just passing through. It seems that the buzz among the group is that God is doing a "new thing". Well I have been hearing God wanting to do a "new thing" way before we left the institution. But now the spiritual atmosphere has taken on more urgency. Some saying that what God is preparing to do (in this "new thing") won't be accepted by most of Christianity; they'll say it's not of God (because it doesn't look like church-Hallelujah!)

In reality, this "new thing" is not new at all. It is what God has purposed all along. That being, the truly good news of God saving all!

So, I said all that to say, that this teaching from John MacArthur is no "funny coincidence". It's right on time. The Holy Spirit is quickening to alot of people the Truth of the fact that His Bride truly will be w/o spot or wrinkle & she will be His Bride, not man's. It's a standard move by man (the institution) to head off at the pass or refute God's "new thing".

Anyway, I hope this all makes sense. It seemed to make more sense in my thoughts, than on paper.  :?

Peace

[Lightseeker]

B18bhatch

I know you're new poster, and I don't really know where you're coming from theologically, so bear with me.

I’ll just get my bias out in the open first.  I don’t think much of McArthur and some of what he teaches, but I am not going to say he isn’t ‘born again’ either.  But I do believe that his ‘understanding’ (or should I say ‘lack of’) concerning this passage in 1 Timothy 4:10 is a big one.  I wouldn't recommend spending a lot of time reading his long article, because he really doesn’t get ‘Universal or Ultimate Reconcilliation’ in the first place IMO.  And if you spend a bunch of time rolling in piles of….religious stuff…you’re libel to get some of it on you.  But if one is inclined to go there anyway, just be sure you, eat the grapes and spit out the seeds.

However, that cannot be the treatment indicated in this particular passage. And I'll point out why. The use of the word "especially" is a very vital thing to consider. It is the adverb malista and it has a very significant sense. What it means is that all men enjoy salvation to some degree. Therefore it must be talking about the same salvation, or God is the Savior of all men in the same sense to all men as to believing men. It's just that in the case of believing men it is an especial way.

The first problem I have is this:  Doesn't understand 'malista' IMO.
Second problem:  â€œit must beâ€??  Not iswaswillbe…oh no, it’s a waffling ‘must be’.  Why a 'must be'?  Because of the fundamental theological box he's limited himself to 'see' in.

[B18bhatch]

I agree with you guys thanks for your thoughts.