So I was in discussion (more of a debate that my friend started with the predication she just wanted my opinion) about Matthew 18: 23 -35
To be honest I had not even remembered this series of passages and after reading this parable I was just so amazed at God and it has instilled even MORE faith in God's reconciliation of all humanity. She wanted to use this story as proof of eternal torment but the moment I read it I was just so thankful to God for her showing it to me because it proved the exact opposite! I will post the KJV here just for convenience sake but of course if you feel like looking it up by all means do so.
Matt 18:23-35 Therefore the Kingdom of Heaven is like a certain king, who wanted to reconcile accounts with his servants. When he had begun to reconcile, one was brought to him who owed him ten thousand talents. But because he couldn't pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, with his wife, his children, and all that he had, and payment to be made. The servant therefore fell down and kneeled before him, saying, ‘Lord, have patience with me, and I will repay you all!’ The lord of that servant, being moved with compassion, released him, and forgave him the debt. "But that servant went out, and found one of his fellow servants, who owed him one hundred denarii, and he grabbed him, and took him by the throat, saying, ‘Pay me what you owe!’ "So his fellow servant fell down at his feet and begged him, saying, ‘Have patience with me, and I will repay you!’ He would not, but went and cast him into prison, until he should pay back that which was due. So when his fellow servants saw what was done, they were exceedingly sorry, and came and told to their lord all that was done. Then his lord called him in, and said to him, ‘You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt, because you begged me. Shouldn’t you also have had mercy on your fellow servant, even as I had mercy on you?’ His lord was angry, and delivered him to the tormentors, until he should pay all that was due to him. So my heavenly Father will also do to you, if you don’t each forgive your brother from your hearts for his misdeeds."
Let me start off by saying that this seems to be (correct me if I'm wrong) a parable with multiple teachings and principles in one that represent different aspects of how God works and does not have just one meaning, which is deciphered incorrectly by the way and taken out of context. I believe it has three things taught in it:
1) How generously forgiving and loving of humanity He is regardless of our sin
2) How we are supposed to treat and forgive others
3) How God judges and the temporary nature of that judgment
Therefore the Kingdom of Heaven is like a certain king, who wanted to reconcile accounts with his servants. When he had begun to reconcile, one was brought to him who owed him ten thousand talents.
First of all we do not know who this servant is, the automatic idea is he is some poor person who doesn't have much to their name but that is not necessarily the truth. Servants were often employees but they lived on the property of their master. Also, a servant would be anyone under a king. If you live in the king's kingdom ipso facto you are their servant. So we don't know exactly how rich this servant really was and while this amount of money is apparently quite a lot, equal to millions of dollars by todays standard, it shows that we are incapable of attaining forgiveness on our own. The ridiculous amount of money owed would be nearly impossible to repay on one's own. The main point it is clear that this servant was not a poor person who was loaned a ridiculous amount of money by a stupid king who didn't think it could ever be repaid in the first place! We may not be able to on our own but it can be repaid somehow and in someway!
But because he couldn't pay, his lord commanded him to be sold, with his wife, his children, and all that he had, and payment to be made. The servant therefore fell down and kneeled before him, saying, ‘Lord, have patience with me, and I will repay you all!’ The lord of that servant, being moved with compassion, released him, and forgave him the debt.[/b]
As stated before, the servant could not afford to repay the debt. Now this is not saying that it is not forgivable but simply the servant could not afford to pay it himself. So, he begged for forgiveness of which the king did forgive him. God forgives humanity of our sins no matter how extreme they may be. He is the one who chooses to forgive us, we do not save ourselves. This is in stark contrast to belief that it us who saves ourselves. Even though the servant begged forgiveness the question is did he ever have the power to save himself to begin with? Does asking automatically save you? No, it is God who saves us from our overwhelming sin (debt).
"But that servant went out, and found one of his fellow servants, who owed him one hundred denarii, and he grabbed him, and took him by the throat, saying, ‘Pay me what you owe!’ "So his fellow servant fell down at his feet and begged him, saying, ‘Have patience with me, and I will repay you!’ He would not, but went and cast him into prison, until he should pay back that which was due.
