horrific tragedy - "free-agency"

[cjwood]

i do not post this to start ANY debate on ANYthing.  i post this because, as horrific and tragic as the act of evil which was perpetrated against so many young, precious children and their teachers/staff yesterday in our country was, something as equally tragic has been aired to the masses.  the "true" reason the whole ordeal happened was because the person who caused all the terror, was given a God given right of "free-agency".  this was part of a statement by a young father who lost his 6-yr old daughter.  the person had the right to do this act because God cannot take away this "right" He has given everyone.  just as this poor father who is trying to lean on his faith and "religion" (his quote), has the right to not feel rage and to try and help all the others who were directly affected by this tragedy.  that's how he's using his "free-agency".

when i heard this father make such a dynamic (false) statement on national t.v., i spoke out loud "oh my Dear God.  oh my Father and Lord.  this is truly a tragedy beyond what is so evidently being played out.

but,

isa. 45:7  "I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things."

but,

as ray quoted from the Scriptures many, many times, "who hath believed our report?"...

but, it will ALL be made right on That Day when our Lord and Saviour returns.

praise God.  He IS sovereign.  there is NOTHING that He cannot do in any person's life.  there is NO "free-agency" that He has given each and every person.  and there is most assuredly no "right" of free-agency that He has given to every person, which He would not be able to "take away".

but, we CAN and DO make choices that are caused by the circumstances in our lives, around and within us, which (lives) HAVE been preordained by our Creator.

but we can pray for everyone affected directly and indirectly by the tragedy which unfolded in connecticut yesterday.  for our Father God's mercy and comfort for these families.

claudia

[Craig]

Claudia, I agree 110% with everything you say.  But right now I'm just mad...I'm mad a God for this tragedy, I'm mad at God for the depth of the depravity He allows. I don't understand it, but right now my faith and only hope for this world lies in the knowledge that all will work out for a final perfection.  It's sad for the parents but we have to understand the God is our Father and we all belong to Him.

Craig

[Rhys 🕊]

Im with Craig on this one

Rhys

[gmik]

thanks for your honesty craig...i am mad at God too....i know i will repent and get over it and love and trust His ways....but my heart hurts right now...

as a retired teacher i always felt like a sitting duck w/ no protection against angry parents, but i never thought of anything like this!!

there is evil out there folks

[Joel]

It really is a sad time, knowing about all the lives that were snuffed out like a candle. And even more disturbing that so many of them were little children not much younger than my two grandsons. 
It seems like if good, and evil could be weighed in a set of scales, evil would out weigh the good in the earth today.
Job said; "Shall we receive good at the hand of God, and shall we not receive evil?
Amos said; "shall there be evil in a city, and the Lord hath not done it? My Bible's center column says;" Or, and not the Lord do somewhat?"
During this sad, and mournful time there are those that immediately went about doing good, trying to help where there is a need, shouldering burdens, and comforting as much as possible.

We all know the story of Jesus birth in Bethlehem. How the angel of the Lord made it know to the shepherds, and how he told them to "fear not."
I can surmise that when Herod made the decree for all the children two years old and under to be killed. It must have affected some of those very same shepherds that had been earlier blessed of God.

Joel

[walt123]

Hello to all.

IT is a heartbreaking,to see such evil,especially when it involves children.
this one scripture come to mind.

Isaiah 57 (NIV)

1 The righteous perish,
    and no one takes it to heart;
the devout are taken away,
    and no one understands
that the righteous are taken away
    to be spared from evil.

2 Those who walk uprightly
    enter into peace;
    they find rest as they lie in death.

Isaiah 57
New Living Translation (NLT)

1 Good people pass away;
    the godly often die before their time.
    But no one seems to care or wonder why.
No one seems to understand
    that God is protecting them from the evil to come.

2 For those who follow godly paths
    will rest in peace when they .die

It may be ,they where more righteous, then the surrounding area they lived.

Just my thoughts, to comfort others.

Walt.

[John from Kentucky]

Our God is a strange, strange God.

He doesn't look at death the way we do.  Jesus called death, "sleeping", and they laughed Him to scorn.

It's as simple for God to bring the dead back to life as it is for us to rouse someone from sleep.

I remember Ray saying somewhere that one reason Jesus suffered and died the way He did was that no one could ever accuse God of not understanding pain, suffering, or losing a loved one.

The Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.  You cannot have one without the other.

He will swallow up death forever, and the Lord God will wipe away tears from all faces.  Isa 25:8

[dave]

Our God is a strange, strange God.

He doesn't look at death the way we do.  Jesus called death, "sleeping", and they laughed Him to scorn.

It's as simple for God to bring the dead back to life as it is for us to rouse someone from sleep.

I remember Ray saying somewhere that one reason Jesus suffered and died the way He did was that no one could ever accuse God of not understanding pain, suffering, or losing a loved one.

The Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil.  You cannot have one without the other.

He will swallow up death forever, and the Lord God will wipe away tears from all faces.  Isa 25:8

Very well said

[Rene]

I also feel the shock and the sadness from this tragedy, but I do not feel mad at God.  I feel blessed to have been given the faith to believe in our Creator's master plan of salvation for all of mankind, and therefore, I can look beyond the here and now. 

