Is water baptism necessary for Jews？if baptism necessary for Jews,so what age?

[soberxp]

cuz this

John - 约翰福音 21:7
kjv:Therefore that disciple whom Jesus loved saith unto Peter, It is the Lord. Now when Simon Peter heard that it was the Lord, he girt his fisher's coat unto him, (for he was naked,) and did cast himself into the sea.
niv:Then the disciple whom Jesus loved said to Peter, "It is the Lord!" As soon as Simon Peter heard him say, "It is the Lord," he wrapped his outer garment around him (for he had taken it off) and jumped into the water.

Luke - 路加福音 5:8
kjv:When Simon Peter saw it, he fell down at Jesus' knees, saying, Depart from me; for I am a sinful man, O Lord.
niv:When Simon Peter saw this, he fell at Jesus' knees and said, "Go away from me, Lord; I am a sinful man!"

Joh 21:14  This is now the third time that Jesus shewed himself to his disciples, after that he was risen from the dead. 
Joh 21:15  So when they had dined, Jesus saith to Simon Peter, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me more than these? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my lambs. 
Joh 21:16  He saith to him again the second time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? He saith unto him, Yea, Lord; thou knowest that I love thee. He saith unto him, Feed my sheep. 
Joh 21:17  He saith unto him the third time, Simon, son of Jonas, lovest thou me? Peter was grieved because he said unto him the third time, Lovest thou me? And he said unto him, Lord, thou knowest all things; thou knowest that I love thee. Jesus saith unto him, Feed my sheep. 
Joh 21:18  Verily, verily, I say unto thee, When thou wast young, thou girdedst thyself, and walkedst whither thou wouldest: but when thou shalt be old, thou shalt stretch forth thy hands, and another shall gird thee, and carry thee whither thou wouldest not. 
Joh 21:19  This spake he, signifying by what death he should glorify God. And when he had spoken this, he saith unto him, Follow me. 
Joh 21:20  Then Peter, turning about, seeth the disciple whom Jesus loved following; which also leaned on his breast at supper, and said, Lord, which is he that betrayeth thee? 
Joh 21:21  Peter seeing him saith to Jesus, Lord, and what shall this man do? 
Joh 21:22  Jesus saith unto him, If I will that he tarry till I come, what is that to thee? follow thou me.

[Kat]

Hi Soberxp,

Are you asking about the physical ritual of being dunked in water? Baptism is a spiritual thing and all must be baptized into Jesus Christ in order to receive salvation.

Rom 6:3  Or do you not know that as many of us as were baptized into Christ Jesus were baptized into His death?
v. 4  Therefore we were buried with Him through baptism into death, that just as Christ was raised from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life.

Rom 6:11  Likewise you also, reckon yourselves to be dead indeed to sin, but alive to God in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Here are a couple of places that Ray spoke on this.

http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php?topic=4472.0 -----------------------

But there is only one body, one spirit. Even as you are called in one hope of your calling, one Lord, one faith, one baptism. There's only one baptism that counts, that's Christ's baptism. Now if your not baptized into Christ, your water baptism is of no value whatsoever  But people want to do the physical, keeping the physical. They think well I have to keep the baptism and circumcision, and every year we have to wash one another's feet, and we take the Passover or communion, sometimes it's six times a year, sometimes it's twice a day, whatever. 

Paul says they love the letter, their little communion thing and their little wafer (such a cute little thing) and they take their communion cup and say bless you, bless you, bless you and send me money, money, money. You have to have an anointing cloth and the hands laid on you and rubbed with oil... You got to pay your tithe and keep the Holy Days... You can't wear mixed fabrics... The clean and unclean foods... You have to keep the Sabbath... You can't work from sunset to sunset... and it just goes on and on and on. You do all these things and you will be a holy person, it will just make your heart so wonderful? But what it does is it makes hypocrites and heretics out of people.

It's only ONE baptism and that's JESUS CHRIST. We are baptized into His DEATH. You say I thought we were suppose to be baptized in water? No. We are baptized into His death, that's the thing that counts. It is only one baptism, there is only one circumcision, you either get that one or you have none at all.

Col 2:10-11  "And you are complete in Him, who is the Head of all principality and power, in whom also you are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands..."

No skin, no hands, no knife, that's circumcision, okay. Continuing verse 11 "... putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ." 
That is what it represents, "the flesh by the circumcision of CHRIST!" That is the only way it counts. 

Col 2:12  "buried with Him in baptism, in whom also you were raised through the faith of the working of God, raising Him from the dead."

Then you say, 'alright Ray there it is, we have to be baptized, can't you read it in context?' The circumcision is without hands, the baptism is without water. This is Christ's circumcision, Christ's baptism, Christ is the anointing, it's Christ, Christ, Christ, all of it.

