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Does anyone else here fear God?
indianabob:
Good morning in Australia to Marrcus,
Great to read your question and your introduction.
At my age I recall that I used to fear the unknown and that included what God was going to do to me or let happen to me. Now that I have a little of the truth of God's purpose I am at peace even in my physical pain. It still hurts but I know that God will heal me eventually and I live with real joy.
Many of my friends have learned to deal with their physical and emotional pain as well, but their way of dealing with it is to give up and stop caring and just assume that either they deserve it or that God is vengeful and mean when He enforces His law. e.g. you break God's law and the law will break you. That seems to be what some authorities teach about our Father based upon their human understanding.
If you no longer believe that God is vengeful and mean then your eyes have begun to be opened to the real truth. You are being invited (drawn) to learn and to grow in grace and knowledge and it is a process similar to other life experiences EXCEPT that you are in God's classroom now and the lessons are tailored for you and for your individual needs. What a wonderful gift we have from our Lord.
Welcome to the family of brothers and sisters in Christ.
Indiana Bob
Patrick:
Ray's Bible study from March 2011 ~ Are You Afraid Of God?
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,12896.msg113269.html#msg113269
Gina:
I went through that very thing recently, and the only thing I can tell you is, you have to get to the place where you confess to believing that God is evil. That is, in order to believe that God would torment humanity forever, which HE made weak by the way, for no redeeming purpose what-so-ever, you would have to believe that God does NOT love us, is stupid, impatient, and more evil than Satan himself.
And that's just preposterous. Here's what will happen if you look at God that way:
1. You will start to look for ways to run from Him.
2. You will start to look for ways to make yourself feel better.
3. Then you will start to look to others to get you out of messes you find yourself in.
4. When that doesn't happen, you will reluctantly turn back to God.
5. You will find that only God can save you and love you like no one else can.
6. Then, you will see that God does not torment people for no redeeming purpose.
7. And you will start to really believe what you read.
Seven's a good number. I'll stop there.
Kat:
Hi Marrcus,
The doctrine of hell was created in order to strike fear into the people. Ray brings out the origin of where this came from and how and why it is now preached in all the churches. Here are some of the places he teaches on this.
http://bible-truths.com/lake16-C.html --------------------------------
KEEPING THE DUMB SHEEP DUMB
Since none of these things which the Jews of Jesus’ day believed were taught in the Law of Moses, just where did the Jews learn of these pagan doctrines?
Most theologians are clearly deceived; however, not all are ignorant. Many theologians know at least some of the material I am presenting to you. But they don’t want you to know or understand any of it. It has been the purpose of the ruling privileged elite to keep the masses at bay by evil indoctrinations, deceptions, and gross fear.
v
And it is EGYPT that is the originator of these gross and evil doctrines of eternal torture after death of the souls which supposedly cannot die.
The Egyptian priests and legislators invented these damnable heresies, and the Babylonians, Greeks, and Romans thought it was the best thing that ever happened to them since homemade chocolate fudge. What a clever and inexpensive way to keep the people in constant fear of their religious and civil leaders!
Historians have called Egypt, "The MOTHER OF SUPERSTITIONS." Does "Mystery Babylon the Great, THE MOTHER OF HARLOTS, and the abominations of the earth" come to mind when you read that?
Greek and Roman lawyers, philosophers, and priests, acknowledge their indebtedness to Egypt in this respect, and freely credit her with the ORIGINAL INVENTION OF THE FABLES AND TERRORS of the invisible world; though it must be allowed that they have improved somewhat upon the hints given, and shown a wonderful inventive faculty of their own. (Paraphrased from some of Thayer’s material.)
So, how did they keep the dumb sheep in line? By filling their heads with visions of eternal torture in fire if they didn’t obey every whim of their religious and civil leaders.
"How LONG, ye simple ones [Heb: ‘silly, seducible, foolish, naive’] will ye love simplicity [Heb: ‘silliness, seductiveness, foolishness, naivete’]? And the scorners delight in their scorning, and fools hate knowledge?" (Prov. 1:22.)
Yes, how true: "…fools HATE knowledge." I do my best to free people from the spiritual dictators over their lives, but often they not only hate the knowledge that I give them, but they also hate me for teaching them.
"My people have been lost sheep: THEIR SHEPHERDS HAVE CAUSED THEM TO GO ASTRAY…" (Jer. 50:6.)
http://bible-truths.com/lake16-D1.htm --------------------------------
The Holy Scriptures know nothing of a Christian hell of eternal torment.
The Christian hell is a Christian hoax.
The Jewish hell is a Jewish hoax.
The Islamic hell is a Islamic hoax.
The Greek hell is a Greek hoax.
The Hindu hell is a Hindu hoax.
The Babylonian hell is a Babylonian hoax.
The Egyptian hell is an Egyptian hoax.
And every other hell of every other culture and religion on earth is a man-made HOAX!
