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In need of some clarification.
zander:
This verse below:
"And that servant, which knew his lord's will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with MANY STRIPES. But he that knew not, and did commit things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with FEW STRIPES. For unto whomsoever much is given, of him shall be much required: and to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more." (Luke 12:47-48)
OK so now i "know" the truths of God. Not all but some, many, i dont know. What i mean is i know the ending is going to be good for all and i basically understand what God's will is.
However, as i am still basically human and i sin, does this mean i am in for a harsh time in the LOF because i am not a "avid follower" of the word? I mean im a normal guy, i do normal things. I might lie on the odd occasion and do small stuff like that, but ive not killed anyone, robbed a house etc. The again, neither am i Ray or anyone who is a avid follower.
But at the same time because i "know" the lord's will, what does this mean to me? Am i screwed? SHOULD i be therefore like Ray or anyone else who is following God to the tee?
Any help?
adiamondintheson:
This is a really good question... one I've asked myself a number of times. How does a person know if he falls in the list of 'chosen' ones and does not go through the LOF.
I have to believe that God looks at the thoughts and intents of the heart. He knows when we are actively searching for truth... and then applying it. In looking at Romans I do have to believe that there is something that is 'required' of us... other than just falling back on the fact that 'all will be saved'... Romans 12:1-3 I beseech you therefore, brethren, by the mercies of God, that ye present your bodies a living sacrifice, holy, acceptable unto God, which is your reasonable service. And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God. For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
The fact that Romans 6:1-2 says: What shall we say then? Shall we continue in sin, that grace may abound? God forbid. How shall we, that are dead to sin, live any longer therein?
So in my mind... there has to be an accountability for the choices we make... to lie or not to lie... to sin or not to sin... and if we do our best to follow after His will and His ways.
Don't know if I'm right about my thinking on this, and if not... I truly would like to know too.
Thanks for any help in this whole thing.
Connie
Samson:
So in my mind... there has to be an accountability for the choices we make... to lie or not to lie... to sin or not to sin... and if we do our best to follow after His will and His ways.
Yes Connie, Your above quote is accurate, We are accountable for all Our choices. We make many choices every day, However, all of the choices We make are the result of CAUSES, whether internal or external. God is the Author of All CAUSES that took place in the past, are taking place in the present and will take place in the future. Due to the fact individuals desire to Sin, they are accountable for their Sins, because they wanted to commit them. God is responsible for undoing the affects of all the Sins that were ever committed, because He created us with the capacity to Sin and as a result of Our sins, We experience Evil, the consequences of Our Wicked acts or others experience Evil as the result of Our Sins. In the present Age, the majority of Mankind commit Sin with no remorse or repentance. Joe Hillsbororiver Posted a good illustration or example regarding ones showing True remorse versus someone mainly upset about getting caught & being sad about the inevitable consequences.
Sometimes We make CHOICES that turn out bad, CHOICES We might have decided to make at the time, thinking that choice was the best choice and results of even that type of choice has consequences that we didn't anticipate. God's Chosen Elect commit individual Sins, but Sin doesn't have Dominion over them or reign in their lives or becomes a practice.
Rom 6:14 For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.
1Co 6:9 Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
1Co 6:10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.
1Co 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
1Jn 2:1 My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous:
1Jn 2:12 I write unto you, little children, because your sins are forgiven you for his name's sake.
1Jn 1:8 If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
1Jn 1:9 If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
1Jn 1:10 If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.
Kind Regards, Samson.
Kat:
Hi Zander,
--- Quote ---But at the same time because i "know" the lord's will, what does this mean to me?
--- End quote ---
Luke 12:47 And that servant who knew his lord's will and did not prepare, nor did according to His will, shall be beaten with many stripes.
v. 48 But he not knowing, and doing things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For to whomever much is given, of him much shall be required. And to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.
I think that part in bold is the key to what you are asking. It's like the parable of the talents, the more knowledge one receives the more that is expected from them.
You know John, it is true that only God can draws anyone to Himself, but once we have our eyes opened to this truth, which there is no greater reward a human being can receive, it is incomprehensible to think one would settle for the Lake of fire, which is a time of God's wrath and indignation. Even though it is God who decides, He puts the desire in us and we will go through the motions and carry it out. So we should run the race with all we have, because we want the better resurrection, not the Lake of fire.
Rom 2:5-6 But according to your hardness and your impenitent heart, do you treasure up wrath for yourself in a day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God, who will render to each according to his works;
Isa 13:6 Howl! For the day of Jehovah is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.
v. 7 Therefore all hands shall be faint, and every man's heart shall melt;
v. 8 and they shall be afraid. Pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them. They shall be in pain like a woman who travails. They shall be amazed at one another, their faces like flames.
v. 9 Behold, the day of Jehovah comes, cruel and with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land waste; and He shall destroy its sinners out of it.
