> General Discussions
Jo.2:4 Is there a disrespect?
dave:
--- Quote from: mharrell08 on November 19, 2010, 09:18:15 AM ---
--- Quote from: micah7:9 on November 19, 2010, 07:23:19 AM ---" My time to preach the gospel has not yet come.'"
I thought that Jo. 1:38-51 shows Jesus was already if not at least started to preach. Doesnt "my hour has not come..." doesnt that speak of His time of sacrifice?
--- End quote ---
Those passages speak of Jesus gathering His disciples. They don't say He was preaching to the masses as yet. Jesus turning water into wine is thought to be His first miracle, that is the perspective I was speaking of.
Whether Jesus was talking about preaching the gospel or just His sacrifice, either way, Jesus made the point that worrying about wine is no where near important as to the job He was sent to do.
--- Quote from: micah7:9 on November 19, 2010, 07:23:19 AM ---Maybe the word disrespect was wrong. It just "sounds" like there is a tone for a seemingly harmless question. I don't expect that people should judge, and I hope you don't think my question was a judging one. I reason that whatever my Lord spoke that there is word of knowledge within.
Thank you.
--- End quote ---
When I use the word judge, it's not with a direct negative connotation. It's simply means to use one's own 'judgment' to discern whether a matter was right/wrong/, good/bad, etc. We can judge a situation in a positive light.
But the fact remains, whether we say 'disrespect' or 'had a tone' or whatever, the question is still the same. It's a judgmental question: you are asking whether we think Jesus answer to His mother's questions was right/wrong, respectful/disrespectful, etc. At least, that is what I understand the question of the subject to be.
We don't know if Jesus' mother made a 'seemingly harmless question'. It only seems harmless to us because we are only given very little details of this event. There's no telling how many times she asked Him to do this. And she also knows from her pregnancy that Jesus was sent to do much more important matters than turning water into wine. And like Kat says: He STILL did it.
--- Quote from: micah7:9 on November 19, 2010, 08:16:12 AM ---I don't believe that there is a misreading, and I don't believe for a moment that Jesus said anything unkind to His mother. The situation was certainly in His plan, I also must believe that His mothers request was not what caused Jesus to begin His ministry. If Jesus only spoke in parables, as I understand, then am I in error to believe that there is more to His words that what we read?
John 2:11 This beginning of the signs Jesus does in Cana of Galilee, and manifests His glory, and His disciples believe in Him.
Peace and Love Through Jesus
--- End quote ---
I believe you when you say you don't believe Jesus was unkind to His mother. But when you starting off asking was His words disrespectful, that led to confusion. If you didn't believe it, why even ask?
As far as whether Jesus words had more meaning than what was said, this is why the 12 Truths paper is a great guideline to follow. Yes, Jesus spoke in parables but no parable is it's own interpetation (Truth #9). We must compare Jesus' words of spirit in His response to a spiritual match (Truth #8). We need 2-3 witnesses that can attest to whatever point you believe is being made (Truth #6).
So what do you believe the spiritual message is in His response?
Marques
P.S. Please do not take my direct approach as strife with you. I think this is an interesting study, Micah. :)
--- End quote ---
I find no strife my friend
Joel:
I don't think any disrespect was shown here by Jesus towards Mary.
I know that God does whatever, whenever, where ever he wants at any time.
And that he rewards us when we obey him and place our trust, and faith in him.
I am reminded that Mary told the servants to "do whatever he tells you to do." (Faith)
I see it as God making a concession and giving a small taste of the great things to come.
If I go to the kitchen and my wife is making a mouth watering meal and I ask for something to eat or DRINK she very well may say " get away its not ready yet". But if I'm carefull, she may let me have a little taste of this, or that. LOL 8)
Never the less, it was a wonderfull thing for Jesus to do, at the start of his ministry.
Joel
dave:
Does Ray have any work to read on Jesus' first sign? Or any paper on John 2?
mharrell08:
--- Quote from: micah7:9 on November 19, 2010, 03:26:50 PM ---Does Ray have any work to read on Jesus' first sign? Or any paper on John 2?
--- End quote ---
None that I can recall, perhaps another member can find an excerpt.
I was still waiting your response as to what you thought the spiritual significance of Jesus' response regarding the wine...
dave:
--- Quote from: mharrell08 on November 19, 2010, 05:51:31 PM ---
--- Quote from: micah7:9 on November 19, 2010, 03:26:50 PM ---Does Ray have any work to read on Jesus' first sign? Or any paper on John 2?
--- End quote ---
None that I can recall, perhaps another member can find an excerpt.
I was still waiting your response as to what you thought the spiritual significance of Jesus' response regarding the wine...
--- End quote ---
I understand the number six is the number of man, and is for Adam/man. The pots were for washings/purifying (law) which had 2 or 3 firkins; 2 is the number of witness and 3 is the number of completness. There was a happening (witness)and there would be a completness, yet with partial understanding.
Jesus said fill the water pots with water and they filled them to the brim, here we have complete filling to the brim which represents a complete work, but the washing of the water(law) was past and a new washing was presenting Himself. The wine, the best wine was now offered to the Governor (leader/religion) and represents the cleansing power of the Blood of Jesus. The washing water is changed to wine(blood) the cleansing power of the Blood of the Lamb. The cleansing and regeneration, the renewing for the new man.
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