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Writings of Paul and Peter?
Lupac:
(I hope this isn't against the rules. If it is, I'm sorry, please remove this topic.)
Hi. I was wondering about something. It seems that some people think that 1 Timothy, and a few other of Paul's epistles weren't written by Paul. They use examples like, Colossians combating an early form on Gnosticism, or 1 Timothy saying the, things it says about women in the church when Paul said in Galatians that there is not male or female in Christ. Also, lots of people say that nether 1 nor 2 Peter was actually written by Peter.
I'm only asking this because 1 Timothy, to me, is the most "pro universal salvation" book in the whole Bible. (But I guess if I can't trust it, how can I trust anything in the Bible?)
So, my question is, is there support I'm not seeing that Paul and Peter really wrote those books? (Also, 1 Corinthians 15:22 is just as strong, I guess. But what does being "made alive" mean? I just need some faith, but back to my question. Thanks.)
mharrell08:
--- Quote from: Lupac on December 07, 2009, 08:27:04 AM ---So, my question is, is there support I'm not seeing that Paul and Peter really wrote those books? (Also, 1 Corinthians 15:22 is just as strong, I guess. I just need some faith, but back to my question. Thanks.)
--- End quote ---
Hello Lupac,
Peter and Paul epistles agree with the rest of the Holy Scriptures, that should be proof enough. But the faith is not for everyone and when these people have doubts it is because God is not calling them.
James 1:8 A double minded man is unstable in all his ways
John 20:29 Jesus saith unto him, Thomas, because thou hast seen me, thou hast believed: blessed are they that have not seen, and yet have believed.
Marques
Deborah-Leigh:
Hi Lupac,
Here is an excerpt from HOW WE GOT THE BIBLE transcript Bible Study by Ray Smith
II Peter was written to show the apostasy that had set in and would grow worse. That the WORDS OF THE PROPHETS AND THE WORDS OF THE APOSTLES must be heeded and preserved.
II Peter 3:2 that you may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us, the apostles of the Lord and Savior,
But Peter says, Paul writes to you, isn’t that what he says in II Peter 3:15?
But I thought Peter was suppose to go to the Jews and Paul to the Gentiles. Now it says in Gal. 2, that I (Paul) was to the uncircumcised and Peter to the circumcised.
Gal 2:7 …when they saw that the gospel for the uncircumcised had been committed to me, as the gospel for the circumcised was to Peter.
But look at this.
II Peter 3:14 Wherefore, beloved, seeing that ye look for these things, give diligence that ye may be found in peace, without spot and blameless in his sight.
v. 15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also, according to the wisdom given to him, wrote unto you;
Who did Paul write all his epistles to? The Gentiles. Paul is now in prison in Roman and Peter is writing to the Gentiles. What is going on here? Apparently Paul wanted him to, because Paul can’t get these letters out being in Roman, like he use to.
II Peter 3:16 as also in ALL his epistles, speaking in them of these things;
What did Peter know about “all his (Paul’s) epistles”? Because Peter had them. He had them all. How did he get them?
II Tim. 4:11 Only Luke is with me. Take Mark, and bring him with you; for he is useful to me for ministering.
v. 12 But Tychicus I sent to Ephesus.
v. 13 The cloak that I left at Troas with Carpus, bring when thou come, and the books, ESPECIALLY THE PARCHMENTS.
These are Paul’s letters. These are not the books, but the vellums, these are his epistles. Why would he want all his epistles? Didn’t he know what he said? Well he knows his time is near the end and Paul knows what he has written is Scripture. We read many Scripture showing that he knew that he was writing ‘Bible verses’ if you will.
Now Paul wants Mark to come and bring those letters, because he’s going to go through them. In fact he’s going to edit some of them.
Eph 1:1 Paul, an apostle of Christ Jesus through the will of God, to the saints that are at Ephesus,
It doesn’t just say to the saints of God, but “that are in Ephesus,” That was editorialized, because his first letters apparently do not contain that. But then he edited it, so that they would know where this letter went.
Of course Ephesus was really the head quarters for the Asian church.
Remember there are 7 churches on a mail route; Ephesus, Smyrna, Pergamos, Thyatira, Sardis, Philadelphia and Laodicea. But the head church was always in Ephesus.
So he says, bring the parchments ‘especially’ I want those, these were Paul’s epistles. Now Mark returned to Peter in Babylon. Remember Peter wrote from Babylon.
II Peter 5:13 The church is in Babylon, elect together with you, greets you; and so does Mark my son.
So Paul said sent Mark and be sure to bring the vellums and he must have brought them. Paul then edits them and says these are the ones. He started with the most important one of all for basic information, the book of Romans. It sets the doctrinal standards, but it’s mostly milk as far as doctrine goes. This leads up to his last epistles written from prison, Ephesians, Philippians and Colossians. These are the most spiritually strong Scripture in the whole bible.
Now Mark is back in Babylon with Peter and then when we go to II Peter, guess what? Peter has all of Paul’s epistles. There was a reason why Mark got them and took them to Paul. Then Paul sent them with Mark and he gave them to Peter. Now Peter has got them all, at least all the ones that Paul wanted to be sent to him. So Peter is definitely in charge of the Scriptures and here he talks about his epistles and the OTHER Scriptures. So he knows what the other Scriptures are.
So obviously the Apostles had all the Scriptures. They had the Law of Moses, the Prophets and the writings, they had it all. It (Old Testament) was in the synagogues and the Temple until 70 AD, but they also had them.
General epistles James, Peter, John and Jude should come before Paul's epistles. They were first to teach, first in authority (Acts 15) and first in teaching the milk of God's Word, followed by Paul's strong meat of God's Word.
Lupac:
Thank you. Where can I find the "HOW WE GOT THE BIBLE" bible study? Also, is being "made alive" in 1 Cor. 15:22 the same as being saved? Thanks. (I guess since sin=death it does, but I have lots of, I don't want to say doubts, maybe worries?)
Deborah-Leigh:
Click on Introductions, Announcements and more of Ray's Teachings and then click on Transcripts of Ray's Audio's and More Teachings
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,5815.0.html
--- Quote ---Also, is being "made alive" in 1 Cor. 15:22 the same as being saved?
--- End quote ---
You will find deeper meaning to this question at http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,3849.0.html
Sample excerpt quote :
….in Acts 6:31, it says “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and you shall be saved.”
Well which is it? CALL upon the name of the Lord, or BELIEVE in Jesus Christ….and then you’ll be saved.
Well then in Mark 16:16, it says, “He that believes and is baptized shall be saved.”
Well, now we are getting down to it…(counts off on his fingers): You call upon the name of the Lord, you believe on the name of the Lord, you’re baptized and then…..?? You’ll be saved, right? Well, that is if there were no more scriptures.
But then we have a scripture in John 10:9 that says, “I am the door, by Me if any man enter he shall be saved.” Well what if you don’t enter by the door? If Christ is the door and you have to enter in at the door to be saved, if you don’t enter in at the door can you be saved? Well, I wouldn’t think so.
And then we have in Ephesians 2:8, “For by grace, are you saved, through faith”
Now let me see if I’ve got this straight:
1. believe on the name of the Lord
2. call on the name of the Lord
3. be baptized
4. enter in at the door of Christ
5. and then by grace
6. through faith
…….and then I will be saved. Right? Wrong Paleface, because there’s more!
Arc
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