Of course we should seek to be in the first resurrection, as there is a huge difference if you are in the first resurrection or the Lake of fire. Why would anybody think the Lake of fire is acceptable if you have the chance to be in the first resurrection? Sure you will be saved in the end, but as Ray has said the Lake of fire will not be a walk in the park.
http://bible-truths.com/email5.htm ----------
There is coming a time of severe judgment upon sinning mankind. It will not be a walk in the park for any of them. God will purge them all with the fires of His Spirit. But then, all mankind will be saved.
---------------------------------------------------
mercy, peace and love
Kat
John from Kentucky:
--- Quote from: Kat on June 07, 2011, 07:43:56 PM ---
Hi Zander,
--- Quote ---But at the same time because i "know" the lord's will, what does this mean to me?
--- End quote ---
Luke 12:47 And that servant who knew his lord's will and did not prepare, nor did according to His will, shall be beaten with many stripes.
v. 48 But he not knowing, and doing things worthy of stripes, shall be beaten with few stripes. For to whomever much is given, of him much shall be required. And to whom men have committed much, of him they will ask the more.
I think that part in bold is the key to what you are asking. The thing is that those that are given this truth are no longer ignorant and deceived and will be held accountable for what they know. It's like the parable of the talents, the more one is blessed to receive the more that is expected from them.
You know John, it is true that only God can draws anyone to Himself, but once we have our eyes opened to this truth, which there is no greater reward a human being can receive, it is incomprehensible to settle for the Lake of fire, which is a time of God's wrath and indignation. Even though it is God who decides, He puts the desire in us and we will go through the motions and carry it out. So we should run the race with all we have, because we do not want to settle for the Lake of fire.
Rom 2:5-6 But according to your hardness and your impenitent heart, do you treasure up wrath for yourself in a day of wrath and revelation of the righteous judgment of God, who will render to each according to his works;
Isa 13:6 Howl! For the day of Jehovah is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty.
v. 7 Therefore all hands shall be faint, and every man's heart shall melt;
v. 8 and they shall be afraid. Pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them. They shall be in pain like a woman who travails. They shall be amazed at one another, their faces like flames.
v. 9 Behold, the day of Jehovah comes, cruel and with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land waste; and He shall destroy its sinners out of it.
Of course we should seek to be in the first resurrection, as there is a huge difference if you are in the first resurrection or the Lake of fire. Why would anybody think the Lake of fire is acceptable if you have the chance to be in the first resurrection? Sure you will be saved in the end, but as Ray has said the Lake of fire will not be a walk in the park.
http://bible-truths.com/email5.htm ----------
There is coming a time of severe judgment upon sinning mankind. It will not be a walk in the park for any of them. God will purge them all with the fires of His Spirit. But then, all mankind will be saved. This occurs at the white throne judgment, not when Christ returns to reign on the earth.
---------------------------------------------------
mercy, peace and love
Kat
--- End quote ---
Hi Kat,
I could be wrong, but I believe I received my understanding from Ray's teaching in the Lake of Fire articles, which I was rereading yesterday.
It is true that the phrase Lake of Fire is referring to the end time judgment. However, Ray has taught that Fire is symbolic of God. We all will go through a judgment by Fire (God) whether it is now or in the Lake of Fire judgment. "Our God is a consuming Fire." Also, "God is no respecter of persons".
All will be judged by Fire (God), whether now or later. "Judgment is now on the House of God", and it is a judgment by Fire. Fire is not a bad thing because it symbolically refers to God. God (Fire) is spiritually burning out all that is evil or wrong in His people, and is thereby forming His jewels.
Further, as you know, there is no free will. We do not decide which resurrection we are in. God has already decided, before He created the world, who was going to be in the 1st Resurrection. It is a total futile exercise to wish to be in the 1st Resurrection. You either will be, or you will not be. The Potter has already decided.
If any of us are to be in the 1st Resurrection, then God will give us both the will and the to do (works) to make it. Jesus is our Savior. It all depends on Him. Our own will and works cannot save an ant. But with His Spirit in us, then we can do all things; we will then have the will and the to do (works) to make it into the 1st Resurrection.
If my understanding is wrong, I am willing to change. But it has to be by the Spirit of God, two or three Scriptures please, with a spiritual match to a spiritual match.
So, if I have misspoken, then show me precisely my error. That is if you have the time or inclination. I am in no hurry. I am not being contentious, but what I have written above is my current understanding of this topic. Peace.
John
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