So the servant did not forgive another person such a small debt which was incredibly cruel...especially after having been forgiven for such a huge debt himself but interestingly enough the parable goes deeper which people tend to overlook. While what this man did was cruel it is saying that the "fellow servant" was thrown into prison UNTIL he should pay back that which was due. Which means the amount could be paid back at some point. What applies to us applies to God but on a greater level. Even though the torture/punishment was used to coherce or to meet the payment for a debt obviously it would not last forever especially by human terms which is what this smaller amount of money equals.
So when his fellow servants saw what was done, they were exceedingly sorry, and came and told to their lord all that was done. Then his lord called him in, and said to him, ‘You wicked servant! I forgave you all that debt, because you begged me. Shouldn't you also have had mercy on your fellow servant, even as I had mercy on you?’ His lord was angry, and delivered him to the tormentors, until he should pay all that was due to him. So my heavenly Father will also do to you, if you don't each forgive your brother from your hearts for his misdeeds."
People overlook such a simple word, "until", what does "until" mean?
Until - used as a function word to indicate continuance (as of an action or condition) to a specified time
Strong's Greek Lexicon: ἕως eōs 2193 till, until a prim. particle used as a preposition, adverb and conjunction
In both Greek and English this word means its English definition, "a specified time..."
How can something be forever if it's "a specified time"? Why does Christendom insist on saying this insinuates forever when it clearly says it isn't?!
The next issue at hand is why was the servant tortured? For the money that he originally owed? No, he had been forgiven for that. He was being punished for his cruelty toward the fellow servant! This has nothing to do with the money that he owed! Jesus even tells us why this will happen right after.
So my heavenly Father will also do to you, if you don't each forgive your brother from your hearts for his misdeeds
This has nothing to do with the impossibility of paying back a ridiculous amount of money (sin) through being punished by the tormentors (hell) by being sentenced there forever by the king (God). Why does the church believe the Bible is just a bunch of ironic outcomes? The majority of the Christian church assumes that this is some prank played on the servant. Essentially they believe it is saying something like "You have to be punished until it's paid back but guess what, you will never be able to repay it, BWAHAHAHA!!!"
Tell me, when did Christ speak in ironic statements? The whole of Christendom believes all of the parables regarding judgment are based on their perception of hell that was created with Dante's Inferno and other UNscriptural sources where everyone had some cruel and ironic punishment! No where in this did it even suggest that it would last forever! Just perhaps a long time most likely, but even then we aren't exactly sure!
This was all a spiritual metaphor - There will be those who are judged, but only UNTIL they pay back that which is owed! Why say "until" if it doesn't mean it will end? Why not just say never, will not, can not? If it did then it would justify everything they believe but guess what? It doesn't! They want this ironic situation because its either funnier, crueler or justice in THEIR minds. It's what THEY WANT to believe. That's the mind of the church today, it really is as Ray says, its disgusting and most of all it's sad.
My friend tried to trap me with this story and I thank God so much for the ability to discern these thing now. That although many may be punished, that punishment will end. It may not end UNTIL the debt is paid but it WILL end...
*****ADDITIONAL INFORMATION EDIT*****
I had been putting this off for a while but I wanted to add something to this in regards to the word "torment". I recently learned that the word "torment" comes from the word "basamos" which is the Greek word for a Touchstone. For those who don't know what a touchstone is exactly, it is a stone that is used to test the quality of a piece of gold. Jewelers still use them to this day.
They would rub the gold on the touchstone then apply an acid I believe to determine its worth. The words interrogate, torture, torment, etc all came from this word basamos. It is the same word used in Revelations and in this parable that Jesus provided. A touchstone was a TEST to see the true worth of something. It had a purpose..not just mindless barbarianism. That is what people will go through...a test...
Anyway, just thought I would add this for you guys! Thanks!