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We shall see God.
bob:
Thank you to those who responded to my post "Will we see God". I was away this weekend and did not have time to read all that was said. It is a privilege to be a part of this church. The depth of knowledge displayed on this site from so many people is very comforting. Thanks again, and God bless Ray. Leesburg Bob
daywalker:
--- Quote from: RRHinds on October 02, 2010, 09:00:54 PM --- We are made of Body, Spirit and Soul, so if we were made in the exact image of God then he too has a body spirit and soul.
--- End quote ---
Based on what Scripture?
We don't "have" (are not "made of") a soul; we ourselves (as well as animals) are "living souls":
Genesis 2:7 And the LORD God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.
soul = Hebrew "nephesh". Same word found here:
Gen 1:24 And God said, Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind: and it was so.
creature = Hebrew "nephesh" *Concordant and Rotherham's both translate "soul" as do a few other translations*
All living souls (whether human or animal) can and do die:
Ezekiel 18:4 ...the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
v.20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die...
Ecclesiastes 3:19 For that which befalleth the sons of men befalleth beasts; even one thing befalleth them: as the one dieth, so dieth the other; yea, they have all one breath; so that a man hath no preeminence above a beast: for all is vanity.
v.20 All go unto one place; all are of the dust, and all turn to dust again.
Are we to believe that God (since He has a "soul") dies? God is Spirit--John 4:24. The Scriptures do use "soul" in a figurative way sometimes to describe God (as in His feelings, etc.) but God is not a soul, because a soul is a physical, carnal, mortal being.
...........
This doctrinal teaching of "body, spirit and soul" is unscriptural and is commonly used by Babylon to promote their Trinity doctrine--which Ray exposes in great detail (if you haven't already read it: http://bible-truths.com/trinity.html ).
To help understand the correct meaning and usage of "body, spirit, soul", here's an excerpt from one of Ray's letters to Dr. Kennedy:
TV ANALOGY
Here is an analogy that is applicable and easy to understand: God's spirit gives life to the body. Only in life does a man have consciousness or sensation. When God takes back His spirit, the body and soul are dead.
Picture a TV console as representing the human BODY with all its intricate circuitry and components.
Now picture ELECTRICITY as the invisible, powerful force representing God's life-giving SPIRIT.
Picture the blank PICTURE TUBE as representing the SOUL.
Without the electricity (God's spirit), the TV and picture tube (body and soul) are dead. All the time I hear preachers talking about our souls and our spirits as if they were one and the same. Soul and spirit are not one and the same.
Next plug in the electricity (God's spirit). The TV comes to life, and we see the picture tube (soul) animated. We see color, sound, dancing, singing, talking, intelligent conversations, all live via satellite. The dead TV becomes a living, visible, animated, intelligent entity-"Soul." But notice very carefully, the Soul (the animated picture in the TV tube) is not one of the original components. It is not a component in and by itself, but is rather the result of two other vital components, Body and Spirit (the TV console and electricity).
At bedtime I sometimes tell my daughter to give the TV a rest. When one turns off the "on/off" switch the TV goes to "sleep." The power light is still on, but the TV is blank and silent.
But now, pull the plug and take away the electricity (spirit) and what happens to the TV console (body)? It dies. It's just a box of circuits. Not even the power light is on anymore. If left unplugged it will, in time, decay and return to the dust of the ground.
And what happens to the colorful animated picture on the screen (soul) when we take away the electricity (spirit)? Want the real answer? Ask a child. Let several children watch TV together, then pull the plug and ask them where the picture went? A child will shrug his shoulders or say "I don't know" or say "It disappeared." Guess what? He is Scripturally correct on all three counts.
Without spirit there is no life and no consciousness. Without power a TV has no life and no animated picture. It's dead.
If you were to ask an ancient Hebrew person what happens to the soul (the thinking, feeling, animated, sentient personality of a man) at death, he would shrug his shoulders or say "who knows" or just say "it disappears." That's what "Sheol" meant to the Hebrews. It was a question mark. And the Greeks had their word for the same idea (Hades-the UNSEEN, the IMPERCEPTIBLE), and hades and sheol are synonymous in Scripture (Acts 2:27).
There is one more profound Scriptural truth that is also perfectly analogous to the operation of a TV, and that is this. Picture God's Throne as the Broadcast Headquarters. The TV picture Tube, by itself, is not the source or originator of the picture it portrays on the screen. It is a channel for the signal transmitted from the TV Station and Tower. It can only manifest and portray on its screen that which is sent from the source [God]. And often the source [God] uses intermediaries like satellites [Angels] to relay the signals.
In Scripture, death is called a "return" [Heb. shub]. Before we were born we had no body, no soul, and no perception of any kind. At birth God gave us a body, implanted to us His spirit, which gives the body perception (through the brain and the five senses). At death, we [shub] RETURN. The reversal of what happened at birth. The spirit returns to God (Ecc. 12:7), the body returns to the dust (all the elements of man's body are found in the ground or earth) (Job 10:9, Ecc. 3:18-21), and the soul returns to no perception again (the imperceptible or unseen-hades) (Acts 2:27 and Psalm 49:15). This is what the Scriptures very plainly teach: where all that man "is" came from, that's where all that man "is" returns to.
http://bible-truths.com/kennedy2.htm
Hope this helps.
Daywalker 8)
RRHinds:
Mathew 10 verse 28 words spoken by Jesus himself, unless of course you say that he was lying!
