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Did the Father ever have a beginning? Where is the Scriptural proof?
myms:
'What I am saying is, some people want proof that what God says is true.'
Sorry Marques, point taken!
Thanks, myms.
Samson:
come to mind are using Scriptures that prove the opposite or deducing a Truth from a Scripture. I will illustrate that using two ex
--- Quote from: TRUTH281 on January 23, 2010, 10:40:41 PM ---How do we know He never had a beginning? Is there any Scriptural proof that the Father never had a beginning? Everlasting God really means "the God of the ages", so that's not proof. I know this isn't relevant, but everyone says the Father never had a beginning and I say where is the Scriptural proof? And if there isn't any Scriptural proof then don't make the assumption.
Thanks,
Jake from Baytown, TX
--- End quote ---
Hello Jake,
After reading this Thread and considering your question, something Ray said dawned on me regarding how we might prove something that may not or may not be specifically stated. Two ways from Examples found below from Ray's article " Does All mean All." These are not direct quotes, but I recall these examples, because they left a profound imprint in my memory.
Example #1(Some have argued that the Greek Word Pas(All) doesn't necessarily mean everyone, but can mean " as many as" or "Most" or can mean everyone, but we can prove that God will save All from 2Peter. 3:9; where it says that God Wills or Desires that "None" perish. The Greek Word for our English word "None" is taken from the Greek Word "oy" which is derived from the Greek No'te which means "no, never, none, not;etc. So the point from This Scripture is that if God Wills or Desires that "None" perish, there can't be anyone in that category. You have an opposite created here from this Scripture; "None Perishing." So, if God Wills none perish, there can't be anyone that does. We used a negative word to prove the opposite.
Example: #2 ( Love Never Fails; 1Cor13:8 & God Is Love; 1John. 4:8-God Is Love. So, If God is Love and Love never(Gk-no'te,oy), it can never happen on God's part, because He IS( a state of being) Love. Is there a Scripture that says Love will fail, No.
So, What's the point of the above examples, I will explain that now. Jesus is the First born of all creation(Col. 1:15); He is the beginning of creation of or by God(Rev. 3:14); God gave his only Begotten Son(John. 3:16); He sent his only Begotten Son into the World(1 John. 4:9); No man has seen God at any time, the only begotten God(Gk-monogenes Theos) who is in the bosom with the Father has explained him.(John. 1:18); This one was in the beginning with God(John. 1:2); An only Begotten Son from a Father(John. 1:14). From all of this and other Scriptures, we know that Jesus had a beginning and was created by The Father or Begotten of The Father, yet THERE ARE NO SCRIPTURES THAT STATE THAT THE FATHER HAD A BEGINNING OR WAS CREATED BY ANYONE. So we can deduce from all of that to prove God the Father didn't have a beginning, because the Scriptures don't state that He did, but they state that the Son(Jesus) had a beginning. And since Jesus is God and had a beginning, wouldn't they state that God the Father had a beginning, if that was so, because God the Father is God, also(John. 4:24-God is Spirit, stated by Jesus, while he was flesh).
Hope this helps, but remember, We walk by Faith, not by sight.
Kind Regards, Samson.
Deborah-Leigh:
Hey Jake
Samson answered you well.
Also, I am sure there are many members here who can find many scriptures to show what God IS but you are not looking for that are you Jake. Are you not looking to prove that God the Father had a beginning? If so, why so?
God does not create ANYTHING out of NOTHING so why would He be either out of or from nothing?
Just because God is INVISIBLE, does not mean that He is NOTHING, or that He is out of nothing or came from nothing which is the same as looking to see if He had a beginning. Can you see that? Can you see that you are looking for something that is not there?
If God had a beginning then there has to be nothing before He began right? WRONG. If you think that there was something before God the Father then you do not believe what He says that
Isa 46:9 Remember the former things of old: for I am God, and there is none else; I am God, and there is NON like Me,
God is was and ever shall be. God will NEVER be nowhere or nothing. God is a consuming fire and many other Scriptures show what God is. God is EVERYTHING not NOTHING.
As Samson nails it, no where in the Scriptures does it say that God the Father began somewhere. If God began somewhere then somewhere had more power, status, rank, position, standing and eminence than God which demotes, lowers and makes inferior, God’s rank and status as Sovereign God subserviating Him to a somewhere somewhere. Get my drift? No?
Here it is in a nut shell. God is the somewhere and the something of everything and everywhere. Get it? Perhaps still not?
Let’s try this. The Son of God had a beginning. His Son is the First and Last of many sons and daughters and His Kingdom will go on and on expanding, not from NOTHING but from God. God is somewhere, that is everywhere. God is something that is everything. Is this a little clearer? No? Maybe not?
When you see that God is Spirit and that He is invisible then you will know that EVERYTHING you feel, ask or question is caused by HIM and that is not from nothing or nowhere.
It is good to ask questions Jake. Be encouraged. Keep on keeping on. God is right behind you…all the time!
For further study please consider, think about, regard, mull over, reflect on, contemplate and take into account to ponder the LOF part 2 teachings
Quote....
So creation is ‘IN Christ” but “OUT of God” Not , out of “nothing.!”
Arcturus
gmik:
Hi all. How about Col. 1:16-17.......He is before all things.....
That is clear (to me at least)
...and by HIM all things consist....
So HE was at the beginning and called into being everything else.
TRUTH281:
Col. 1:16-17.......He is before all things.....
This is a verse stating the present condition of Christ and in no way proves the Father never had a beginning. I'm not saying he did have a beginning but everyone is using verses which address the present pense or have nothing to do with the topic. This is why I've addressed the issue because everyone says God never had a beginning and I have yet to see the Scriptures. All I'm saying is why assume something that's not Scriptural.
...and by HIM all things consist....
Again this verse has to do with the PRESENT condition of Christ's power. You can't use verses about Christ who had a beginning to prove that the Father never had a beginning. It's like how Ray explained God's Wisdom and how there is no verses which state he has always had the Wisdom he has today. Ray says "I don't doubt that he has all wisdom. Where did he get it?" I don't doubt that God is immortal today but what veses suggest he has always been this way?
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