> General Discussions
The physical SUN
Drew:
Recently, I don't remember the context, Mr. Smith said and someone else reminded us that the whole scripture is one giant PARABLE. With that in mind, and that our God doesn't lie. What are we to make of these scriptures? Ecl.1:5 The sun rises, and the sun sets and gasps back to it's place that it may rise there once more. Josh.10:13 So the sun stood still...Isa.38:8 And the sun turned back ten steps... Do I believe man says that the Earth revolves around the Sun or that the Sun, and that would imply every thing else, revolves around the Earth? Everyone I have known has accepted that the Sun is the center of our Universe. My spouse, who used to work with a Physicist, asked him how that could be proved. His answer was you would have be outside of our Universe to observe it, so it really can't be proved. Scripture states the facts whether man believes them or not. Am I missing something? Has Mr. Smith ever addressed this question or it just not that important? Anyone?
Drew
P.S. I am aware that two of the refs. were in the category of miracles but not Ecl. and many others that refer to the Sun rising and setting.
Joel:
I for one accept what the scriptures say, as opposed to what man in his convoluted interpretations may promote.
By way of analogy only, Mark 2:27-28
And he said unto them, The sabbath was made for man, and not man for the sabbath.
Therefore the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.
Joel
Dave in Tenn:
Ray certainly believes that the earth revolves around the sun. For more reference, check out the Nashville '08 conference materials.
I know that there is minority science that 'disputes' that, but understand that their 'disputing' is based on definitions and what can be 'observed'. Ordinarily, science watns to describe what can be observed. Motion only exists in relationship to other motion. If I am standing still with a butterfly floating around my head, that is a description from my head's perspective. The butterfly experiences the motion (and therfor describes it) differently. Now suppose I'm on a 12-foot escalator going downstairs with the same butterfly flying around my head. I and the butterfly experience and describe our motion the same way, but someone at the bottom of the escalator observes it (and therefor describes it) differently.
Now imagine that the escalator is on a moving steam ship being oberved by a bird who is flying counter to the motion of the butterfly. And this scene is observed by a US Spy satellite technician who has more interest in the movement of the forty- foot Tsunami soon to pass under our hull towards the coast of Chile, than in the fate of the butterfly.
The very nature of the universe and the relationship of the many motions contained in it cannot be "observed" except from a postion outside the universe. There IS no position outside the Universe. If anybody thinks there is, they have no idea what a universe is. :D So, there CANNOT BE any observation of all the motions contained in the universe. Therefor what careful science says is that it cannot be 'proven'. And that is true.
With earth-based observation coupled with mathmatics, there is a tremendous amount of 'inferred' safety in saying that the earth and other planets actually DO revolve around the sun. And we HAVE put 'observation' posts outside of our solar system in the form of missions to the outer planets and beyond. We can with great safety also infer that all the other solar systems in the galaxy revolve around their 'suns'. And from that safely infer that every other galaxy works essentially the same way.
As for scripture, God created the Heavens and the Earth. That's everything. And in ONE verse, GOD moves His point of observation from the Heavens to the Earth. What follows is an inspired description of events from the perspective of the Earth--particularly the surface of the waters. The passages you mention continue in that vein to describe events from man's point of view.
I'm not a scientist. That's the best I can do. I have zero interest in debating science. I like science because it is not a matter of opinion or 'faith'. It's a matter of understanding or not understanding. Science itself is about being wrong until you learn what's right. That is exactly what my life has been like. I think we've found what is 'right' concerning the relative motions of the Sun and the planets, including the earth. It seems kind of unfair (if not tongue in cheek) to require someone to break every law of physics and existense to prove it.
Drew:
Dave,
I certainly don't want to belabor this, however, I have heard the argument before regarding perspective. I just find it difficult to accept that God inspired Solomon to write what he did when the inspiration could have just as easily have been "the Sun (appears) to rise ... etc." Why, for instance, is it so difficult to believe that God could just as effortlessly "whirl" the, so called,Solar System around the the earth? I also realize that it really isn't a matter of capability but rather back to, why He would make it appear to be what it isn't? Especially, since over and over He inspired "the Sun rises and sets"! There are reasons that the Lord sends delusions but why this particular allusion? My argument probably isn't flawless but this is particularly fun to me because I want to believe scripture and not "the wisdom of man" in all cases. I honestly don't think there is any harm in that. What do you think?
Respectfully,
Drew
Drew
aqrinc:
Drew,
To find out a bit more, google Zodiac of Dendera and do some research for yourself. Hope this does not break any forum rules, just making a suggestion.
george.
Navigation
[0] Message Index
[#] Next page
Go to full version