But do not be afraid of those who want to kill your BODY; they cannot touch your SOUL. Fear only God who can destroy both SOUL and BODY in HELL. His words not mine. And please don´t try and translate it away through Greek or Hebrew interpretations. God´s word is and was always meant to be simple. Why do you call all churches Babylonian. I know many churches that teach the correct meaning of the word. Okay they are not perfect, but then again who is.
God bless.
Roland.
Kat:
Hi Roland,
Here is what we believe on the Matt, 10 verse.
http://bible-truths.com/lake16-C.html -----------
"And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: fear Him which is able to destroy both soul and body in gehenna" (Matt. 10:28).
IMMORTAL SOUL?
I am now going to show you how to be smarter and more knowledgeable than most theologians in the world—(at least in this one little point). Okay; follow very closely, for we are going to get really really technical for a few minutes:
First: Can God "destroy the body?" Well, yes, of course He can, Jesus just said that He "is ABLE." So God "IS able to destroy the body." Now, I believe Jesus. I think that most of you believe Jesus. But, do orthodox pastors and theologians, believe Jesus? Yes, from all that I know, they do believe Jesus on this point.
Next: Can God "destroy the soul?" Well, yes, of course He can, Jesus just said that He "is ABLE." So God "IS able to destroy the soul." Now, I believe Jesus. I think that (some of) you believe Jesus. But, do orthodox pastors and theologians, believe Jesus? No, of course not. How can a soul which they teach is immortal, ever be "destroyed?" Now let’s proceed to some more "technical stuff":
God created humanity in two stages, not three (Gen. 2:7):
[1] "And the Lord God formed man [Heb: ‘adam, a human being’] of the dust [Heb: ‘aphar, powdered gray, hence clay’] of the ground [Heb: ‘adamah, soil’]
[2] "and breathed into his nostrils the breath [Heb: ‘n’shahmah, puff, wind’] of life [Heb: ‘chay, alive, life, living’] and man became [Heb: ‘hayah, exist, be, become, come to pass’] a living [Heb: ‘chay, alive, life, living’] soul [Heb: ‘nephesh, a breathing creature, animal, vitality, mind, mortality’]."
Well, there you have it: God’s abbreviated version of how He created humanity.
Let me next draw your attention to something that few Christians have ever seen, even though it is right before their eyes in every Bible on earth. I said that God created man in two stages rather than three. I emphasize this because theology teaches that God made man in three stages. Here is their unscriptural version: First God formed the man of the ground, Second God breathed life into the man, and Third God put an immortal soul into the man. If you doubt that this is what they teach, ask your pastor.
However, did we read of these fabled three stages of man’s creation in the Scripture quoted above? No, no we didn’t. We read of two things in man’s creation at the hands of God. First God formed the man of the ground, Second God breathed life into the man, and Third God…? God what? There ain’t no Third. "man became a living soul" is part of stage Two. There is no third stage. God did not "put an immortal soul into the man." Where do we read of such unscriptural nonsense?
God didn’t need to do anything after He breathed into him the breathe of life. It was the breath of life from God that caused the man to become a living soul. God didn’t put a soul into Adam; Adam is a living soul. The spirit of man, which God gives to every human, is like a light switch—Switch it ‘on’ and the light glows: Switch it ‘off’ and the light is dark, gone, dead. Put the spirit in the man, and the man is a living soul: take the spirit out of the man, and the man is a dead soul. Do you think that even your children could understand this Scriptural Truth? Perhaps you should teach them, and then they could teach your pastor.
The "body" of the deceased is gone forever. In resurrection to immortality, God gives everyone a new spiritual body. God can bring back the person in any "body" He desires. When God puts your "spirit" (not you soul) but your spirit (which has no consciousness) back into another body (as in a resurrection with a new spiritual body), the same real person/soul will live again. God can do this, but man can’t, so fear God.
----------------------------------------------------
mercy, peace and love
Kat
Samson:
--- Quote from: RRHinds on October 04, 2010, 07:21:28 PM ---Mathew 10 verse 28 words spoken by Jesus himself, unless of course you say that he was lying!
But do not be afraid of those who want to kill your BODY; they cannot touch your SOUL. Fear only God who can destroy both SOUL and BODY in HELL. His words not mine. And please don´t try and translate it away through Greek or Hebrew interpretations. God´s word is and was always meant to be simple. Why do you call all churches Babylonian. I know many churches that teach the correct meaning of the word. Okay they are not perfect, but then again who is.
God bless.
Roland.
--- End quote ---
Roland,
No one believes Jesus is lying or would lie, but Bible Scholars and Translators do lie or at least are misinformed. They might tell you the above words in Your Post(Matt. 10:28) is physically literally, yet why is it, " If your eye offends thee, cut it out or if your hand offends thee, cut it off, because it's better to go through life without an eye or a hand, than to be thrown into Gehenna(Fiery Hell). I bet that they would concede the passage in Matt. 5:28,30 isn't physically literal. If it was, there would be an awful lot of believers walking around missing an eye and a hand, unless most or all believers haven't offended God, at least once, but I'm sure you would agree, that's highly unlikely. The literal Gehenna mentioned in these verses above have long ago burned out, although unquencheable, it burned out, already serving it's purpose, to completely consume garbage, the carcasses of dead animals and those not given a burial. Whatever the fire didn't consume, the worms would consume, but that literal garbage dump(the valley of the Son of Hinnom) doesn't exist anymore. It's now a beautifully nice place to live. So, it's that simple, what Jesus said by using the word Gehenna(Ge-Valley & Henna-Hinnom).
Food for thought, Samson.
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