For thousands of years the religious and civil leaders of virtually every major nation and culture on earth have used the fear and terror of a future "hell" to keep their citizens (always considered dumb sheep by the elite clerics and governors) obedient to the whims of their authority. This practice continues unabated to this day, and the majority of the human race has ignorantly bought it.
http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,2407.0.html --------
Dear Pastor Tim:
You need to put away the Christianized Paganism of the Greeks and Egyptians and learn the Truths of God's Word. Read my series on "Hell" for more information. Jesus never spoke the word "hell" in His entire ministry--not in Greek, not in Hebrew, and not in Aramaic. Neither are the words "everlasting, eternal, evermore, and forever AND EVER" found in any Greek or Hebrew manuscripts from which our modern English bibles have been translated. I know this for a fact, Tim, but you don't, and you should.
http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,2658.0.html -------------
No, Augustie was not the first, but he was probbly the most effective in spreading the heresy of an hell of eternal torment. Paul warned that after his departure wolves would enter the flock and tear it apart, and that heresy and apostasy was already at work, so it should come as no surprise that many of the early "fathers" taught such unscriptural nonsense, but not all.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,6978.0.html -------------------------------
Dear Bob: Justinian (540 AD) was one primarily responsible for changing eons or ages into "ENDLESS ages." He knew that aion/aionios in the Greek did not mean endless, but rather an age or pertaining to a age, and so he began teaching "endless" ages or eternity. The words "chastisement" which means to correct and set straight and right were changed to "punishment." So instead of having age-lasting correction in Judgment, Judgment became endless, eternal torture as punishment for sins that could never again be repented of. The King James translators followed closely the traditions of the Jerome and his Vulgate, Justinian, and the Roman Catholic Church, regarding these teachings. What a damnable teaching.
http://bible-truths.com/email8.htm ------------------------------
It has been the churches that have caused men to fear God as a fickled kind of a god who one never quite knows for sure which side of the bed he got up on and therefore we must always be in fear and trepidation of our salvation. The "Pastors" (you are correct there is truly only ONE PASTOR of the sheep and that is Christ) love this power over the dumb sheep.
Have no fear. If you love God you will NEVER be blotted out of Christ the true book of life.
"Error laden sermons" is not nearly as huge a problem as error laden hearts and minds. As most pastors of Christendom are not converted and actually despise the True Word of God, they will have to be purged with the fire of God's Holy Spirit. In one way or the other we ALL must bear our cross and go through the fire (See First Cor. 3). Also be sure to read my paper on the Lake of Fire which is now being posted in installments on this site.
Isaiah tells us that it is the "shepherds" that have LEAD GOD'S SHEEP ASTRAY. They will bear the greater accountability for their sins.
http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,136.0.html ----------------
you do not have enough information on this subject to even have a valid opinion. You say: "The BIBLE says....." God did not write the "bible." God wrote the Hebrew and Greek Scriptures from which we translate bibles. There are many bibles that do not contain the word "hell." Do you know why? Of course you don't. Well the reason is that there is no word in either the Hebrew or Greek Scriptures that can be translated "hell," that's why. If you would read my series on "HELL," you would learn these things, but the question is, Are you interested in the Truths of God or the evil traditions of men?
http://www.forums.bible-truths.com/index.php?topic=3866.msg29307#msg29307 -----------
Dear Mike in NH:
Your own words condemn you! You despise the Word of God. You teach contrary to the Word of God. You teach "DAMNABLE HERESIES," when you teach that God cannot and will not convert all sinners, and that Jesus will NOT be "THE SAVIOUR OF THE WHOLE WORLD" as His God and Fathered commissioned Him (John 1:29; I John 2:2 & 4:14 and a hundred more like them). You teach that most of humanity will burn eternally in a hellhole of literal fire, and you then tell me about the lies of Satan.
"For the wages of sin IS DEATH," Mike, NOT eternal LIFE in pain and torture (Rom. 6:23). God told Adam: "But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, you shall not eat of it: for in the day that you eat thereof you shall SURELY DIE" (Gen. 1:17). But what do YOU & SATAN teach? "And the serpent [and Mike in New Hampshire] said unto the woman, YE SHALL NOT SURELY DIE" (Gen. 3:4).
You, Mike, YOU & SATAN are the liars. And here is YOUR fate and SATAN'S fate and all peoples fate who do not bitterly repent of LYING: "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, AND ALL LIARS, shall burn with fire and brimstone: which is the second death" (Rev. 21:08). No, it is not "eternal" burning, neither is it physical, "For God [Who is SPIRIT] is a CONSUMING FIRE" (Heb. 12:29), but it will SPIRITUALLY cleanse all of their evil and UN-repented sins.
http://forums.bible-truths.com/index.php/topic,6979.0.html ---------------
We could just as easily ask: "If there IS an hell of eternal torture for most of our grandmothers and grandfathers, what would be the point of believing in Christ?" I couldn't worship a "god" who would torture most of the grandfathers and grandmothers and great grandfathers and great grandmothers of the entire human race in literal fire for all eternity. That is total insanity. (See My HELL series for proof that if 90% of humanity is going to hell as Christendom suggests, then the majority of people suffering in hell would be Great grandmothers, etc.)
Surprising as it may sound, there is not one Scripture in the entirety of the Bible which states that Jesus came to "save us from HELL." Why do you suppose that is? Because Jesus does NOT save us from hell. Jesus saves us from such evil, and foolishness, and pride, and vanity, and evil, and pain, and suffering, and disease, and fear, and sin, and DEATH. Those are the things that Jesus saves us from, and none will be saved except THROUGH & BY Jesus Christ. So therefore, all will come to Jesus eventually, and He will save all humanity. That is the "Good News Gospel" as opposed to the Christian "BAD News Gospel."
God be with you,
Ray
Gina:
Beautiful.
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