If you don't see that, you are just spinning your wheels in physical rituals. You don't get any more obnoxious than holier than thou, seventh day Sabbath keepers and holy sacred name societies. Maybe it's a secret handshake, it's like you belong to the Masons and you get a secret handshake and your in, you see. It's total nonsense.


http://bible-truths.com/lake16-D4.htm -------------------------------

It is never okay to sin. What did Paul say:

"What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin [but just HOW do we get 'dead to sin?'] live any longer therein? Know you not, that so many of us as were baptized into Jesus Christ were baptized into His death? [THAT'S how we get 'dead to sin']. Therefore we are buried with Him by baptism into death: that like as Christ was raised up from the dead by the glory of the Father, even so we also should walk in newness of life" (Rom. 6:1-4).

This "newness of life" means "led by the Spirit" of Jesus Christ IN US.

But here's the problem with most Christians. Most Christians have been baptized in WATER, but they have never been "baptized into His DEATH." Therefore they write me weekly telling me how important this physical ritual of water baptism is, because they have never been SPIRITUALLY "baptized into the NAME of Jesus," or "baptized into His DEATH," and therefore know nothing of the spiritual meaning of these physical symbols.

For this reason they also feel it most important to observe the physical ritual of Sabbath keeping, because they have not as yet "entered into His [SPIRITUAL] rest." ("For we which have believed DO ENTER INTO REST..." Heb. 4:3).

For this reason they feel it most important to partake of a little grape juice and a wafer on a regular basis, because they have not as yet SPIRITUALLY "eaten His body or drunk of His blood" (John 6:54).

For this reason they want to "give unto God the things that are CAESAR'S." They want to give God the filthy lucre tax money with Caesar's image on it instead of "unto God the things that [truly] ARE God's." Such as:

"WHAT? Know you not that your body is the temple of the Holy Spirit which is in you, which you have of God, and you are not your own? For you are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's" (I Cor. 6:19-20).

Therefore, since our bodies belong to God and ARE God's, we are to "...present our bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable UNTO GOD [NOT Caesar's filthy tax money], which is your reasonable [rational, intelligent] service. And be not conformed to this world, but be you transformed by the renewing ['walk in newness of life,' (Rom. 6:4), 'a new creature,' II Cor. 5:17, 'a new creature,' Gal. 6:15] of your mind, that you may prove what is that good and acceptable, and perfect will of God" (Rom. 12:1-2).

For this reason they feel it most important to be physically circumcised in the flesh, because they have not as yet been circumcised "in heart and in spirit" (Rom. 28-29).

For this reason they desire physical healing over spiritual healing, etc., etc. Sadly, the Church of Christendom knows little of Christ's "words of spirit."


http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php?topic=6142.0 -----------------

IN CHRIST  - IN SPIRIT

Col 2:10  And you are complete in Christ, who is the Head of all principality and power,

This is talking to the Colossians here, these are Gentiles, these are people who are trying to be the kingdom of the heavens.

Col 2:11  in whom also ye (all of you) are circumcised with the circumcision made without hands (no more physical rituals, talking about the real stuff now, in your heart - in your mind - in your soul - in your spirit), in putting off the body of the sins of the flesh by the circumcision of Christ,

People will say, 'so Ray you are saying that we don't need to be baptized anymore?'  Oh I never said that.  I never said we don't have to be baptized anymore.  We have to be baptized, we have to be circumcised, we have to partake in the foot washing, we have to keep the Sabbath, we have to partake of the bread and the wine...  IN SPIRIT. 

If you don't do it in spirit, then forget it.  When you go down dry, you'll come up wet.  You will loose some skin and some blood and that's all.  You'll eat a little piece of wafer and you'll drink a little grape juice and that's all.  This is the real thing,  SPIRITUALLY.

Spiritually you must be circumcised, you must have the foreskin of your heart, that flesh cut off.  You must be baptized with Christ, that means you have to die.  That's not too popular, that you have to die to the flesh.  The flesh doesn't want to die.  The flesh says, here I am look at me, don't let me die, pay attention to me, puff me up, make me great, make me important, it's flesh flesh flesh. 

We have to be crucified with Christ.

Gal 2:20  I have been crucified with Christ; it is no longer I who live, but Christ lives in me; and the life which I now live in the flesh I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave Himself for me.

But this next verse is "buried with Him in baptism."

Col 2:12  buried with Him in baptism...

It doesn't say buried in water.  Where do you see buried in water there?  I don't see buried in water, I see buried with Him in baptism.

Col 2:12 ...in which you also were raised with Him through faith in the working of God, who raised Him from the dead.

I don't see anything about water there.  You say, 'well that's what it's all about isn't it?'  Paul said in the first chapter of Corinthians, Christ has not called me to baptize.

1Cor 1:17  For Christ did not send me to baptize, but to preach the gospel,

He said that's not my calling, He called me to preach the gospel.  This is the gospel.  Being baptized in Christ is the gospel and persecuted with Christ, and hated of all nations.
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mercy, peace and love
Kat

[soberxp]

 THX.
honest. I haven't done this, circumcision，things as this,when I was planted(not I planted) to did it at 2007,somehow I got accident，It was a pure accident，but near death experience。