Even in times of pain and suffering, I truly believe that our Heavenly Father, through our Lord and Saviour Christ Jesus, is going to do what He has promised that He will do.  We shall become "Children of God."  Those innocent little babies that were murdered, will be resurrected and they will learn righteousness, and they too shall become "Children of God."  Death in this world is not the end of the story.  God will make all things new.

It takes a lot of faith to trust and believe these spiritual truths, but it is the only way we will overcome this world.

René

[zander]

You guys do realise this kind of evil stuff happens every day in the world, we just don't get to hear about it all in the media.

What i find even more disturbing is the neurotic thirst for blame placed on those poor Australian DJ's who never meant to kill anyone with a frikin phone call.  You had all sorts of sanctimonious ******** posting vile accusations online.  That made me quite very sick.

[Rhys 🕊]

You guys do realise this kind of evil stuff happens every day in the world, we just don't get to hear about it all in the media.

What i find even more disturbing is the neurotic thirst for blame placed on those poor Australian DJ's who never meant to kill anyone with a frikin phone call.  You had all sorts of sanctimonious ******** posting vile accusations online.  That made me quite very sick.

People go around shooting dead 20 beautiful children between 5-10 years of age every day???, plus the adults. I hope not. Of course plenty of other evil stuff is going on as all are aware of. This sort of crime is not normal and if we are not moved by it then something is wrong with us.

As for those Australian DJ's I find myself growing tired of some of these people's ways to get a laugh.

Rhys

[lauriellen]

death is coming to all of us--this i can accept....it is the insane level of sufferring of the LIVING that i am struggling with...its hard to wrap my mind around this....sufferring of such magnitude that the wounds seemingly will never heal and the scars so deep that they may remain thru ages. Ray once said that if you were stranded in a tiny boat in the middle of an ocean, God would certainly be with you and hear your prayer...wether or not He would help you or not was another matter.  i believe this is true, knowing God is with us doesn't mean we will have peace and safety. I do have faith that Gods plan will most definitely be completed, but i don't have much comfort concerning what we may have to endure, experience and suffer thru between now and then. Gods will be done, but Lord have mercy on us all in the mean time.

[levycarneiro]

death is coming to all of us--this i can accept....it is the insane level of sufferring of the LIVING that i am struggling with...its hard to wrap my mind around this....sufferring of such magnitude that the wounds seemingly will never heal and the scars so deep that they may remain thru ages. Ray once said that if you were stranded in a tiny boat in the middle of an ocean, God would certainly be with you and hear your prayer...wether or not He would help you or not was another matter.  i believe this is true, knowing God is with us doesn't mean we will have peace and safety. I do have faith that Gods plan will most definitely be completed, but i don't have much comfort concerning what we may have to endure, experience and suffer thru between now and then. Gods will be done, but Lord have mercy on us all in the mean time.

Great and comforting thought!

Thanks!

[zander]

I prefer to not always think about it in quantities.  1 child dead, 1 person killed in such crimes is still one too many and it does happen virtually every day.  Perhaps not always in the States and perhaps through different means but it does happen.

[cjwood]

i do not post this to start ANY debate on ANYthing.  i post this because, as horrific and tragic as the act of evil which was perpetrated against so many young, precious children and their teachers/staff yesterday in our country was, something as equally tragic has been aired to the masses.  the "true" reason the whole ordeal happened was because the person who caused all the terror, was given a God given right of "free-agency". this was part of a statement by a young father who lost his 6-yr old daughter. 

i pulled the above quote from my post because as i read through the post responses to the thread, it appears that the whole reason for my post was overlooked and the thread drifted in another direction. 

but, as ray used to say so often, we don't pay attention to all the words.

claudia

[Akira329]

Hey Claudia,
Tragedies like this tend to overshadow the abundant false doctrines that follow.
Tragedies like these also bring people together but when together, they do nothing but argue over whose at fault and what laws they can enact to prevent actions again. They're free agency at work I guess.
Those that do weep and offer solace to one another turn to false statements like this for comfort. Tragic indeed.
We know his statement is false but those who hear this same message every Sunday only affirm it. Tragic and sad.
I cannot expect those who do not know God to find comfort in knowing that he is responsible and the only one justifiable in his actions.
Only he can bring life from death.
My hope is in that day.
Thanks for paying attention Claudia!
Thanks for helping us pay attention too!
Antaiwan

[gmik]

very interesting thread...loved isa 57..thanks for that....claudia, i heard emilie's father say that as well, and it jarred w/ me....that murderer had free will?  who w/ "free will" would willingly do such a thing? but that helps the father make sense out of the senseless in his time of great pain so he uses his "free will" to forgive him...sad sad

   

[theophilus]

very interesting thread...loved isa 57..thanks for that....claudia, i heard emilie's father say that as well, and it jarred w/ me....that murderer had free will?  who w/ "free will" would willingly do such a thing? but that helps the father make sense out of the senseless in his time of great pain so he uses his "free will" to forgive him...sad sad

I think that father doesn't know that none of us has a free will. In fact, he can't see this truth.